Titan Owners: Are you fed up with Nvidia?

gridironcj · May 23, 2013

So I purchased 2 Titans back in March because I figured this would be Nvidia's top single GPU card for at least a year. Then comes the 780... essentially just as powerful as a Titan but with 3GB less vram for $350 less. Is $350 worth the premium of having GK110 3 months early? Not at all. Nvidia has officially pissed me off and I will be favoring AMD for my next set of cards. Nvidia has just shit on Titan owners by releasing pretty much the same card a few months later with the same specs (a few frames slower, same thing overall) for a cheaper price. I hope I'm in good company here because every Titan owner should be pissed at Nvidia for this.

Snipergod87 · May 23, 2013

Everyone knew this would happen, there is something that always comes out in the future at a lower price which has close to similar or better performance. That being said the Titan is still more powerful then a 780.

JD88 · May 23, 2013

You have a point, but you also agreed to shell out $1000 for something that everyone knew at the time was priced far over it's value. Name branding and having the best at the time is what you paid for and got.

You can favor AMD if you want, the but fact remains that they have nothing that can currently compete with Nvidia's Titan or 690, and who knows if that will change anytime soon. With AMD's current driver problems, the 7990 is something of a joke. Part of Nvidia's ability to set insane price points is their competitive advantage relative to AMD.

gridironcj · May 23, 2013

JD88 :

It's kind of funny, because this duopoly is actually producing worse results for the consumer than a pure monopoly would. If Nvidia was the only GPU developer, I'm sure they wouldn't be releasing the same card 3 months later for a cheaper price since they wouldn't need to. I'm sure the 8970 or whatever the next AMD flagship is called will be more powerful than a Titan. I mean, it sort of has to. The driver problems with AMD are a bit of a turn off, so that could be an issue. I also don't want my CPU running PhysX. That's a job meant for a dedicated GPU.

Yes, there is always something more powerful coming out in the future at a lower price. I was just not expecting the same company to release essentially the same card for a significantly cheaper price point just 3 months later. I would have gotten 3 780s, which would have been exactly the performance I want because 2 Titans still isn't cutting it for me.

Mousemonkey · May 23, 2013

gridironcj :

JD88 :

It's kind of funny, because this duopoly is actually producing worse results for the consumer than a pure monopoly would. If Nvidia was the only GPU developer, I'm sure they wouldn't be releasing the same card 3 months later for a cheaper price since they wouldn't need to. I'm sure the 8970 or whatever the next AMD flagship is called will be more powerful than a Titan. I mean, it sort of has to. The driver problems with AMD are a bit of a turn off, so that could be an issue. I also don't want my CPU running PhysX. That's a job meant for a dedicated GPU.

Yes, there is always something more powerful coming out in the future at a lower price. I was just not expecting the same company to release essentially the same card for a significantly cheaper price point just 3 months later. I would have gotten 3 780s, which would have been exactly the performance I want because 2 Titans still isn't cutting it for me.

More fool you then because its been talked about for months and today's launch date was known about ages ago. :pfff:

MyNewRig · May 23, 2013

That is really funny in a provocative way!

You had $2000 to burn, not only on one but TWO extremely overpriced elitist card release that was not even a part of any family or series of cards but was clearly only released for barging rights for those who have some extra money laying around.

I would not expect someone who put so much money on such items would be such price sensitive like the budget bound enthusiast who would favor a card over the other because it is $50 or so less, you have been part of a very elite group for 3 months and you still are and that is what you paid for.

You say that two Titan cards aren't cutting it for you? what is your use-case? with the two Titans you have, you can run the most demanding NextGen titles on 4K resolutions for above or near 60FPS, what else would you really want to do?

For the average enthusiast like myself i perceive the GTX 780 as a dirt expensive, overpriced card for the performance it delivers, as it is very close to a $400-450 7970Ghz clocked at around 1200Ghz in most benchmarks, you are looking for around 8FPS difference tops for much less money. for me i want the GTX to be a max of $500, because this is its fair value for the performance it delivers and has been the price point asked for all previous gen high-end cards, and i am expecting it to reach this price point within next month, will you be more pissed off by then? I don't think you should be, because if you were so much price sensitive you would have not bought two GPUs @ $1000 each when they were not clearly 3 times the performance of current $400 cards!

17seconds · May 23, 2013

You can always sell each of your Titans for pretty much the cost of a GTX 780 if that's what you want. The Titan is the better card overall though, they are not equal.

I do think you've hit on a key marketing strategy though. Produce a card that is a cut down version of the expensive one, price the new card way too high, but a "bargain" in contrast to the expensive one, sit back and watch while people buy up every one of the very overpriced second level cards because they perceive it as a relative value.

It worked for the GTX 670, which as you may recall was selling for $450 up until a few months ago, but is still far and away the best-selling video card in the performance segment today. Why? Because "It's only 5% less performance and yet $100 less expensive" (as we read all the time on these forums).

MyNewRig · May 23, 2013

Still despite all of Nvidia's sick marketing gimmicks and the "relative value" game that they are playing, add to that the milking of their 600 series as 700 series with some name changing and spiced up specs, the AMD 7970 is still a much much better deal, with performance way above the GTX 680 and just too close or even exceed the GTX 780 according to Toms review of the GTX 780 released today. especially when you are getting 4 AAA game titles with it for free!!

I don't see any point of buying the GTX 780 at 650USD/700EUR price point unless Nvidia drop that card's price down to 500 bucks!

I think whoever buys that 780 at its current price will come back complaining like our friend at the OP above

gridironcj · May 23, 2013

MyNewRig :

Here's the thing, if AMD released a single GPU card that was almost on par with a Titan for $650, that's fine considering they're the competition. However, Nvidia releasing the same card with a different name for a cheaper price and with almost identical performance only a few months later is absurd. I'm complaining about the premium regarding getting the GK110 3 months early. It is not worth $350 per card for a 3-month premium. I knew the 780 was coming, but I did not expect it to be so close to the Titan, which is now illogical to buy considering you can get the same card with a little less vram for $350 less. You can get 3 780s for less than 2 Titans and get significantly better performance.

Yes, 2 Titans don't cut it for me and I was going to get a Titan Ultra (if it's compatible in SLI with normal Titans) whenever those are released. No, you can't max out any game in 4K with 2 Titans. Hell, I can't really even max out everything on 2560x1440. Prime example: Metro Last Light. I play with Advanced PhysX on, everything maxed out with SSAAx2 at 2560x1440. I definitely don't get 60FPS on average. I'd say it's close to 50FPS average, which is not ideal. Perhaps my preferences are very high-end, but 2 Titans certainly isn't overkill like many think it is.

caydn12 · May 23, 2013

Ummm.. Lol?
You bought Nvidia.. What do expect? You overpay because they are the mainstream company..
Sure Adidas has far better quality, and comfort, than Nike.. But cmon man.. It's Nike! Of course its more expensive.
Same with Nvidia and AMD

cookybiscuit · May 23, 2013

It's not like there was any value for money in it when it was first released, so coming out now and saying the Titan is a rip off is a bit silly.

Meanwhile, cheap Titans for everyone!

Factory OC'd 780 beats Titan.

bystander · May 23, 2013

Any time you buy the cutting edge card, such as the Intel extreme CPU's, and the Titan, you do not do it for value. You have to know that within a few months to a year, you can get the same thing for half the price. That is how the cutting edge market is.

That said, the Titan is far better for Double precision compute. A lot of the Titan's are being used for CUDA in the professional world, and they are still great for that.

17seconds · May 23, 2013

You can also OC the Titan.

renz496 · May 23, 2013

afaik nvidia was clear when releasing the titan that it will serve the ultra enthuasist and as an entry level card for developer that interested developing their software for compute and CUDA related stuff. even nvidia themselves are underistimating the popularity of titan. when titan was able to out sell gtx690 in 3 months even nvidia themselves was surprised with that. personally i believe most of the titan sold were in the hands of developer that interested with titan DP performannce that are not quite ready to dumps thousands of credit on full fledge tesla K20X board. unlike titan GTX780 will not going to have the priviledge to use DP like the titan did.

ubercake · May 23, 2013

caydn12 :

Not the same... The difference is... Adidas don't come with built-in microstutter.

gridironcj · May 23, 2013

caydn12 :

So AMD has far better quality? I understand AMD is great for price per performance, but you can't tell me that their products are of superior quality and not sound silly. AMD's top GPU doesn't even come close to the GK110. Not to mention everything else that matters:
- Power consumption
- Acoustics
- Multi-GPU quality
- Exclusive features (PhysX, GPU Boost, overclocking your monitor, etc.)
- Architecture
Nvidia is superior in all of these regards, although it is more expensive. Like I said before, I'm just pissed that Nvidia would essentially drop the Titan's price this quickly (I consider the 780 a price drop of the Titan since it's the same card with less vram). I don't even know what the point of the 780 is except piss off people that bought a Titan. Yes, obviously new technology is always on the horizon, but 3 months after by the same company? That's a bit much. I will give AMD a chance if they can produce a 30+% jump over the Titan and fix their Crossfire stuttering crap because I would definitely be purchasing 2-3 cards. AMD needs to pick up their game and not just throw a bunch of free games into a bundle because Nvidia is able to "overprice" since their competition is so lacking.

caydn12 · May 23, 2013

Actually... AMD's 7000 series vs Nvidias 600 series they were better..
7970 definitely beat the 680.
You can't compare a titan to a $400 graphics card lol

gridironcj · May 23, 2013

caydn12 :

Be more specific. GTX 680 vs. HD 7970: GTX 680 wins (flagship vs. flagship). Just scroll up and look at the relative performance chart. Even the GHz edition loses in that illustration.

Yes, I can compare a Titan to a $400 graphics card: the Titan is a superior single-GPU card to the 7970. There, I just did it. My points about Nvidia being superior have nothing to do with price. A Honda Accord has better price per performance vs. any Ferrari. Obviously the Ferrari is a superior vehicle for performance purposes in general. I hope AMD does well because it'll stop Nvidia from being able to sell a single GPU card at $1,000 since there will be competition. The reality is, AMD currently cannot compete with Nvidia's top GPU. End of story.

dave0510 · May 23, 2013

If you bought the GTX Titan because it's the fastest single card solution on the market 3 months ago, then it's still the fastest single card solution today. You can overclock the 780, but then you can also overclock the Titan. The Titan was always a halo product. If you wanted to be cost effective you would've bought a 690. 10% performance over the 780 is not negligible or statistically insignificant. You got your fastest single card (still is) and the other bragging rights of owning a Titan. Not sure what you're complaining about.
You then start talking about how this duopoly produces a worst outcome for consumers. What? Titan owners who are pissed about the 780 are only a small subset of all consumers. A very small one. Some Titan owners are too rich to care, some bought it for the compute power. On the other hand, now many consumers benefit from being able to buy a slightly slower Titan for 650 dollars. Please don't taint your arguments with your own anger, it just hurts your case.

17seconds · May 24, 2013

VRAM is expensive. 6GB vs. 3GB, as useless as it is, is still going to command a price premium.

caydn12 · May 24, 2013

gridironcj :

Oh, and this makes me laugh a lot. See Tom's Hardware released some benchmarks today:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-780-performance-review,3516.html

If you go ahead and look at them, since they are very up-to-date (uploaded today), you will see that out of the 8 games they tested, the GTX 680 beat the Radeon HD 7970 on 0 of them..
Yep, it couldn't even win in borderlands 2 which is "optimized for Nvidia".
Poor Nvidia fanboys still saying that more money means better. But, apparently some people have to throw their money down the drain.

gridironcj · May 24, 2013

caydn12 :

I could do that too.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_780_review,1.html

Reference 680 beats reference 7970 in most of these. Regardless, that's not the point. You're not getting my point and I don't think you ever will because you're too caught up in "AMD IS DA BEST AND U SUCK." Your horrible grammar and inability to understand my argument makes that quite obvious.

For the last time, I made the statement that Nvidia is able to price their top cards so high because AMD simply has no answer in terms of competition. They don't have a single GPU to compete with the GK110. Their answer was the 7990 and that's a dual GPU card, which AMD is infamously horrible for in terms of frametime. Just take a look at the link you shared with me and look at the frametime charts. The 7990 is horrid and no super enthusiast would ever purchase it. I would welcome AMD with open arms if they released something competitive with Nvidia's best. The reality is, they currently cannot compete. Hence, higher prices from Nvidia. I'm a super enthusiast. Hell, I have 2 Titans, clearly I want the best of the best and AMD simply does not offer anything for someone like me. Now, for someone who simply wants to play at 1080p with decent framerates and little-to-no antialiasing, a single 7970 is a nice choice due to the price per performance and if you can handle the horrible acoustics. Beyond that, you're jumping into uncomfortable territory with Crossfire. Yeah, it's that bad and all of the super enthusiasts choose Nvidia cards for a reason. Take a look at all of the top benchmarks out there, all Nvidia cards. CPU benchmarks records are all with Intel cards. AMD offers affordable products that are not of the same quality as Nvidia and Intel. Why do you think the new consoles all have AMD GPUs in them? It's cheaper.

17seconds · May 24, 2013

gridironcj :

caydn12 :

I could do that too.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_780_review,1.html

Reference 680 beats reference 7970 in most of these. Regardless, that's not the point. You're not getting my point and I don't think you ever will because you're too caught up in "AMD IS DA BEST AND U SUCK." Your horrible grammar and inability to understand my argument makes that quite obvious.

For the last time, I made the statement that Nvidia is able to price their top cards so high because AMD simply has no answer in terms of competition. They don't have a single GPU to compete with the GK110. Their answer was the 7990 and that's a dual GPU card, which AMD is infamously horrible for in terms of frametime. Just take a look at the link you shared with me and look at the frametime charts. The 7990 is horrid and no super enthusiast would ever purchase it. I would welcome AMD with open arms if they released something competitive with Nvidia's best. The reality is, they currently cannot compete. Hence, higher prices from Nvidia. I'm a super enthusiast. Hell, I have 2 Titans, clearly I want the best of the best and AMD simply does not offer anything for someone like me. Now, for someone who simply wants to play at 1080p with decent framerates and little-to-no antialiasing, a single 7970 is a nice choice due to the price per performance and if you can handle the horrible acoustics. Beyond that, you're jumping into uncomfortable territory with Crossfire. Yeah, it's that bad and all of the super enthusiasts choose Nvidia cards for a reason. Take a look at all of the top benchmarks out there, all Nvidia cards. CPU benchmarks records are all with Intel cards. AMD offers affordable products that are not of the same quality as Nvidia and Intel. Why do you think the new consoles all have AMD GPUs in them? It's cheaper.

The funny thing is that the GTX 770 will be out in a week beating everything but the GTX 780 and Titan. At that point, you'll have a situation where the top three Nvidia cards will be faster than the top AMD card.

shamsmu · May 24, 2013

and unlike Titan, the gtx780 would have several high overclockable variations like Asus Direct cu II top, msi PE and lightning, EVGA ftw etc. I think the gtx780 would outperform the titan at the end of the day.

oh wait just realised it already is lol

mactronix · May 24, 2013

Swings and roundabouts really.
AMD really took the mick with the pricing on the 7 series when it launched and have been returning less performance for more of an increase over the last couple of generations.
I personally have always used AMD cards but that was always a price perf decision at the time of purchase so you could say that proves that in the long run they have been better value over all here in the UK.
Titan was always a bleeding edge product not even considered a mainstream consumer card.
You pays your money you takes your chance as they say.

Mactronix

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