Get Bay Trail or wait for Cherry Trail for light gaming?

jmasta111

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Hello all,

As many of you may know, Intel has recently been putting in a lot of work to their Atom SOC's in an attempt to combat ARM's dominance in the mobile world. As a result, they recently released their new Bay Trail line of Atom processors and results have been quite impressive. In the wake of this launch, we have seen quite a few new low power, x86 tablets running a full Windows 8 (not the red-headed stepchild we all know as Windows RT). Being able to have an affordable, lightweight tablet with long battery life that is also able to be used for work and productivity on-the-go has been quite an attractive prospect to many people, myself included. So I went looking at what the different manufacturers had to offer.

After doing some looking around at a few reviews and videos I concluded that the Asus Transformer Book T100TA would be my best bet. Great performance, long battery life, expandable storage, and includes a keyboard dock, all for only $379 for the 64GB version (i'm a broke ass college student so every penny I can save is great). There were some downsides to it compared to other high end tablets like the lower end 1366x768 screen, less premium feel, but all in all it seemed pretty great. To top it all off, one of the biggest advancements that Bay Trail had over Clover Trail was the massive increase in graphics performance of over four times. The improvement was so dramatic that many games that had previously run well into the single digits on fps were now at playable framerates. This is a huge difference and makes this little machine a viable gaming machine for loads of indie games and other more demanding games at low settings (see link below, you might be surprised what this thing can do). So, I was all set and felt comfortable/excited to buy this.... until I heard about Cherry Trail. Cherry Trail being Intel's next iteration of their Atom line which is slated for release in late Q2/ early Q3 2014. The important thing that caught my eye on the list of advantages projected about Clover Trail was its further increased graphics performance. The problem is I have heard all sorts of conflicting claims about how dramatic this performance increase actually is. This is important because as you can probably see from the link I provided the Bay Trail chip is able to offer performance in a lot of games that is ALMOST playable. And I mean so close you can almost taste it (20-25fps in a lot of games). So, this leads me on to my main question:

Do I buy Bay Trail now or do I wait for Cherry Trail?

This is difficult because I would definitely like to get my hands on this thing as soon as possible, but I am willing to wait if the difference is that dramatic. I am completely aware that you can spend your whole life saying, "Well i'll just wait till X releases then i'll buy it" and not actually buy anything, but this is kind of a special exception because Intel is playing very aggressive catchup in an attempt to gain market-share in the mobile field. It would really be eating me for eternity if I ended up going with the Bay Trail and six months later Cherry Trail comes out with double the performance and half of my game library is unplayable on the go. You should all also bear in mind that considering my financial situation and (relatively) competent ability to to resist splurging and reflex purchases, I am going to be stuck with this machine for at least a couple years. This is all also obviously under the assumption that ASUS will be releasing a Cherry Trail option in the same price bracket when it launches, which it probably will... hopefully... okay feel free to chime in any time here, JJ.

Also I should mention that some of the things that ARE known about Cherry Trail is that it will be based on the 14nm manufacturing process (possble delays then?) and that it will be using a Broadwell-class GPU.

Thanks for all the help guys and I hope some of you who are better informed than myself can help me to make the right decision.

Cheers!

-Julian

tl;dr Bay Trail now or wait for Cherry Trail for gaming?

Example of Bay Trail gaming performance (this guy has loads on his channel): https://www.youtube.com/user/th3drow/videos

The laptop I was looking at:http://www.amazon.com/Transformer-T100TA-C1-GR-10-1-Inch-Convertible-Tou...
 
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Regarding the GPU performance increase in Cherry Trail, all I can say is that it's GPU core will come directly from Intel's Broadwell CPU. Of course it will be a cut down version meaning fewer shaders and lower frequencies; no specifics.

It is speculated that Broadwell's iGPU performance improvement could be between 30% - 40% over Haswell. However, that is pure speculation. Using Broadwell iGPU cores should mean an improvement, but I can't really guess what it would be.
i wouldn't go near an Atom processor for a tablet yet.

They still don't compete on any level with ARM. Maybe in a few years, but right now your best bet is probably a Nexus 7. Cheaper, and frankly superior.

On a laptop in the x86 architecture, your best bet is anything AMD in the sub $600 market for cheap gaming. Intel's onboard graphics in their low end devices isn't in AMD's class yet.
 

jmasta111

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That is not what these benchmarks would leave one to believe. This machine is quite competent for gaming compared to the Nexus 7 and I can benefit from being able to play games from my Steam library. This trades blows and beats most other android/iOS tablets on the market currently (Nexus 7 included), and every review/benchmark I have seen has backed this up (I will go link more as I realize synthetics have limited usefullness but I just grabbed this one quickly). What I am MORE concerned about is if Cherry Trail will be enough of an upgrade to make waiting for it worth my while.

Also I should mention that I am already decided on going with an 8.1 tablet. The functionality for productivity is just so far superior to anything else offered on competing platforms that it is not even a competition. Games were more of an afterthought for me and all I am concerned about is whether Cherry Trail offers enough of a difference because many of these games are on the verge of being playable. MOST of them, in fact, are on the verge of being playable. So at the end of the day, games are not the most important factor to me, but I would like to know if Cherry Trail would be worth the wait.
 


you're comparing devices with completely different architectures... here is a better site with multiple different benches.... including an amd a4... to make my point.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7314/intel-baytrail-preview-intel-atom-z3770-tested/3

that said if you're looking at spending 350-400 you can actually get a full blown A8 quad core laptop in that range this week. That will put any of those chips benched in that review to shame.

really, i like what intel is trying with Atom, but the price/performance isn't there yet. Right now as an all round option, I'd still rather an ARM processor in that market. And if your goal is strictly gaming and you need to be on an x86 platform i'd rather an AMD (especially if a little shorter batter life isn't a concern).

The cpu side of the atom is very strong... the igpu is middle of the road AT BEST. And for gaming it's that igpu that matters.
 
There is always something better on the horizon so you can only play the waiting game for so long before you need to buy something or your desire to have something overshadows your patience.

The question of should you buy a tablet now for productive purposes and entertainment depends entirely on if you currently have a laptop or desktop for schoolwork. If you do not have anything and you must rely on the university's computer lab, then it would actually be best to buy a laptop first.

An example of an inexpensive laptop that has decent gaming performance for $400 is the following 17.3" HP laptop with the A8-5550m and integrated Radeon HD 8550g core. You can use it to do schoolwork and play some non intensive games on maybe medium quality at native resolution (1600x900), and intensive game at low quality and likely 1366x786 resolution. Naturally, it is not as portable as a tablet and you cannot simply whip it out of your pocket or bag and start using it.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/hp-pavilion-17-3-34-laptop-4gb-memory-750gb-hard-drive-anodized-silver/2287004.p?id=1219071221794&skuId=2287004


It you already have a laptop / desktop and simply want another device that is a bit more portable to take notes, study from, play games on, then sure get the tablet. I use my 2012 Nexus 7 to mostly read and play pinball (Pinball Arcade). I rarely use it to write notes or use the simple (and free) spreadsheet app I downloaded.

Cherry Trail is interesting because it should reduce power consumption even further. CPU core performance will not likely improve that much since it will be more of a refinement of Bay Trail. However, I am sure Intel is looking to bump up GPU performance a bit by adding in some additional shaders. Perhaps there will be a rough 5% improvement in overall CPU processor performance.

Personally, I am pretty interested in what comes after Cherry Trail as I am not yet willing to ditch my Nexus 7 any time soon. Certainly a 10% - 15% boost in performance over Chery Trail would be good, more would be great. More importantly though is how well will Intel's 64-bit version of the Android OS will perform in comparison to the standard Android OS. Intel is expected to release that version early next year since it was announced for Bay Trail not Cherry Trail. It is interesting in the fact that this would mean Intel will be a OS developer they would be on the cutting edge of a 64-bit Android OS since no others exist yet... at least none that have been released by Google.

It would be nice though if consumers can eventually have the ability to install either a 64-bit Android OS or whatever Windows OS version in the future on Atom based tablets.
 

jmasta111

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Thank you very much for the response, it has added a lot of context to the whole situation and made me consider some things. Also your point you were talking about 64-bit android is also very interesting and I remember reading about it a little while ago. I think it is a necessary play for them to make because Google has not made any concrete announcement yet and mobile devices are rapidly approaching 4GB or system memory, and we certainly don't want another "Windows-esque" situation when it comes to making the transition from 32 to 64 bit.

Also thank you for recommending me that laptop, as it does appear to be quite a good value, however I DO indeed have a desktop back at home (FX-8350/7950) so i'm not super pressed to have a powerful laptop. On the CPU side, it seems that the T100TA is more than capable for handling Windows, multiple programs, and even some moderate Photoshop use (which is invaluable to me).

Anyway I really appreciate all you've imput, it's been very helpful and I feel a lot more secure in making a buying option though. I just need to ask one more thing about when you mentioned the GPU for Cherry Trail. You mentioned that "Intel is looking to bump up the GPU performance a bit by adding in some additional shaders". When you say a BIT, do you mean a bit as in the ~4x jump in graphical performance we saw from Clover Trail, or the more typical performance increase we have seen from Intel over the years. And most importantly, when speaking in real world terms, do you think the bump up will be enough of a push to make the loads of games that were showcased in videos on that channel I linked that were ALMOST playable, become playable? This link: http://

At the end of the day, that is what is really of importance to me because this isn't talking about going from High to Ultra settings, this is about going from unplayable to playable


Anyway, you've been hugely helpful and I appreciate you taking your time to help me out.
 
I will also add that it is unlikely Cherry Trail will be released in Q2 2014 because Intel had yield problems with it's 14nm manufacturing process which delayed the release of Broadwell. Having said that, it is only logical that the production of Cherry Trail has also been pushed back as well, but they still should be released in 2014.
 
Regarding the GPU performance increase in Cherry Trail, all I can say is that it's GPU core will come directly from Intel's Broadwell CPU. Of course it will be a cut down version meaning fewer shaders and lower frequencies; no specifics.

It is speculated that Broadwell's iGPU performance improvement could be between 30% - 40% over Haswell. However, that is pure speculation. Using Broadwell iGPU cores should mean an improvement, but I can't really guess what it would be.
 
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