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First build in a few years - kindly asking for help

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August 20, 2013 2:47:31 PM

Hello. I will finally be able to buy a new PC and it is important to me for a number a reasons - including the financial part (I am from Romania - it will be around what i earn in 5 months), so i would love to get your advice. I stop by Tom's almost daily but i would never buy a PC without asking first as I am still not sure about a number of things.

Approximate Purchase Date: as soon as possible.

Budget Range: As I mentioned before, I'm from Romania and prices are somewhat different, obviously cannot order from newegg or similar shops, so if you recommend I replace something, as long as it is in the same price range, it should be fine.

System Usage from Most to Least Important: Starcraft 2 - 90%, PS, movies and so on.

Are you buying a monitor: Yes, an Asus Gaming VG248QE, 24'', 1920 x 1080.

Do you need to buy OS: No

Location: Romania

Overclocking: Yes

SLI or Crossfire: Not at the moment, maybe when other games require it.

Your Monitor Resolution: 1920x1080

And Most Importantly, Why Are You Upgrading: Because my old Phenom II 555BE struggles with Starcraft 2.

I apologize I did not make a pcpartpicker list, i will if it would make things easier.

Here are the components i have right now:
CPU Intel Core i5 4670k
CPU Cooler CM Hyper 212 EVO + Arctic Silver 5
Mobo Asus Maximus VI Hero
Memory Crucial Ballistix Elite 8Gb 1866Mhz CL9 - BLE2CP4G3D1869DE1
SSD Samsung 840 Pro 128Gb
HDD WD 1T Caviar Black
Video Card Gigabyte 650 TI Boost 2Gb or Gigabyte 7850 OC 2Gb =
Case CM HAF 912 Plus with additional fans
Power Supply Seasonic X 650W - SASS650KM3 or the Corsair HX 650

The issues i would greatly appreciate your help with:
-do i need the Maximus VI Hero? - would there be any difference in normal use with an MSI Z87 G45 or an Asus Z87-Plus (or something around that price).

-i've seen a lot of recommendations for the G.Skill Sniper memory, i cannot get those, so what would be a similar performing kit? Also, go i need a 2133 kit? I understand frequency and timings and that 1600Mhz/CL8 and 1866Mhz/CL9 perform pretty much the same (correct me if im wrong), but i just unsure what exact memory modules to buy.

-regarding the case, i dont care about the looks, lights and so on, just want one with decent cooling and cheap.

-power supply - i know they are enough for the system and that they are both high quality - should i go for something cheaper? if so, which one?

Thank you for your time and knowledge.


More about : build years kindly

August 20, 2013 2:56:17 PM

With voltage regulation being onboard the haswell chips themselves nowadays, there isn't really a reason to be going for super high end motherboards anymore really.

that monitor may be expensive but people who have used an IPS monitor before feel that the monitor is really washed out:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2321917

At that price range an IPS monitor is reccommended.

The 7850 is actually a slightly better card, especially if its the OC version, then its definetely better:
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/782?vs=778

everything else looks great, if you do find a cheaper PSU just google for reviews for it, if there are good reviews from professional PSU reviewing websites like jonnyguru, anandtech, techpowerup etc. then they are good but generally XFX, Corsair, Antec, Seasonic and many others make good PSUs.

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August 20, 2013 3:06:21 PM

Mobo: I guess The Asus Z87 Plus would be plenty enough. Based on this recent Tom's article it overclocks like a champ for the price: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/z87-express-motherb...

Memory: Don't overspend on memory. You probably won't notice any difference between 2133Mhz and 1600Mhz, or between CL8 and CL9. There's maybe a 5% performance difference, but considering the extra price it's not really a good bang for the bucks if you ask me. That Crucial Ballistix kit you've picked should be perfect and doesn't cost too much.

Case: I have the Antec Nine Hundred myself and it got a lot of airflow (2 x 120mm intake fans + 1 x huge 200mm exhaust fan). I heard a lot of good things on the Corsair Cabide 500R too.

PSU: That power supply is perfect. It's ok if it provides more power than required in case you want to upgrade your GPU in the future.

SSD: I wouldn't pick the 840 Pro. It's overkill for gaming. I would recommend it only for people who do a lot of video editing or other intense software that write constantly to the disk, like databases, etc... For gaming, you only need Read speed basically. Once your OS, software, and games are all installed you don't need to write to the disk very often after, only read speed is important so that your applications load fast. So to save money I would recommend the "Samsung 840" (non-pro) or the new "Samsung 840 Evo". Since they cost less I would recommend you go with 250GB versions instead. They will cost almost the same as the 840 Pro 128GB, but will offer twice the capacity (250GB) if you want to install more games and stuff. SSD is such a big upgrade from previous mechanical drive, that you will have a hard time noticing the difference between two different SSD models anyway. In other words, even if other models might show slower write speed, you would have a hard time telling the difference between a 840 Pro and a 840 Evo when sitting behind your computer.
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August 20, 2013 4:08:42 PM

The monitor is great .... I have one with a Dell IPS in next room.... While the Dell IPS rules in photo editing it pales next to the Asus 144Hz in gaming

Your PSU is OK for the 650 TI Boost in SLI

Card - System / SLI ....add more if OCing
GTX 780 - 600w / 850
GTX 770 - 600w / 830
GTX 760 - 600w / 670
GTX 660 Ti - 450w / 600
GTX 660 - 450w / 590
GTX 650 Ti Boost - 450w / 584

Id do the Corsair 500R paired with the HX650

The hero is a great board but the best board at about the $200 mark is the MSI Z87-GD65
http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/msi_z87_gd65_ga...

Quote:
MSI has been using components that meet or exceed MIL-STD-810G for some time as part of its Military Class build philosophy. Parts such as Super Ferrite Chokes that run at up to 35 degree Celsius lower temperatures, have a 30% higher current handling capacity, and a 20% improvement in power efficiency; Tantalum filled Hi-C Caps that are are up to 93% efficient; and "Dark Capacitors" that feature Lower ESR and a ten-year lifespan all tied into a PCB with improved temperature and humidity protections as part of the "Military Essentials" package......In the end MSI's Z87-GD65 is a board that comes with an expansive feature set that includes all your basics and the extras that set them apart such as the V-Check points, upper end audio, Dual BIOS ROMs, KIller Network package, Military Class IV package, and a three-year warranty. Couple that with good looks that carry the dragon theme through the board, and you have a winning combination at $189.


http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/cpu_mainboard/msi_z8...

Quote:
Now and again a motherboard appears that is so obviously brilliant, and so affordable, that we wonder if anything will be able to top it. For a while that crown was held by the ASUS Sabertooth, both in X58 and then P67 variants. Then MSI stole the crown with the Z77 MPower. Looking at the Z87 GD65 Gaming we think it's going to take something extraordinary to top it, such is the perfect storm of price, performance, features and looks.

The switch to Military Class 4 has given us an extremely ready overclocker too. You're always thermally limited when overclocking and the i7-4770K is one of the most demanding around. Considering the amount of cooling we're using we think that although the GD65 is capable of bringing 5GHz from our i7-4770K you'd need a proper water loop to make the most of it.

Performance is outstanding. The stock results were a particular highlight. We know a lot of people still just like to put their CPU in and go, without overclocking it first. Despite how easy it is these days we know that the fear factor still exists. So you'll be glad to know that the MSI Z87 GD65 Gaming really rocks hard even at stock settings. Naturally the overclocking is blistering too, with some OC3D records broken.

MSI have laid the gauntlet down to all the other manufacturers. Gorgeous to look at, blistering performance and all at a very affordable price, the MSI Z87 GD65 Gaming is not only the new benchmark for Z87 motherboards, but probably for all motherboards.


Storage choices are top notch.

RAM Speed matters. It's oft said that performance increase doesn't match increase in RAM cost, so it's not worth it. But look at it compared to system cost and it's a whole new discussion ..... here's some sources to look at.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2792/12

22.3 % (SLI) increase in minimum frame rates w/ C6 instead of C8 in Far Cry 2
18% (single card) / 5% (SLI) increase in minimum frame rates w/ C6 instead of C8 in Dawn of War
15% (single card) / 5% (SLI) increase in minimum frame rates w/ C6 instead of C8 in World in Conflict

Also see http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/memory/2011/01/11/the-...

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-1...

(CAS / Frequency (MHz)) × 1000 = X ns

I'm liking the Mushkin DDR3-1866 CAS 9 modules

With all the top notch components you have, id want more than a Hyper 212.......Look at the Phanteks
http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/phanteks_ph_tc14pe...

And read the bottom of the AS5 home page .... the part about 200 hrs thermal cycling to cure....each tome ya puter goes on heats up and cools down....thats a 5-10 minute cycle, so ya talking year or more. Shin Etsu has same thermral properties and no curing issues

http://archive.benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=co...
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August 20, 2013 11:25:32 PM

Thank you all for everything...so, after a few changes, i am currently looking at:

Intel Core i5 4670k
CM Hyper 212 EVO
Arctic Silver 5 3.5g
MSI Z87 GD65
Crucial Ballistix Elite 8Gb 1866Mhz
Samsung 840 Pro 128Gb
WD 1T Caviar Black
Gigabyte 7850 OC 2Gb
CM HAF 912 Plus
Corsair TX650 V2

I cant get Phanteks coolers here or the Shin Etsu thermal compound.

I might get another SSD, have to see what's available.

About the TX650 V2 power supply - i know it is a tier down from the HX650 and that it is not modular. Otherwise, reviews look good, pretty much the same voltages as the HX650 and both made by Seasonic.

Im pretty sure the Hyper 212 EVO wont have problems with the case or the memory.

Anything i should change?...again, thanks so much!
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August 20, 2013 11:53:55 PM

pshych0 said:

I might get another SSD, have to see what's available.


Yeah I strongly suggest the "Samsung 840" (non pro) or the new "Samsung 840 Evo". You could get the 250GB version of one of those drives instead since they're a lot cheaper than the "Pro". For gamers, there's no real point in getting the Pro version so you probably won't notice the difference.
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August 21, 2013 2:21:59 AM

One thing i forgot to ask, what mobo does your current 550BE run on?
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August 21, 2013 4:23:51 AM

ps3hacker12 said:
One thing i forgot to ask, what mobo does your current 550BE run on?

On an Asrock n68-gs3 UCC - OC to 3.4, not unlocked.

Also I have 2 more questions:
1. I've seen some mixed reviews regarding the PSUs made by Seasonic - mostly about an annoying high pitched sound. Are PSUs made by Channel Well better? The Corsair TX650 V2 and HX 650 are made by Seasonic and the HX 750 is made by Channel Well. Should i go for something made by Channel Well?

2. I'm guessing there woudnt be a problem in running for a while a 256Gb Samsung 840 EVO without another storage HDD?

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August 21, 2013 8:20:46 AM

Yeah, no FX6300 or FX8350 upgrades for that mobo sadly. No there wouldn't be a problem with running with just that SSD.
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Best solution

August 21, 2013 10:22:48 AM

pshych0 said:
Also I have 2 more questions:

1. I've seen some mixed reviews regarding the PSUs made by Seasonic - mostly about an annoying high pitched sound. Are PSUs made by Channel Well better? The Corsair TX650 V2 and HX 650 are made by Seasonic and the HX 750 is made by Channel Well. Should i go for something made by Channel Well?

2. I'm guessing there woudnt be a problem in running for a while a 256Gb Samsung 840 EVO without another storage HDD?



1. Seasonic are top notch, never heard anyone complain about high pitch sounds, must be something that happens in 1% of the case. For instance, I have a TX650v2 myself and it's dead silent. I highly recommend Seasonic and Corsair. Worst case scenario if there's a noise with the unit you can contact the company for an exchange (or bring it back to the store if this happens during the first 15-days). But I guess high pitch noise can happen with any PSUs, even if it's made by Channel Well. Sometimes you just get a bad unit, even if you pay over 1000$ for it.

2. No there wouldn't be any problem. Once you got your secondary storage, I recommend moving some of your personal folders to the HDD to save space on the SSD. I mean folders like: My Documents, Desktop, Music, Movies, etc... You can change their target location in Windows if you right-click on the folder and go to Properties, then go to the "Location" tab and change the path from C:\ to D:\ for example. I don't find any benefit in putting mp3 or movie files on a SSD because they already load in less than 1 second on a mechanical drive.
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August 21, 2013 11:12:50 PM

I finally went with this:

cpu - Intel Core i5 4670k
cpu cooler - CM Hyper 212 EVO
mobo - MSI Z87 GD65
memory - Crucial Ballistix Elite 8Gb 1866Mhz
ssd - Samsung 840 EVO 250Gb
graphics - Gigabyte Radeon HD 7870 2048MB DDR5 OC - instead of the 7850
case - CoolerMaster HAF 912 Plus
psu - Seasonic X650 SS-650KM3

I hope everything will be ok...any other advice?
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August 22, 2013 6:49:23 AM

Everything looks great there :) 
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August 22, 2013 10:21:58 AM

Thank you so much. Hopefully everything will be here Saturday and i wont have any problems putting it all together. Cant really put into words how much your help means, but i am grateful. Ill be back with pics :) 
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August 22, 2013 4:47:57 PM

Forgot to mention the TX650 has a 5-year warranty, I'm pretty sure they'll replace it if there's a high pitch noise.

But seriously if you can invest just a little more, I regret not getting the HX650 instead. Not that the TX650 is bad (as I said it's very silent). It's just that the HX650 is modular, which means less cables laying around in the case.
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August 22, 2013 10:14:40 PM

MC_K7 said:
Forgot to mention the TX650 has a 5-year warranty, I'm pretty sure they'll replace it if there's a high pitch noise.

But seriously if you can invest just a little more, I regret not getting the HX650 instead. Not that the TX650 is bad (as I said it's very silent). It's just that the HX650 is modular, which means less cables laying around in the case.


Yes, i was considering the HX650 over the TX, but as i mentioned in my previous post, i ended up going for the Seasonic X650 SS-650KM3 which by all account is higher quality, 7 years warranty and so on...
Also, about the PSU and power in general...do i need a UPS? I dont really have power outages (maybe 1/year) and the system i have now has been running without issues for a few years on a High Power 400W PSU (made by Sirtec as far as i can figure out). So excluding data loss issues, should i get a UPS? (also i dont have time to read up on pure sine waves or whatever they are called).

Again...lots of thanks.
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August 23, 2013 10:21:29 AM

pshych0 said:
Yes, i was considering the HX650 over the TX, but as i mentioned in my previous post, i ended up going for the Seasonic X650 SS-650KM3 which by all account is higher quality, 7 years warranty and so on...
Also, about the PSU and power in general...do i need a UPS? I dont really have power outages (maybe 1/year) and the system i have now has been running without issues for a few years on a High Power 400W PSU (made by Sirtec as far as i can figure out). So excluding data loss issues, should i get a UPS? (also i dont have time to read up on pure sine waves or whatever they are called).

Again...lots of thanks.


Yeah Seasonic is very high quality too. Good choice.

No you don't need a UPS. Of course a UPS is better (I have one), but it's not mandatory. If you have a good powerbar with surge protection it should protect your components. APC makes good UPS and Powerbars too if you ever want to change yours.
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