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i7 4770k Haswell or i7 3770k cooling question...

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June 8, 2013 3:20:59 PM

I'm getting the i7 4770k Haswell or i7 3770k for my new build. It sounds like the new Haswells get very hot. I was planning on getting the Cooler Master Hyper EVO "new one" for cooling, $35. Will this cool the new Haswell adequately? If it will I'll get it. This is the only thing I'm really nervous about with the Haswell.
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June 8, 2013 3:23:21 PM

Do you plan on overclocking?
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June 8, 2013 3:29:48 PM

Haswel and Ivy Bridge both get very hot due to Intel using crappy thermal paste between the die and Integrated Heat Spreader instead of solder like they used to. Go with Haswel. A 212 evo will do great on both CPUs. You should reach about 4.4GHz with fine temps if you get an average chip.
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June 8, 2013 3:33:45 PM

marshal11 said:
Haswel and Ivy Bridge both get very hot due to Intel using crappy thermal paste between the die and Integrated Heat Spreader instead of solder like they used to. Go with Haswel. A 212 evo will do great on both CPUs. You should reach about 4.4GHz with fine temps if you get an average chip.


recent press is claiming Intel cherry picked their samples to reviewers... it's looking like 4.2 might be the top average overclock on air.

i know IB could do better then that. So my suggestion would be to go IB unless you have a need for 6 SATA 3 ports, or an overiding desire to save $0.50 on his monthly power bill.

If those temp reports are accurate, the hyper evo might not be a one size fits all cheap cpu cooling solution anymore, with most haswell requiring H100i or better to scrape up to 4.4ghz... and many overheating at turbo (4.0)
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June 8, 2013 3:35:37 PM

slomo4sho said:
Do you plan on overclocking?



Yes I plan on Overclocking.

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June 8, 2013 3:37:58 PM

ingtar33 said:
marshal11 said:
Haswel and Ivy Bridge both get very hot due to Intel using crappy thermal paste between the die and Integrated Heat Spreader instead of solder like they used to. Go with Haswel. A 212 evo will do great on both CPUs. You should reach about 4.4GHz with fine temps if you get an average chip.


recent press is claiming Intel cherry picked their samples to reviewers... it's looking like 4.2 might be the top average overclock on air.


^ This.

Interesting read. Even with an H100i they are getting 98C! at 4.7Ghz. Sounds like a dead chip in weeks. I would go with an Ivy Bridge CPU if you plan on overclocking. Hopefully a new stepping in a few months will fix Haswell. If not sounds like Intel loses the overclocking market.

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2013/06/06/haswel...
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June 8, 2013 3:41:57 PM

I have also heard somebody's i7 4770k might perform better than someone else's i7 4770k. There is like a top 10%. Is this true???
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June 8, 2013 3:51:01 PM

CarterT said:
I have also heard somebody's i7 4770k might perform better than someone else's i7 4770k. There is like a top 10%. Is this true???


That' true with all CPUs to a certain extent. When Sandy Bridge came out a certain percentage of them could only hit 4.2Ghz another certain percent could hit 4.5Ghz and so on to some that can run at 5Ghz+ on air with safe temps and voltage. It really depends on what part of the silicon wafer the CPU came from when it was manufactured.

There is certainly a "CPU lottery". This is somewhat not as prevalent in later revisions of a CPU line. So the first run of a CPU line is more likely to be hit or miss than one made when the process is more mature.
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June 8, 2013 4:28:08 PM

Get the Haswell, OC also depends on the motherboard from what I have seen the Asus Z87 Pro is an excellent board for this purpose. Thus far most have been able to hit around 4.4Ghz on i7 haswell CPU's. Temps go crazy after 1.25v, so if your keep the voltage below that than yes a Hyper Evo can aid a mild overclock
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June 8, 2013 6:03:18 PM

Doing some more research among forums of normal users, it seems that Haswell hates overclocking. HOWEVER. A 4.2GHz haswell would be like a 4.5GHz Ivy Bridge. Chances are you will get higher than 4.2GHz too because it's not the average. It seems the average is about 4.4, like I previously stated. The "cherry picked" CPUs from Intel were able to hit 4.8. Even if you aren't able to get passed 4.2GHz, I say it's still worth it as 1150 will have an upgrade path where 1155 is a end of the line socket.

You can always de-lid as well. I just delidded my 3770k yesterday using the vice method, which is probably the easiest thing I've ever done. Just wedge it in a vice upside down, get a block of wood, and smack the other end of the wood to knock off the CPU from the IHS. Apply some CLU and watch your temps drop 15-25c. Took me literally 10 minutes. I went from 90c to 65c with my 4.8GHz overclock and because of the lower temp I am able to hit 5GHz, but at a ridiculous and dangerous voltage. It was still fun to run some tests at 5GHz and watch my crazy scores, including my above 10.00 score in Cinebench which I've been trying to achieve forever (Got 10.07) :D  .
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June 8, 2013 6:13:06 PM

Sandy Bridge still remains as Intel greatest achievement
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June 8, 2013 6:52:58 PM

redeemer said:
Sandy Bridge still remains as Intel greatest achievement


Actually Core2 was probably more of a game changer. It was 40% faster than the old Netburst Pentium 4 architecture it replaced. Sandy Bridge is still a great series though.
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June 8, 2013 7:57:57 PM

anort3 said:
redeemer said:
Sandy Bridge still remains as Intel greatest achievement


Actually Core2 was probably more of a game changer. It was 40% faster than the old Netburst Pentium 4 architecture it replaced. Sandy Bridge is still a great series though.


Core 2 definitely was a game changer no doubt, Sandy Bridge overclocking is just Godly
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June 8, 2013 8:04:44 PM

^ great point right there. The average Sandy overclocked performance keeps up to Haswell overclocked performance, which is 2 generations ahead. If you have good enough cooling it's almost guaranteed you can hit 5GHz on sandy. 5GHz on Ivy requires either LN2 or a delid with good cooling IF you get a decent chip that will go that far. Haswell, you need either LN2 and lots of luck or a delid with good cooling and lots of luck just to get to 4.7GHz.
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June 8, 2013 8:06:56 PM

redeemer said:
anort3 said:
redeemer said:
Sandy Bridge still remains as Intel greatest achievement


Actually Core2 was probably more of a game changer. It was 40% faster than the old Netburst Pentium 4 architecture it replaced. Sandy Bridge is still a great series though.


Core 2 definitely was a game changer no doubt, Sandy Bridge overclocking is just Godly


considering they both are based on the old Pentium 4-M architecture, i'd say that was the true game changer... but lets not quibble. Intel with it's insane R&D budget stumbled upon a golden chip design with the Pentium 4 M, and has rode that horse as far as it will take them.
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June 9, 2013 12:38:03 PM

marshal11 said:
Doing some more research among forums of normal users, it seems that Haswell hates overclocking. HOWEVER. A 4.2GHz haswell would be like a 4.5GHz Ivy Bridge. Chances are you will get higher than 4.2GHz too because it's not the average. It seems the average is about 4.4, like I previously stated. The "cherry picked" CPUs from Intel were able to hit 4.8. Even if you aren't able to get passed 4.2GHz, I say it's still worth it as 1150 will have an upgrade path where 1155 is a end of the line socket.

You can always de-lid as well. I just delidded my 3770k yesterday using the vice method, which is probably the easiest thing I've ever done. Just wedge it in a vice upside down, get a block of wood, and smack the other end of the wood to knock off the CPU from the IHS. Apply some CLU and watch your temps drop 15-25c. Took me literally 10 minutes. I went from 90c to 65c with my 4.8GHz overclock and because of the lower temp I am able to hit 5GHz, but at a ridiculous and dangerous voltage. It was still fun to run some tests at 5GHz and watch my crazy scores, including my above 10.00 score in Cinebench which I've been trying to achieve forever (Got 10.07) :D  .


HAHA That's freakin cool! I have heard this before. When I can come to grips with maybe ruining a good CPU ill try this...one of these days.
I'm going with the Haswell. Just bought the 4770k. Might as well go with the new stuff. Worse comes to worse I'll look into water cooling. Really don't want to though.

Thanks for the input everyone!

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June 9, 2013 12:45:11 PM

An EVO should be enough. If you do become interested here is a video of a super easy delid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eFzNpTOaOw It's really that easy. Just apply some good thermal paste (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra gives best results) and put the CPU back in the socket and let the clamp seat the IHS on top of the die. Instant 20c drop in temps. Amazing stuff. I Wish Intel would at least use solder on the unlocked CPUs and used the bird poop thermal paste on everything else so advanced overclockers don't need to delid. Shame on you Intel.
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June 26, 2013 3:59:48 PM

CarterT said:
I'm getting the i7 4770k Haswell or i7 3770k for my new build. It sounds like the new Haswells get very hot. I was planning on getting the Cooler Master Hyper EVO "new one" for cooling, $35. Will this cool the new Haswell adequately? If it will I'll get it. This is the only thing I'm really nervous about with the Haswell.


Yes I am currently running i7 4770k haswell with the cooler master hyper evo. Seems to do a great job, I have the processor clocked at 4.3ghz and I just ran a stress test and the highest temp shown was 60 degrees celsius. one thing I will tell you is that mounting it is much easier with motherboard out of the computer, and don't use to much thermal paste just a thin layer. I just built this computer it runs great, 750w power supply, 2x geforce 660 ti sli, 120gig pny ssd, baracuda 2tb hard drive, baracuda 750 gig. i7 4770k, 16 gig ddr3 1600mhz corsair vengance, msi gd-65 gaming motherboard, I am a big fan of this build.

I mean't to tell you before i got excited about my build was that make sure when ur screwing the motherboard down to A. makesure you tighten opposites until it is secured and the screws on the motherboard sometimes come a little loose while your tightening so you might have to secure them. B. the heatsink wobbles a little (I accidentally hit it when i was installing hardware and it moved a little, not a big deal though still does its job extremely well.
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June 26, 2013 4:09:56 PM

CarterT said:
10936280,0,195632 said:
Do you plan on overclocking?
said:



Yes I plan on Overclocking.

[/quotemsg
I OC'ed haswell 4770k to 4.7 using water cooling, it got there and ran some benchmarks, but wasn't that stable. def wouldn't be able to hit 4.8 without throttling
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June 26, 2013 4:44:13 PM

anort3 said:

^ This.

Interesting read. Even with an H100i they are getting 98C! at 4.7Ghz. Sounds like a dead chip in weeks. I would go with an Ivy Bridge CPU if you plan on overclocking. Hopefully a new stepping in a few months will fix Haswell. If not sounds like Intel loses the overclocking market.

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2013/06/06/haswel...


This seems to be the general consensus, the chips appear to be hypersensitive to voltage increases. My 4770K and ASRock Extreme6 should be arriving in a day or two (forgot to sign into ShopRunner) and I can test out overclock potential on air with my Zalman CNPS9900MAX this weekend.
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June 26, 2013 4:57:28 PM

slomo4sho said:
anort3 said:

^ This.

Interesting read. Even with an H100i they are getting 98C! at 4.7Ghz. Sounds like a dead chip in weeks. I would go with an Ivy Bridge CPU if you plan on overclocking. Hopefully a new stepping in a few months will fix Haswell. If not sounds like Intel loses the overclocking market.

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2013/06/06/haswel...


This seems to be the general consensus, the chips appear to be hypersensitive to voltage increases. My 4770K and ASRock Extreme6 should be arriving in a day or two (forgot to sign into ShopRunner) and I can test out overclock potential on air with my Zalman CNPS9900MAX this weekend.


^ I would be interested to see the results of that with a retail chip here a month or so after release. You plan on doing a thread about it?
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June 26, 2013 5:17:00 PM

It really depends on the voltages your chip requires for the boosted ghz. i say stay under 1.2 volts and your heat will be fine with a high end air cooler. I have this cooler http://www.phanteks.com/PH-TC14PE.html and the highest i have bothered pushing my cpu is 4.5 ghz and i use 1.175 volts at full load. i could probably hit 4.6 while staying under 1.2 volts but i dont care for the performance increase as the heat will probably take away any performance increase done by overclocking 0.1 ghz. for now i do not need to overclock at all because i do not really care for 5-10 extra fps so i just stay at stock speeds.
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June 26, 2013 5:59:29 PM

On air the most a hyper 212 evo could handle with my 4770K was 4.5ghz. A lot of people were having issues overclocking Haswell because you need to change more settings around to overclock. The days of simply setting multi and voltage are over. Now you have to throw vrin and cache voltage into the mix.
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June 26, 2013 6:55:49 PM

Intel God said:
On air the most a hyper 212 evo could handle with my 4770K was 4.5ghz. A lot of people were having issues overclocking Haswell because you need to change more settings around to overclock. The days of simply setting multi and voltage are over. Now you have to throw vrin and cache voltage into the mix.

what core voltage were you running?

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June 26, 2013 6:59:26 PM

Hakumisoso Terror said:
Intel God said:
On air the most a hyper 212 evo could handle with my 4770K was 4.5ghz. A lot of people were having issues overclocking Haswell because you need to change more settings around to overclock. The days of simply setting multi and voltage are over. Now you have to throw vrin and cache voltage into the mix.

what core voltage were you running?



4ghz - 1.1v
4.1 - 1.125v
4.2 - 1.15v
4.3 - 1.2v
4.4 - 1.25v
4.5 - 1.275v
4.6 - 1.30v
4.7 - 1.35v
4.8 - 1.42v
4.9 - 1.46v
5.0 - 1.51v

My chip sucks
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June 26, 2013 9:50:32 PM

Intel God said:

4ghz - 1.1v
4.1 - 1.125v
4.2 - 1.15v
4.3 - 1.2v
4.4 - 1.25v
4.5 - 1.275v

4.6 - 1.30v
4.7 - 1.35v
4.8 - 1.42v
4.9 - 1.46v
5.0 - 1.51v

My chip sucks


yeah... i'm not sure i'd be using your chip with any overclock over 4.3-4.5... those voltages are really way too high after that point.

That's alright, not everyone gets a golden chip... my PhII can get to 3.7 on stock voltages... after that the numbers go through the roof, and temps go loco...
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June 26, 2013 9:53:29 PM

ingtar33 said:
Intel God said:

4ghz - 1.1v
4.1 - 1.125v
4.2 - 1.15v
4.3 - 1.2v
4.4 - 1.25v
4.5 - 1.275v

4.6 - 1.30v
4.7 - 1.35v
4.8 - 1.42v
4.9 - 1.46v
5.0 - 1.51v

My chip sucks


yeah... i'm not sure i'd be using your chip with any overclock over 4.3-4.5... those voltages are really way too high after that point.

That's alright, not everyone gets a golden chip... my PhII can get to 3.7 on stock voltages... after that the numbers go through the roof, and temps go loco...


Chip is rated for 1.52v Max and temps don't even break 60C so I'm not worried. All it has to do is survive a year so I can upgrade to x99 and the 8 core 5960X
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June 27, 2013 6:47:11 AM

wow those are high voltages. @ 4.5 ghz i got mine stable at 1.18 volts. Im not going to bother to go higher.
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June 27, 2013 4:17:12 PM

anort3 said:
^ I would be interested to see the results of that with a retail chip here a month or so after release. You plan on doing a thread about it?

I'll post the results here.

Intel God said:

Chip is rated for 1.52v Max and temps don't even break 60C so I'm not worried. All it has to do is survive a year so I can upgrade to x99 and the 8 core 5960X

What cooler are you using? 60C is extremely low for 1.42V.

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June 27, 2013 6:04:28 PM

slomo4sho said:
anort3 said:
^ I would be interested to see the results of that with a retail chip here a month or so after release. You plan on doing a thread about it?

I'll post the results here.

Intel God said:

Chip is rated for 1.52v Max and temps don't even break 60C so I'm not worried. All it has to do is survive a year so I can upgrade to x99 and the 8 core 5960X

What cooler are you using? 60C is extremely low for 1.42V.



Custom water loop and I'm also delidded
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June 27, 2013 7:16:04 PM

Intel God said:

Custom water loop and I'm also delidded


Out of curiosity, how many radiators and what size?

anestarks said:
I'm just posting this to sub to this.


You can also click the "Track this thread" link at the bottom of the OP to accomplish this task ;) 
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September 14, 2013 9:25:37 PM

I managed to get to 4.86GHz with a corsair H100i cooler. The temps started getting above 80 C on some cores with full load. I've turned it down to 4.5GHz to be safe and turned the voltage down a bit too.
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September 17, 2013 12:06:00 PM

anort3 said:
^ I would be interested to see the results of that with a retail chip here a month or so after release. You plan on doing a thread about it?


I killed my first 4770K but my current build is delidded and running stable at 4.6Ghz at 1.195V.
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September 17, 2013 12:22:32 PM

slomo4sho said:
anort3 said:
^ I would be interested to see the results of that with a retail chip here a month or so after release. You plan on doing a thread about it?


I killed my first 4770K but my current build is delidded and running stable at 4.6Ghz at 1.195V.


Thanks for posting back. How did you kill your first chip?? Heat and voltage or delidding it? Looks like things turned out pretty good if you are at 4.6Ghz although I guess it was not cheap!

Speaking of cheap, great job on slickdeals! I don't post much there but it has been a site I check daily for years. I actually got the Origin Humble bundle because of your thread over there. Keep it up!
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September 17, 2013 1:37:03 PM

anort3 said:
Thanks for posting back. How did you kill your first chip?? Heat and voltage or delidding it? Looks like things turned out pretty good if you are at 4.6Ghz although I guess it was not cheap!

Speaking of cheap, great job on slickdeals! I don't post much there but it has been a site I check daily for years. I actually got the Origin Humble bundle because of your thread over there. Keep it up!

The wood block slipped when I was delidding it. I was sleep deprived and exhausted, not a good combo when tackling a delicate task :rofl:  I killed the chip and bent the pins on my Z87 Extreme6 all in the same night. I guess there is a first time for everything :pt1cable: 

The current build is capable of running stable at 4.9Ghz under 1.4V but I would need a custom water loop for me to feel comfortable running it at those frequencies 24/7.

The Origin Humble Bundle was pretty hard to pass up. Needless to say, I have a huge backlog of games on my Steam account.
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