Mini-ITX gaming pc build?

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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I want to build another pc for myself that is pretty tiny, but can still do some serious gaming. I am hoping to use a Mini-ITX mobo so i can make a build almost the size of a gaming console... hopefully. Im not sure what good mini mobos there are out there, but there has to be some. I plan on no overclocking, pretty much everything will be basic and simple. I dont really need usb 3.0, but it would be nice if i could, again, not necessary.
What ram would be good, as in very small, short, but still good at 1600mhz, im thinking 16gb. What about a good intel cpu? Would prefer one with low power draw, but still beefy performance. Obviously will need a very small case, simple, but with at least one 5.5" drive bay hopefully for movies, cd's, etc. disks.
I am worried mostly about the gpu, i still want pretty good performance, but it has to fit. Right now i have a GTX 660 SC, good enough for me, so i would need something like a 760 or slightly better, but again, it has to ultimately fit; what would be a good gpu for these needs? The psu also worries me, i know its going to be big, gonna take up a lot of space :(

So any recommendations for parts for this Mini-ITX gaming build? If i could fit a Micro-ATX build into a console sized rig, i would go for it, but i dont think a micro build would be small enough.

Please help me out, open to any and all feedback. Thanks!
 

Rammy

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Yeah budget would be helpful.

The Minicube doesn't really hit your requirements as it doesn't have ODD support. Would you be open to a slim optical drive or are you attempting to reuse a full size one?

Also, I dunno how much it is worth upgrading from a GTX660 to a GTX760. It's a pretty decent performance gap, but given the price it's really not something that is terribly appealing - I also use a GTX660. It's most likely you'll be better off reusing the GTX660 for the time being and waiting until it becomes more obsolete before buying another card.
What kind of display resolution are you running?

I rather like the 250D, but I think it only makes sense if you are using the radiator support. Otherwise it's a very wide+heavy case for the format.
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Yeah, that one might be a little too big, but ill see about the size. Looks really nice though, ill give it that for sure, and sounds like it can really fit a tiny bit amount of stuff in there (definitely not sarcasm :p ). Does it have cable management? Thats another big thing and a reason i like the Mini Cube-has cable management, im becoming needy for a clean case since my current rig looks like a rats nest inside.

As far as budget goes, anything reasonable, i dont have a real budget yet b/c im starting to look into this, ill manage to get the money though. Nothing crazy like dual gpu's (if possible with a micro build lol) or a cpu over $200, etc. Again, just a reasonable budget, not too crazy high, not too restricting low. Im thinking... $600-$900 max.
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Slim optical drive, they make those? They are external USB drives basically right? I just need a basic disk drive to install windows, burn/rip cd's, etc. etc. I will be buying all new parts, im not going to be reusing any parts from my current pc, they will be their own seperate systems. Im actually thinking something more than a 760, maybe a 770 or a R9 280x, something for some real gaming and future proofing, this will be a serious gaming rig and everything on ultra- need to consider size, and temperatures that will be in the case. I will be running a 16:9 1080p monitor, 1920x1080, eventually might go multiple screens, bigger tv, whatever, no plans for multiple displays atm though.
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Hey everyone, how does this stuff work out?
250d_built_side_left_open.png

How does the gpu go over the mobo? How does it connect like that??

91IWlQbVdbL._SL1500_.jpg

And here, first of all, how does the gpu connect like that to the mobo as well? And the bigger problem, how does the cpu cool like that if the psu is over nearly the while mobo? Wheres the freaking cpu cooler? How does it even fit in that tiny space between the board and psu? Where does the air even go... the psu? lol. Looks like a nuclear meltdown waiting to happen in there.

91125MHrB4L._SL1500_.jpg

HOW THE HELL DOES THE GPU CONNECT TO THE MOBO LIKE THAT!??!!!11?

Help?
 

Rammy

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Yeah a slim optical drive is what you get in a laptop so its quite a bit smaller. Cases like the EVGA Hadron Air and Silverstone FT03-Mini use them as it gives a lot more space and they can be used in more unusual orientations/locations.

If you aren't going to overclock, that gives you quite a lot of flexibility in one area, as CPU cooler limitations are a big issue in ITX builds. Any ITX case will allow some measure of aftermarket cooling, but assuming you go with a standard Ivy Bridge/Haswell i5, there isn't any specific need to change from the stock cooler.

As for graphics cards, some cases will limit you in this aspect by length, but you'll find that the vast majority of gaming orientated ITX cases will support 250-300mm graphics cards which covers you for a huge amount of cards. A reference GTX780/780Ti/Titan is 267mm for example. There are some cards which will potentially cause issues, for example the R9 280X Toxic which is 308mm long and pretty power hungry.
For 1080P gaming right now, a GTX760 is actually perfectly passable, but if you want some lifespan then something in the GTX770/280X range isn't a bad investment. In both cases a ~550W PSU is likely to be sufficient for your build.

For PSUs, you shouldn't have any concerns about power limitations, there will always be a solution. The thing you need to watch out for is that "ATX" PSUs suggests a fixed length, when it's actually used to describe PSUs of hugely varying depths. It's relatively common to find 170mm+ PSUs, and a lot of these will not fit into a lot of ITX cases, but there are 140-150mm ones that will.

For more case ideas and info on the restricting dimensions, have a look at the link below. Hopefully it will help you narrow down your case choice.
 

Rammy

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In the 250D, the motherboard sits horizontally, so the graphics card is upright. This is very common in ITX cases.
Another thing to note is that while ITX only contains a single expansion slot, most cases support dual slot graphics cards by allowing space for them to overhang the motherboard.
It connects in exactly the same way as any other motherboard.

In the Elite 130, it's not the greatest cooling in the world, but it's also not a massive problem unless you are trying to overclock. It has a fan at the side of the motherboard, and one at the front of the case. You can install an additional fan alongside the front part of the motherboard too. There are quite a lot of vents too, CPU cooling isn't a big concern.
In the picture you linked, the PSU is actually upside down. In most Elite 130 builds, the PSU will sit with the fan facing upwards, to draw air in from the top vent, and push it out through the back of the case.
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Turns out to have been a bit more than i was expecting lol.
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.95 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-I DELUXE/WD Mini ITX LGA1155 Motherboard ($202.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LP 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($162.84 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Samsung 840 Pro Series 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($199.00 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($148.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($329.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 130 Mini ITX Tower Case ($44.99 @ Microcenter)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-F12 PWM 55.0 CFM 120mm Fan ($25.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Power Supply: Corsair CX 750W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.98 @ OutletPC)
Other: Thermalright AXP-100 ($69.90 @ Amazon)
Total: $1481.60
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-31 00:26 EST-0500)
 

Rammy

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You can chop the price down pretty easily to get it under $1000 or so. $900 is doable, but it will mean compromise on performance.

As for your build itself, it's mainly ok, but a lot of things are too expensive/pointless.
Motherboard is hugely expensive. At those prices you might as well get a 4670K and a Maximus Impact. It's only selling point is WiDi, which is a very very niche feature.
16Gb of ram is pointless for gaming.
256Gb SSD is nice to have but a luxury, especially a Samsung Pro.
2TB drive is a huge amount of storage for a solely gaming machine. Also Caviar Blacks are expensive and no faster than a Barracuda, but have a longer warranty.
750W PSU is entirely pointless on an ITX build, as 550W or so will power any single graphics card. Additionally, the Corsair CX is kinda poor in terms of quality. On a budget build they can make sense, but this is an expensive build, and not a component to go cheap on.
CPU cooler/front fan are expensive, and given the nature of the case (airflow isn't amazing) you probably won't be able to extract a vast overclock anyway.

With that in mind, here's a suggested build for $360 less which doesn't really compromise anything significantly.
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Corsair H60 54.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($49.99 @ NCIX US)
Motherboard: ASRock Z87E-ITX Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($139.98 @ OutletPC)
Memory: A-Data XPG V1.0 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($72.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($89.00 @ Amazon)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($87.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($329.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 130 Mini ITX Tower Case ($49.99 @ Mwave)
Power Supply: Rosewill Capstone 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($84.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1121.89
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-31 00:55 EST-0500)

And here is a <$1000 version with very similar in-game performance
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4430 3.0GHz Quad-Core Processor ($184.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-H87N-WIFI Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($110.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: A-Data XPG V1.0 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($72.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($89.00 @ Amazon)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($86.47 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($329.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 130 Mini ITX Tower Case ($49.99 @ Mwave)
Power Supply: XFX 550W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply ($49.99 @ NCIX US)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $991.38
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-31 00:56 EST-0500)

If you want to get the price down further, I'd suggest going to a GTX760 and a 1TB HDD. It's still going to be perfectly competent. for 1080P gaming for the time being
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Ill admit i guess i did overkill at first, and i legit thought i would need a lot of power for a gtx 770 or above in the future, plus i want some headroom for upgrades. Yeah, 16gb of ram is a lot in retrospect. I need a big hdd and plenty of space because i will also be recording with probably Fraps, and their file sizes are huge before converted (~1gb/minute) and i always hear the WD Black is best for gaming and performance. I still am hesitant towards a Barracuda hdd because i hear they fail a lot and are noisy, and i definitely can not have my hdd fail on me, even if i back up and create system images itll be a huge hassle. That ASRock board seems excelent though and sounds to have plenty of potential for OCing if i ever want to and it has a UEFI bios (I need uefi). I also dont really need a cpu cooler right now either i guess, ill just use the stock cooler, and i dont want a water cooler- leaks are certain to eventually happen, and requires more upkeep.

Basically the same as you gave me, but without aftermarket cpu cooler. Still looking for a cheaper good, quiet fan too- which is why i wanted the Noctua nf-f12, its only an extra like $20 anyways.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock Z87E-ITX Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($129.99 @ Microcenter)
Memory: A-Data XPG V1.0 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($72.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($89.00 @ Amazon)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($87.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($329.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 130 Mini ITX Tower Case ($44.99 @ Microcenter)
Power Supply: Rosewill Capstone 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($84.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1056.91
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-31 01:37 EST-0500)
 

Rammy

Honorable
The Elite 130 isn't terribly friendly towards air cooling, hence why in both threads you've been directed towards closed loop coolers. It's not infeasible that they can leak, but it's incredibly rare, far from certain, and in the Elite 130 your cooler is quite a long way from your motherboard, so it's fairly unlikely to cause damage even if it did leak. They don't need maintenance either.

The Noctua NF-F12 is a radiator fan, it's not really an appropriate case fan. If you were looking to upgrade the fans on a closed loop cooler, it'd be a great choice. For case fans you want S12 or P12s.

Caviar Black makes zero difference in terms of performance versus a Barracuda. It's simply a high quality, high warranty (5 years) item, not a performance focused one.

I picked the Capstone as it fits in this case, is a suitable wattage, and is 80Plus Gold which is nice. One thing to note is that in the Elite 130 the PSU sits above the motherboard, so cable management is a nightmare. There are other options such as the Seasonic G-series, M12 II, Antec HCG-M and Corsair HX650 (actually probably the best of the bunch at current prices)
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
635
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Ive been revising the build and i have some questions.

- Im going to instead get an EVGA GTX 770 SC w/ ACX cooling. Im firm on that, even if the price may be more, ive fallen in love with everything about it, but not going to go into details right now. I also need a psu that has 42 amps on the 12V rail, which isnt that hard to find, it is also suggested that a 600W psu be used, but they always over estimate.

- Id rather get a Thermaltake TR2 TR-700 700W. It is cheaper than the Rosewill Capstone 550W and has more watts (obviously) and it also has great reviews. I know the quality may not be as amazing, but i honestly think its going to be just as good- just because its not the most stellar name brand doesnt mean its bad. Thing is, its not modular, which is more of an inconvenience, but i would still prefer modular or semi modular.
So i found the RAIDMAX HYBRID 2 RX-630SS 630W which is modular, but seems worse to me. Its only 630W, sounds like a worse and cheaper brand, and has two 12V rails. I dont think i would like to have two 12V rails, i feel it might lead to problems like for one, not having enough amps go to the gpu. They are both 22 Amps which equals 44A together which would be enough for the GTX 770 (logically/on paper).
~I want a lot of headroom for upgrades and possible future OC'ing, thats why i want an upgraded psu.

Im still debating whether to get the CM 130 or the Cubitek Mini Cube. The 130 had an ODD drive which is nice, but i can always use an external disk drive if i need to. The Mini Cube has actual cable management, i like the size, layout and design better than the CM 130 too, and im pretty sure airflow will be better than the 130. But then, the mini cube is more expensive at $100 versus $50 for the CM 130. Hmmmm... what do you guys think?
 

Rammy

Honorable
Absolutely nothing wrong with the EVGA. It's a great brand, and that cooler is commonly well reviewed. They suggest 600W because a lot of PSUs aren't capable of delivering their rated wattage.


That Raidmax for example, is labelled as a 630W PSU, but only has 44A on 12V - 528W. Two 12V rails isn't necessarily a problem, some quality PSUs will use this and if it's wired in correctly it leaves you at no disadvantage. The Raidmax however, is junk.

The "Thermaltake TR2" is synonymous with "terrible PSU". I understand some of the newer versions aren't quite so awful, but it's still a dud really. I'm not entirely in agreement with this list, but it's not a bad reference point of which brands/models to avoid. Note that the Thermaltake TR2 and Raidmax as a brand both appear in "NOT RECOMMENDED. Replace ASAP if you have one".

In the Elite 130, going semi or fully modular is near to essential as the cables will hang down and they will be very awkward to tie up. Your budget isn't tiny, and this isn't a great place to try to cut corners. Based on the current prices, if you want to go for more wattage (not that it's needed) I'd suggest one of these -
Corsair HX650 - $80
SeaSonic M12II 620 - $80
SeaSonic SS-650AM - $85
Antec HCG-620M - $90
XFX P1-650X-XXB9 - $90
Rosewill CAPSTONE-650-M - $100
SeaSonic SSR-650RM - $100
The HX650 is the best buy right now as it has a discount and a rebate. It's RRP is around $140, so it's a pretty excellent price. At other times any of the others might present a better alternative. With the exception of the Rosewill, they are all made by Seasonic who are widely regarded as among the best PSU manufacturers.

I wouldn't say the Mini Cube and the Elite 130 are direct competitors. There is a pretty huge price gap, and they take fairly different form factors. If you aren't bothered about the ODD and want better airflow then look at the Fractal Design Node 304 - looks nice, solid airflow and great cooler support. The main downside- no ODD (and it's a bit more expensive than the 130). I think at $100 the Minicube is too expensive for what it is, and it's airflow isn't great either, it really lacks vents and the sole intake is almost entirely blocked by a full length graphics card.
If you want case ideas, have a look at the link below -
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Thanks for the help on the psu's, i dont really know which are bad ones to avoid. If anything, i like the SeaSonic SS-650AM. I dont think im going to be building this soon, so the HX650 probably wouldnt be on sale then, but if it is, ill get it.

I really like the Node 304 case, i love the exterior, how it looks just about perfectly plain and that is what im looking for, and doesnt bring attention. But im afraid that it will be just as crampt and cluttered as the Cooler Master 130; the layout inside is almost the same too.
I cant really see by pictures on google, but does the psu or anything go over the cpu or the cooler?
 

Rammy

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Despite a fairly similar form factor, the Node is quite different in terms of internal layout. It has the PSU at the front, which I'm not a massive fan of in general, but it means that the space above the motherboard is relatively clear, giving you enough space for even the biggest heatsinks/air coolers. It also fits two small fans at the front, and one larger one at the back, plus a basic fan controller for them as standard. Rather than having drive bays, it has removable brackets that hang from the roof of the case.

Any ITX build is going to be cluttered in some way, it's a hazard of the format. The advantage of having a PSU in the bottom of the case rather than the top is you have more scope for tucking loose cables without having to get very creative with cable ties. You'll probably end up with a small bundle however you work it though.

Keyboard looks like a pretty standard MS media keyboard. I think its the "Microsoft wired keyboard 600". Great name guys.
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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Here is the new, third revision of my build and im pretty happy with it. Of course i would like a price tag under $1000, but what are you gonna do? :/

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($229.97 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: ASRock Z87E-ITX Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($139.98 @ OutletPC)
Memory: A-Data XPG V1.0 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($72.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($89.99 @ Adorama)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($86.47 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 770 2GB Video Card ($349.49 @ B&H)
Case: Fractal Design Node 304 Mini ITX Tower Case ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic M12II 650W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($84.99 @ Newegg)
Other: LG USB 2.0 Super-Multi Portable DVD Rewriter ($28.00 @ Newegg)
Total: $1151.87
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-31 20:57 EST-0500)
 

Rammy

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Yeah if you want something you can carry around those Lian Li cases are awesome. They aren't cheap though. To me their best selling point is the handle and the reinforced edges so it can take a few knocks.

To me, if you want something of similar dimensions, don't need a handle, and aren't too bothered about costs, I reckon the EVGA Hadron Air is a better option. The Lian Li has limits imposed on the PSU, HDD, ODD, CPU cooler and graphics card, most of which the EVGA avoids (at the expense of a fairly small size increase).
 

DarkDubzs

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Jun 10, 2013
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The EVGA Hadron Air is nice and the cost is cancelled out by the 500w 80+ GOLD! psu, but its not really for me. I like the Node 304 better though for my purpose, I need a case that is small, basic exterior, and doesn't grab attention. But if those didnt matter and I still needed an ITX build, the EVGA case would be really nice, especially with the side window.