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for stricly gaming, but never 3d, which is better 144hz 1ms tn monitor or 5ms ips

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  • Gaming
  • 3D
  • Monitors
  • Graphics
Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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December 26, 2013 7:46:20 PM

looking at two asus monitors both 24 inch

one is tn panel 144hz 1ms
one is ips panel 5ms

lol I did the reaction time test and I scored in the 200s lol do I really need the 144hz, ill never 3d game, (blind in one eye) I play a mix of games like battlefield, civilization , dragon age, mmos, coh2. I hear ips is newer, better.

also if it matters, I sit very close to the monitor, small room small desk etc distance from my eyes to the screen varies from 2.5 to three feet

More about : stricly gaming 144hz 1ms monitor 5ms ips

a b C Monitor
December 27, 2013 8:05:53 AM

I will get the Tn...
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December 27, 2013 2:31:58 PM

hmmm
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
December 27, 2013 2:53:22 PM

5ms is not the latency of the monitor. The latency will be much higher than that. That is the pixel response time. That is how long it takes the pixel to change from one color to another. It relates to motion blur. With 144hz, 5ms is 5/7ths of the time a pixel is displayed, it is in transition.

144hz gives you 7ms frame times. This results in things being smoother than 60hz which has 17ms frame times. While things times seem small, and you may not be able to click a button within that amount of time, you notice the latency very noticeably when tracking your mouse or in game view. With large amounts of latency, the mouse feels a bit disconnected to your hand, and in some cases, this can even cause motion sickness type symptoms (I experience this). With low latency, your movements are easier to track and feel more connected to your actions. The low response times means everything is clearer to see. Using Lightboost at 120hz makes it even better, because it eliminates motion blur almost entirely, giving you very clear crisp motion.

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

That reaction time test is hardly related to response time, or even input latency. We are far more sensitive to latency than that test could possibly show. If that reaction time test meant we didn't need anymore than 200ms of latency, we'd be ok with 5 FPS.
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December 27, 2013 6:57:01 PM

bystander said:
5ms is not the latency of the monitor. The latency will be much higher than that. That is the pixel response time. That is how long it takes the pixel to change from one color to another. It relates to motion blur. With 144hz, 5ms is 5/7ths of the time a pixel is displayed, it is in transition.

144hz gives you 7ms frame times. This results in things being smoother than 60hz which has 17ms frame times. While things times seem small, and you may not be able to click a button within that amount of time, you notice the latency very noticeably when tracking your mouse or in game view. With large amounts of latency, the mouse feels a bit disconnected to your hand, and in some cases, this can even cause motion sickness type symptoms (I experience this). With low latency, your movements are easier to track and feel more connected to your actions. The low response times means everything is clearer to see. Using Lightboost at 120hz makes it even better, because it eliminates motion blur almost entirely, giving you very clear crisp motion.

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

That reaction time test is hardly related to response time, or even input latency. We are far more sensitive to latency than that test could possibly show. If that reaction time test meant we didn't need anymore than 200ms of latency, we'd be ok with 5 FPS.


I see a lot of conflicting info out there, for example if say im playing my game at 60 fps, will a 144hz monitor still help it be smoother, some say well 60fps only utilizes 60hz so unless your running 120fps you wont need a 120hz or 144hz monitior

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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
December 27, 2013 7:01:46 PM

Higher refresh rate is always better regardless of the framerate, 60FPS 120Hz looks a billion times better than 60FPS at 60Hz, far less tearing. If you are using vsync it wont really make a difference, e.g. 60FPS 60Hz Vsync'd looks as good if not better than 60FPS 120Hz but obviously there will be input lag.
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January 4, 2014 6:39:04 PM

So which one did u go with ?
I am myself confused with asus vg248qe (1080p 120hz) tn vs qnix qx2710 (1440p overclockable to 96hz ) pls pannel for gtx 780
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:40:53 PM

Prathit Pannase said:
So which one did u go with ?
I am myself confused with asus vg248qe (1080p 120hz) tn vs qnix qx2710 (1440p overclockable to 96hz ) pls pannel for gtx 780

780 at 1080p is a waste of cash, if you are comfortable with importing then there is absolutely zero reason to go with the Asus monitor.
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:44:47 PM

cookybiscuit said:
Higher refresh rate is always better regardless of the framerate, 60FPS 120Hz looks a billion times better than 60FPS at 60Hz, far less tearing. If you are using vsync it wont really make a difference, e.g. 60FPS 60Hz Vsync'd looks as good if not better than 60FPS 120Hz but obviously there will be input lag.


It is true that the tearing is visible for half the time on a 120hz monitor, if you have 60 FPS. Latency also improves in DX games that use triple buffering (almost all). The reason is a rule that DX has that forces the monitor to display every frame created. 60 FPS on 60 hz, means that frames get backed up one frame, so the monitor is always displaying the older of two frames sitting in the back buffers. This won't happen until you reach 120 FPS when using a 120hz monitor. Unfortunately, you may experience some uneven frame times if you aren't getting exactly 60 FPS.

Using a FPS limit can be used to get around these issues to some degree. With a 60hz monitor, setting a FPS limit to 59 will prevent frames from backing up, and with a 120hz monitor, you can set it to 60 FPS, which is more ideal than 59 FPS is.

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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:49:27 PM

cookybiscuit said:
Prathit Pannase said:
So which one did u go with ?
I am myself confused with asus vg248qe (1080p 120hz) tn vs qnix qx2710 (1440p overclockable to 96hz ) pls pannel for gtx 780

780 at 1080p is a waste of cash, if you are comfortable with importing then there is absolutely zero reason to go with the Asus monitor.


Most people can't get 120 FPS with a single 780 in many games. If you are doing 120/144hz at 1080p, then you'll need the power. 1080p @ 60hz won't use the power very often, but 120hz most certainly will.
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:53:02 PM

bystander said:
cookybiscuit said:
Prathit Pannase said:
So which one did u go with ?
I am myself confused with asus vg248qe (1080p 120hz) tn vs qnix qx2710 (1440p overclockable to 96hz ) pls pannel for gtx 780

780 at 1080p is a waste of cash, if you are comfortable with importing then there is absolutely zero reason to go with the Asus monitor.


Most people can't get 120 FPS with a single 780 in many games. If you are doing 120/144hz at 1080p, then you'll need the power. 1080p @ 60hz won't use the power very often, but 120hz most certainly will.

The extra 26Hz on the Asus monitor can blow to the wind for all I care, not that the Qnix can't do 120Hz with some cable swapping.

Games tend to run into a CPU bottleneck long before you reach 120FPS anyway, at least thats how its going with modern titles. I went from a 670 to 780 at 1080p and it pretty much did nothing other than in synthetic benchmarks, even 3D performance was worse for some bizzare reason, one of the reasons I give it up.
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:54:55 PM

cookybiscuit said:
The extra 26Hz on the Asus monitor can blow to the wind for all I care, not that the Qnix can't do 120Hz with some cable swapping.

Games tend to run into a CPU bottleneck long before you reach 120FPS anyway, at least thats how its going with modern titles. I went from a 670 to 780 at 1080p and it pretty much did nothing other than in synthetic benchmarks, even 3D performance was worse for some bizzare reason, one of the reasons I give it up.


It is true that the CPU will bottleneck you often, before you get there, but that is going to be game dependent. In many games you'll wish you had the extra performance. Others you might not.

Crysis 3, BF4, DA2 and many other games will allow you to get more FPS and at least closer to 120FPS than you can with a lesser card.
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:56:20 PM

Yea but a 780 scales much better at 1440p than it does at 1080p, compared to slower cards. Either way, if you wanted that high a framerate medium settings 1440p beats ultra 1080p every time.
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January 4, 2014 6:57:47 PM

Should I go with qnix qx2710 ?
I will mainly be playing BF4
Watching movies
And lots of coding
CPU is i5-4670k
What would u guys recommend
120hz tn vs 96hz ips 1440p ?
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January 4, 2014 6:58:03 PM

Should I go with qnix qx2710 ?
I will mainly be playing BF4
Watching movies
And lots of coding
CPU is i5-4670k
What would u guys recommend
120hz tn vs 96hz pls1440p ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 6:59:09 PM

cookybiscuit said:
Yea but a 780 scales much better at 1440p than it does at 1080p, compared to slower cards. Either way, if you wanted that high a framerate medium settings 1440p beats ultra 1080p every time.

And 1440p will be limited to 60hz and high motion blur.

I'm just trying to state that with a 120hz monitor, the 780 isn't wasted at 1080p most the time. At least with newer games.
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:00:38 PM

Qnix does 96Hz, so 96FPS. Motion blur is a compromise admittedly, but I've used it side by side with a VG278H on numerous occasions, the difference isn't massive.
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:01:28 PM

cookybiscuit said:
Qnix does 96Hz, so 96FPS. Motion blur is a compromise admittedly, but I've used it side by side with a VG278H on numerous occasions, the difference isn't massive.

Did you use Lightboost in those comparisons?
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:03:32 PM

Nope, I never used Lightboost hack other than messing around, cant stand what it does to the brightness. It's impressive what it does to the blur, but its not even close to being worth the colour and brightness compromise in my books.
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January 4, 2014 7:05:11 PM

Bystander
But the qnix can be over locked
To 120hz or safer 96hz
But the stand Is crappy
Is difference between 1080p tn 120hz and 1440p pls 96hz noticeable ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a c 135 C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:07:17 PM

You'll find people who have used both who will pick one or the other. There is no right or wrong answer. One person will prefer IPS, the other will prefer 120hz and Lightboost. It depends on what is more important to the individual.
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:09:45 PM

Only reason I can see to go with the Asus is if you are a competitive gamer (or are just serious about it) and need every edge, blur reduction would help there. 1440p PLS is lightyears ahead of TN 1080p in my opinion, though I believe the PPI of a 24" 1080p display and a 1440p 27" display are about the same, so I guess you aren't really losing or gaining image quality other than it being bigger.
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January 4, 2014 7:12:50 PM

bystander said:
You'll find people who have used both who will pick one or the other. There is no right or wrong answer. One person will prefer IPS, the other will prefer 120hz and Lightboost. It depends on what is more important to the individual.




Will we see any true 120hz 1440p ips monitor in future like a year or two ?
I am moving up from 720p laptop
So have no experience
With any of the monitors
1080 or 1440 /120hz or 96hz
It's really confusing
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January 4, 2014 7:17:28 PM

Also I have read threads about it
And some say 1080p looks like crap after seeing 1440p
And others say lot of things about input lag and stuff
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January 4, 2014 7:22:33 PM

Prathit Pannase said:
Should I go with qnix qx2710 ?
I will mainly be playing BF4
Watching movies
And lots of coding
CPU is i5-4670k
What would u guys recommend
120hz tn vs 96hz pls1440p ?

For gaming I would already pick a 1440p monitor over a 120hz monitor any day, but that's mostly because I enjoy visuals a tad bit more than I do having the absolute best response for competitive games. If you enjoy having a boost to visuals more than response time, get the 1440p.

I think what sold me on the QNIX Evolution II was that it could be overclocked to 120 Hz, so basically it was a 120 Hz monitor with slightly higher ms and is a larger size (could be viewed as a negative or positive depending on perspective, as usually a 22" monitor is perfect on the eyes as far as seeing surroundings in a FPS game, too much bigger and you have to move your eyes). The 1440p monitor ended up giving me many more options, and that one in particular let me overclock hz as well, so I couldn't really lose. I have a little bit of backlight bleed but no dead pixels. The stand is nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be, it honestly never moves for me.

Don't underestimate how beautiful 1440p is though, it really is a hugeee boost in resolution, and in the very worst case scenario you can always go to 1080p for higher FPS.

If you're planning on purchasing a monitor solely because of FPS games, want to be at the top and are in competitions that bring in money the 120hz will be more useful to you, but otherwise the 1440p hands down.
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:25:10 PM

The Qnix already does it so long as you don't get a dud, my two do 120Hz no problem, though its more of a luck thing where as 96Hz is a certainty. If by true you mean non crappy branded, theres the Overlord Tempest monitors, but they are twice the price and not as good a panel.

Main difference between PLS/IPS (the two are pretty much the same Samsung just likes to be obscure) and TN is PLS/IPS will have much better colour fidelity. You'll have a better range of colours, and they will be truer to life if you set it up properly. 96Hz and 120Hz can't really be compared between the two monitors as the difference in motion blur messes this up, 96Hz on a Asus you can see the individual frames, on the Qnix you cannot, there is enough blur to hide the transition, if or not this is good or bad is up to you.

Again since you are comparing a 24" 1080p to a 27" 1440p the PPI is about the same just the screen is larger. 1080p does look dreadful after using a 1440p display for a while, but 1080p can look fairly decent if you pile on enough anti aliasing, though the things you read probably referred to a 27" display where because you are sitting so close and the display is so large the individual lines of pixels are obvious at 1080p.

Input lag isn't an issue on the Qnix as its simplicity/lack of parts means it bypasses components that would typically introduce input lag. It only has one input port and no internal scaling (meaning you cant use it on anything but a PC, consoles are a no go, so if you planned to use it for that too you're out of luck unfortunately). Tested the Asus and Qnix side by side, no tangible difference to me and I'm very fussy about input lag.

Backlight bleed should be mentioned too. I had three of those 120Hz Asus monitors, they all had a very light blue glow around all edges, no abnormal bleed. One of my Qnix's has no bleed, the other had some, had to take it apart to fix it. Keep that in mind if you are picky about bleed and such, if you aren't willing to open it you are going to be stuck with it, where-as with a monitor from your country you could return it.
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January 4, 2014 7:28:24 PM

cookybiscuit said:
The Qnix already does it so long as you don't get a dud, my two do 120Hz no problem, though its more of a luck thing where as 96Hz is a certainty. If by true you mean non crappy branded, theres the Overlord Tempest monitors, but they are twice the price and not as good a panel.

Main difference between PLS/IPS (the two are pretty much the same Samsung just likes to be obscure) and TN is PLS/IPS will have much better colour fidelity. You'll have a better range of colours, and they will be truer to life if you set it up properly. 96Hz and 120Hz can't really be compared between the two monitors as the difference in motion blur messes this up, 96Hz on a Asus you can see the individual frames, on the Qnix you cannot, there is enough blur to hide the transition, if or not this is good or bad is up to you.

Again since you are comparing a 24" 1080p to a 27" 1440p the PPI is about the same just the screen is larger. 1080p does look dreadful after using a 1440p display for a while, but 1080p can look fairly decent if you pile on enough anti aliasing, though the things you read probably referred to a 27" display where because you are sitting so close and the display is so large the individual lines of pixels are obvious at 1080p.

Input lag isn't an issue on the Qnix as its simplicity/lack of parts means it bypasses components that would typically introduce input lag. It only has one input port and no internal scaling (meaning you cant use it on anything but a PC, consoles are a no go, so if you planned to use it for that too you're out of luck unfortunately). Tested the Asus and Qnix side by side, no tangible difference to me and I'm very fussy about input lag.

Backlight bleed should be mentioned too. I had three of those 120Hz Asus monitors, they all had a very light blue glow around all edges, no abnormal bleed. One of my Qnix's has no bleed, the other had some, had to take it apart to fix it. Keep that in mind if you are picky about bleed and such, if you aren't willing to open it you are going to be stuck with it, where-as with a monitor from your country you could return it.



Well I am not a professional gamer so I think I will go with the qnix qx2710
And maybe get gtx 780 ti
If the support comes out for OS X
Two more question how does 1080p on 1440p screen look like ?
And does over clocking the monitor causes damage ?
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January 4, 2014 7:29:14 PM

Prathit Pannase said:
bystander said:
You'll find people who have used both who will pick one or the other. There is no right or wrong answer. One person will prefer IPS, the other will prefer 120hz and Lightboost. It depends on what is more important to the individual.




Will we see any true 120hz 1440p ips monitor in future like a year or two ?
I am moving up from 720p laptop
So have no experience
With any of the monitors
1080 or 1440 /120hz or 96hz
It's really confusing

Think of it this way, you have your 720p laptop, you are far sighted (can't see up close), you put on glasses and the screen gets much clearer, images are sharper, letters are smaller yet easier to read, there is much more space on your desktop, your surrounds in games etc. That's 1080p. 1440p is a very similar transition., it's like putting on even better glasses, images are even more clearer, and things look much more spectacular.

The only downside to 120hz and 1440p is that you need a better GPU to handle it all, for 1440p I would definitely shoot for a 300$+ GPU if you don't already have one. If you're trying to get 120 FPS, on a 120 Hz monitor it's even more demanding than a 1440p monitor (though it depends on the game).

I have yet to upgrade my GPU yet I have my 1440p monitor and I still think it's worth every penny. I have a 7750 (100$ GPU) and it can barely run games at 1440p, I end up turning settings down, but things are still gorgeous in comparison to my 1080p monitor. I will be even more impressed by my monitor when the GPU I'm looking at finally goes back to its normal pricing.

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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:35:03 PM

Prathit Pannase said:

Well I am not a professional gamer so I think I will go with the qnix qx2710
And maybe get gtx 780 ti
If the support comes out for OS X
Two more question how does 1080p on 1440p screen look like ?
And does over clocking the monitor causes damage ?

1080p on a 1440p display looks quite a bit worse than 1080p on a 1080p display, still has the jaggies but now has softness to it, not as crisp as native 1080p.

Hard to say if it causes damage, I've heard of Qnix's dying but can't say if its down to overclocking. Had mine 6 months I think and its fine so far. One of mine has image retention/burn in at 96Hz, haven't used the other enough at 96Hz to say if it does too but from what I gather its a common issue. I tend to just leave it at 60Hz for desktop use and enable 96Hz when gaming. Burn in happens on high contrasting stuff on screen if they are left there for a few minutes, takes about as long to come back out. Doesn't leave permanent damage but is annoying.

Funnily enough the Asus monitors do the same thing in Lightboost mode, except that takes seconds to burn in and out rather than minutes.
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January 4, 2014 7:39:58 PM

I know there's a little backlight bleeding which can be fixed
Thanks a lot both of you
You guys really helped me out of my misery
1440p it is
Do u guys know If the qnix ships to countries other than us or canada ?
I live in India after taxes it will cost me around 450$
And also should I buy from eBay or amazon ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:43:49 PM

Ebay, use Accessorieswhole as they have a fast turn around and are willing to lie on import papers. Don't know what your country is like as far as import goes, but if its anything like mine they love to charge import tax on expensive items. Use an import duty calculator and see how much it will be, if its too expensive contact the seller and ask them to mark it as a reduced value, say $150, done it twice had no issue.

Disclaimer: I am not to blame if you get taken to prison for 50 years for intentionally lying on import papers. :) 
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January 4, 2014 7:47:55 PM

Indian customs recently just raised the import tax on monitor from meager 5% to whooping 35%
If there would be any problem with the monitor who would replace it with ease amazon or eBay ?
I guess even eBay sellers now don't do that ?
I read somewhere that they have stopped using fake price
I guess I will have to ask the dealer
But if he says no
Then which one
Amazon or eBay ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 7:50:02 PM

Ebay sellers will, they have a years warranty to my knowledge. Don't know who would suck up the shipping fees though.
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January 4, 2014 7:51:00 PM

Even if he gives a fake amount
I will save about 50$
Which is not worth going to jail :D 
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January 4, 2014 8:07:37 PM

I am building a PC for the first time
So do I have to order different types of wires for connecting CPU to monitor
Or does it come included ?
And which screwdriver is required for building a PC ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 8:12:00 PM

It comes with a dual link DVI cable so no worries there. You'll need a standard sized phillips head screwdriver.
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January 4, 2014 8:18:00 PM

can I connect a MacBook Air to qnix ?
And did u replace the stand ?
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a b 4 Gaming
a b C Monitor
January 4, 2014 8:26:30 PM

Not sure what ports it has, it would need to have a mini display port out and have an adapter to make it dual link DVI.
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January 4, 2014 8:47:24 PM

ok you two, you've hijacked my thread long enough /boot lol
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January 4, 2014 11:01:29 PM

raknarius said:
ok you two, you've hijacked my thread long enough /boot lol


Lol :D 
Btw Which monitor did u buy ?
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January 4, 2014 11:48:06 PM

I still haven't decided, ive never owned a ips monitor, nor a 144hz monitor, I am building this for gaming so I think im going to get the benq 144hz 24inch monitor with now pwm dimming, and then if im not impressed with it, ill get an ips, buying at best buy for returns without restocking fees

I just cant buy a Korean import I need a warranty, seems risky
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January 7, 2014 12:28:29 AM

Guys
What fps will I get at 1440p ultra aa off multiplayer 64 players ?
I am planning to build a PC
With evga gtx780 and i5-4670k
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January 7, 2014 12:31:52 AM

gtx780 will get you 40+ FPS with aa turned off, probably 50+ with OCing. Are you talking about BF4? You haven't really specified but I'm just taking a wild guess.
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January 7, 2014 12:39:12 AM

Yeah sorry battlefield 4
But seriously only 50fps ???
Then maybe I should I go 1080p with asus vg248qe instead of qnix qx2710
And what if I get a gtx 780 ti !?
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January 7, 2014 12:49:41 AM

There aren't really any good benchmarks for 1440p resolution for BF4, I'm kind of shocked, so I can't really say anything for sure. With that processor you might be able to push 60 average FPS. It's honestly too hard to tell, I've heard people ahve been able to get 70 FPS with the 780, but it just depends on how much you're willing to OC, and which settings you're willing to drop.

The R9 290/290x is better at 1440p resolutions and better at BF4, so if you're completely nuts about just BF4 or any game with mantle support and you aren't impatient waiting for 290 prices to drop really is the best way to go about getting good FPS on BF4 with that resolution.

You still have the option of turning down AA and everything will still look significantly better than 1080p yet will still be decent FPS.

You hypothetically should be good with a 780 even at stock clocks, but for whatever reason there aren't extensive benchmarks and the ones I've found have showed much lower FPS than it should be getting.

Seriously though, you're going to have too look around for 1440p BF4 benchmarks, there's not too much more I can do for you.

If you're willing to turn down a couple settings for higher FPS the bottom line is you should still have 60+ FPS and it should still look much better than a 1080p monitor. It might not be ultra with every single thing maxed out, but pretty darn close.
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January 7, 2014 1:13:00 AM

One more question but does
1080p on 1440p 27" inch screen looks nice ??
I know I have asked it before
But wanted to get your opinion ?
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January 7, 2014 1:57:29 AM

1080p looks ok, but most games can be set up to 1440 anyway, so what is the point?
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January 7, 2014 3:23:31 AM

Mineria said:
1080p looks ok, but most games can be set up to 1440 anyway, so what is the point?


The point is in first person shooter games like battlefield 4
If I tone down the resolution
I can get higher fps
That's why the question does 1080p look good on 1440p screen
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