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TLC vs MLC for SSD

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June 8, 2013 9:11:04 PM

So between Samsung 840, 120 GB which is a TLC and a Kingston v300 120 GB, which is mlc. Looking at many benchmarks and forums apparently their are a lot of ware issues (Including other issues)with TLC. The 840 is really popular over the Kingston but I was wondering if I should go with the mlc. I can get the kingston v300 at local store for 95 dollars or I can order the 840 online. Any opinions on which one I should go for, TLC or mlc? I do prefer mlc due to last ting longer......

More about : tlc mlc ssd

June 8, 2013 9:18:04 PM

TLC is technically a form of MLC.

MLC = Multi Level Cell(while most are 2bit/cell, 3 can still be called MLC)
TLC = Triple Level Cell(3 bits)

Your biggest advantage to TLC nand is the price(cost less to make and customers can get a bigger drive for a lower price). It has about 30% higher latency, but than again MLC(2 bit/cell) have twice the latency of SLC(Single Level Cell). Samsung has a good track record, this makes the drives the sell popular.

For most users, in day to day use, both will provide very similar results.

I am personally using M4 SSD's and while they are far from top end drives, they work very well and have been solid.
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June 8, 2013 9:25:28 PM

nukemaster said:
TLC is technically a form of MLC.

MLC = Multi Level Cell(while most are 2bit/cell, 3 can still be called MLC)
TLC = Triple Level Cell(3 bits)

Your biggest advantage to TLC nand is the price(cost less to make and customers can get a bigger drive for a lower price). It has about 30% higher latency, but than again MLC(2 bit/cell) have twice the latency of SLC(Single Level Cell). Samsung has a good track record, this makes the drives the sell popular.

For most users, in day to day use, both will provide very similar results.

I am personally using M4 SSD's and while they are far from top end drives, they work very well and have been solid.


Im a heavy gamer (Specifically BF3 and League of legends). As of right now i am using a 1TB harddrvie and only 100 GB is filled. This 100 gb includes 5 games (BF3, Bioshock infinite, Last light, Guild wars 2, League of legends, Call od duty black ops 2) and a few other normal programs such as AVG and Microsoft office with windows 7. My desktop is mostly used for gaming and browsing the internet so. I gues ill just go with the kingston, i can buy it at the store so its easier.

My question is, lets say my 120 gb on the SSD does eventually fill up. Will i be able to fully installl games on the HDD and play them of the HDD while using the SSD as the boot device?

Also will my mobo (gigabyte 990FXA-UD3) support SSD?

I also need a step by step on how to install the SSD with my HDD. I basically want to completly format the HDD with nothing on it. And install the OS on the SSD with a few games while I stilll want to run some programs of the HDD that don't require being on the SSD.
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June 9, 2013 6:13:14 AM

Yes, your board does support SSDs

Installation
Make sure your bios is set to AHCI mode.
You can just disconnect the hard drive and install windows to the SSD(because windows may want to use the hard drives boot partition to boot to the SSD, this avoids this issue)
Once Windows(and drivers and such) is installed, format the old hard drive and install or place whatever files you want on it.
I recommend setting your desktop/documents/videos/pictures/downloads locations on the hard drive as well(location tab on each folder is the most easy way to do this.).


If you wish to move a game installed on the SSD to the hard drive in the future you can follow this guide.
Guide : Move software/games to another drive/partition without reinstalling.
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June 10, 2013 5:45:56 AM

nukemaster said:
Yes, your board does support SSDs

Installation
Make sure your bios is set to AHCI mode.
You can just disconnect the hard drive and install windows to the SSD(because windows may want to use the hard drives boot partition to boot to the SSD, this avoids this issue)
Once Windows(and drivers and such) is installed, format the old hard drive and install or place whatever files you want on it.
I recommend setting your desktop/documents/videos/pictures/downloads locations on the hard drive as well(location tab on each folder is the most easy way to do this.).


If you wish to move a game installed on the SSD to the hard drive in the future you can follow this guide.
Guide : Move software/games to another drive/partition without reinstalling.


Thanks for the help, I installed the new SSD and optimized it. IDK why but for some reason i have about a 10 to 15 fps increase in BF3 i use to avg like 70 fps on caspian border, at 1080P and on ultra, now i surprisingly avg 85 to 90 fps. Its weird though cause many people said the SSD wont really effect FPS buts its dramatically helped all my multiplayer games and random stuttering has stopped.
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June 10, 2013 7:02:47 AM

I can see a reduction in random stuttering since data loading on the fly will be faster so the game should not have as much of a pause(or even none at all), but the FPS it self honestly should be 100% unaffected(I have tested it out quite a bit).

Most games run from ram, this is why ssds should not chance fps. Maybe a combination of newer drivers and less stuff running in the background helped you out :) 
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August 21, 2013 9:37:07 AM

CrazymanWO said:
nukemaster said:
TLC is technically a form of MLC.

MLC = Multi Level Cell(while most are 2bit/cell, 3 can still be called MLC)
TLC = Triple Level Cell(3 bits)

Your biggest advantage to TLC nand is the price(cost less to make and customers can get a bigger drive for a lower price). It has about 30% higher latency, but than again MLC(2 bit/cell) have twice the latency of SLC(Single Level Cell). Samsung has a good track record, this makes the drives the sell popular.

For most users, in day to day use, both will provide very similar results.

I am personally using M4 SSD's and while they are far from top end drives, they work very well and have been solid.


Im a heavy gamer (Specifically BF3 and League of legends). As of right now i am using a 1TB harddrvie and only 100 GB is filled. This 100 gb includes 5 games (BF3, Bioshock infinite, Last light, Guild wars 2, League of legends, Call od duty black ops 2) and a few other normal programs such as AVG and Microsoft office with windows 7. My desktop is mostly used for gaming and browsing the internet so. I gues ill just go with the kingston, i can buy it at the store so its easier.

My question is, lets say my 120 gb on the SSD does eventually fill up. Will i be able to fully installl games on the HDD and play them of the HDD while using the SSD as the boot device?

Also will my mobo (gigabyte 990FXA-UD3) support SSD?

I also need a step by step on how to install the SSD with my HDD. I basically want to completly format the HDD with nothing on it. And install the OS on the SSD with a few games while I stilll want to run some programs of the HDD that don't require being on the SSD.


I have a similar setup currently there isn't much to it. Currently I have 2 SSDs 128, 1 for boot and windows, another for games, and HDDs for Storage. After installing OS you just have discipline yourself on installing games to the drive you want. I make sure my higher stress games are on the SSD, Music and the like go on the HDD, and I as a preference always isolate the OS/Boot Drive. Not saying the build you are going for is bad but Gaming off a SSD you will see some improvements.

Additionally if you like to do things yourself you can use Mk-linking which basically creates pointers to other locations. You could for instance mk-link your program files to one place so as far as windows is concerned your installing to the default C drive Program files location but you are actually doing it from lets say the D drive. But this is not really suggested by me cause its added steps with little gain.
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August 27, 2013 8:41:58 AM

The following guide will allow you to migrate all USER data to a different drive than the OS; OS and Programs on SSD and User Files on HDD as an example.

FROM: www.eightforums.com/tutorials/4275-user-profiles-reloca...

This works on Windows 7 & 8, fyi...

This method will prevent the need to manually migrate each folder and will keep your saves defaulting to the appropriate location in the future without user needing to be aware.

1.Audit Mode

1.1. Boot to Audit Mode when installing Windows 8
(If you have already installed Windows 8, continue from step 1.2.)
Start Windows 8 installation normally.
When installation after a reboot or two is completed and Windows 8 comes to Personalize page (see
screenshot below) press CTRL + SHIFT + F3 (press and hold down CTRL and SHIFT, press F3 still holding
CTRL and SHIFT down, release all three keys).
DO NOT ENTER PC NAME HERE OR CLICK NEXT! Just press CTRL + SHIFT + F3.
Your computer reboots now. Don’t panic, it’s just doing what it really should do. Windows 8 starts now in so
called Audit Mode, using built-in administrator account to let you to modify Windows before any user
profiles and user specific folders are created.
Continue from step 2.

1.2. Boot to Audit Mode from existing Windows 8 installation
First you need to open Command Prompt using built-in administrative account: hover pointer over bottom left corner of the desktop, right click to open Start Menu , select Command Prompt (Admin):
Command Prompt window opens. Type this to command prompt:

Code:
C:\Windows\System32\Sysprep\Sysprep.exe /audit /reboot
Hit Enter.Windows reboots now to Audit Mode, "thinking" it's been started first time. Text Preparing can be
seen on screen.

2. Audit Mode
Windows has now booted in Audit Mode using built-in administrator account, and you should see Metro
interface. Click Desktop to enter classic Windows desktop:
To start, click Cancel to close System Preparation Tool:
If you don’t have a second internal hard disk or you have not created and formatted an extra partition on
your system disk, you need first to create one. Notice that the drive or partition don't have to be empty,
but especially if relocating on an existing installation it must be big enough to allow Users folder to be moved
there. When we sysprep with answer file on next step these two folders are physically moved to new
location.
If you already have a formatted second HD or partition, you are ready to go.

2.1. Creating an answer file (script) for System Preparation Tool
Audit Mode lets us to start Windows without creating any user accounts. At the moment we are using the
built-in administrator account. Your own accounts are created later.
We are going to use System Preparation Tool (sysprep) to run an XML-script (so called Answer file)
which modifies the Windows registry and settings as we want to, relocating both Users and ProgramData
folders to another partition, E: in this example, by changing a so called Windows Environment Variable. You
can of course use any internal drive you want to.
Extensible Markup Language (XML) is a set of rules for encoding documents in machine readable form.
To make changes to Windows registry, we will now create a script in XML and run it with sysprep.
Open Windows Notepad text editor (press Win + R, type Notepad, hit Enter). Type the following script, or
copy it from here and paste to Notepad (please do not forget to read the notes below code lines 4, 6 and 11
regarding said lines):
1. <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
2. <unattend xmlns="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:unattend">
3. <settings pass="oobeSystem">
4. <component name="Microsoft-Windows-Shell-Setup" processorArchitecture="amd64"
publicKeyToken="31bf3856ad364e35" language="neutral" versionScope="nonSxS"
xmlns:wcm="http://schemas.microsoft.com/WMIConfig/2002/State"
xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">
Note
(If you are installing Windows x64 (64-bit), value processor Architecture should be amd64 , also on Intel
processors. For x86 (32-bit) it should be x86.)
5. <FolderLocations>
6. <ProfilesDirectory>e:\Users</ProfilesDirectory>
Note
In this example the new location of Users would be E:\Users. Change the drive letter according your needs.
7. </FolderLocations>
8. </component>
9. </settings>
10. <cpi:o fflineImage cpi:source="wim:F:/sources/install.wim#Windows 8" xmlns:cpi="urn:schemasmicrosoft-
com:cpi" />
Note
(Change the drive letter in wim:F: to that of your CD/DVD drive, USB stick or virtual drive containing your
Windows 8 installation m edia (DVD/ISO ). Notice that installation m edia has to be available to system when
running sysprep. Change Windows version accordingly, Windows 8 Pro if you have the Pro edition, Windows 8
Enterprise if you have the Enterprise edition)
11. </unattend>
(Please leave the row numbers out when typing or copying the above code. Answer file generated with
Windows System Image Manager).
If you are installing Windows 8 x64 from CD/DVD/USB F: and relocating folders to E: you don’t have to
change anything, you can use the script as it is.
Select Save As from Notepad’s File menu. Select Save as type: All Files. Name the file as you want, add
.xml extension to the filename. Save the script to the root of any drive:

2.2. Using System Preparation Tool
Open the Start Menu, select Command Prompt (Admin):
Type the following to the command prompt and press Enter to move to the right folder:
Code:
cd \Windows\System32\Sysprep
Now type the following and press Enter (notice the name and path of the script we created above, change
it if needed. I saved answer file on E so the path is E:\relocate.xml):
Code:
Sysprep.exe /audit /reboot /unattend:E:\relocate.xml
You should now see System Preparation Tool dialog telling it is working on our script:
Let it run, don’t touch mouse or keyboard now. When System Preparation Tool is ready, Windows must and
will reboot. It reboots back to Audit Mode.

2.3. Exiting Audit Mode
To continue Windows installation we have to exit Audit Mode and reboot. After reboot you’ll land back on
Metro interface. Click Desktop to enter classic Windows desktop, click OK on System Preparation Tool dialog
to boot normally in OOBE i.e. normal mode.
Before clicking OK, check that System Cleanup Action is set to OOBE, and Shutdown Options set to
Reboot:

3. Finalizing installation
Finalize Windows installation.
If you did this from an existing Windows installation, you will notice that for your Windows this is as if it were
the first time Windows was booted i.e you are back on OOBE boot, inserting product key and personalizing
Windows. It also means that you have to enter so called initial user. In this case Windows does not accept
any of the users created earlier, whether local or Microsoft accounts; instead you need to create a new
user.

An example from this PC I am using now: I had already created two users and installed software when I
decided to do sysprep to relocate Users. I had a local account for me and an Microsoft account using my
email address. After finalizing sysprep, I needed to create a third user Test because system does not let me
to use either Kari (local account) or Kari (Microsoft account) usernames because those accounts already
existed on this PC.
So I created user Test (local), then from Welcome screen logged in as Kari (Microsoft account) and simply
deleted the new Test account which I had just created. An extra step, small annoyance but there's nothing
to do to avoid it.
When Windows finally boots first time to Start Screen you will see that Users folder is now located on the
new drive or partition with all its subfolders.
When you check your system drive (C:)  still contains Users folder. The old, original Users on C: can contain
some Windows Store information that may not be moved, so let the old Users folder stay on C:. It will no
longer grow, all new user data will be stored on a new location, but it is essential it remains on C:. You can
hide it if you want, you are never again going to need it.
If you relocated the ProgramData you will notice that original ProgramData is there on C: drive, too. As
with Users, it is important you let the original Programdata folder stay on C:. Some applications and programs
use absolute file locations instead of environmental variables when installed, for those apps it is important to
find C:\ProgramData. Also if you sysprepped an existing installation with software already installed, some
applications might not like ProgramData to be moved.
Notice that Users (and ProgramData) are not created on or moved to new location when you return to
Audit Mode after running sysprep. Relocation will first happen when you exit Audit Mode and boot to OOBE
(Welcome) mode to continue installation. If done on an existing system the first OOBE boot after sysprepping
can take quite a long time, depending on how big those folders are that sysprep is physically moving to new
location.
Remember also that when you create a new user profile the user folders are not created before the new user
logs in first time.
That’s it, folks! Welcome to the Windows 8:

Now create a system image and you wont have to ever again remember jumplists and links everytime you
restore the system to earlier point or system image. User account folders are now permanently moved to
another drive, all new user profiles are automatically created on this new location and your system drive
won’t be full so soon.
Thanks for reading.

Written and published on 02nd of March 2012
Edited and updated on 6th of February 2013
4/24/13 User Profiles - Relocate to another Partition or Disk
www.eightforums.com/tutorials/4275-user-profiles-reloca...
Edited and updated on 6th of February 2013
Edited, answer file's validity checked on 14th of April 2013



My Sample XML File:
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
-<unattend xmlns="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:unattend">-<settings pass="oobeSystem">-<component language="neutral" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xmlns:wcm="http://schemas.microsoft.com/WMIConfig/2002/State" versionScope="nonSxS" publicKeyToken="31bf3856ad364e35" processorArchitecture="amd64" name="Microsoft-Windows-Shell-Setup">-<FolderLocations><ProfilesDirectory>d:\Users</ProfilesDirectory></FolderLocations></component></settings><cpi:o fflineImage xmlns:cpi="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:cpi" cpi:source="wim:E:/sources/install.wim#Windows 8"/></unattend>
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