A8-5600K dual graphics GPU

tduanebarr · Mar 2, 2014

Hello,

My friend has a build with an A8 5600k in it.

I'm trying to figure out what GPUs are supported in dual graphics mode to give him a cheap upgrade to his graphics performance.

I'm having a hard time finding anything from AMD. There are some reports of dual graphics working with the HD7750, but I'm not sure if it is officially supported.

I am curious if any of the R7 cards are supported or really just what the best option is for dual graphics here.

Thanks!

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 2, 2014

here is a list of the supported graphics from officially supported graphics cards for dual graphics

http://www.amd.com/us/products/technologies/dual-graphics/Pages/dual-graphics.aspx#3

your apu has a 7560d igpu so it is officially supported by the 6570

that being said i have done dual graphics on a llano setup(you have trinity 2nd gen) and the micro stutter is extremely annoying
i havent tried dual graphics in trinity so maybe they upgrade the drivers but in llano it was horrible.

argeru · Mar 2, 2014

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121645#13938091409221&{"sso":"sr_ssotoken::ViFTNUlSygKnfAh2tT99cIIRRwkTsCDc80HPU9zoQto="}
the a8 5600k is one of the original apu's, so crossfire support is still limited, the card above would work perfectly though, and has 2gb of ram.

tduanebarr · Mar 2, 2014

Thanks, I saw that chart but for some reason I was not interpreting it correctly.

Yeah, I know that dual graphics with trinity wasn't great according to some reviews. However, I think it was more of a driver issue than a hardware issue. Have you tried dual graphics lately? The latest Tom's review showed that it has improved on the kaveri platform but I'm not sure if that is due to driver updates. The 7750 is quite a bit better of a card, I may try it just to see if it works for me. Any thoughts on if an R7-240 could work?

Bad_Kitty13 :

tduanebarr · Mar 2, 2014

argeru :

You linked a 6670 here vs the 6570, are you sure that would work?

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 2, 2014

tduanebarr :

the r series are just upgrades to the 7000 series i have even seen a 290 cfx with a 7970, however the trinity platform ran dual graphics on the 6000 series so i doubt it would work and i have seen forums of people trying to use a 7750 in dual graphics and fail, never seen one work.
the unofficial solutions sometimes do work but have less performance than if you was just using a single 6670 so if you use dual graphics with your igpu i suspect that the same issue would happen because the dedicated card is to powerful to work well with the igpu. hope this clears some stuff up

tduanebarr · Mar 2, 2014

Yes, that helps thanks. I have seen some people in forums claim the 7750 worked great for them, namely this one guy:

http://forums.amd.com/game/messageview.cfm?catid=475&threadid=168178&enterthread=y

Do you think the 6670 would work since AMD claims to support only the 6570?

Finally, at $65 there is this 6670:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1366279&CatId=7005

Think this would be a good upgrade option? Does anyone have any experience with combo 5600K and 6670? What kind of results do you have?

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 2, 2014

i doubt that post is legit because no matter what scaling it does it never goes over 100% the newer gen cards can get around 75-80% and that is with a legit cfx/sli respectively. dual graphics the scaling is even lower than that because the memory of the igpu is based off of system memory, ddr3 where as gpu memory is ddr5
and i couldnt look at the 6670 the domain is blocked on my server

but so long as its memory is around 2gb vram and try to get a ddr3 model as to avoid the microstutters and other rendering nightmares. you can pick the model you want, i like saphire and asus myself
and you already know my views on dual graphics...meh... hehehe but it should work i think the only reason that it is not officially supported is because some 6670 have gddr5 memory and it creates compatibility issues.

tduanebarr · Mar 3, 2014

Oh, well the link is for a GDDR5 version of the 6670.

I have heard some say it doesn't matter what type of memory is on the card for dual graphics, but you are indicating that it does. Do you have a reference or explanation for why that is the case?

It seems for every other reason GDDR5 would be better. The card I linked BTW says it supports dual graphics with A8 apus, but I don't know if I can trust the manufacturer (xfx model - XFX HD-667X-ZWF4)

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 3, 2014

this is a review of the newer cards r7 with fm2+ apus (i couldnt find any older ones)

's actually worthwhile to compare the R7 250 against the also-GCN IGP used in the A10-7850K. The APU can team a discrete card up with the IGP for extra performance by way of Dual Graphics. The two processors' specifications are broadly similar, albeit with the IGP taking its memory-bandwidth allocation from system memory rather than onboard RAM. For folk considering running Dual Graphics the DDR3 version makes more sense as the memory bandwidth is similar to the IGP's.

http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/65977-sapphire-radeon-r7-250-dual-graphics-mantle/

i have just seen issues with it thats all, the gddr5 memory is faster but i think that is why people get stuttering issues also because if the gpu is rendering faster than the apu how can they work in tandem to provide smooth fps?

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 3, 2014

here are some gddr3 mem 6670

http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-video-card-hd66702gd3
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvr667d32gi
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/msi-video-card-r6670md2gd3v2
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/xfx-video-card-hd667xcnf3

thes are all 2 gb cards as i would not reccomend getting less than that for 1080p gaming on the new games

tduanebarr · Mar 10, 2014

Thanks for all the great info. I could see how in theory the different memory speeds could cause problems, but I don't know if anyone has proven this by measuring frame rate variability or the more subjective 'frame-tearing' type issues.

Regardless, I will probably go ddr3 just to make sure I don't have that to worry about. As far as memory goes, hypothetically won't the system memory be used as well? I don't see why I would need 1gb on the board when the igp is doing part of the work with the on board memory. The 1gb cards are only about $10 less at retail, they are still $60 which seems a little steep.

This 2GB is $70 here vs the others you linked that 80 and up.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/amd-radeon-hd-6670-2gb-ddr3-pci-express-2-1-graphics-card/4677014.p;jsessionid=364435B0F033A9CB912C7A9E9F083253.bbolsp-app01-189?id=1218505322347&skuId=4677014&st=6670&cp=1&lp=1#tab=specifications

Ooh, just found one that is $60 AR on amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/XFX-650MHz-PCI-Express-Graphics-HD667XCLF3/dp/B00AHV7NNE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1394490459&sr=8-2&keywords=hd+6670

My big question is:

Are dual graphics worth it at this price point? Newer cards like the R7-250 or the 7750 are routinely on sale for around the same price and I'm not sure what would give better performance in game.

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 10, 2014

with dual graphics or sli/cfx it isnt a 2+2=4gb situation each card renders seperate images so as one card is rendering an image the "slave" card is rendering a different image so it is really 2 cards working independantly but in tandem.
as for the the cards i would get the first one (higher clocks)
i personally do not like dual/hybrid graphics and would always suggest a single card over using them. if you can find a 7770 they dip down to 80/90 dollar range sometimes as well
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/sapphire-video-card-1003582l
thats one for 90
if he could spare 120/125 there are gtx 750 and r7 260x for that range but i know thats probably more than he wants to spend

tduanebarr · Mar 10, 2014

Thanks for the reply.

So if dual graphics memory isn't 100% additive is it 0% additive? As in, all memory used will be on the card? Or is it that some memory will be used by the card and some by the igp- meaning that with a 1gb card I will have actually more than 1gb for the igp/apu to load textures in?

The 7770s are around the same price at times- would that give him better performance? Also- I think I'm gonna buy the card for his upcoming bday, but I don't want to spend too much and he only has a corsair cx-430 psu.

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 10, 2014

with a 7770 it would be close as he would draw 29.3a and his psu pushes 32a rated but it may not be pushing that due to age and the cx series isnt exactly the best build quality. thats pretty close and not exactly sure if it would handle it. the dual graphics maybe your best route. as far as the memory works, the way normal graphics work in sli/cfx the cpu looks for a item to be rendered on the hdd then it gets sent to a gpu it keeps dong this to render image. dual graphics one uses ram memory and one uses vram(card) to store and render. the igpu uses the system memory and pushes through the card as the card renders its own images i believe.

tduanebarr · Mar 10, 2014

Bad_Kitty13 :

Looks like the 7770 may be a little much for this psu to run real safely? Despite this guy here that saying the 7770 only draws 23A? If AMD recommends a 500 watt PSU it may be wiser to go by that standard than try to push it.

www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1658217/cx430-psu-good-7700-gpu.html

This is the psu here, it is one of the cx430s rated for 32A http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026

If it's risky to run a 7770 with this psu- I don't want to buy him a psu too- so perhaps dual graphics is best for him.

Bad_Kitty13 · Mar 10, 2014

yea i wouldnt suggest putting a 7770 on it as the psu itself might not be pushing its rated amperage and may cause his system to power off so i would just go with the dual graphics option

the cpu and gpu and depending on psu, memory/chipset all run on the 12v rail that is where the massive power draw comes from and why amd reccomends a 500w psu because they usually have 38a-42a and is enough to handle almost any setup with that rating

tduanebarr · Mar 10, 2014

Cool, thanks for all the great info. I'll post up here what I eventually buy for my friend and how it works for him.

A8-5600K dual graphics GPU

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