what would build

burritobob

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CPU: Intel Core i7-3770K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($304.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler ($79.80 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V LE PLUS ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($149.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($97.01 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($109.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 Series 250GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($169.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition 3GB Video Card (2-Way CrossFire) ($418.13 @ SuperBiiz)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition 3GB Video Card (2-Way CrossFire) ($418.13 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Rosewill THOR V2-W ATX Full Tower Case ($139.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Corsair Enthusiast 850W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($118.99 @ Amazon)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.96 @ Amazon)
Total: $2008.97
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)

With the 7970 you get Bioshock Infinite and Crysis 3 for free, also with the i7 you get a 25$ gift card.
 

willard

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Heh, you basically just posted a parts list of my computer, with a few differences.

1. Get a nicer PSU. For about $50 more you can get a SeaSonic. The SeaSonic X-650 Gold will power this system, and do it with class leading efficiency. It's an 80 Plus Platinum PSU marketed as Gold because Platinum didn't exist when they launched it.

2. No need for 16GB of memory, even in a big budget. The extra literally doesn't help at all. You can, however, get 8GB of DDR3-2200 for the same price. In high end gaming systems, high performance memory really is a good way to boost your framerates. An extra $50 on a $2,000 computer is only a 2.5% increase in cost, for a 3-5% increase in performance. Good investment in my book.
 
This is THE build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Corsair H80 92.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($83.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V PRO ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($200.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Corsair XMS3 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($52.99 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($92.64 @ Outlet PC)
Storage: Samsung 840 Pro Series 128GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($137.58 @ Amazon)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($369.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($369.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master HAF X ATX Full Tower Case ($160.00 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic Platinum 860W 80 PLUS Platinum Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($189.98 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Lite-On IHBS312-98 Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer ($89.97 @ Outlet PC)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($89.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $2040.09
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-03-20 11:27 EDT-0400)

Can't help but enjoy it. If I were buying one specifically for gaming today, this would be it.
 

willard

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http://www.anandtech.com/show/5054/corsair-hydro-series-h60-h80-and-h100-reviewed/6

The H80 couldn't get within 5C the Silver Arrow (discontinued, it's about 1C better than the NH-D14) except on high, which was still 2C hotter and a whopping fifteen decibels louder. That's one and a half orders of magnitude more noise coming out of the H80, to do a worse job. Why would you want this thing in your system?

I've got a feeling that somebody building a $2k gaming machine is going to want more than 1TB of storage. Given that you can get 3TB drives for $50/TB, and we already have high speed storage in the form of an SSD, I don't really see the need to spend $100/TB on high speed mechanical storage. The things that will tend to live on the mechanical drive (media, steam installs moved off the SSD, etc.) are totally insensitive to transfer speed and latency.

Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($369.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($369.99 @ Newegg)
7970s perform better, overclock better and handle high resolutions better for a about $30 more per card. Well worth the small increase in cost.

The SeaSonic X-650 Gold is up to the task, and costs about $50 less. I've got one powering my system. 2x overclocked 7970s in crossfire, overclocked 3770k, three HDDs, two SSDs, seven fans ranging from 120mm to 230mm, DVD burner, etc. etc.. The little guy is a monster, easily the best 650W PSU on the market.

Honestly, I don't think this is a good build. It costs as much as the previous system, but is inferior in every way. The CPU is slower, the GPUs are slower, you have half the SSD space, half the HDD space, half the memory (or same amount at lower speed) and the cooler is louder and doesn't cool as well. In every area that counts, your build is strictly inferior.
 


There's more than cooling that is an advantage of using an H80. It takes the bulk of the cooler and moves it to an exhaust port making it easier to work on your motherboard, doesn't block your RAM slots and doesn't put any stress on your motherboard. Is 2C worth a large, metal obstacle inside your case?

Also, who the hell needs more than 1TB for a gaming machine? Do you go out and buy every game available and put them on your TBs of hard drive space, then decide which to play? Massive amounts of storage are not too key for a gaming machine. If massive amounts of storage is your goal, maybe drop a NAS onto your network?

Yeah, willard, I'm sure you have experience with both crossfire and SLI. Based on my experience with crossfire and all the driver issues and perceivable microstutter that goes along with it, I'll most likely not shop for another AMD video card any time soon. You can try to convince yourself you got a good deal on Radeon cards, but there's a reason you pay a little more for Nvidia cards. I learned this the expensive way.

Also, check out any review SLI review compared to crossfire and you'll see that two cards in SLI scale better than two in crossfire.

Based on my experience with SLI on multiple platforms with multiple generations of GPUS, there's no reason for me to think there's any other way to go. SLI is trouble free with no perceivable microstutter. Nvidia doesn't ignore the needs of it's minority SLI base, the way the driver team over at AMD does. Most AMD customers like to think they got a good deal. If that's what you're after, then fine. But an AMD two-card setup is definitely inferior.

Yes the other power supply is up to the task. It's good enough and it's a quality supply. But it puts you right at the edge of your power requirement. Definitely not something to make a practice of.
 

willard

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You're glossing over the issue. It's only a 2C difference if you make if 15 dB louder. It is a full 12C hotter at the same noise level. This is not a small difference. This is the difference between a good cooler and an awful cooler.

Also, my air cooler doesn't block my RAM slots, like most air coolers, and it's perfectly easy to work around it in my case. Stress on the motherboards is some idiocy Tom's was spouting a few months back, and I don't buy it. Who cares if the computer is more likely to break in shipping? I am not shipping my computer, who does aside from people like Tom's? It was honestly bewildering when they started saying that, my guess is it's just more influence from corporate shills who weren't happy that the truth about their garbage coolers came out.


Also, who the hell needs more than 1TB for a gaming machine? Do you go out and buy every game available and put them on your TBs of hard drive space, then decide which to play? Massive amounts of storage are not too key for a gaming machine. If massive amounts of storage is your goal, maybe drop a NAS onto your network?
Despite what you may think, people do tend to use their computer for more than one task. "Gaming machine" doesn't mean "I will only ever game on this machine and never ever do anything else, I promise." My gaming machine has 5TB of used storage and climbing. And no, this is not from a massive collection of pirated movies, it's mostly OS disc images, virtual machines and rips of my Blu-Rays so they'll be available on the Roku.

And why spend a large amount of extra money on a NAS when you can spend much less money and just put it directly in the computer? A NAS is meant to solve a very particular problem, sharing storage across multiple devices, not to boost the storage of a single device. We already have a good way to do that, and it's to buy a bigger hard drive like I said.

Yeah, willard, I'm sure you have experience with both crossfire and SLI. Based on my experience with crossfire and all the driver issues and perceivable microstutter that goes along with it, I'll most likely not shop for another AMD video card any time soon.
I do, actually. Used SLI GTX 9800s at work for years (for powering a complex and inefficient 3D display). been using Crossfire 7970s for the last 8 months. My Crossfire 7970s perform just fine, thank you, as did my GTX 9800s.

When you assume, you make an ass out of u and me.

You can try to convince yourself you got a good deal on Radeon cards, but there's a reason you pay a little more for Nvidia cards. I learned this the expensive way.
This logic would make more sense if the 670 wasn't cheaper than the 7970s. You pay more for the 7970, and get more.

Also, check out any review SLI review compared to crossfire and you'll see that two cards in SLI scale better than two in crossfire.
Really?

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162973

Looks like just the opposite to me.

Based on my experience with SLI on multiple platforms with multiple generations of GPUS, there's no reason for me to think there's any other way to go.
http://techreport.com/review/22890/nvidia-geforce-gtx-690-graphics-card/7

tp99 frame latency is still lower on 7970s in Crossfire, and this is comparing to 680s in crossfire, which will obviously beat the 670s in frame latency due to being more powerful. So yeah, the 7970s in crossfire are objectively better.

Nvidia doesn't ignore the needs of it's minority SLI base, the way the driver team over at AMD does.
Maybe go read patch notes instead of just telling me how AMD is ignoring me?

Yes the other power supply is up to the task. It's good enough and it's a quality supply. But it puts you right at the edge of your power requirement. Definitely not something to make a practice of.
The PSU is actually capable of providing a good deal more than 650W. I've seen people load them up with 750W+ and they still power the system fine. Rumor is it's not really a 650W PSU, but something much bigger so it can pull off the ludicrous efficiency, ripple and noise levels it does. My computer is so little stress on this thing that it doesn't even need to turn the fan on while gaming. JohnnyGuru loaded it past its peak output and put it in a hotbox at nearly 50C, still remained fanless and beat the 80+ Platinum requirements while doing it, class leading ripple and noise.

I'd never do this with any other 650W PSU, but the X 650 Gold is a monster.
 
I was waiting for you to respond willard. Took you a couple of days.

My experience with crossfire has been different. Either you are very tolerant of perceivable microstutter (but your framerates are way up there aren't they?) or you don't process visual signals all that effectively. Just keep telling yourself crossfire is good and eventually you accept it, right? Also, you cite a techpowerup forum post. I'm going to put a lot of faith in that.

We can all find charts to support our arguments if we really want to, huh?

Also, if we base our opinions of a power supply capacity on rumors, we make an ass out of just you.
 

willard

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What can I say, I'm a busy guy.

My experience with crossfire has been different. Either you are very tolerant of perceivable microstutter (but your framerates are way up there aren't they?) or you don't process visual signals all that effectively.
Or, you're blowing this out of proportion, or my framerate is above my frame limit thus microstuttering gets swallowed up by not rendering the frame in the first place, or it varies from game to game (it does) and system to system (it does).

Just keep telling yourself crossfire is good and eventually you accept it, right?
Just keep telling people that cards you haven't used are better than other cards you haven't used and eventually you accept it, right? You've read articles, you know first hand! Oh wait, I'm the one with the firsthand experience. Sorry, I got confused for a second.

We can all find charts to support our arguments if we really want to, huh?
Then do it. Show me SLI 670s beating Crossfire 7970s in tp99 frame latency. This is a metric of both performance and microstuttering, so it should satisfy your desire to show how vastly worse Crossfire is than SLI.

Also, if we base our opinions of a power supply capacity on rumors, we make an ass out of just you.
You may want to re-read my post. The rumor is the explanation as to why it can do this, not whether it can or not.

I based my opinion on the fact that I own the power supply and am doing this right now. I based my opinion on the fact that I personally know people who are stressing it even more. I based my opinion on the fact that the most respected PSU review site on the planet practically swooned over the goddamn thing and couldn't make it sweat under conditions far worse than this computer would ever apply to it.

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story3&reid=169

And I quote:

And look - I did get the unit up to high ambient temps. Forty eight degrees, to be specific. Forty eight marshmallow roasting, butter melting, finger burning degrees, to be prolific. For-ty eig-ht de-gree-s to be sporadic. But look - the X650 didn't mind one bit. Why, it barely added any of its own heat to things, only hitting fifty nine by the time test five was over. For a while there, I thought the thermometer was faulty. Even better, the fan was barely spinning at all through the whole session.


Since you keep professing to have so much experience with Crossfire and SLI, why don't you be specific? What cards did you Crossfire, and for how long? What cards did you SLI, and for how long?
 
Haven't bought AMD cards for gaming machines since the 5800 series. I started with 1 5850, then 2, then 3. The problems with microstutter existed only when I went to crossfire. Framerates were incredible. The actual image on the screen was stroboscopic at certain times. The frequency of microstutter was fairly consistent. Certain actions would trigger it. Certain positions at corners of buildings. I could always count on a disco light show hopping into a tank in BFBC2 due to microstutter (it was like watching an old filmstrip movie with all the flickering going on). When the video quality wasn't blinking, I'll admit the performance was great. I did always have driver-related issues that weren't microstutter-related or crossfire-related. Wake from sleep. HDMI audio drivers failing to install. I could come up with a larger list if I felt like thinking about it hard enough, but I don't have to deal with them any longer.

But after a little over a year of no driver fix for the microstutter issue in BFBC2, I switched to first a single GTX 580. Then I wanted to see if microstutter was still perceivably present in all multi-GPU setups (as many people on the forums had indicated), so I picked up a second 580 for SLI. It was completely smooth. No strobe. When the 680s came out, I picked up two and sold my 580s. It was the same smooth performance. The 5850s were used on X58 and 1155 platforms. The 580s and 680s on X58 and X79 platform.

What was funny is a year and a half after BFBC2 was out and I had already gotten rid of my 5850s, the driver release notes indicated they fixed an issue with microstutter in BFBC2.

So since you stress the heck out of your PSU, you think everyone will have the same success drawing more power than the supply is rated to provide? That's like saying everyone else can take their i5 to 5.25GHz 24/7. Have you seen what jonnyguru had to say about the seasonic platinum series? Why would you discourage someone from getting a platinum series supply? They have received among the best reviews I've seen on that site.