Please help new i74770k @3.7ghz idel 44c load 99c

shandidy

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Ok i just got a new rig it is a month old and i am not able to run prime 95 more the 5 mins as my cpu will reach 99c and it idles between 40 to 44c i have reseated the cpu cooler and reapplied thermal paste twice i am using asetek lclc water cooler and arctic mx 4 as the Thermal compound, i tried delidding the cpu and reapply thermal paste on the die it self but i cut my thumb open with a raiser blade and i am not able to remove the integrated heat spreader, bump and rad fan is working fine. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
Solution
This is my personal "Minimalists Guide to Haswell Overclocking on Asus Boards". I don't have the patience to invest 100 of hours but I admire those who do. Using this method, most can knock it off in a weekend.

1. Stop using AIDA, Prime 95 or anything else like that. Download RoG Real Bench, HWiNFO64 and Intel ETU.

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?43233-Realbench-v2-Discussion-Thread-Download-Links
http://www.hwinfo.com/download.php
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/motherboards/desktop-motherboards/desktop-boards-software-extreme-tuning-utility.html


Usage of testing and monitoring programs:

When you open Real Bench, move both windows to left side of screen. Open HWiNFO64, run "sensors only", you will get a pop...
Those Prime95 are entirely expected but without knowing your ambient temps and a specific cooler it's hard to judge the idle temps. The new prime95 should not be used on Haswell unless in manual mode whereby you limit voltages to a max. Read up about AVX loadings and Prime 95

AIO coolers do no better than standard air coolers. Use RoG Real Bench but watch temps during the Open CL portion as it uses AVX.
 

shandidy

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well i have read it and my cpu tems is not consistent , plus this is a prebuilt system ASUS ROG TYTAN G30AB with locked UEFI and it has a side button to auto OC to 4.1GHZ the problem is the temps are insanely bad my old i7 920 @ 3.5 GHZ max temp is 72C, the new rig i got after i run prime 95 for less that 10 minuets temps were sky high 99c without even pressing the speed button to oc @ 4.1GHZ and that is the youtube link to the machine ad https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pktQMj1GEIo, ok my cooler is asetek 510LC and the thermal paste is arctic mx 4, ambient temp around 25C
 

Dom_79

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If it's a pre-built with a locked UEFI BIOS and it's new, just contact the seller/manufacturer a let them fix it for free. It's their setup and it's malfunctioning/overheating so it's their problem :)
 

shandidy

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well i called asus and they told me these temps are normal and i didn't have to stress test the cpu, but the answer from asus wasn't satisfactory to me as the temps under load is very high and simply not acceptable, plus i voided the warranty any way by opening it, here is a youtube link i also uploaded the issue on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN_5p2k0YG8 , in that video idle temps is 36 due ambient temperature is around 15c normaly if it is around 20 to 25 it will idle at 40 to 42c.
 

Dom_79

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Sorry to hear about the voided warranty. The BS they gave you about not needing to stress test the CPU is hard to take as those kinds of loads (or minimally less) can be replicated by certain games/programs.

Just a question, where is your PC located that your normal ambient temps are 15C? That's a brisk temperature for outdoors let alone indoors.
 

shandidy

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my pc is located in my room but i have to leave the window open otherwise the room will get very warm and ambient temps will rise to 29c, cause it is a small room thought temps build up inside it quickly, one thing i forgot to mention i updated my UEFI/BIOS hoping that issue will be resolved but no good.
 
I agree with Asus, the temps are entirely expected with that level of cooling. Haswell heat is genrally not the issue with proper cooling ..... you readily hit uncomfortable voltage limits before temperature limits when running real world applications and Haswell appropriate benchmarks.

Your temps on the 920 are entirely appropriate for that CPU, Prime95 was entirely appropriate for that CPU. Prime95 is not appropriate for Haswell if you are running under Adaptive and having P95 spit out a constant hammering of AVX instructions.

I think you have an unrealistic expectation because you consider your system "water cooled". Yes, my system runs at 74C at 46 GHz and 46 cache but that's possible because I have a appropiate water cooling system for that kind of load.

The 510LC cooler is an entry level cooler, with comparable performance to a Hyper 212. Be aware that CLC's in and of themselves offer no improvement in cooling over air coolers. What they do have most of the time is extremely noisy hi rpm fans that are more powerful than the 1200 rpm fans typically found on the better air coolers. A Phanteks PH-TC14-PE or Noctua DH-14 would keep your temps much cooler.

What are your Vcores .... are they within Asus Guidelines ?

My thinking is:

Up to 1.200v = Very Good Air Cooler (Hyper 212)
Up to 1.250v = Best Air Coolers (Phanteks PH-TC14-PE, Silver Arrow or Noctua DH14) ....... Dual 140mm CLC / AIO Cooler w/ 1500 rpm fans (Corsair H110)
Up to 1.275v = Extreme Speed CLC / AIO w/ 2600 rpm fans (too noisy for most folks)
Up to 1.325v = Custom Loop w/ 15C Delta T (3 x 120mm / 140mm) *
Up to 1.400 = Custom Loop w/ 10C Delta T (5 x 140mm or 6 x 120mm) *

* At this level, I assume GPU(s) under water.

Also, if you are not running AVX, you can add as much as 0.10 to all those voltages.

Suggestions:

-Use a manual voltage setting to prevent the CPU from raising voltages during AVX, or
-Run a Haswell appropriate benchmark such as RoG Real Bench

I give my user's a "Minimalists Overclocking Guide" for their Asus Boards. I'll post it in the message below.
 
This is my personal "Minimalists Guide to Haswell Overclocking on Asus Boards". I don't have the patience to invest 100 of hours but I admire those who do. Using this method, most can knock it off in a weekend.

1. Stop using AIDA, Prime 95 or anything else like that. Download RoG Real Bench, HWiNFO64 and Intel ETU.

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?43233-Realbench-v2-Discussion-Thread-Download-Links
http://www.hwinfo.com/download.php
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/motherboards/desktop-motherboards/desktop-boards-software-extreme-tuning-utility.html


Usage of testing and monitoring programs:

When you open Real Bench, move both windows to left side of screen. Open HWiNFO64, run "sensors only", you will get a pop up asking whether to disable reading the Asus EC chip, click "Disable this sensor". Move the HWiNFO64 window to upper right hand corner of screen. Stretch bottom of window to full screen height. Make the following changes:

-Right Click on "System" right at the top, select hide.
-In the next section, hide the last 4 lines starting "Core CPU Thermal Throttling" (if you watch temps, this is useless)
-Skip over the next section and Hide the section after that (section includes CPU Package thru DRAM Power)
-Now the whole reasons we did that was so you could see everything you wanna see at same time. You should be able to see Vcore 0, 1 and 2 at -the bottom of the window. If not hide a few more lines. Save and Quit will save your edits.


2. I am going to assume that you want your PC to power down and reduce voltages when not needed so for this we'll use Adaptive settings. Adaptive will throw an extra 0.10 to 013 volts at your CPU. Again, I would NOT use P95 or AIDA on this setting without constant attention.

3. After setting BIOS to defaults, Input the following settings and then right click on them to add them to your favorites page. This will allow you to access all the settings you need to without bouncing all over the BIOS:

AI Overclock Tuner = Auto
1-Core Ratio Limit = 42 (all others should automatically change with Sync all cores selected above)
Max. CPU Cache Ratio = Auto
Min. CPU Cache Ratio = Auto
Fully Manual Mode = Disabled
Core Voltage = Adaptive
Additional Turbo Mode CPU Core Voltage = 1.200
Core Cache Voltage = Adaptive
Additional Turbo Mode CPU Cache Voltage = Auto
Eventual CPU Input Voltage = 1.90
DRAM Voltage = Auto

I'd suggest taking a screen shot (F12) of the favorites page when ya have successfully passed the stress tests.

4. Open Real Bench, select Benchmark Tab Check only the last box. Open HWiNFO64, run "sensors only" as described above. Start Real Bench and don't touch mouse till finished. Observe voltages and temps. If you can get thru these 2 minutes, your close.

5. Then try checking all 4 boxes and run again NOTE: During the 3rd test Open CL will send AVX instructions to CPU; pay close attention to Vcores as they will spike as described above. If passes.....

6. Switch to the Stress Test Tab and select 16Gb (or what you have) and 2 hours..... (Note: If you plan on raising cache and / or RAM after a run, I will usually save the two hours and skip this step until I have Multiplier / Cache and RAM speed at my targets.

7. If passes, let sit for a while till CPU cools down and reaches steady state. Reset Values in HWiNFO64 and run benchmark again and record data. Data I find useful:

42/A/A/Auto - Shorthand for 42 Multiplier / Auto Max. Cache / Auto Min, Cache / Auto DRAM setting
Actual RAM Speed - i.e. 1600
Ambient = Room Temperature
Coolant Temp at Idle = Requires a sensor
Idle Core Temps Before Test on Each Core = i.e. 25, 26, 24, 22
Average Core Temps for Each Core During Test = i.e. 59.6, 58.2, 52.7, 49.4
Max Core Temps During Test on Each Core = i.e. 65, 62, 59, 54
Settings you input in BIOS for VCore, VCC Ring (Cache), VCCIN (Eventual), DRAM i.e. 1.2000, Auto, 1.900, Auto
Actual Readings in BIOS for VCore, VCC Ring, VCCIN, DRAM i.e. 1.040, 1.122, NA, 1.671
Actual Readings in HWiNFO64 for VCore, VCC Ring, VCCIN, DRAM i.e. 1.296, NA, 1.920, 1.681
Highest Voltage Reading on any Core During each of the 4 Benchmarks, i.e. Image Ed. 1.200 / Encoding 1.216 / Open CL 1.296 / Multitask 1.248

7. If at any point you fail, up Core Voltage to 1.250 (+0.025). If ya fail again, go another notch (1.275) but I'd stop there....Always watch temps and stop tests if you reach temperatures of concern (> 85C in my book)

8. Once you pass, it's time to consider cache voltage. Some are content to leave at Auto (39) as it affects very, very few applications (skip to step 9 if this is you), others try and get as close as they can to the CPU Multiplier. If you want cache up, go to 42/42/42/Auto. If ya fail, bring up cache voltage in same 0.025 increments.

Settings will look like this when starting:

Max. CPU Cache Ratio = 42
Min. CPU Cache Ratio = 42
Additional Turbo Mode CPU Cache Voltage = 1.200

9. Once stable, it's now time to get ya RAM up to its rated 2133, 2400 or whatever. Change 1st setting above to XMP

AI Overclock Tuner = XMP

Referring back to step 6, this is the point I normally do the 2 hour test when I am "done" with a given multiplier. So run the 2 hour test here, followed by an 8 hour test w/ Intel ETU.

10. If ya fail.... up ya voltages as per above..... as long as things don't get two hot.....see limits below. If ya pass, it's time to see if we can lower temps and voltages. I dunno if it matters what order ya do it in but I did VCCIN 1st till I failed then bumped up till I got lowest table setting. Then did VCCring (Cache Voltage Setting in BIOS) till I got lowest stable setting....and finally VID (BIOS CPU Voltage setting) last. I leaped in "half" amounts.

For example.... Default VCCIn is reportedly less than 1.8 .... so if 1.9 worked, i went "half way" to 1.85 .... if 1.85 failed, I went halfway between known good and bad to 1.875 ....same deal with VID and VCCring.

11. With the 42 series if tests complete, "rinse and repeat" with steps 3 thru 10 after moving up to CPU Multiplier to 43, then 44 or as high as you are willing to go. At 46 multiplier I found 1.9 VCCIN to be inadequate.... this is the one voltage I found that going too high or too low is problematic (other than heat and maximum upset voltage limits of course). I went to 1.98 (last yellow setting) and it was too low..... 2.08 was too high. 2.04 worked for me w/ 46 multiplier,

12. These are my settings to give ya an idea of luck I had .... your mileage will vary. Asterisked ones are those I didn't go back and try and get better temps / voltages.

42/42/42/XMP (2400) *
VCore 1.200
VCC Ring 1.200
VCCIN (Ev) 1.880
DRAM 1.700

43/43/43/XMP (2400) *
VCore 1.225
VCC Ring 1.225
VCCIN (Ev) 1.880
DRAM 1.700

44/44/44/XMP (2400) *
VCore 1.260
VCC Ring 1.260
VCCIN (Ev) 1.880
DRAM 1.700

45/45/45/XMP (2400)
VCore 1.318
VCC Ring 1.318
VCCIN (Ev) 1.880
DRAM 1.700 *

46/43/43/XMP (2400)
VCore 1.385
VCC Ring 1.385
VCCIN (Ev) 2.020
DRAM 1.700

46/46/46/XMP (2400)
VCore 1.385
VCC Ring 1.410
VCCIN (Ev) 2.040
DRAM 1.70

I'll try 47 OC this weekend.


13. As for cooling / heat / voltage concerns

Here's Asus recommendations:

A very good air cooler is required for voltage levels above 1.15V.
1.20V-1.23V requires use of closed loop water coolers [or their air cooling equivalent]
At 1.24V-1.275V dual or triple radiator water cooling solutions are advised.

My thinking is:

Up to 1.200v = Very Good Air Cooler (Hyper 212)
Up to 1.250v = Best Air Coolers (Phanteks PH-TC14-PE, Silver Arrow or Noctua DH14) ....... Dual 140mm CLC / AIO Cooler w/ 1500 rpm fans (Corsair H110)
Up to 1.275v = Extreme Speed Dual Fan CLC / AIO w/ 2600 rpm fans (too noisy for most folks)
Up to 1.325v = Custom Loop w/ 15C Delta T (3 x 120mm / 140mm) *
Up to 1.400 = Custom Loop w/ 10C Delta T (5 x 140mm or 6 x 120mm) *

At this level having the GPu(s) also under water is assumed

Also, if you are not running AVX, you can add as much as 0.10 to all those voltages.

14. NEVER WALK AWAY from your machine while stress testing until you are sure that temps have stabilized.
Be AWARE if test uses multiple instruction sets like Real Bench who throws out its hardest load voltage wise with the 3rd test in the Benchmark but the 4th test results in higher temps.

Remember some AVX instructions are present during RoG Real Bench type loads which will raise VCores by 0.10 to 0.13 for short periods.

I would not suggest running Prime 95 w/ AVX under adaptive under above conditions.

15. Having 4 sticks of memory will hinder ya OCs a bit.

16. If ya want the best OCs ya machine can get, this is not the guide to use. If ya wanna get it done over the weekend in between taking work home, course work, Honey-Do Lists, Daddy Taxi and other life demands, this may get it done in a weekend :) .

WORD OF WARNING: Some of us are having problems with the BIOS clock freezing and a suspected cause is the use the saving, loading and backing up of OC profiles in the Tools section of the BIOS. I would avoid use of that feature until such time as the cause is confirmed or a fix is available.

 
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shandidy

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ok before i start please keep in mind this is an OEM machine ASUS tytan g30ab and the max OC is 4.1GHZ due to locked UEFI so you cant play with the cpu multiplier, the good news is i ran both tests the ROG real bench and it ran for about 8 to 10 mins maximum temps is 70C, the second test is the intel extrem tuning utility cpu stress test and i ran it for also 10 mins for a maximum temps of 75C, both tests ran at 4.1GHZ, and that is much much more better because i was using before prime95 at stock speed and it reaches very high temps, ok so now do you think these temps are normal? plus i ran both tests for only 10 mins each.
 

shandidy

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UPDATE i delided my cpu today and applied artic mx 4 on the die and above the IHS and started my pc and actually it is worse ,idle temps is 44C and under load is 100C do any body know what did i do wrong?, i am sure the cooler is mounted correctly, or maybe wait a little bit and see, because i was reading that artic mx4 have a cure time but i don't know how long.
 

shandidy

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ok i guess my issue is resolved i figured out what i did "wrong" when applying thermal paste on the die using artic mx 4 the grain of rice method and then spread it didn't work, i reapplied the thermal paste using the line method then put the IHS without spreading, then a made sure the cooler is installed properly, then i fired it up here is the tricky part though it almost fooled me idle temps will be the same but load temps are much better i7 4770k stock speed running prime 95 for an hour max temps is 86C so i got a 14 to 15C temp drop at full load after i delided my cpu using the vice method, thank you all for your help, bottom line deliding the CPU is a peace of mind.
 

shandidy

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after testing for 2-3 days temps are stable max temps are 85 running prime 95 for 30min @ stock speed no cpu throttling after deliding please keep in mind that i have searched my "water cooler" and it is a entry level (aseteck 510lc) so with a high end cooler like corsair h80i i should see much better temps especially after deliding the cpu, so the 90C to 99C temps are gone, issue is resolved.
 

shandidy

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I take all i said back about deliding cpu is a peace of mind :D, after a week i have to reapply TIM again after discovering that artic mx4 deteriorates and it is NO GOOD between CPU die and IHS, i ordered coollaboratory pro TIM and i am waiting for it :D:D:D:D:D:D:D
 

shandidy

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i Sold the system way back 6 month ago as it was over heating no matter what i did, thanks to Intel and there cheap cheap methods for cooling the dies without soldering the die to the IHS, or it could be a defective cpu