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Motherboard & case sizes, and AMD and Intel CPU's - Newb looking for answers

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August 2, 2013 10:16:50 AM

Hello!

Recently I've been hunting around for an upgrade to my CPU, Mobo and RAM, and eventually my GPU. Just to be clear, I live in Australia, so I don't think buying from Newegg is an option. I'm pretty sure Amazon does international shipping though.. I think.

My current computer specs are:
-Intel i3 540 Dual-core
-Corsair HX650 650W PSU
-XFX Radeon HD6850 GPU
-P7H55-M Asus Mobo uATX Socket LGA1156
-4GB DDR3 1333MhZ RAM
-HDD: ST31000528AS ATA 1TB
-CDROM: HL-DT-ST DVDRAM GH22NS50 ATA
OS: Windows 7 Home Premium
Other: This computer is pre-built and I bought it a few years ago.

~

My budget is:
$0-120 for a motherboard
$0-80 for RAM [Although I think I've already decided: Corsair Vengeance 8 GB ( 2 x 4 GB ) DDR3 1600 MHz - Most bang for your buck]
$0-240 for a CPU - but honestly, if there isn't much difference between performance, I'd rather go for something around $200.

GPU will be a GeForce GTX 760 2GB, once I get the funds.

So yeah, I am leaving my PSU, GPU, HDD, and all of the minor peripherals.

~

I spent the past day hunting around for a Intel CPU that will work with a motherboard that is mATX size, until my friend introduced me to AMD processors, and say they're the best best if your budget isn't high. So I looked around on online shops and benchmark sites (PassMark) and saw that they are amazing for their price. Almost too amazing? I don't know.

Such as the AMD FX-8350 Eight-Core, for $200. It scored 9128 on Passmark, higher than a lot of Intel core i7s around the prices of $200-400.

So I guess that is my first question. Why are AMD Processors so cheap when they seem to be superior to other expensive Intel CPU's? Do they lack something Intel has?

~

Before I pick a CPU, I have to pick a motherboard. Since I don't know whether I'm going AMD or Intel, I found two that seemed good within my price range.

- Asus M5A78L-M LX V2.0 AM3+ mATX Motherboard for AMD CPU
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=611237&...
- ASRock B85M-PRO4 LGA1150 mATX Motherboard
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=612527&...
Click the links to look at the specs and other stuff.

Luckily, these are just a little smaller than my current mobo, so I'm sure it'll fit. (Right?)

And as you see, they are both mATX mobos. Probably not the best for gaming. The reason for that is my case. This is a picture I whipped up in paint of my case and the insides:

http://imgur.com/qVfBGTN

The case itself is a decent size, but when I checked inside it I saw that the motherboard couldn't really be any bigger than it is now. (24.5cmx22.5cm). The HDD dock and PSU are quite close to it. Still, it's got alright air ventilation.

I understand the problems with mATX mobos, in particular the possible inability to crossfire, the cramping of hardware (temp increases) and such, and I'm okay with them. Whatever CPU I get, I am not overclocking. I also plan on getting a standard-high quality heatsink. My computer also has a vent and it's out in the open. So second question. With all of the above in mind, should I still be worried about mATX motherboards? Why?

Third question, are these motherboards okay? I mean, one only allows 8GB of RAM, but I'm okay with that. They're just really cheap so I'm not sure if maybe they're flimsy or whatever.

~

Back to CPU.
These are some of the CPU's I am considering (both AMD and Intel)

-AMD FX-8150 Eight-Core (With Liquid Cooling Kit [I can pick whether I want liquid or heatsink]) - AM3+ for $200

https://www.centrecom.com.au/amd-fx-8150-eight-core-wit...

- Intel LGA 1150 Haswell quad Core i5-4670 3.4GHz w/graphics BX80646I54670 boxed for $220-250 (having trouble finding a steady AUS price)

- AMD FX-6350 Six-Core for $140

- AMD FD8320FRHKBOX FX-8320 FX-Series 8-Core Black Edition for $160 on amazon

According to PassMark, the FX-8320 series is the best. But $160, that just seems too cheap!!! It must be because I'm Australian, new games are $120 here.

Question 4: Anything I should I know about these CPU's or any warnings you might have?

Question 5: What one of these would you suggest?

Question 6: Would all of the AMD CPU's work with the motherboard I said earlier? [Asus M5A78L-M LX V2.0 AM3+ mATX Motherboard for AMD CPU
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=611237&...]

Question 7: Different sort of question, Power Supply. Like I said, I have 650W and am planning to get a GTX 760, which apparently requires 500W. Lets say I buy the 760 and the FX-8320, which apparently has Thermal Design Power of 125 Watts, would that be okay? Do I need more power supply?

Question 8: Since I'm all Intel and MAYBE about to go to AMD, will there be any incompatibilities between things like the audio drivers, HDD, CD rom and stuff like that?

Remember, I'm upgrading from an i3 540. I am not really interested in things like i7 K editions that cost hundreds of dollars, I just want something that is in between standard and high.


Finally, is there anything else I should know? Just in general. Since I am a newb, maybe I am approaching this all wrong and talking like an idiot. Also, is AMD cpus and mobos reliable? I don't know why I'm asking that specifically, I just have never really come across them before.


Thanks a lot for reading this wall of text and i hope you can reply!

Best solution

a c 98 à CPUs
a c 86 V Motherboard
August 2, 2013 10:24:58 AM

Jaycent15 said:

I spent the past day hunting around for a Intel CPU that will work with a motherboard that is mATX size, until my friend introduced me to AMD processors, and say they're the best best if your budget isn't high. So I looked around on online shops and benchmark sites (PassMark) and saw that they are amazing for their price. Almost too amazing? I don't know.

Such as the AMD FX-8350 Eight-Core, for $200. It scored 9128 on Passmark, higher than a lot of Intel core i7s around the prices of $200-400.

So I guess that is my first question. Why are AMD Processors so cheap when they seem to be superior to other expensive Intel CPU's? Do they lack something Intel has?

You cannot rely on Passmark. At all. You need to look at reviews or at least a wider selection of benchmarks.

AMDs FX CPUs do well in multithreaded workloads like rendering or compression. They're a lot worse in gaming and single-threaded tasks.

And definitely avoid the old Bulldozer CPUs like the 8150. They're terrible. Their best value offerings are probably the FX-6300 and the FX-8320. The FX-6350 and FX-8350 are clocked a little higher, but that's meaningless since you can overclock freely. So you could just buy eg. an FX-6300 and go for the same clocks you could get with an FX-6350.

Jaycent15 said:
Before I pick a CPU, I have to pick a motherboard. Since I don't know whether I'm going AMD or Intel, I found two that seemed good within my price range.

- Asus M5A78L-M LX V2.0 AM3+ mATX Motherboard for AMD CPU
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=611237&...
- ASRock B85M-PRO4 LGA1150 mATX Motherboard
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=612527&...
Click the links to look at the specs and other stuff.

Luckily, these are just a little smaller than my current mobo, so I'm sure it'll fit. (Right?)


I understand the problems with mATX mobos, in particular the possible inability to crossfire, the cramping of hardware (temp increases) and such, and I'm okay with them. Whatever CPU I get, I am not overclocking. I also plan on getting a standard-high quality heatsink. My computer also has a vent and it's out in the open. So second question. With all of the above in mind, should I still be worried about mATX motherboards? Why?

Third question, are these motherboards okay? I mean, one only allows 8GB of RAM, but I'm okay with that. They're just really cheap so I'm not sure if maybe they're flimsy or whatever.

mATX is fine, not a problem. In many ways, mATX is the new ATX.

However, those are very low-end motherboards, particularly the AMD one. It's using a chipset from 2007 or thereabouts. I would urge you to pick a motherboard with a 900-series chipset if you go AMD.
The Intel motherboard is okay, but B85 means no overclocking. Up to you whether that's okay.
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August 2, 2013 10:43:53 AM

Sakkura said:
Jaycent15 said:

I spent the past day hunting around for a Intel CPU that will work with a motherboard that is mATX size, until my friend introduced me to AMD processors, and say they're the best best if your budget isn't high. So I looked around on online shops and benchmark sites (PassMark) and saw that they are amazing for their price. Almost too amazing? I don't know.

Such as the AMD FX-8350 Eight-Core, for $200. It scored 9128 on Passmark, higher than a lot of Intel core i7s around the prices of $200-400.

So I guess that is my first question. Why are AMD Processors so cheap when they seem to be superior to other expensive Intel CPU's? Do they lack something Intel has?

You cannot rely on Passmark. At all. You need to look at reviews or at least a wider selection of benchmarks.

AMDs FX CPUs do well in multithreaded workloads like rendering or compression. They're a lot worse in gaming and single-threaded tasks.

And definitely avoid the old Bulldozer CPUs like the 8150. They're terrible. Their best value offerings are probably the FX-6300 and the FX-8320. The FX-6350 and FX-8350 are clocked a little higher, but that's meaningless since you can overclock freely. So you could just buy eg. an FX-6300 and go for the same clocks you could get with an FX-6350.

Jaycent15 said:
Before I pick a CPU, I have to pick a motherboard. Since I don't know whether I'm going AMD or Intel, I found two that seemed good within my price range.

- Asus M5A78L-M LX V2.0 AM3+ mATX Motherboard for AMD CPU
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=611237&...
- ASRock B85M-PRO4 LGA1150 mATX Motherboard
http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=612527&...
Click the links to look at the specs and other stuff.

Luckily, these are just a little smaller than my current mobo, so I'm sure it'll fit. (Right?)


I understand the problems with mATX mobos, in particular the possible inability to crossfire, the cramping of hardware (temp increases) and such, and I'm okay with them. Whatever CPU I get, I am not overclocking. I also plan on getting a standard-high quality heatsink. My computer also has a vent and it's out in the open. So second question. With all of the above in mind, should I still be worried about mATX motherboards? Why?

Third question, are these motherboards okay? I mean, one only allows 8GB of RAM, but I'm okay with that. They're just really cheap so I'm not sure if maybe they're flimsy or whatever.

mATX is fine, not a problem. In many ways, mATX is the new ATX.

However, those are very low-end motherboards, particularly the AMD one. It's using a chipset from 2007 or thereabouts. I would urge you to pick a motherboard with a 900-series chipset if you go AMD.
The Intel motherboard is okay, but B85 means no overclocking. Up to you whether that's okay.


1. Whats bad about a 2007 chipset?

2. Which AMD processor would you recommend for gaming? $0-240?

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a c 98 à CPUs
a c 86 V Motherboard
August 2, 2013 11:02:35 AM

Jaycent15 said:
1. Whats bad about a 2007 chipset?

2. Which AMD processor would you recommend for gaming? $0-240?

1. The featureset is outdated and such an old chipset isn't ideal for use with a much newer processor.

2. An FX-6300 is a good option at the cheap end of the spectrum, the FX-8320 is good at the pricier end. I'd say the 6300 is probably the best bang for the buck CPU in AMDs lineup at the moment.
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August 2, 2013 11:22:30 AM

Sakkura said:
Jaycent15 said:
1. Whats bad about a 2007 chipset?

2. Which AMD processor would you recommend for gaming? $0-240?

1. The featureset is outdated and such an old chipset isn't ideal for use with a much newer processor.

2. An FX-6300 is a good option at the cheap end of the spectrum, the FX-8320 is good at the pricier end. I'd say the 6300 is probably the best bang for the buck CPU in AMDs lineup at the moment.


The FX-8320 being this? http://shop.amd.com/us/All/Detail/Processor/FD8320FRHKB...
I also thought you said that FX Processors aren't good for gaming? Is the 8320 an exception?
Since I'm used to an i3, any upgrade is very welcome.

If you have any experience with the 8320 with gaming, can you like, give it a rating or something? For latest cpu-intense games?

Also do you know about the Power Supply issue? thatd be a help.

Thanks for your response
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August 2, 2013 12:10:54 PM

hey sakurra, perhaps I should get the Intel Core i5 4570 Haswell 3.2GHz 6MB Retail Box for $220.
However the 4570K version is like $50 more expensive so is it big difference?
Using this Mobo ASRock B85M-PRO4 LGA1150 mATX Motherboard http://ple.com.au/ViewItem.aspx?InventoryItemID=612527&...

That means no overclocking right? i dont really want to because I dont want to spend a lot of ventilation devices
would this work for me? using gtx 760
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a c 98 à CPUs
a c 86 V Motherboard
August 2, 2013 2:21:51 PM

Well, the FX processors aren't so great for gaming. But at least they make up for that by being cheap. In terms of what you get for your money for gaming, Intel processors are a little better in general. AMD shines when it comes to multithreaded things like rendering, where their CPUs can almost keep up with Intel and cost a lot less.

The Core i5-4570 is a decent option if you don't want to overclock. The 4670K is for overclocking, that's why it has the K and costs a lot more. So that would be a poor choice to go with a B85 motherboard, whereas the 4570 would be fine. It would be plenty powerful for a GTX 760.

Edit: And as for the power supply, your HX650 is plenty for a GTX 760 and any of these CPUs. The 500W recommendation is for the whole system and also includes a little extra margin to be on the safe side. The 760 itself won't even draw 200W unless you overclock it.
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August 2, 2013 8:21:28 PM

Sakkura said:
Well, the FX processors aren't so great for gaming. But at least they make up for that by being cheap. In terms of what you get for your money for gaming, Intel processors are a little better in general. AMD shines when it comes to multithreaded things like rendering, where their CPUs can almost keep up with Intel and cost a lot less.

The Core i5-4570 is a decent option if you don't want to overclock. The 4670K is for overclocking, that's why it has the K and costs a lot more. So that would be a poor choice to go with a B85 motherboard, whereas the 4570 would be fine. It would be plenty powerful for a GTX 760.

Edit: And as for the power supply, your HX650 is plenty for a GTX 760 and any of these CPUs. The 500W recommendation is for the whole system and also includes a little extra margin to be on the safe side. The 760 itself won't even draw 200W unless you overclock it.


ok, one last question, since these are similar priced, which do you think is better for gaming? (And not overclocking)

Intel Core i5 3570 1155
or
Intel Core i5 4670 1150
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a c 98 à CPUs
a c 86 V Motherboard
August 2, 2013 8:46:00 PM

The Core i5-4670 is the direct successor of the 3570 and is a little faster.
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