What memory speed for Photoshop CS6? Massive images

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

I create huge gigapixel composite images. My last one was actually 104 36MP images combined into one to create a 1.4GP image. It is not unusual for me to shoot that many images, load them all in to Photoshop CS6 (64-bit) and do synchronized RAW adjustments on all them at once before I do the stitching operation. That's a lot of images and even my 24GB of RAM isn't enough - I am now planning to build a new image editing workstation and plan to build it on the Haswell 4770K (OCed like I did my i7-920) and will put 64GB or RAM on the MOB.

So, I constantly read how higher speed RAM (1866, 2100, 2400 etc) really provides no significant performance impact - but is that just for surfers and gamers? Will a mem intensive user like me benefit from say, 64GB or 1866, 2100, 2400..instead of 1600 RAM and by how much for this kind of use?

PS: Yes, I also already use might fast SSDs as well

Regards,
Mike

ronintexas · Mar 25, 2013

I would think your bottleneck is going to be RAM - and because you are using virtual memory to load a file that size, the RAM speed is going to have very little to do with processing a file that size. Do you know how much virtual memory is being used to process a file that size (look at task manager and how much RAM is being utilized by Photoshop).

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

I will check. It depends on how many images are loaded per composite- it varies, but the larger ones for sure need more memory and are definitely RAM constrained eve with the SSD giving me pretty good virtual memory performance.

Still, let's say I have enough RAM with 64GB for most of my work, will the RAM speed make much of a difference given all of that working data in RAM?

Regards,
Mike

ronintexas · Mar 25, 2013

The faster RAM, if you aren't utilizing 100% of it, will make a difference (i.e. the image takes 50GB of the 64GB RAM). Once you hit the limit of the RAM, the virtual memory takes over - and it will be slower than the RAM. Then either the SSD or the HDD will be the bottleneck.

When you load a file that size - I would look at CPU/RAM utilization to see what is going on - also, because of the number of files, and size, your anti-virus/malware programs could be slowing down the system as well.

I haven't create that large of an image in Photoshop, typically less than 50MP total in size, and 16GB RAM is enough for me. Without knowing the way that Photoshop utilizes the RAM and/or caches the images to disk, it would be very difficult to calculate total RAM size.

itzdanielp · Mar 25, 2013

To be honest, jumping from 1600 to 2133MHz won't be noticeable outside of synthetic benchmarks. And even in those you will only see around a 2% performance boost.

In gaming (I know, not apples to apples) you are still holding a ton of images and other files in RAM and you notice a 3fps increase on a good day.

Still, let's say that this is different, and photoshop will give you the 2% difference you will see in synthetic benchmarks. And let's say that a batch job takes you 1 hour with 1600MHz. It will drop it to 58 minutes and 48 seconds. Is 72 seconds worth 20% of a price increase (1600MHz to 2133MHz) over an hour long process?

Also, on a side note... I am not completely sure how you are planning on putting 64GB of RAM in a haswell build, as they only have 4 RAM slots, and 16GB Standard DIMM's are not currently available. (Yes, they have 16GB ECC DIMM's, but those won't work in consumer boards).

Your best bet is to go with a X79 system (or if you really don't mind waiting, wait for the IB-E) with either a 6-Core i7 (3930K) or an 8-Core Xeon (E5-2687ws). Photoshop is actually pretty good with multi-threaded workloads, and you will see a much bigger difference with the core count (12/16 vs 8) than with your RAM speed.

swifty_morgan · Mar 25, 2013

i know i should avoid this but what about using an msata ssd for virtual ram............. but then again it probably won't matter with 64gb ram..??

I also think perhaps a 6 0r 8core processor? a lot of data is going to be moving and I see everything getting taxed.

itzdanielp · Mar 25, 2013

swifty_morgan :

an msata SSD is going to be even slower than the SSD's he is currently using (more than likely)

ubercake · Mar 25, 2013

I would say your better with Photoshop and as much RAM as you can load onto the motherboard. Photoshop is one of those programs that allows you to specify how much of the systems RAM you will allocate for Photoshop use under program preferences.

If you're dealing with giant RAW files, RAM is where it's at because less will be going to virtual memory (disk), during basic operations. Less disk operations means faster performance.

Faster RAM will make a difference and like itzdanielp said, more CPU cores will help. An X79 platform would be good for you. Not only does it offer more cores/threads, you also get quad-channel memory on the X79 platform. Not only can you load it up with more RAM, you get the bandwidth of the quad-channel interface. You are definitely an X79 candidate.

J_E_D_70 · Mar 25, 2013

Assuming you already know this since you have 24GB now, but just in case... need Win 7 Pro or higher (or any Win 8) to support that much RAM.

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

J_E_D_70 :

Yes, I am running Win 7 Ultimate 64-bit and hte 64-bit version of CS6. Thanks, Mike

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

itzdanielp :

I am expecting a MOB that will take 8x8GB sticks; there are a few MOBs out there today that support 8x8. I think 64GB will be on the high end of what I'll need. Thanks. I tend to agree - the high speed RAM probably won't make much of a difference, but having enough capacity will. Regards, Mike

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

itzdanielp :

With 24GB of 1600 RAM now I am paging too much; I'll likely be fine north of 48GB with the rest of the 64GB being extra headroom for those rare massive loads (I actually have to use .PSB format in CS6 - that is the file format when the images exceed a certain size beyond what .PSD can handle). For the SSDs I am currently running a pair of Intel X25M 256GB Sata II SSDs in RAID 0 (system, apps, working data) and backup all to HDDs. My new Haswell rig I am gathering the components for now will a pair of Samsung Pro 512 SATA III SSDs in RAID 0 (and I'll finally get TRIM support which I am now lacking on my P6T MOB and not have to do manual TRIM maint anymore thank goodness). Regards, Mike

ncmike · Mar 25, 2013

ubercake :

Yes, will definitely be quad channel RAM. I am using 1600 RAM in my current rig. In the Haswell rig I am thinking of going with something a little fast, maybe 8 sticks of Corsair Dominator Platinum DDR3 1866 - might be overkill to go faster than that. Regards, Mike

ubercake · Mar 26, 2013

ncmike :

Haswell's looking to be a dual-channel memory bandwidth:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461.html

Your current i7-920 X58 build offers triple-channel. X79 Sandy Bridge-E platforms will give you quad-channel.

Tests actually show memory bandwidth for Haswell lower than Ivy Bridge and Sandy Bridge:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461-2.html

Quad-channel memory bandwidth is why I'm thinking an X79 platform is your best option. Your going to see better performance going with this than you would with slight performance increase by using faster RAM on a dual-channel interface.

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

ubercake :

ncmike :

Haswell's looking to be a dual-channel memory bandwidth:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461.html

Your current i7-920 X58 build offers triple-channel. X79 Sandy Bridge-E platforms will give you quad-channel.

Tests actually show memory bandwidth for Haswell lower than Ivy Bridge and Sandy Bridge:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461-2.html

Quad-channel memory bandwidth is why I'm thinking an X79 platform is your best option. Your going to see better performance going with this than you would with slight performance increase by using faster RAM on a dual-channel interface.

Grrrrrr, you are right, Haswell 4770K is looking like dual channel. Humm might have to rethink X79 Sandy Bridge-E. I do prefer higher OC speeds though, and no one yet knows how the 4770K will OC...
Thanks for pointing that out. Mike

itzdanielp · Mar 26, 2013

I am still confused how you are planning on getting 8 DIMMs on an Ivy-Bridge or a Haswell.

But it is definitely possible with X79.

Also, as much as we all like Overclocking. In this case more cores will be much more beneficial than more GHZ.

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

itzdanielp :

I am not considering Ivy Bridge. I am considering the Sandy-E six-core 3930K OCed to 4.8GHz on an Asus Rampage Extreme which will take 64GB or RAM. The other option is waiting for the Haswell 4770K and the yet to emerge MOBs for it and hoping ther ewill be Haswell MOBs that support 64GB of RAM. However, as pointed out, the 4770K is only 4-core and only dual channel RAM and OC headroom unknown yet but, has a lower TDP and I expect the Haswell MOBs to have more RAID-capable SATA III ports than the current LGA 2011 boards, but I decided to go with a pair of Samsung Pro 512 SSDs in RAID 0 so I can get by with just the pair of RAID-capable SATA III ports on the current MOBs.

Of course its always nagging in the back of the mind if and how long it will Intel will take to release a six core 4 channel Haswell....

Regards Mike

itzdanielp · Mar 26, 2013

That is the exact setup I would suggest going with.

Haswell itself will not be made with 6 core and quad channel memory, as that would be a complete redesign of the entire chipset.

IB-E, which may or may not be quad channel is not scheduled for another year or so, so Haswell-E (assuming they even make one) is probably about 3 years out.

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

itzdanielp :

Yes, I am coming to the same conclusions. While I might (and that is a big might) get higher OC clock with Haswell and more SATA III/6 RAID ports, its anyone's guess if the extra OC will be worth it, if any - and even if so the extra Haswell OC might be more than negated by the six core and quad channel of the 3930K. We're probably within 60 days of the real Haswell and MOB specs - so I and trying to decide if its worth holding out just so that I can avoid surprises, but me think the 3930K will be the best bet to carry me 2-3 years.

ubercake · Mar 26, 2013

That's why I recommended it. You are among the few that can really benefit from all the X79 platform has to offer.

From what I understand too, there will be no such thing as Ivy Bridge-E. I haven't heard anything otherwise. Usually Intel will release an enthusiast platform like X58 within a processor family, then we wait until the next big platform change (ie X79). Has anything been published or released with regard to IB-E?

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

ubercake :

OK, back to the basic question though - what memory for the 64GB? Mike

itzdanielp · Mar 26, 2013

ubercake :

Last I heard it will be released, but it was pushed back from Q3 '13 to at least Q4 '13. However I think it is just a new series of chips, that will probably still use LGA-2011 and possibly X79, or a minor upgrade to X79. It is not a complete refresh (ie X58 - X79)

ubercake · Mar 26, 2013

ncmike :

How much money do you have to spend on it?

You could pick up 1600Mhz Corsair Vengeance 8x8GB kits for $460. 2400Mhz Corsair Dominator 8x8GB kits run just over $1000. There are many speeds in between. Like I said, the faster RAM speed is really not going to get you a heck of a lot of performance. Each will give you some minute bit of improvement.

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

ubercake :

No limit cost wise, but don't want to waste money either. I was happy to have gone to 1600 for my i7-920 rig when everyone was saying don't need to go beyond 1333, so I'll probably do similar and go for 2133 this time and not sure if I should stick to 1.5V which I hear is best to do for Intel-based boards, but I do see some builds using 1.65v RAM. I don't typically OC my RAM - just use XMP. One kit I've considered is G.SKILL Ripjaws Z Series 32GB 2133 (Two 4 x 8GB kits at 1.5v for about $300 USD per 32GB kit for a total of $600.

Regards, Mike

ncmike · Mar 26, 2013

Thanks for all of the good advice. So here is my current build spec:

Components I Already Have in Hand

• Case: Coolermaster CM Storm Series Trooper. Yah, it's a beast, but I've loved my HAF-932 and this is a step up from that incredible case.
• PSU: Corsair AX1200i modular (yes, I will be driving at least one EVGA GTX 4GB 690, or two 680's at some later date)
• Cooler: Corsair H100i Hydro. I loved my H100, might even get the Corsair Link kit
• DVD BR: Two LG Blue Ray 14x rewriters
• SSDs: Two Samsung 840 Pro 512GB SSD (will run in RAID 0 array (OS, apps, and temp data)
• Main DATA HDDs: Two Seagate 3TB Sata III Baracuda HDDs
• CF/SD/SDXC Internal Reader: Uspeed USB3.0 3.5" multi card reader
• Display Card: I'll start out using my current 2GB Sapphire Toxic HD 5850. (Later I plan to upgrade to EVA GTX 680's or a 690 for gaming and some video editing higher end 30" monitor).

Yet to get

• CPU: Core i7-3930K Sandy- E OCed to a 4.8GHz target or better starting with a CPU ratio of 48 @1.35v (hopefully I get a good sample) on the H100i cooler, XMP mode.
• Motherboard: Asus Rampage IV Extreme 64GB Two SATA III RAID ports, 4 SATA II ports
• RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws Z Series 2x32GB kits @ 2133 (11-11-11-31)

My current rig I am moving to my studio is an i7-920 running 24GB 1600 RAM, a pair of SATA II Intel X25-M 256GB in RAID 0 on an H100 OCed to 4.0GHz -So between the 3930K, the additional RAM, and the pair of SATA III Samsung pro 512GB SSDs I am expecting a decent improvement for my main workstation. Regards, Mike

What memory speed for Photoshop CS6? Massive images

Distinguished

Judicious

Distinguished

Judicious

Splendid

Illustrious

Splendid

Splendid

Splendid

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Splendid

Splendid

Distinguished

Distinguished

Share this page