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what exactly would be the difference if I did upgrade ???

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April 16, 2014 11:34:55 PM

I posted a thread earlier this week, I had an outdated gaming rig and just bought a sapphire oc r9 280x toxic Gpu card.

GA-MA785GT-UD3H mother board
Amd 440 rana chip i think its a 3 core, I couldn't get the fourth core open
16gb ram 4X4
crossfire 2X5700's 512mb each. now 1 beautiful sapphire r9 280x oc toxic card.
650w PSU
1 tb hard drive

Anyways .. my wife is kinda pissed I blew what I did on a GPU and for a game titan fall ...
My system currently is using the 440 rana chip, I can upgrade to a 1090t ...
I looked over cpu comparisons and yes I know the 1090t is better and the best chip I can put on this board.
I have not purchased Bf4 yet .. and basically I have a choice .. either a new chip or a new game.

Just want to know from experienced people ... if i skipped buying the chip and buy BF4, would the CPU be too weak to play the game ...

I don t normally play too intensive Cpu games... GW2, Skyrim, now Titanfall, Mechwarrior online warframe, CIv 4... all which seem to run fine so far on this chip and with the new GPU.

I read that newer games are both GPU and CPU intensive ... and need more cores .. my chip has 3 cores.. is that enough for bf4?? How badly will the CPU bottleneck my GPU for newer games?

my last upgrade is the 1090t ..for this system does it need to be done now to keep up with current newer titles or can it wait???
Skyrim on line, Bf4 etc ...

Will the 440 be just enough?

I mean a difference of a few FPS is not a big deal .. but more than 30 or other problems,I should go for the upgrade of the chip before any new titles.

Thx in advance .. having other opinions will help guide my choice.

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April 16, 2014 11:58:51 PM

I would get the phenom X6

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a b 4 Gaming
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April 17, 2014 11:25:48 AM

Go here www.systemrequirementslab.com/ plug it the game you want to play, it will tell you how well your system meets the requirements.

This is a comparison between your CPU and the commonly accepted lower end gaming CPU pick, the FX 6300 http://www.cpu-world.com/Compare/192/AMD_Athlon_II_X3_4...

While your CPU is not horrible, it's WAY bellow what should be matched with the 280X video card. You would have been better off upgrading the CPU and getting a lower end video card. What you have now is a Ferrari engine hooked up to a Prius. You overspent on a video card by about $100 if you keep your current CPU.
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 17, 2014 12:13:14 PM

you defenetly be very limited by this CPU in terms of performance...BF4 will run on low settings for fluid gameplay but your GPU could run it on ultra provided you would have an intel quad core or AMD 6 core CPU...wich is kinda sad, i don't know what you think...if i where you i would try to get either the phenom II X6 if you can get one for cheap and sell this CPU you have to get money towards this upgrade, or i would sell both the motherboard and CPU online (ebay or craigs list or something) and get money toward something like this :
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor ($109.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI 970A-G43 ATX AM3+ Motherboard ($59.99 @ Micro Center)
Total: $169.98
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-04-17 15:11 EDT-0400)

This will use your current memory sticks and will provide better performance and upgrade path to an 8 core FX chip in the future if you may need to...

For BF4 you'll have to play on low/medium settings but you will be able to ramp up the textures settings and anti-aliasing to the roof with that graphics card so the experience should be pretty good in the end...at least playable and not that bad looking...no 60 solid FPS here but playable framerates. Still defenetly better than a PS3 can do for example...but i will pawn you, bad, i own them all... HAHAHAHAHA :D 
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April 17, 2014 10:48:17 PM

Thank you both for the detailed answers and links ...I will upgrade the chip to a 1090t as suggested. This system by the looks of it should get me buy for the next 2 years of gaming hopefully longer ..being in China its hard at times for me to get the parts I need lol .. and I always worry about fakes ... not sure if it is possible to fake a chip??

Thx again .
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 17, 2014 11:05:06 PM

The phenom x6 is very close in performance to an FX 6300 . It would be wasted money to change mb , cpu and probably your operating system [ if you have win7 oem you would have to ] tojust get the samr performance as buying the Phenom that would drop right in .

If you do buy an FX processor and board then do not get an MSI board with a 970 series chipset . A quick search will find many examples of failures and possible fires with these parts
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 18, 2014 7:02:18 AM

these board fails with fx 8 core 125w tdp cpu's...they are just fine for fx 6 core for ppl on very tight udget...and i also recommanded the phenom chip if you check it was just to show the op another upgrade path in case he cant find a phenom at good price....
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April 21, 2014 10:19:01 AM

Thx .. but I dont want to change my board ... this system is in it last upgrade stages .. and I want to make it last ... in 2 years will get a whole new gaming rig ... maybe CF the toxic if it can still keep up at that time....but for now

I just got the 1090t and i bought an after market cooler .. deepblue 400 with double fans.. looks similar to the 212 evo. i know its not as good but where I am at the 212 eve are sold out..
Did my first ever CPU change .. and installation of my first ever after market air cooler ...
Next .....question ....
is it worth OC ing??
how much of a difference will it really make ? I read over the forums and 4.0ghz is possible ...with my current Gpu the r9 280x toxic is it worth OCing ??
if anyone can let me know what is the actual difference .. Never oc'd before and reading over the forums .. it seems quite complicated for a non techy kinda guy.... will learn if it makes a good difference though.


Again this is mostly for gaming, GW2, Titanfall, Skyrim, Diablo 3, starcraft 2, lol, Civ, mechwarrior online etc most titles I dont believe are extremely CPU hungry.
Thx in advance .. this community is awesome ..
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 21, 2014 10:40:11 AM

what im glad that you found a chip at a good price and the swap went fine...
now about ocing, most of the games you stated are actually cpu intensive games...everything that fits in the category of strategy games, mmo, rpg, thos type of games are usualy mostly single-threaded cpu intensive games so try them out and if you're still not happy with the performance you get with your new chip, ocing this cpu would help some...overclocking a cpu never makes it perform like ''MUCH'' better you know but it does makes a significant difference in performance and since its free and pretty much ''risk free'' nowadays...why not you know...plenty of tutorials can be found online on how to do this and its actually quite simple especialy with an unlocked cpu like a phenom you can just raise the multiplier and add a tiny bit of voltage on the core and youre done...
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April 21, 2014 10:35:10 PM

paitjsu sadff said:
what im glad that you found a chip at a good price and the swap went fine...
now about ocing, most of the games you stated are actually cpu intensive games...everything that fits in the category of strategy games, mmo, rpg, thos type of games are usualy mostly single-threaded cpu intensive games so try them out and if you're still not happy with the performance you get with your new chip, ocing this cpu would help some...overclocking a cpu never makes it perform like ''MUCH'' better you know but it does makes a significant difference in performance and since its free and pretty much ''risk free'' nowadays...why not you know...plenty of tutorials can be found online on how to do this and its actually quite simple especialy with an unlocked cpu like a phenom you can just raise the multiplier and add a tiny bit of voltage on the core and youre done...



To: paitjsu sadff

Thanks so much for all your input, I just realized, I can only select one person as best answer ...
So I really wanted to make a point to express my appreciation for taking the time out to provide genuine knowledgeable advise.
As you had recommended, I did look over a few places to learn about oc .. It seems it is something I can do... and thanks for clarifying about Cpu intensive games .. Still learning .. about all this stuff ...

Currently with my set up, my games are running nearly 100 times better than before ... maybe an exaggeration, but sure damn feels that way ..
1090t vs the 440
hd 5700 CF vs. the Toxic
Just ... wow ...
And saving the cash from the mobo and chip made it much easier to get a good GPU.. although i did it in reverse.

so if ocing will make that even better .. as you said " with little or no risk if i read up properly" then it is worth it ..
I am hoping to last a few years on this set up .. so i might as well oc to future proof...

Bottom line
Great place this TOM's, great people who help with advise, do some reading, learn some stuff and get good results.

I must say I am starting to get a better understanding of the hardware, and honestly its a bit addictive, it was fun solving and putting in a new chip, adding an after market cooler, connecting everything, chopping a bracket from the case frame to make room for the extremely large GPU... lol noobie mistake .. i didn't even think of measuring ..getting confirmation from experience people so i don't feel like I am flying blind and finding out there are many other ways to optimize a system ... that every piece has some influence on the end result.

Not only that but DAMN my games run faster, smoother and look sooo much better, dont have any data or proof ..but damn .. dont really need data confirmation when its that much better... lol

So now to start digging even deeper , ocing ,then optimization then really understanding how it all works .. I though gaming was my hobby lol ... i think that is just becoming part of it ..

anyways thx again and I hope other new members get the same support..





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a b 4 Gaming
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April 21, 2014 10:52:21 PM

Use FRAPs

That will tell you your frame rates before and after overclocking . If an OC makes a difference and the temps of the cpu stay under 60C you are good .

Check the mb temps too . Before and after overclocking .
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 22, 2014 5:53:27 AM

Jleon75 said:

so if ocing will make that even better .. as you said " with little or no risk if i read up properly" then it is worth it ..
I am hoping to last a few years on this set up .. so i might as well oc to future proof...



Hey Jleon i'm glad you are happy with the performance of your new CPU, it's always a great feeling when you perform an upgrade that gives good results and it does get a bit addictive...

Now about overclocking...i was checking your motherboard and it seem's like it only has a 4+1 powerphase and for a 6 core chip like the phenom you got it's not that good...but this gigabyte board if really not bad and it will run the chip just fine at stock voltage but if you start ramping this up the motherboard could overheat on the VRM's and something could fail...so you can overclock YES but don't go too crazy about raising the voltage allowed for Vcore on this...

If you want to test overclocking try to see first how far you can go with your CPU by raising only the multiplier and not touching the voltages and check for stability and monitor your temperatures at all time...as i said overclocking is not very risky because nowadays modern CPU have shut down feature to prevent them from overheating or overvolting, but if something in the power delivery system of your motherboard fails, bad things can happen...but in general as long as you stay in the limit of your chip and motherboard in terms of voltages and temperatures there should be no problem for you to overclock if needed.

also make sure you read some about overclocking, something like this would be a good start :

http://www.overclockers.com/step-guide-overclock-amd-ph...
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April 22, 2014 11:39:43 PM

Thx Outlander and Paitjsu,

I will look for more software to track, and benchmark and I will keep it under 60 c when I do OC.

I will also follow your recommendation and thank you for telling me more about my mobo. I will do a lot more reading before I attempt an OC and wont play around with the voltage.

I am quite pleased with how things are, I will just OC using the multiplier as suggested. If I can reach near 3.8ghz, I will be happy and higher of course is more than welcome hehehe depending on my chip of course.

Later on when I am ready for a complete chip and mobo change, I will push the chip as far as it can go with my current cooling and see if voltage changes can get me to 4.0ghz plus and hopefully not fry anything(read somewhere people got up to 4.8ghz is that really possible???),
but if I do fry it all I will go and change the chip and mobo to the current best performance vs cost combo, like the I5 4670k currently is to tie me over the next 3years and if i dont fry anything ... maybe upgrade the gpu again with 2x r9 280x CF and a new PSU to support the power needs .... hehe either way win win for me
I just might need to buy my wife something expensive lol.
One question if I do increase voltage later on ... and the worst happens ... will other components be at risk ??
I mean things like the GPU, Ram and other hardware .. or will the CPU and Mobo only get fried....

If the GPU is at risk by increasing voltage for the CPU via MObo for ocing ... I wont risk it.... would hate to lose the GPU.
so far i have read that only the component oc'd will get damaged ... I am ok with losing the chip and mobo but not frying the entire computer(GPU mainly) .. if u get my meaning.

and thanks for the link .. perfect ... reading it now
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April 23, 2014 9:54:27 PM

Just to be complete and conclude...

I over clocked my chip to 3.7 using multiplier only, and temps are below 50. For now as a newbie OC .. I am happy here.
Although I did play around a bit with voltage, but not through the bios only through the AOD to test how far it would go and got close to 4.0, actually 3.9789 it crashed under testing of prime 95.

I went back and reset everything back to stock went back up to 3.7 with multiplier alone tested and left it there.
It is not 100% stable as I have not run PRime95 for 12+, only 4 hours, will check once I get home from work. if it fails then ill move down the multiplier and give it a go again.

Over all
** upgrade from CF hd5700's to r9 280x ---HUGE difference
** Upgrade from 440 to 1090t also Very noticeable difference
Installing my first aftermarket cooler .. and installing my first chip ever ... freakin cool ..
not to mention the inside of my comp looks beefy .. flashy with led lights from the fans and GPU

OC my first chip experience ... awesome... feels good to actually understand a little about how your CPU works and not live in fear of the blue screen .ok im still scared of it.. kinda like looking under the hood of your car and tweaking to get more horsepower or detailing it to make it more your own ..
although I am not sure if an oc from 3.2 to 3.7 will make a huge impact on the games I play...i know I still have room to push my computer further when it gets a little more dated, with voltage, better cooling, NB, HTT and the FSB..maybe i can get it to 4.0 plus and i just read that GPU can also be OC'd. more fun...

For my mobo and chip i noticed the AOD turbo automatically increases the volts from 1.35 to 1.45 for the CPU but only for 3 cores out of the six. I will need to read more as I have also read something about shutting down cores and running 4 only, as 6 cores for gaming is not really needed. Also need to read more about my mobo voltage and Mofats?? cooling??
If AOD can pump up my volt .. does that mean it's safe?? I have it turn off for now anyways.


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a b 4 Gaming
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April 23, 2014 10:10:37 PM

The board is quite hot .and that may be the limiting factor . Can you set up a fan to blow cooling are at the voltage regulators .These will be between the cpu and the i/o shield
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April 24, 2014 1:24:24 AM

Thx Outlander ... I updated/edited my post... and yes that was kinda hot ... I have another fan and when I get home I will install it . ... right now I am starting to run out of room.... the GPU and the after market CPU tower of hell is taking up a lot of space.

At 3.7 my temps are more reasonable ...all under 50c on loads if i recall correctly .. I will check again ...
Before I push my CPU again I will install more Fans .. my case fan is a little tiny and currently dead ...and is near the CPU area for airflow ....it might help directly with cooling the volt regulator as you suggested.

if I can install the fan so airflow is increased to help cool the board, I may try to push for 3.8 again and maybe 3.9
thx

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a b 4 Gaming
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April 24, 2014 5:19:35 AM

Remind you that no games will push your CPU like prime95 does, and you should not run that for hours in a row, i usualy run it for like 15 minutes and if no core fails you are close enough to a stable OC that no games or applications in the real world will ever crash your PC so go ahead and try games for hours instead to see if they crash...and if it does THEN add some voltage if temps are fine in games or lower the clockspeed...but please don't torture you machine for hours to try to make it crash you will break something.
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April 24, 2014 7:42:03 PM

paitjsu sadff said:
Remind you that no games will push your CPU like prime95 does, and you should not run that for hours in a row, i usualy run it for like 15 minutes and if no core fails you are close enough to a stable OC that no games or applications in the real world will ever crash your PC so go ahead and try games for hours instead to see if they crash...and if it does THEN add some voltage if temps are fine in games or lower the clockspeed...but please don't torture you machine for hours to try to make it crash you will break something.


Thanks , I was under the impression to make sure you oc was stable that running prime95 for 12 hours was needed. thx for letting me know.

http://www.overclockers.com/step-guide-overclock-amd-ph...
Stressing

For most people, they want to use the overclock settings they obtained 24/7. To make sure these settings are stable you should use the tools below:

Prime 95: Use this tool to check full stability. Use it for 10 mins to learn if it is somewhat stable. Use for 12+ hours to learn if settings are fully stable

I will take your advice and run games rather than prime95 for hours to test the stability. I hope I haven't damaged anything or shortened the lifespan of my chip and board ..
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a b 4 Gaming
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April 24, 2014 8:15:35 PM

if you your settings run prime for 15 minutes with no core failing it should be good enough for gaming without issue...i think you are now at the point where you can enjoy your new machine...
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April 24, 2014 9:18:43 PM

Thanks again ... just in time for the weekend lol...

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