were the old CPU's cores whithout threads??

[davy rockstar]

hi guys

i had hear a lot of threading, but i have much doubts...

for example i have my phenom II and i know that it just have 4 cores, reading about the XBOX 360 processor it is a tricore with three threads so i was like "oh damn, so the 360 CPU is a 3 real cores and 3 "virtual" (as people use to call them) cores, so perhaps, cpuld that CPU be better than my actual phenom ii?"

latter i run the CPUID to check perfomance and stuff, so i figured that my phenom has one thread per core as well...

and after reading about threading my questions are:

does the thread is a phisical part of a core or a complement?
if this is so, does the old CPU's hadn't threads?

or is thread, just a property of the "newest" operative systems?
so all cores of a CPU has a thread, or has the property to do threading (and so make them multitasking, without any phisical modification on the structure of the cores)

or them both?

at this point i realize that my nerdiness has limits ):

 

[cbrunnem]

cpus have always had threads. a thread is just a pipeline capable of processing a process of some program. your cpu has 4 threads. now where is gets confusing is hyperthreading. hyperthreading on the desktop i7 is basically a better way to get performance out of 4 cores. typically a 4 core chip can run 4 threads at once but with hyperthreading it can run 8 threads. its not a octacore but just a 4 core with HT. the same thing will AMDs new bulldozer architecture kinda but they go a different route. they actually built a octacore cpu but eliminated some features of a typical core and made 2 cores share one. so a BD cpu has 4 modules that has independent and dependent resources kinda like HT.

 

[manofchalk]

A "thread" can be described as a stream of resources and processing power that can be dedicated to programs to make them run. Generally you have one thread per CPU core. Though with the introduction of Hyperthreading and similar technologies, leftover resources of each core can be leveraged to make another thread, hence to the computer acts as a "Virtual Core".
Whether a CPU has Hyperthreading or some equivalent technology, comes down to the CPU.

Performance comes down to more than just a core or thread count, I think you'l find that your Phenom far outperforms an Xbox360 CPU.

 

[davy rockstar]

cpus have always had threads. a thread is just a pipeline capable of processing a process of some program. your cpu has 4 threads. now where is gets confusing is hyperthreading. hyperthreading on the desktop i7 is basically a better way to get performance out of 4 cores. typically a 4 core chip can run 4 threads at once but with hyperthreading it can run 8 threads. its not a octacore but just a 4 core with HT. the same thing will AMDs new bulldozer architecture kinda but they go a different route. they actually built a octacore cpu but eliminated some features of a typical core and made 2 cores share one. so a BD cpu has 4 modules that has independent and dependent resources kinda like HT.

yeah, i had read about that technologies, but i didnt mean to go to the newer technology, but the older

but still, the thread or threads are part of each core, and they have their space in the CPU, isnt it?

 

[davy rockstar]

A "thread" can be described as a stream of resources and processing power that can be dedicated to programs to make them run. Generally you have one thread per CPU core. Though with the introduction of Hyperthreading and similar technologies, leftover resources of each core can be leveraged to make another thread, hence to the computer acts as a "Virtual Core".
Whether a CPU has Hyperthreading or some equivalent technology, comes down to the CPU.

Performance comes down to more than just a core or thread count, I think you'l find that your Phenom far outperforms an Xbox360 CPU.

but... that stream is part of the each core who have it, right? and resources as transistors?

yeah, no doubt about it, back then i thought that threading technology was just for intel processors, so i thought the 360 CPU was a monster (and it was, but years had pased)

 

[manofchalk]

A thread is a software concept, it isn't a physical part of the CPU. Its a way of allocating CPU resources to programs.

All CPU's can support threads, not just Intel. Just that Intel have developed Hyperthreading technology, which on the desktop at least no-one else has really followed. AMD have gone the route of just including more cores.

 

[davy rockstar]

A thread is a software concept, it isn't a physical part of the CPU. Its a way of allocating CPU resources to programs.

All CPU's can support threads, not just Intel. Just that Intel have developed Hyperthreading technology, which on the desktop at least no-one else has really followed. AMD have gone the route of just including more cores.

so, the more threads, the more resources?... then i wonder now, why the i3 processor has a better performance that my phenom x4?

 

[manofchalk]

Not all cores and architectures are created equally. Just because its a Quad core doesn't mean it will outperform a Dual core. More than just Core and thread counts matter when it comes to performance, it also involves the underlying CPU architecture.

Or skip all this and look at benchmarks. That will tell you what outperforms what.

 

[davy rockstar]

Not all cores and architectures are created equally. Just because its a Quad core doesn't mean it will outperform a Dual core. More than just Core and thread counts matter when it comes to performance, it also involves the underlying CPU architecture.

Or skip all this and look at benchmarks. That will tell you what outperforms what.

yeah, i know that really matters in performance is the IPS, and thanks a lot, you solve my doubts