Enermax ETS-T40 plus 3570K core temps

Snake Guy

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I installed Enermax ETS T40 cooler on my 3570K and am using Real Temp and HWMonitor and some others to check temps. I ran Prime torture test blend for 2 hours in 26C room. I got these values:
min: 38 31 34 33
max: 70 69 71 68

Real Temp said load was 100% and speed about 3819 MHz

Box is big and open, no gpu, PSU has a fan blowing in from the bottom, case has 2x120mm fans, front in, rear out.

The temps seem OK from what I have read in the forums, but I am wondering about the Enermax or my installation of it. Do those max temps seem right?
Thanks!
 
I use my ETS-T40 on my FX-4170 - so take my reply with a bit of salt.

Even though your processor runs with less watts, it's running with its Turbo function on. I am not sure exactly how that affects the final result, but, just to muddle things up, I have heard that Ivy Bridge processors can run hot (sometimes due to their manufacturing quality).

That said, I ran a test of my rig for you:
My case is old; I have an 80mm in-take side fan, and a 120mm out-take fan. (Case is closed.) In a 24C room, I got a 57C temp doing a blend test. That's a Delta of 33 - yours is around 43.

Your max temps are a step higher than mine; still acceptable, but definitely beyond the margin of error. There may be a way to shave some degrees off. Then again, as noted, there are a lot of other factors to be taken into account between both our situations. So, before we go jumping to conclusions, how did you install your cooler? (More specifically, how did you apply the thermal paste, and did you use the thermal paste included?)

 

Snake Guy

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Thanks for the interest.
I read a bunch of stuff online regarding coolers and paste before I chose the enermax as my upgrade.
This is interesting:
http://archive.benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=150&Itemid=62&limit=1&limitstart=5

I followed that strategy as best I could. I skipped the part about wet-sanding. The base of my enermax had uniform very fine symmetrical lines that imply a disc sanding device was used by the factory as opposed to a belt sander. Anyway, the lines appeared fine enough when compared to the recesses between copper pipes and aluminum base material. I spread small amounts of compound with a thin piece of plastic that I nipped off a blister pack with scissors. Using the factory straight edge of the plastic I filled those recesses between pipes and base material, carefully scraping away excess compound. I thought I did a good job, looked very much like the picture in that link. Copper was clean and compound in the ditches. I followed the 2 line procedure and estimated the the amount and position since the enermax is a 4 pipe cooler and the pictures describe a 3 pipe cooler. I shot for the thirds.

I used the compound provided with the cooler, Dow Corning TC-5121
Read this:
http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-233341/dow-corning-5121-artic-silver.html

It is quite possible that I used too much compound, or that my cooler is not located precisely atop of the processor. Since this was my second time ever installing a cooler, I think I will do it again, just because. But I am wondering if anyone in the community has specific experience with the 3570k and the enermax, or one of the hyper 212 coolers. I found very few posts with temp results, and even fewer that declare ambient temp at the time of the testing.

I would like to make sure that I am getting the best performance from the cooler before I start in on case fans etc. My case is a Corsair Carbide 200R, with plenty of room for more fans.
 
Excellent!

You've probably already read these then, which I shall post for others to browse through:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/What-is-the-Best-Way-to-Apply-Thermal-Grease-Part-1/1303/10
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/What-is-the-Best-Way-to-Apply-Thermal-Grease-Part-2/1392/8
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5

The last post shows Dow Corning TC-5121 as performing within the top 10 of their tested thermal compounds. Like with all sources, though, there is a limited amount of truth. This source shows the age-old Arctic Silver 5 as performing better than Arctic Cooling MX-4 - other sources will show a reversed result. Both are right, of course. In my own experience, I've had the privilege of trying out AS5, MX-4, TC-5121, and I even went out of my way to hunt down TC-5022. From my limited means of experimentation, I can tell you they all have given me the same result.

I wish I had more relevant information to give you, specifically with the 3570k. I can tell you that, if you have enough compound left, it might be worth experimenting a bit. The "small dot" method worked great for me with AS5 and MX-4, but the thinner TC-5XXX compounds gave me the best results with the "transversal stripe." (Also, with that type of mounting system, taking the time to tighten each nut a bit at a time, as evenly as possible, made a slight difference as well.)

Lastly, one thing I forgot to mention was that I have a second Enermax fan (TB Silence PWM) installed for a push-pull configuration. :\ It only helps by a couple degrees, though.
 

Snake Guy

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Maybe not so excellent. I pulled the cooler today, and shot some pics. It looks like I used too much paste. So I cleaned things up, and tried using less, according to my memory of the lines I used before.
I will run the stress test later.

cooler base
cooler.jpg


processor
processor.jpg


2cd try
2cdtry.jpg
 

Snake Guy

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I ran the blend test again, but forgot to start RealTemp first, so I didn't get minimums.
But I think they are roughly the same since max's are the same.
Duration was 1:42 ambient 26
max 70 69 70 67

Maybe 1/2 degree lower.
Now I'm getting curious.
I may pull it again, try less compound.

 
That's pretty good that you managed to get a really close result the second time around; that might be as good as it gets? As long as you are able and willing, I would say keep experimenting, and be sure to share the results with us so that we may all learn.

That little tube has a surprising number of uses in it. I haven't found any place to find any replacements, except for 1 kilogram tubs from OEM distributors. I ordered my 3.5g tube of TC-5022 from a place called Moddiy (http://www.moddiy.com/products/Dow-Corning-TC%252d5022-(3.5g).html). With shipping, it was just shy of $20 bucks, but if you pay attention, some days, they'll offer a code for free shipping, cutting the cost in half. Since it took three weeks to get to my doorstep, and results didn't differ much from my other owned products, I didn't think it was quite worth it. (I'll probably run some other tests, later, just to triple-check. Who knows what factors I might not have taken into account, like how other previous thermal compound residue left over might have affected results.)

If you do run out, though, before you feel like your testing is done, I can recommend Arctic Cooling MX-4 as a replacement. Cheap, plentiful, and gives good results. Good luck!
 

Snake Guy

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I'm back on the Enermax solution, didn't have quite enough of the TC-5121 compound to refill crevices and anoint for a third go at re-seating the Enermax.

I ordered a 20g syringe of MX-4.

After my initial experience, in which I am chasing a few thorough tests already linked in this thread, the word that less-is-more is right on. Like minimalist art theory, looks like less compound = more temp reduction. And quite likely, the center of the processor is where the heat action is.
With my eye on subjective variables that any builder should be aware of, "once more unto the breach" I go with thermal compound, anti-static device and long handled screwdriver...

Here's what I got. I pulled the T-40 and documented the compound spread, which was maybe a 1/2 degree more successful than my first effort, based on p95 blend test results, see previous posts.

Enermax base


CPU top


As you can see, significantly less spread area and material in general, this was still the TC-5121 compound packaged with my Enermax cooler. This application gave me maybe .5C degrees improvement in heat dispersal over my first effort, as tested by p95 blend test at 26.6C ambient.
Not a great-looking spread pattern, but less overall material and perhaps just enough in the right place or places, whatever they are, yielded a .5C improvement in one blend test. Center-processor might be the key, which confirms the small-dot practice already evaluated by experts. Keep in mind the heat pipe cooler construction and crevice-filling technique :)

So, with a ginormous syringe of MX-4 in hand, (about $15 after coupon at newegg), I removed and assessed the T40 cooler. After cleaning, I noticed a nick in one of the center copper pipes. There is a corresponding ding in the surface of my processor, hmm, I didn't see that before now. Never mind the arc-shaped factory grind marks. I have read about lapping, and already purchased a pack of silicon carbide sheets at Harbor Tools for, damn, $2.99, are you kidding? 220, 500, 1000, 1200 grits, 2 each, wet/dry. Now I have a reason to try lapping the base of the cooler, there is an obvious nick in a center pipe area, I can feel it with my finger tip.

nick


It's time to try lapping the base of the cooler, since I am out of the 5121, whatever, science is really just a matter of writing stuff down so here goes. Dry sanding for starters.

after hitting it with 500 grit


1000 grit


1200 grit


and now, crevice filling and double dash anointment with MX-4


Then, I ran the blend test for about 1.5 hrs
26.6 ambient temp
Max 72 71 71 69

for an average of 70.75

Hmm, that's my science for the day!





 
I am a bit envious with all the testing you get to do!

With such consistent results, I am not sure if testing out different methods of applying thermal compound would be worth it, so I'm not going to attempt to bother you to do as such. Adding another fan, for a push-pull configuration, would shave off a couple degrees at most, and I am not sure you'd want to drop another 15 bucks for that.

At this point, I think it is safe to say that perhaps the cooler has reached its limit for you. Your CPU running at its full 3.8 Turbo and that might be enough to explain the differences between our deltas. (Maybe try running the test at the "normal" 3.4?)

The only other thing I can think up of, currently, is that I know that Ivy Bridge tends to run hot since Intel decided to cut some corners in manufacturing. Sometimes stock examples are so bad that buyers are almost forced to de-lid the unit and replace the TIM inside the unit itself. There are actually videos and demonstrations on Youtube about it. Honestly, though, I am not sure I would go there, so I wouldn't recommend that someone else do it.
 

Snake Guy

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I am interested in your thoughts. Thanks.
Now I am thinking about trying the stock cooler again, since I have a tube of suds available.
Perhaps the Intel stock cooler deserves a proper chance with jazzy MX-4, let alone 5121 paste...
Of course, before all that, I will pop the Enermax and view the paste pattern of most recent MX-4 application.

Since I lapped the Enermax mount surfaces, it's possible that I dosed the smooth surfaces too heavily, and need another go to be sure. Maybe paste spreads better minus the factory grind ridges.

The cooler swims a bit, when placing it gently atop the CPU, and then while precariously poised in a slippery state feeding the restraining bar underneath the radiator, whilst trying to drop the bar over the mount posts, and at the same time, attend to alignment of the locating pins on the underside of the bar...there is more than a bit of delicate swimming going on here.

All of that affects paste distribution, no doubt.

At this point, my hope is to inform another builder on the fine art of attention to detail.
It is really not that hard to clean things up, put a little dab in the center, and screw it all down.
What happens next is all in the details.

My temps just went up, after lapping and switching to MX-4, no way!
Well, maybe it's a tic F one way or the other, surely been hot in NE U.S. lately, but I am looking at a wall thermometer, which has consistently read 80F or 26C, during my stress tests. meh

When I am convinced this is good as it gets, I will move to a 2cd fan on the Enermax.
The cooler resides atop my CPU with the radiator about 3 inches from a rear case fan.
Not sure how much better the ventilation will be if I add a fan there, but I will do it!
Got a few 120's gathering dust somewhere...
After that, more case fan options and cable management for better airflow. I haven't nailed down cables yet. Etc.