Custom loop vs Closed loop ?

GustavoGimpel · May 30, 2013

Hello everyone!
First of all, sorry for the stupid questions i'm about to ask, but i'm completely new to water cooling, and I'm kind of confused about what to do and what to buy.
Is a custom loop much better than a closed loop? If it it, does the extra performance worths the higher price? There is much difference between the XSPC 750 RS240 Raystorm and the Corsair H100i? And what about the H100i in push/pull with 4 NF-F12s?

Personally I think the Raystorm looks better, but it's highly overpriced here in Brazil, about 530 USD, and the H100i is about 180 USD (believe it or not, these are the best deals I could find...) Does it worth the price? Or should I stick with Corsair? Which one has more chances of leaking? Beside these 2 options, do you have any other recommendations?

By the way, I only want to water cool my CPU, not the GPUs...

I don't know if it makes any difference at all, but this is my rig:
AMD FX-8350 4.8Ghz
NZXT Phantom 410
Noctua NH-D14
Crosshair V Formula-Z
NZXT Hale90 1000W
G.Skill Ares 2133Mhz
Corsair Force GT 60GB
2x1TB Seagate Barracuda RAID0
2x XFX Radeon 7970

Thanks for your time and for any help!!

CommentariesAnd More · May 30, 2013

Buy the Corsair H100i. Its performance is just as good as the Raystorm. The Advantage of Custom Loop is GPU Cooling , but since you are not interested in that go for the Corsair H100i , Its awesome and Corsair Link Compatible. Once you buy tell me your experience , Looking forward to that since I might buy one too.

CommentariesAnd More · May 30, 2013

About Push-Pull , Its good and you should do it if your case has enough space. I would Recommend the Corsair SP120's though.

GustavoGimpel · May 30, 2013

SP120s are better than the NF-F12s? I think there is enough space in my case for push/pull config. But how exactly do they perform (Raystorm and H100i)? 5ºC difference? More or less? And which one has more leaking chances? I don't want to ruin my precious 7970s

Another thing I forgot to ask is about the noise between those 2. And do you guys know better cooling options? Please share if you do :bounce:

bryonhowley · May 30, 2013

Agree buy the H100i and if your case can support it do a push/pull. My two AMD rigs I went for a custom XSPC setup but could not afford that with the higher price of intel rigs. So when I built my intel i5 rig in January I went for the H100i and I must say the performance was much better that I would have thought it would be. While my temps are not quite as low as the custom loop's they are not bad at all and at full load they are very close.

CommentariesAnd More · May 30, 2013

GustavoGimpel :

Q1. A - The SP120 High Airflow Edition is way too fast than the F12.
Q2. A - IMHO The H100i will outperform the Raystorm. Corsair says that under full load an i7-3770K on 4.6GHz stays on 47.94 Celsius. That's impressive for any water cooler. However I think the NH-D14 should satisfy your needs TBH. Just Sayin.
Q3. A -Closed Loop is much secure as they are fitted tight as hell. More ever , Corsair will pay for the damage caused by their coolers if any. Whereas in custom loop you do it at your own risk. So if anything is caused , you are responsible for it.
Q4. A - I think H100i is a great one you can get. See those options though -
http://www.nzxt.com/product/detail/83-kraken-x60-cpu-cooler
http://www.thermaltake.com/products-model.aspx?id=C_00002065

manofchalk · May 30, 2013

A custom loop is better than a CLC loop, even if you just stick with CPU cooling. However at the prices your looking at, custom cooling's dismal price/performance gets even worse. At those prices its probably even worth importing parts from the US before you buy locally.

I wouldn't bother with a Push/Pull setup on a H100, the benefit of doing so is increased Static Pressure, which is only needed on thicker and higher FPI radiators, which the H100i is neither. Besides, the fans that comes with the H100i are decent, I believe their just re-painted SP120's.

:lol:
H100i outperforming a Raystorm kit, good joke

.
The Raystorm kit was plenty more going for it than the H100i, it will perform better for a number of reasons.

The chances of a custom loop leaking are inversely proportional to the amount of time and effort you spend researching and assembling the loop. You make a stupid decision like putting 3/4" tubing on 1/2" barbs and don't bother leak testing, expect bad things to happen. Do it right and the thing will never spill a drop.

Have a look at the Swiftech H220, its a unit that sits between a CLC and Custom loop, you can expand on it and it uses proper water-cooling grade components (an actual DDC pump and Copper tubed radiator, rather than the weak 6W pumps and Aluminium rads on a Corsair Hydro).

CommentariesAnd More · May 30, 2013

manofchalk :

A custom loop is better than a CLC loop, even if you just stick with CPU cooling. However at the prices your looking at, custom cooling's dismal price/performance gets even worse. At those prices its probably even worth importing parts from the US before you buy locally.

I wouldn't bother with a Push/Pull setup on a H100, the benefit of doing so is increased Static Pressure, which is only needed on thicker and higher FPI radiators, which the H100i is neither. Besides, the fans that comes with the H100i are decent, I believe their just re-painted SP120's.

:lol:
H100i outperforming a Raystorm kit, good joke

.
The Raystorm kit was plenty more going for it than the H100i, it will perform better for a number of reasons.

The chances of a custom loop leaking are inversely proportional to the amount of time and effort you spend researching and assembling the loop. You make a stupid decision like putting 3/4" tubing on 1/2" barbs and don't bother leak testing, expect bad things to happen. Do it right and the thing will never spill a drop.

Have a look at the Swiftech H220, its a unit that sits between a CLC and Custom loop, you can expand on it and it uses proper water-cooling grade components (an actual DDC pump and Copper tubed radiator, rather than the weak 6W pumps and Aluminium rads on a Corsair Hydro).

Maybe I was wrong. The Raystorm might beat the H100i. But look those prices. And the H220 will be a great choice. But it might be expensive too.

GustavoGimpel · May 30, 2013

manofchalk :

Thanks for the reply!! Everything in Brazil is expensive, and importing the parts from USA is going to be annoying... The raystorm RS240 kit is about 180$ at amazon. I could get it for at least 300$ (USD), because of the importing taxes and s**t..

But if it is worth the price and the effort, I could go for the RS240 (The Phantom 410 only supports 240mm radiators), pay 300$ and wait about 45 days for it to arrive. I could not find the Swiftech H220 here in Brazil... how does it work?

And before I forgot, I was searching the prices of the SP120s and the F12s and, the SP120 Performance Edition is about 32 USD and the NF12 about 25 USD. But, unfortunately the SP120 Performance Edition is sold out in all the Brazilian stores :heink:

. They only have the Quiet Edition, which I guess it's not good enough and it's the same price as the NF-F12.

The only Complete Custom Loop kit that I could find here is the RS240 and 360. Would be better to buy the parts or the kit itself?

Thanks again!!

bebop460 · May 30, 2013

From what I've read (quite a lot), with Closed Loop vs Custom Loop there's really no comparison.

I agree with ManofChalk in that XSPC kits are far superior to a Corsair set up. Closed loop coolers are on par or sometimes worse than a decent air cooler.

I'd suggest buying some decent high cfm/low db case fans (Silverstone's are nice, but everyone has there fav.s), and a heatsink with push/pull and save the money/potential aggravation/damage from closed loop coolers.

IMO, it's not worth it unless you step up to a custom loop.

manofchalk · May 31, 2013

Custom water-cooling arguable is never worth the price, especially if your situation where the parts are even more expensive than usual. If your trying to go at this upgrade from a value angle, dont go for custom water outright.
As with near everything with computers, there is diminishing returns for your investment. As you go up the performance ladder it costs more to go up a rung each time, and custom water is pretty close to the top.

The H220 is like a normal CLC in that you receive the unit pre-assembled and filled, and you mount it to the CPU and case and its just done. However its using much higher grade components (pump and rad I mentioned before) that are typically found in custom loops. Its tubing is munted in a similar way to custom loops (rather than directly built in, it uses Barbs+Clamps) and can be changed, allowing you to put more components in the loop if you wanted.
In some ways you could consider it like a Raystorm kit that offers the simplicity of CLC cooling, or the flexibility of custom if you want it. Though personally, I think if your going to go custom then just get a custom loop outright. Because eventually the combined CPU Block/Pump will limit what you can do.

The SP120's are actually better than the AF120's, they are far more suited for Static Pressure (hence being called SP) while the AF's are more for CFM which means how much air is moved in a free flow enviroment (Airflow so AF). In radiator usage, static pressure is what your concerned about.
Static Pressure can be described as how hard the air is being pushed by the fan, while CFM is just the volume of air moved.

However the Noctua NF-12's are even better than that, so go for them if you can stand the colour scheme :lol:.
If your going to go with a H100i, wouldnt bother replacing the fans.

Often the kit is a better value than buying the or equivalent parts seperately, but usually an RS240 kit isn't $300 so it might be different in your case.

CommentariesAnd More · May 31, 2013

manofchalk :

Custom water-cooling arguable is never worth the price, especially if your situation where the parts are even more expensive than usual. If your trying to go at this upgrade from a value angle, dont go for custom water outright.
As with near everything with computers, there is diminishing returns for your investment. As you go up the performance ladder it costs more to go up a rung each time, and custom water is pretty close to the top.

The H220 is like a normal CLC in that you receive the unit pre-assembled and filled, and you mount it to the CPU and case and its just done. However its using much higher grade components (pump and rad I mentioned before) that are typically found in custom loops. Its tubing is munted in a similar way to custom loops (rather than directly built in, it uses Barbs+Clamps) and can be changed, allowing you to put more components in the loop if you wanted.
In some ways you could consider it like a Raystorm kit that offers the simplicity of CLC cooling, or the flexibility of custom if you want it. Though personally, I think if your going to go custom then just get a custom loop outright. Because eventually the combined CPU Block/Pump will limit what you can do.

The SP120's are actually better than the AF120's, they are far more suited for Static Pressure (hence being called SP) while the AF's are more for CFM which means how much air is moved in a free flow enviroment (Airflow so AF). In radiator usage, static pressure is what your concerned about.
Static Pressure can be described as how hard the air is being pushed by the fan, while CFM is just the volume of air moved.

However the Noctua NF-12's are even better than that, so go for them if you can stand the colour scheme :lol:.
If your going to go with a H100i, wouldnt bother replacing the fans.

Often the kit is a better value than buying the or equivalent parts seperately, but usually an RS240 kit isn't $300 so it might be different in your case.

Mate , your not getting it. He lives in Brazil. And it doesn't make sense to get something anywhere out of your residential country as if the part is defective you will end up going through the trouble of RMA and courier fees to the company service center. So I say it does not make any sense.

manofchalk · May 31, 2013

I realize that he is in Brazil and parts are way more expensive, I acknowledge it at least twice in that quote. I was just answering his questions because it seems that despite the price he is considering it.

GustavoGimpel · May 31, 2013

Thanks everyone for the replies!!
I was going for a custom kit ( The raystorm ) and cool down my 7970 also, but unfortunately my Corsair Force GT died yesterday (some minutes after my last awnser here, everything just froze and after reboot my BIOS wasn't detecting the drive any longer) so, since my HDD is full and I can't install windows on it, and no one from Corsair helps me, neither anyone from hardware forums, my new computer is unusable until I save some money and buy a new SSD, which will take about 2 months

. So, or the raystorm goes to the end of the year or I could go for the H100i for the price in August.

I was very tempted to get the H220 but I could not find it here, so i'm stuck with RS240 and H100i... What do you guys think? H100i in August or RS240 at the end of the year?

bebop460 · May 31, 2013

For your GT, did you try the number here: http://www.corsair.com/us/company/contact/ ? You can also email tech support there.

Did you try their forums http://forum.corsair.com/v3/index.php ? They have a stupid system where you have to register and login to see the tech support direct number. Hopefully they can help you there.

If you don't make out with Corsair, you could get a cheap HDD and use it as a boot drive until you get an SSD, then transfer the drive image to the SSD and use the HDD for storage.

I'd try to scrape by on air/stock cooler and upgrade to the H220 when you can afford it. It sounds to me like it will offer you the convenience of a closed loop, but you can expand it in the future; the best of both worlds really. I don't know the price/shipping/rma implications in your area though.

GustavoGimpel · May 31, 2013

I tried sending e-mails, logging in and doing that ticket stuff, and their Live Help has been offline for 2 days. No answer and has been 24 hours I sent everything to them.

I did look in their forums and it seems that most of the dead SSDs came back to life after a couple of hours and a CMOS reset. I tried doing the reset, and to boot up after 30 mins, then after 2 hours, then 15 hours, with no luck. The most strange thing is that the SSD, when plugged in, gets warm like if it was working.

A cheap HDD here is about 75 - 85 USD, a 160GB, SATA II 5400rpm ( slow as s**t ), so I don't think it's a good idea, I rather use my notebook until I get a new one...

About the H220, I could not find it here in Brazil, and importing it will be a big headache and I don't have an internacional credit card.. So i'm stuck with the RS240 and H100i.

CommentariesAnd More · Jun 1, 2013

GustavoGimpel :

Try another SATA port and change your wire. Try removing the SATA power cable and plug in another one. Maybe it will solve the issue. Also the H220 is a great choice , But be beware of warranty.

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