Build PC over "Intel Xeon E3-1231v3"

Xzeon · Jul 15, 2014

hallo people, I am trying to build new PC for me, I will heavy use it for 3D Production and 1080p Video Editing, heavy Rendering...soft which I will use: 3DsMax with Vray + RT, Cinema 4D, After Effects, Premiere, PS and etc. I will also make some simulations using Phoenix FD..(Gaming we can Ignore)...I have HDD, Case (ATX, MiniATX, MicroATX) and OS..

I made my choice with CPU,GPU and I need to resolve other parts around it

253$ - Intel Xeon E3-1231 v3 (If here is someone who knows difference good/bad with E3-1231 v3 and E3-1230 v3, please describe it. I know 31 is new and +100MHz, but what means TSX I do not know)
240$ - MSI GTX 760 OC 2GB

this is parts which I think best performance vs cost. if there is better solution for 250$ will be happy (i5 4690K is also good but new Z97 is costs more and it has 4 core 4 thread over 8, and without overclocking i5 it cant catch up with E3 so I decide no Overclock and buy Xeon with stable cool experience)...also I do not need iGPU

so my main complication is Motherboard and Memory (I want 16GB overall). I do not know I need ECC or Buffered, and I need help. also I do not know how many Watt PSU I need and which brand is good (80+ Gold is good I know and modular would be nice)

what about 107$ Gigabyte GA-H87M-D3H ?? but It does not have PCI Express 3.0 right?
it is from HERE

thanks everyone, waiting solutions

13thmonkey · Jul 15, 2014

why use xeon?

byza · Jul 15, 2014

13thmonkey :

The Xeon is like an i7 without the iGPU so it's cheaper. It's good for rendering etc but it cannot be overclocked.

byza · Jul 15, 2014

Xzeon :

TSX is a set of instructions, but they both support it so I don't know why you're asking about it?
Other than the +100MHz, I can't find any difference, except the 1231 is Haswell Refresh (newer model)

Most RAM now is Non-ECC and non-buffered.

For PSU look to this as a guide for good PSU's. 600w should be fine.
http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1804779/power-supply-unit-tier-list.html

numanator · Jul 15, 2014

As far as I can tell the E3 1231v3 just has 100 MHz more than the 1230v3. If you are going for the E3 1231v3 then you should grab a H97 mobo to ensure compatibility with the haswell refresh chip.

For the PSU I would go for either the XFX 650w (or 550w) or the Antec HCG 620w. The Seasonic 620w is also a great choice but usually a bit more expensive.

Xzeon · Jul 15, 2014

for me difficulty is Motherboard with Memory

in Intel's page E3-1231v3 supports Unbuffered ECC memory, but I do not know if it can use Unbuffered Non-ECC memory...
here

here Gigabyte GA-H87M-D3H CPU Support List with E3-1231v3 Haswell Refresh
here
but this Board supports only Non-ECC memory

so, if this Board support E3-1231v3 and non-ecc memory it means non-ecc unbuffered memory must work yes???
this is for me question, and difficulty when I do not know 100% will it work or not

byza · Jul 15, 2014

Xzeon :

Non-ECC unbuffered memory will work with both the CPU and motherboard.

It looks like the Gigabyte will support the E3-1231v3 without a bios update. I checked that already. You may want to move to a H97 with M.2/SATA Express, but this will cost you more. The cheapest I know about is the Asrock H97 Fatal1ty Killer on pcpartpicker.

Xzeon · Jul 16, 2014

byza - how you know if non-ecc memory will work? is there some description or already has such combination?

and if it works with Gigabyte GA-H87M-D3H , it means that E3 will work almost all Board which supports it.
here ASUS H97-PLUS it has M.2 and cheaper than ASrock, also much better board I think and it supports Haswell R E3

well if there is no other to figure out what board and memory is best for me, I think my Question overs here...

bambiboom · Jul 16, 2014

Zxeon,

For demanding workstation applications- and 3ds, video editing / processing, and rendering are among the most calculation intensive, consider an LGA2011 Xeon instead of LGA1150. There are important advantages in that an E5 Xeon has double the memory bandwidth of E3, there are almost twice as many PCIe lanes, there is typically more cache per core than E3, and most importantly, with LGA2011, you can use 4,6,8,10, and 12-core CPU's instead of limitation to 4 cores.

There is a line of LGA 2011 Xeon E5's, the E5-1600 series and these have excellent cost / performance qualities. the E5-1620 v2 is 3.7 / 3.9GHz with 10 MB cache.

http://ark.intel.com/products/75779/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1620-v2-10M-Cache-3_70-GHz

It's not substantially more expensive than the E3 - at Superbiiz, $292 >

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=E5-1620V2

On Passmark CPU benchmarks, the e5-1620 v2 is ranked at No. 63 with a CPU score of 9450. For comparison, the Xeon E3-1231 v3 is No. 49 and 9762. However, as the E3 has a slower clock speed (3.4 / 3.8GHz as compared to 3.7 /3.9) with less cache (8MB compared to 10) and a much lower memory bandwidth of 25.6GB/s as compared to E5 at 59.7. Also, the E5-1620 v2 can run ECC RAM at 1866 whereas the E3-1231 v3 uses 1600 as it's top RAM speed. I don't recommend overclocked RAM for workstation use. I'm convinced that in real world applications the E5 with have much better performance. Plus, in a couple of years you could change to a six, eight, or ten core CPU and extend the life of the system. I have an E5-1620 system (not v2 @3.6 / 3.8GHz) but I use a dual quad core Xeon system (X5460 @ 3.15GHz for rendering. When I sell the Precision, I'll change the E5-1650 CPU to a six or eight core (the excellent six core E5-1650 v2 @ 3.5 / 3.9 about $585 for example) as rendering is a rare case of using all avaialable cores and even a sx core is a 50% increase.

You'll find that LGA2011 motherboards are more expensive than LGA1150. I recommend Supermicro and if you're a professional, you might even consider buying a dual CPU board and running a single E5-1600 and then getting a pair of E5-2600 series, something wonderful like the E5-2643 v2@ 3.5 / 3.8 and 25MB cache.

As for the GPU, take care, as Autodesk does not certify consumer /gaming cards for 3ds Max, only Quadro / Firepro:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=6&release=2014&os=32768&manuf=all&opt=2

A GTX will work, but for video editing and rendering, I suggest something with the widest bandwidth. The 760 is 256-bit- very good, but the 580 and 780 are 384-bit. When I used a GTX briefly- too many artifacts and crashes in rendering, it was a GTX 285 which was 512-bit.

Of course, things that are more expensive are often better, but I think going to an LGA2011 basis could add at least a couple of years use to your system and the cost per year will be less for a higher performance and expandability.

Here's a system I listed a few months ago:

BambiBoom PixelDozer Cadsolidworkarendgrapharific Blazomatic iWorkarama TurboScream 9000 ™$#©™_3.26.14

1. CPU > Intel Xeon Quad-Core Processor E5-1620 v2 3.7 / 3.9GHz 0GT/s 10MB LGA 2011 CPU, OEM> $295 (Superbiiz)

2. CPU Cooler > Cooler Master Hyper T4 - CPU Cooler with 4 Direct Contact Heatpipes > $30 (The Stock CPU coolers are supposed to be sufficient, but I've seen terrifying temperatures when rendering.)

3. Motherboard> ASUS Z9PA-U8 ATX Server Motherboard, C602 chipset, LGA 2011 > $289.99

____http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131915&Tpk=ASUS%20Z9PA-U8

4. 16GB RAM > (4) Kingston 4GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) ECC Registered Server Memory Model KVR16R11S8/4 > $188 ($47 ea)

5. AMD 100-505649(100-505844) FirePro V4900 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 Workstation Video Card > $155.

6. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $89.

7. CORSAIR CXM series CX500M 500W ATX12V v2.3 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply > $60

8. Case > LIAN LI PC-7B plus II Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case $70.

9. Optical Dr > SAMSUNG DVD Burner 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM SATA Model SH-224DB/BEBE - OEM > $20

10. Microsoft Windows 8.1 Pro - 64-bit - OEM > $140

TOTAL = $1,337

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 (2014) > Xeon E5-1620 quad core @ 3.6 / 3.8GHz > 24GB ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro 4000 (2GB)> Samsung 840 SSD 250GB /Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > AE3000 USB WiFi > HP 2711X, 27" 1920 X 1080 > Windows 7 Ultimate 64 >[Passmark system rating = 3923, 2D= 839 / 3D=2048]

Dell Precision T5400 (2008) > 2X Xeon X5460 quad core @3.16GHz > 16GB ECC 667> Quadro FX 4800 (1.5GB) > WD RE4 500GB / Seagate Barracuda 500GB > M-Audio 2496 Sound Card / Linksys 600N WiFi > Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit >[Passmark system rating = 1859, CPU = 8528 / 2D= 512 / 3D=1097]

2D, 3D CAD, Image Processing, Rendering, Text > Architecture, industrial design, graphic design, written projects

bambiboom · Jul 16, 2014

Zxeon,

For demanding workstation applications- and 3ds, video editing / processing, and rendering are among the most calculation intensive, consider an LGA2011 Xeon instead of LGA1150. There are important advantages in that an E5 Xeon has double the memory bandwidth of E3, there are almost twice as many PCIe lanes, there is typically more cache per core than E3, and most importantly, with LGA2011, you can use 4,6,8,10, and 12-core CPU's instead of limitation to 4 cores.

There is a line of LGA 2011 Xeon E5's, the E5-1600 series and these have excellent cost / performance qualities. the E5-1620 v2 is 3.7 / 3.9GHz with 10 MB cache.

http://ark.intel.com/products/75779/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1620-v2-10M-Cache-3_70-GHz

It's not substantially more expensive than the E3 - at Superbiiz, $292 >

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=E5-1620V2

On Passmark CPU benchmarks, the e5-1620 v2 is ranked at No. 63 with a CPU score of 9450. For comparison, the Xeon E3-1231 v3 is No. 49 and 9762. However, as the E3 has a slower clock speed (3.4 / 3.8GHz as compared to 3.7 /3.9) with less cache (8MB compared to 10) and a much lower memory bandwidth of 25.6GB/s as compared to E5 at 59.7. Also, the E5-1620 v2 can run ECC RAM at 1866 whereas the E3-1231 v3 uses 1600 as it's top RAM speed. I don't recommend overclocked RAM for workstation use. I'm convinced that in real world applications the E5 with have much better performance. Plus, in a couple of years you could change to a six, eight, or ten core CPU and extend the life of the system. I have an E5-1620 system (not v2 @3.6 / 3.8GHz) but I use a dual quad core Xeon system (X5460 @ 3.15GHz for rendering. When I sell the Precision, I'll change the E5-1650 CPU to a six or eight core (the excellent six core E5-1650 v2 @ 3.5 / 3.9 about $585 for example) as rendering is a rare case of using all avaialable cores and even a sx core is a 50% increase.

You'll find that LGA2011 motherboards are more expensive than LGA1150. I recommend Supermicro and if you're a professional, you might even consider buying a dual CPU board and running a single E5-1600 and then getting a pair of E5-2600 series, something wonderful like the E5-2643 v2@ 3.5 / 3.8 and 25MB cache.

As for the GPU, take care, as Autodesk does not certify consumer /gaming cards for 3ds Max, only Quadro / Firepro:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=6&release=2014&os=32768&manuf=all&opt=2

A GTX will work, but for video editing and rendering, I suggest something with the widest bandwidth. The 760 is 256-bit- very good, but the 580 and 780 are 384-bit. When I used a GTX briefly- too many artifacts and crashes in rendering, it was a GTX 285 which was 512-bit.

Of course, things that are more expensive are often better, but I think going to an LGA2011 basis could add at least a couple of years use to your system and the cost per year will be less for a higher performance and expandability.

Here's a system I listed a few months ago:

BambiBoom PixelDozer Cadsolidworkarendgrapharific Blazomatic iWorkarama TurboScream 9000 ™$#©™_3.26.14

1. CPU > Intel Xeon Quad-Core Processor E5-1620 v2 3.7 / 3.9GHz 0GT/s 10MB LGA 2011 CPU, OEM> $295 (Superbiiz)

2. CPU Cooler > Cooler Master Hyper T4 - CPU Cooler with 4 Direct Contact Heatpipes > $30 (The Stock CPU coolers are supposed to be sufficient, but I've seen terrifying temperatures when rendering.)

3. Motherboard> ASUS Z9PA-U8 ATX Server Motherboard, C602 chipset, LGA 2011 > $289.99

____http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131915&Tpk=ASUS%20Z9PA-U8

4. 16GB RAM > (4) Kingston 4GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) ECC Registered Server Memory Model KVR16R11S8/4 > $188 ($47 ea)

5. AMD 100-505649(100-505844) FirePro V4900 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 Workstation Video Card > $155.

6. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $89.

7. CORSAIR CX series CX600 600W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply > $65

8. Case > LIAN LI PC-7B plus II Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case $70.

9. Optical Dr > SAMSUNG DVD Burner 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM SATA Model SH-224DB/BEBE - OEM > $20

10. Microsoft Windows 8.1 Pro - 64-bit - OEM > $140

TOTAL = $1,342

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 (2014) > Xeon E5-1620 quad core @ 3.6 / 3.8GHz > 24GB ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro 4000 (2GB)> Samsung 840 SSD 250GB /Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > AE3000 USB WiFi > HP 2711X, 27" 1920 X 1080 > Windows 7 Ultimate 64 >[Passmark system rating = 3923, 2D= 839 / 3D=2048]

Dell Precision T5400 (2008) > 2X Xeon X5460 quad core @3.16GHz > 16GB ECC 667> Quadro FX 4800 (1.5GB) > WD RE4 500GB / Seagate Barracuda 500GB > M-Audio 2496 Sound Card / Linksys 600N WiFi > Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit >[Passmark system rating = 1859, CPU = 8528 / 2D= 512 / 3D=1097]

2D, 3D CAD, Image Processing, Rendering, Text > Architecture, industrial design, graphic design, written projects

Xzeon · Jul 16, 2014

bambiboom

well well, very helpfull answer, thanks. I am not starter, but not professional. I guess I have two way: first 1150 with E3 (today's egg) and second 2011 E5 (tomorrow's chicken)...I know E5 solution is much better (timeproof) and its for serious usage, but today right now I do not have money and time to wait and buy E5. I am working with Q6600 / 8600GT / 2GB RAM and this machine is turtle, for me even E3 would be big jump in performance. oh and also Intel 14 nanometer Broadwell will be already beast and all E3 E5 and all i series will be 14 nm. I think if I will buy E5 my next upgrades with 6 and more cores would be just waste, it because that for that time (after 2 or 3 year) those CPUs would be already old...so I think cheap E3 will be my choice again, and after couple year will see new architecture...

not a big deal with CPU Banchmarks E3 vs E5
9450 - 1867 ---- Intel Xeon E5-1620 v2 @ 3.70GHz
9762 - 2189 ---- Intel Xeon E3-1231 v3 @ 3.40GHz
2982 - 920 ---- Intel Core2 Quad Q6600 @ 2.40GHz (my turtle)

about GPU I was thinking grab Quadro but price is 400$+ above 1GB, and K600 is not enough with 128bit, maybe it can handle more polygons in viewport vs GTX 760 but overall K600 in entry-level and do not think that it is good buy, same with FirePro. I have very limited budget and If u can recommend me GPU around 250$ better than GTX 760 would be very appreciated.

so here my next pc looks like:
253$ - Intel Xeon E3-1231 v3 (8M Cache, 3.40 GHz, LGA-1150) Haswell Refresh
113$ - ASUS H97-PLUS (it's support E3-1231 v3 if we will trust this) and it has M.2 and Sata 6GB
240$ - MSI GeForce GTX 760 OC 2GB 256-bit
165$ - Kingston HyperX Genesis 16GB Kit (2x8 GB) 1600MHz Unbuffered Non-ECC
or
145$ - Crucial Ballistix Sport 16GB Kit (2x8 GB) 1600MHz UDIMM
27$ - Cooler Master Hyper T4 CPU Cooler

about 85$ - SSD and 120$ - PSU

and around 1000$ it is

what do you think bambiboom? is this workable compilation? is this good starting workstation for nonProfessional if u had 1000$

what could be better if we are using LGA1150

Thank...

Xzeon · Aug 26, 2014

workstation mobo and dual E5 with 64gb memory is perfect, but I have less than 1000$ to build as good workstation as possible...here is final parts which I will buy

253$ - Intel Xeon E3-1231 v3 (8M Cache, 3.4/3.8 GHz)
160$ - Crucial Ballistix Tactical 16GB kit (2x8GB, 1600MHz, CL8)
49$ - EVGA 500B (80 PLUS Bronze)
108$ - Asus H97-PLUS

570$
this parts are best for price I think...I would like to pay extra 50$ and get good Z97 but do not know which one

149$ - EVGA GeForce GTX 750Ti SC (2GB GDDR5, 128bit, CUDA Cores: 640) Maxwell
74$ - Crucial MX100 128GB
30$ - Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO

+ 253$ later (I will use old gpu before get new)

bambiboom · Aug 27, 2014

Xzeon,

Sorry, sorry, I somehow completely missed your July 16 post.

Yes the difference in the CPU's is that the E3-1231 v3 is 3.4 /3.8GHz and the E3-1230 v3 is 3.3/3.7GHz, and tsx seems to be a very complex protection of multiple thread integrity that defines thread initiation/ completion. However I haven't taken time to understand it properly. This reads as though it's a benefit on multi-threaded applications which rendering often is.

I think your parts list in general is a good direction but I wasn't able to find mention of the ASUS H97-Plus supporting Xeon E3. It's possible, but if ASUS doesn't list it on their "Supported CPU List" they may well not help you if you have problems.

In the future when upgrading to a better graphics card, you might consider buying a recent, used card, especially if it's a workstation card because these are made to run at full speed over long periods. All the graphics cards I've used in the last 12 years-8 cards- have been used and I've never had a failure. One card, a Quadro FX 580 is 10 years old and still works perfectly. Next month (September, 2014) Quadros are changing series, so in a few months, there may be very good prices on used cards like the K2000 or K4000. If you're looking for a GTX, then you could find a GTX with a higher memory bandwidth and more memory, but find one with low usage.

Have a closer look at the compatibility of Xeon E3 with the H97 motherboard, and you might consider a Seasonic or Corsair power supply with 520-550W (= +20-30), but I think you're close to a good solution.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

numanator · Aug 27, 2014

Found the Xeon E3 1231 v3 on the H97 Plus cpu support page of the asus webpage.

http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/H97PLUS/HelpDesk_CPU/

ctrl+f 1231 should take you right to it.

Xzeon · Aug 27, 2014

BambiBoom

thanks for replay...
I was thinking to get K600 but it looks very weak to comparison with same priced GTX (I know quadro is far better when navigating in Viewport, it handles more polygons and etc, but K600 with 1GB I do not think a smart choice)... as u sad I will wait little more and will buy some used stronger Quadro or maybe some other Maxwell GTX (if will be better than 750Ti at same price point)

confusion about mobo is not in compatibility of CPU, I know H97-Plus supports E3 I already find it in list (numanator)
it is overall mobo features, this Plus I do not know, something I do not like with this H series (do not know why :d)

so decided CPU, Memory, PSU (I like EVGA brand) only little confusion is Mobo (I was thinking ASUS Z97-A - 145$) but it is like whim, so we can complete thread here...

everything clear for me now thanks to u guys, Thanks...

if this post will help someone other I will text it for him...
This is my final parts choice for this time (27.8.2014)

253$ - Intel Xeon E3-1231 v3 (8M Cache, 3.4/3.8 GHz)
160$ - Crucial Ballistix Tactical 16GB kit (2x8GB, 1600MHz, CL8)
49$ - EVGA 500B (80 PLUS Bronze)
108$ - Asus H97-PLUS
149$ - EVGA GeForce GTX 750Ti SC (2GB GDDR5, 128bit, CUDA Cores: 640) Maxwell
74$ - Crucial MX100 128GB
30$ - Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO

823$ Cheers

RAGAZ · Jan 2, 2015

Xzeon

So did you decidet to build that last parts list?
How is it working for you?

Reason I am asking is because I am also building a computer and have come up with basicaly the same parts list as you did. Just wondering if you woud do something different now that you build it and if it suits your needs.

Xzeon · Jan 3, 2015

RAGAZ :

hallo RAGAZ

I had hard times and had not time for buying it. also in my country currency is going crazy to buy $, so I decide to wait and gather more budget for more serious parts, I decide to Build much serious PC than E3 Xeon. I think this build is very good for any Content Creation (value vs money) and it covers all mid range workload, so I think it is good buy...however what I have now is Q6600 and I overclocked it very hard, it gives me 4800 mark vs E3 9600 mark, it is about two times better but steel, I think it will not satisfies me, I want more, and I decide 4790k 11000 mark with stock or 5820K 13000 mark also stock, and both have huge overclock ability.....that is my decision for now, I had time and I did my own Sheet for good parts, here look maybe it will handy

PC Builds (google doc)

digest2 · May 29, 2015

bambiboom :

Apparently your prognosis was wrong. Intel is going to change sockets and render older components useless more often than before. Also Intel has no respect even to professionals and outdated LGA2011 by introducing the very same socket with same amount of pins and dimensions but not compatible. Ahahaha (evil laughing).

bambiboom · May 29, 2015

digest2 :

digest2,

Yes sockets change to improve computational power, and the entire history of personal computers is improvement- Moore;s Law is still holding on, but to do so the sockets change again and again. Whether it's more often I don't know, but it doesn't seem so. Still, as technology improves and makes systems obsolete overnight, those with LGA 1366, 1155, and even LGA775 can significantly improve their systems and that are fully useful. I have an LGA1366 system (Dell Precision T5500) that I could have 12 cores/ 24 thread @ 3.47 /3.73 GHZ (2X Xeon X5690) and with 96GB of RAM and with a modern GPU, do anything I need to do and comparable to a new system costing 4 or 5 times as much as my $950 investment. It's entirely possible to build a six, eight, ten, twelve, or sixteen core LGA2011 system with a speed entirely useful today in the most demanding applications. The LGA2011 Xeon E5-2687w v2 ( was one of the finest Xeons yet made:

Passmark CPU :

Xeon E5-2687w v2 (8-core @ 3.4 /4.0Ghz)
Dual CPU average score = 24544 Rating= No.10

Xeon E5-2687w v3 (10 core @ 3.1 / 3.5GHz) Dual CPU average score = 24796 Rating= No.7

> in which the calculation density of the 8-core and 10-core is very similar. As the E5-2687w v2 is running at 4.0GHz on the first two cores, in typical single-threaded applications, and with 1866 RAM instead of 2133, I would conjecture that 3D modeling could be faster and even rendering would be near enough to the v3 that process completion times would be within a few seconds. PC performance is actually achieving such remarkable performance that the users ability and the limitations of applications make extreme performance systems only necessary for the absolutely most demanding uses.

I have a 1/10-th second timer and I recently loaded a 110MB Sketchup model and 117MB Corel Technical Designer file from a WD Black 1TB onto a partition on an Intel 730 480GB. The Intel 730 has a Passmark score of 4764 in my system and if ranked (mine must be the only one tested) would be No. 36 while the WD Black 1TB scores 1080 and ranked No. 1323. With Sketchup and Technical Designer running I timed the opening of each file and in both cases the time on the Intel 730 and WD Black were within 1 second. The moral of the story, a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link and in this case, the disk was waiting on the CPU. I have to say that I don't sense a really important difference in rendering times between my current 6-core E5-1660 v2 HP z420 and my 2013 z420 with 4-core E5-1620. as rendering is multit-hreaded and the E5-1660 runs on all six cores at 3.7GHz compared to the E5-1620 four cores at 3.6GHz, I would expect a 50%+ improvement- two more cores and 1866 RAM, faster SSD (vs. Samsung 840), but in the same size and setup (VRay) rendering the timing is about 6-8 seconds over an 8 minute total.

I still believe that someone having built a system in 2014 using LGA2011- as there are more than 30 choices for CPU for a system total of 4 to 16 cores- will have has significantly more options in 2016 or even 2018 than is they had used LGA 1150 which is limited to 4 cores. Besides which, LGA2011 has double the memory bandwidth and 40 the PCIe lanes instead of the 28 of LGA1150. The OP in July 2014 had a use for all the cores he could get- "heavy Rendering" in 3ds Max / VRay, and Premiere, etc., which were and are demanding LGA2011 and LGA2011-3 and he would be better off and have longer use of the system with an E5 instead of E3 whether obsolete or not.

No evil laughing- the cat will think she's in a James Bond movie villain's lair!

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 /4.0GHz > 16GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K2200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 4918 > CPU= 13941 / 2D= 823 / 3D=3464 / Mem= 2669 / Disk= 4764]

Pending upgrade: HP /LSI 9212-4i PCIe SAS /SATA HBA RAID controller, 2X Seagate Constellation ES.3 1TB (RAID 1)

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro 4000 (2GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB / WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1080)
[ Passmark system rating = 3339 / CPU = 9347 / 2D= 684 / 3D= 2030 / Mem= 1871 / Disk= 2234]

Pending upgrade: PERC H310 PCIe SAS /SATA RAID controller, 2X WD Black 1TB (RAID 1)(Converts disk system from 3GB/s to 6GB/s)

djClaw · Sep 22, 2015

bambiboom :

Zxeon,

For demanding workstation applications- and 3ds, video editing / processing, and rendering are among the most calculation intensive, consider an LGA2011 Xeon instead of LGA1150. There are important advantages in that an E5 Xeon has double the memory bandwidth of E3, there are almost twice as many PCIe lanes, there is typically more cache per core than E3, and most importantly, with LGA2011, you can use 4,6,8,10, and 12-core CPU's instead of limitation to 4 cores.

There is a line of LGA 2011 Xeon E5's, the E5-1600 series and these have excellent cost / performance qualities. the E5-1620 v2 is 3.7 / 3.9GHz with 10 MB cache.

http://ark.intel.com/products/75779/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1620-v2-10M-Cache-3_70-GHz

It's not substantially more expensive than the E3 - at Superbiiz, $292 >

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=E5-1620V2

On Passmark CPU benchmarks, the e5-1620 v2 is ranked at No. 63 with a CPU score of 9450. For comparison, the Xeon E3-1231 v3 is No. 49 and 9762. However, as the E3 has a slower clock speed (3.4 / 3.8GHz as compared to 3.7 /3.9) with less cache (8MB compared to 10) and a much lower memory bandwidth of 25.6GB/s as compared to E5 at 59.7. Also, the E5-1620 v2 can run ECC RAM at 1866 whereas the E3-1231 v3 uses 1600 as it's top RAM speed. I don't recommend overclocked RAM for workstation use. I'm convinced that in real world applications the E5 with have much better performance. Plus, in a couple of years you could change to a six, eight, or ten core CPU and extend the life of the system. I have an E5-1620 system (not v2 @3.6 / 3.8GHz) but I use a dual quad core Xeon system (X5460 @ 3.15GHz for rendering. When I sell the Precision, I'll change the E5-1650 CPU to a six or eight core (the excellent six core E5-1650 v2 @ 3.5 / 3.9 about $585 for example) as rendering is a rare case of using all avaialable cores and even a sx core is a 50% increase.

You'll find that LGA2011 motherboards are more expensive than LGA1150. I recommend Supermicro and if you're a professional, you might even consider buying a dual CPU board and running a single E5-1600 and then getting a pair of E5-2600 series, something wonderful like the E5-2643 v2@ 3.5 / 3.8 and 25MB cache.

As for the GPU, take care, as Autodesk does not certify consumer /gaming cards for 3ds Max, only Quadro / Firepro:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=6&release=2014&os=32768&manuf=all&opt=2

A GTX will work, but for video editing and rendering, I suggest something with the widest bandwidth. The 760 is 256-bit- very good, but the 580 and 780 are 384-bit. When I used a GTX briefly- too many artifacts and crashes in rendering, it was a GTX 285 which was 512-bit.

Of course, things that are more expensive are often better, but I think going to an LGA2011 basis could add at least a couple of years use to your system and the cost per year will be less for a higher performance and expandability.

Here's a system I listed a few months ago:

BambiBoom PixelDozer Cadsolidworkarendgrapharific Blazomatic iWorkarama TurboScream 9000 ™$#©™_3.26.14

1. CPU > Intel Xeon Quad-Core Processor E5-1620 v2 3.7 / 3.9GHz 0GT/s 10MB LGA 2011 CPU, OEM> $295 (Superbiiz)

2. CPU Cooler > Cooler Master Hyper T4 - CPU Cooler with 4 Direct Contact Heatpipes > $30 (The Stock CPU coolers are supposed to be sufficient, but I've seen terrifying temperatures when rendering.)

3. Motherboard> ASUS Z9PA-U8 ATX Server Motherboard, C602 chipset, LGA 2011 > $289.99

____http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131915&Tpk=ASUS%20Z9PA-U8

4. 16GB RAM > (4) Kingston 4GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) ECC Registered Server Memory Model KVR16R11S8/4 > $188 ($47 ea)

5. AMD 100-505649(100-505844) FirePro V4900 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 Workstation Video Card > $155.

6. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $89.

7. CORSAIR CXM series CX500M 500W ATX12V v2.3 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply > $60

8. Case > LIAN LI PC-7B plus II Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case $70.

9. Optical Dr > SAMSUNG DVD Burner 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM SATA Model SH-224DB/BEBE - OEM > $20

10. Microsoft Windows 8.1 Pro - 64-bit - OEM > $140

TOTAL = $1,337

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 (2014) > Xeon E5-1620 quad core @ 3.6 / 3.8GHz > 24GB ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro 4000 (2GB)> Samsung 840 SSD 250GB /Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > AE3000 USB WiFi > HP 2711X, 27" 1920 X 1080 > Windows 7 Ultimate 64 >[Passmark system rating = 3923, 2D= 839 / 3D=2048]

Dell Precision T5400 (2008) > 2X Xeon X5460 quad core @3.16GHz > 16GB ECC 667> Quadro FX 4800 (1.5GB) > WD RE4 500GB / Seagate Barracuda 500GB > M-Audio 2496 Sound Card / Linksys 600N WiFi > Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit >[Passmark system rating = 1859, CPU = 8528 / 2D= 512 / 3D=1097]

2D, 3D CAD, Image Processing, Rendering, Text > Architecture, industrial design, graphic design, written projects

djClaw · Sep 22, 2015

Wow, that was informative! I really am becoming dumb as I age.. . I'm going to copy your z420 system...thank you. I wanted to build a new computer for solidworks, and comsol. Your list really is helpful.
Cheers!

bambiboom · Sep 22, 2015

djClaw :

djClaw,

The HP z420 E5-1620 was a success story. The performance was very good- Xeon E5-1600 series are really excellent all round, it was completely reliable and quieter then the various Dell Precisions. I tend to prefer Dell Precisions for design and build quality.

Since that post I changed the Quadro 4000 to a K2200 (4GB) and the results were fantastic in 3D- much faster navigation and regen of large models with shadows, etc. The Samsung 840 was changed to an Intel 730 480GB so the disk performance significantly improved:

HP z420 (2013)(Revision 2) > Xeon E5-1620 four core @ 3.6 /3.8GHz > 24GB DDR3 ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro 2200 (4GB) > Intel 730 (480GB) > M-Audio 192 soundcard Linksys WMP600N WiFi
[Passmark system rating = 4403 / CPU = 9280 / 2D= 797 / 3D= 3481/ Mem= 2559 / Disk= 4498]

In February 2015, though I found an astoundingly good deal on a "new other" z420:

HP z420 (2015)(Original) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 /4.0GHz > 16GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K600 (1GB) > WD Blue 500GB

> And I transferred the K2200 and Intel 730 to it which produced:

[ Passmark Rating = 4918 > CPU= 13941 / 2D= 823 / 3D= 3463 / Mem= 2668 / Disk= 4764

> Then, I added +16GB and found a used K4200 (4GB, 256-bit) so as to have:

HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 / 4.0GHz > 32GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K4200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB (9SSDSC2BP480G4R5) > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > 600W PSU> Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 5064 > CPU= 13989 / 2D= 819 / 3D= 4596 / Mem= 2772 / Disk= 4555] [Cinebench R15 > CPU = 1014 OpenGL= 126.59 FPS] 7.8.15

Pending upgrade: HP /LSI 9212-4i PCIe SAS /SATA HBA RAID controller, 2X Seagate Constellation ES.3 1TB (RAID 1)

> which at the moment is the highest rated z420 on Passmark- and well under $2,000.

If you're planning to change systems, I would encourage you to watch Ebay for these "new other: z420's and even not very old used systems. They dseem to arrive with small HDD's and for exmaple the Quadro K600 (1GB) is not a brialliant performer, but it much easier and faster than building- you can have the system up and working the same day it arrives and plug in new components as you find them.

I also had very goof results upgrading a Precision T5500:

Purchased for $171:

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) (Original): Xeon E5620 quad core @ 2.4 / 2.6 GHz > 6GB DDR3 ECC Reg 1333 > Quadro FX 580 (512MB) > Dell PERC 6/i SAS /SATA controller > Seagate Cheetah 15K 146GB > Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
[ Passmark system rating = 1479 / CPU = 4067 / 2D= 520 / 3D= 311 / Mem= 1473 / Disk= 1208]

> and going through a couple of interations, acquiring the Samsung 840 form the E5-1620 z420 and the K2200 form the E5-1660 v2 became:

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro K2200 (4GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB / WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > 875W PSU > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1080)
[ Passmark system rating = 3490 / CPU = 9178 / 2D= 685 / 3D= 3566 / Mem= 1865 / Disk= 2122] [Cinebench 15 > CPU = 772 OpenGL= 99.72 FPS] 7.8.15

Pending upgrade: PERC H310 PCIe SAS /SATA RAID controller, 2X WD Black 1TB (RAID 1)(Converts disk system from 3GB/s to 6GB/s)

This is a bit expensive for a T5500- almost $1,000 invested, but with the PERC 6GB/s disk and adding a second CPU could keep up with many current workstations.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

djClaw · Sep 22, 2015

bambiboom :

djClaw :

djClaw,

The HP z420 E5-1620 was a success story. The performance was very good- Xeon E5-1600 series are really excellent all round, it was completely reliable and quieter then the various Dell Precisions. I tend to prefer Dell Precisions for design and build quality.

Since that post I changed the Quadro 4000 to a K2200 (4GB) and the results were fantastic in 3D- much faster navigation and regen of large models with shadows, etc. The Samsung 840 was changed to an Intel 730 480GB so the disk performance significantly improved:

HP z420 (2013)(Revision 2) > Xeon E5-1620 four core @ 3.6 /3.8GHz > 24GB DDR3 ECC 1600 RAM > Quadro 2200 (4GB) > Intel 730 (480GB) > M-Audio 192 soundcard Linksys WMP600N WiFi
[Passmark system rating = 4403 / CPU = 9280 / 2D= 797 / 3D= 3481/ Mem= 2559 / Disk= 4498]

In February 2015, though I found an astoundingly good deal on a "new other" z420:

HP z420 (2015)(Original) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 /4.0GHz > 16GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K600 (1GB) > WD Blue 500GB

> And I transferred the K2200 and Intel 730 to it which produced:

[ Passmark Rating = 4918 > CPU= 13941 / 2D= 823 / 3D= 3463 / Mem= 2668 / Disk= 4764

> Then, I added +16GB and found a used K4200 (4GB, 256-bit) so as to have:

HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 / 4.0GHz > 32GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K4200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB (9SSDSC2BP480G4R5) > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > 600W PSU> Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 5064 > CPU= 13989 / 2D= 819 / 3D= 4596 / Mem= 2772 / Disk= 4555] [Cinebench R15 > CPU = 1014 OpenGL= 126.59 FPS] 7.8.15

Pending upgrade: HP /LSI 9212-4i PCIe SAS /SATA HBA RAID controller, 2X Seagate Constellation ES.3 1TB (RAID 1)

> which at the moment is the highest rated z420 on Passmark- and well under $2,000.

If you're planning to change systems, I would encourage you to watch Ebay for these "new other: z420's and even not very old used systems. They dseem to arrive with small HDD's and for exmaple the Quadro K600 (1GB) is not a brialliant performer, but it much easier and faster than building- you can have the system up and working the same day it arrives and plug in new components as you find them.

I also had very goof results upgrading a Precision T5500:

Purchased for $171:

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) (Original): Xeon E5620 quad core @ 2.4 / 2.6 GHz > 6GB DDR3 ECC Reg 1333 > Quadro FX 580 (512MB) > Dell PERC 6/i SAS /SATA controller > Seagate Cheetah 15K 146GB > Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
[ Passmark system rating = 1479 / CPU = 4067 / 2D= 520 / 3D= 311 / Mem= 1473 / Disk= 1208]

> and going through a couple of interations, acquiring the Samsung 840 form the E5-1620 z420 and the K2200 form the E5-1660 v2 became:

Dell Precision T5500 (2011) > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro K2200 (4GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB / WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > 875W PSU > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1080)
[ Passmark system rating = 3490 / CPU = 9178 / 2D= 685 / 3D= 3566 / Mem= 1865 / Disk= 2122] [Cinebench 15 > CPU = 772 OpenGL= 99.72 FPS] 7.8.15

Pending upgrade: PERC H310 PCIe SAS /SATA RAID controller, 2X WD Black 1TB (RAID 1)(Converts disk system from 3GB/s to 6GB/s)

This is a bit expensive for a T5500- almost $1,000 invested, but with the PERC 6GB/s disk and adding a second CPU could keep up with many current workstations.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

djClaw · Sep 22, 2015

You are a wealth knowledge ...
I have my eye on this- Lenovo ThinkStation S20
Xeon W3690 Six Core 3.47GHz Processor
24GB RAM
TWO 500GB Hard Disk Drives
OPERATING SYSTEM NOT INSTALLED
Video
NVIDIA Quadro 400 (512MB)
What do you think?

bambiboom · Sep 23, 2015

djClaw :

djClaw,

I had a quick ook at Lenovo thinkstation S20 in Passmark and the results are not bad. There are only 32 systems tested and the highest scores in each category:

Rating = 3101
CPU = 9498 (Xeon W3690)
2D = 701 (Quadro FX 1800)
3D = 5754 (GTX 770) Highest 3D workstation GPU = 1710 (Quadro 2000)
Mem = 1918 (16GB on W3690 / Quadro 2000 system)
Disk = 4806 ("Volume0") (Guessing, this must be a RAID 0 on a pair of SSD's)

The results from a Quadro 400 on the S20 were not wonderful however- 2D =622 / 3D =268. It's a pity that there were not any current Quadros tested.

The very high CPU rating for the W3690, and in other categories means that the basic system has a good potential. I'm a big fan of the W3690 - and LGA1366 in general.

To put the S20 into perspective, the highest scores for Precision T3500 with a W3690:

Rating = 3729
CPU = 9821 (Xeon W3690)
2D = 695 (9800GT)
3D = 8462 (GTX 970) Highest 3D workstation GPU = 2066 (Firepro V7800 Highest Quadro = 1992 (Quadro 4000)
Mem = 1922 (12GB on W3690 / Firepro V7800 system)
Disk = 2589 (Samsung 850 Pro 250GB) The highest disk score for a T3500 is 4572 (Dell PERC 6/i) ( Guessing, this must be a RAID 0 on a pair of SSD's

In my view, if the S20 is a remarkable bargain, then it does have potential with the GPU and disk changed. Here's a system nearly identical to- or may be- the one you're considering:

Lenovo ThinkStation S20 -Xeon W3690 Six Core 3.47GHz/24GB RAM/TWO 500GB HDD

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lenovo-ThinkStation-S20-Xeon-W3690-Six-Core-3-47GHz-24GB-RAM-TWO-500GB-HDD-/262054505664?

-and the ~$400 is not unreasonable.

However, to be confident in your choice, compare Precision T3500's - of which there are very many. It's sometimes possible too to buy a lower specification and upgrade fro a reasonable cost.

Here's a current T3500 listing with the W3690 and a Quadro 5000 (Passmark 2D = 642 / 3D = 2934):

Dell Precision T3500 Xeon Six Core 3.47GHz W3690 12GB 2TB HDD DVDRW QUADRO 5000

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-Precision-T3500-Xeon-Six-Core-3-47GHz-W3690-12GB-2TB-HDD-DVDRW-QUADRO-5000-/281683733460?hash=item4195a8abd4

Yes, $200 more, but you would instantly need to spend the $200 difference on upgrading the S20 GPU. The Quadro 5000 (320-bit, 2.5GB, 352 CUDA) is an really good Solidworks card- the price in 2011 was $2,200. You could have similar scores- and 128-bit, 4GB, 512 CUDA cores with a Quadro K1200 for about $360.

The other concept is to buy a lower specification T3500, T5500, or T7500 and these can have much higher eventual potential. If you get a reasonable specification that is usable as is, you can gradually plug in upgrades when you find deals and never be out of business for more than a couple of hours at a time.

A complicated equation!

Cheers,

BambiBoom

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