Packet loss while downloading/uploading. why?

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A

aflumbahgee

Honorable
Dec 31, 2012
53
0
10,630
When i'm uploading or downloading, or someone else on the network is i get packet loss. I see this from doing a test on pingtest.net. I get 0% when theres no downloading or/uploading but a random packet loss % when i am. Why is this?

Also when im in a game when im uploading/downloading i get disconnected randomly and freeze and i get fluctuating ping. in league of legends when im downlaoding/uploading i get 120-1500 ping or more. but when im not i get a solid 50 ping.

i have a technicolor 582n router

My internet is about 11mb down and 0.37 up and 30-70 ping when no downloading/uploading at the time of the speedtest

 
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Shaun o

Shaun o

Illustrious
Oct 7, 2007
6,113
1
41,960
What Isp are you using and what type of connection. ?
Adsl ,or fiber optic. ?

You may have the wrong MTU value setup in the router.
It should be about 1500.

If it is set wrong in the router you can get packet loss, or fragmented packets.

Log into the router and check the value stated.
 
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A

aflumbahgee

Honorable
Dec 31, 2012
53
0
10,630


Im using ADSL and im with plusnet

Ive looked in the router and i cant find anything that says MTU...





 
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Shaun o

Shaun o

Illustrious
Oct 7, 2007
6,113
1
41,960
Packet loss is not always down to the equipment but the quality of the copper cable used from your house to the local telephone exchange.

The other effect depending on distance, is how much speed you can get in Mbs.
So if you have a lower Mbs speed than currently provided or quoted for the price you are paying.
Then the problem is line quality.

And there is nothing you or Plus net can do. As much as packet loss, low speeds are the cause of old copper phone lines since most are about 30 to 40 years old.

My advice, if you have the option to move to fiber optic do so.
It will resolve the problem. With a better speed,lower ping, and very little packet loss.

I know in some places Fiber is still not available, but if you have the option switch.
You will get a better service and the quoted speeds.

 
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U

Urumiko

Distinguished
Dec 28, 2013
505
0
19,160
from command prompt, Run a trace route to a random website, e.g

tracert www.bbc.co.uk

The first hop will be your router, the next hop is your local telephone exchange.

Try extended ping tests on each of these hops to see if the problem is between you and your router (usually wifi), if not try between you and the exchange.

ping - n 100 -l 1000 [ip address of router/exchange]

if the problem is with your wireless change your wireless channel between 1,6,11, and see if that helps.

if it is between you and the exchange, try connecting your adsl filter directly in to the BT test socket, if this does not fix the issue ring ur ISP.

 
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A

aflumbahgee

Honorable
Dec 31, 2012
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I am connected directly to the bt test socket. I am also on Ethernet not wireless.

i did tracert to bbc website and got around 30 ping for everything then there was 2 lines with just asterisks and request timed out on them. i tested it again and didn't get those 2 requested time out lines.

My area is supposed to get fibre around march. So i will defo just get fibre once its available.
 
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U

Urumiko

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Dec 28, 2013
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Thats fine the asterisked ones are just routers that are set not to respond to ping etc,
You are interested in the first hop after your router... (hop 2).
This is the local telephone exchange.
type "ping - n 1000 -l 1000 [ip address of hop 2]" and it will pasically ping your telephone exchange 1000 times... if you see the odd packet drop, you know your telephone line is flakey and you can contact your ISP.

Getting fiber will most likely improve the situation as you are replacing most of your telephone line, but when you get fiber it still leaves some of your old phone line. If the problem is with that bit of the line the issue may persist.

REPORT AFK!!!!! etc :p ;)
 
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A

aflumbahgee

Honorable
Dec 31, 2012
53
0
10,630


report afk? Is that reference to league? :D anyways, i did the test thingy and most the packets are 55 ping ish. some are around 100 ping and other are 400-500 ping. Does that mean my line is flakey? i with attach the test.

Reply from 195.166.128.195: bytes=1000 time=57ms TTL=126
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Ping statistics for 195.166.128.195:
Packets: Sent = 1000, Received = 1000, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 51ms, Maximum = 748ms, Average = 69ms

C:\WINDOWS\system32>

i will do another one later tonight and see if its different.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
U

Urumiko

Distinguished
Dec 28, 2013
505
0
19,160


Yes it was.. I'm playing right now ^_^
That seems ok assuming you had a little bit of traffic on your internet to cause the little spikes of 200+ms

Have a look on your router and see if it has any error logs... fec, hec, etc
 
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aflumbahgee

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i have since done multiple of these tests and it has came up with 0% packet loss every time. If im getting 0% packet loss on these tests then why do i get it on pingtest.net?

also i monitor packet loss through teamspeak and it fluctuates alot. the ping also fluctuates too and the jitter.

My ping is fluctuating like crazy. it goes from 33 piong and 5 jitter to over a thousand in ping and jitter. can this be caused by being downloading/uploading on the network?

even if there is heavy bandwidth usage on the network like downloading/uploading/watching streams it shouldnt cause packet loss should it?

Does this help at all http://n3.netalyzr.icsi.berkeley.edu/summary/id=36ea240d-25297-f968ead6-8fef-40f7-ae90
 
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Urumiko

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Ok so...

I dont want to go for information overload but here goes :D

Yes downloading will cause Jitter + lag/latency, and in extreme cases packet loss.
Remember your internet connection can only transmit 1 packet at a time, if you are using only teamspeak its going to have free use of your connection and these packets will be able to flow freely and regularly across your line without issue.

Imagine suddenly you start downloading at the same time as team speak, and then there will be other packets wanting to be transited at the same time as teamspeak. Your connection will deal with this by queuing the packets up and transmitting them one after the other. If a team speak packet is at the back of the queue it will have to wait until the packets in front of it are transmitted. As the various team speak packets find them selves having to queue for different amounts of time this is what causes jitter.

You can kind of see this happening with the ping tests where the odd ping takes a lot longer than the others, this is probably because something else used the internet at that point.

The reason the latency is higher and more apparent in my ping tests is because of the packet size. I have specified "-l 1000" (packet size = 1000 bytes), a standard ping test packet is only about 32 bytes. a larger ping will take a little longer to transmit but is also more likely to get stuck in queues or become corrupt if there are errors on the line.

In theory if you were constantly downloading at the max speed of your connection the queue would fill up and stuff would start dropping as there is no place for it to go.
Downloads use TCP which will throttle itself and resend any data that gets dropped, so they may choke your connection a bit but they should settle down and not get loss if speeds stay the same.

However voice traffic like Teamspeak uses UDP This is just fired out at whatever rate the Teamspeak server/client is set at without any confirmation. If this is more than your internet can handle it will drop out all over the place.

These are the steps I would take:

1. Dont download or throttle downloads right down, while playing, try and keep your internet use light/below 20%, some routers may have QOS (Quality of service) options which will let you give your game traffic higher priority but this will only apply to outbound traffic.

2. if you are connected over WIFI perform the same tests i described above, but between you and your router and PC, (first hop on the traceroute), this will check to see if your WI-FI has issues, you should consistantly get less than 10ms for every ping when not in use. If it does have issues change your wireless channel between channels 1/6/11 to find a better one.

3. Check what bitrate settings are configured on the teamspeak server, noobs have a tendancy to ramp this up to really high quality thinking it will improve call quality but all it does is cause lag and dropouts. You dont need high quality for voice, lower is better from a relyability perspective, (i preffer skype tbh)

4.Look in your router for error logs, adsl routers will typically log FEC/HEC/CRC errors, if your routers been on ages its normal to have some , but if you are getting 100's of errors a second this is bad and i can advise more.

5.Be aware League itself is lagging for loads of people randomly at the moment with the start of the new season.

Feel free to add me on League EUW, same name as this forum.

 
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Urumiko

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I just noticed your speeds, Upload 140 Kbit/s, Download 350 Kbit/s this is pretty damn slow? would you mind PM ing me your postcode so i can see if this is normal for your area? either that or put it in www.samknows.com yourself.

Either way what i said about bitrates and download applies a whole lot more at that speed, if someone goes on youtube for example its likely to make you lag.
 
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