NEW R9 290 OR. USED Reference GTX 780 Ti !!
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 19, 2014 2:22:43 PM
Hi Guys,
I posted a topic days ago asking R9 290 vs. Used 7990 and all answers confirmed R9 290 better for gaming and better for my PSU (650w Gold) .. my specs in my signature
No i have another offer to trade my new sealed ASUS R9 290 DirectCU II OC for a Used GTX 780Ti Reference edition without box or accessories (only the card)
Some Topics mentioned the GTX 780 Ti is 30% faster than R9 290 !
I play BF4, crysis, Farcry,etcc.. Single Monitor 1920x1080
Good deal or stick with the R9 290 !
Thanks :-
I posted a topic days ago asking R9 290 vs. Used 7990 and all answers confirmed R9 290 better for gaming and better for my PSU (650w Gold) .. my specs in my signature
No i have another offer to trade my new sealed ASUS R9 290 DirectCU II OC for a Used GTX 780Ti Reference edition without box or accessories (only the card)
Some Topics mentioned the GTX 780 Ti is 30% faster than R9 290 !
I play BF4, crysis, Farcry,etcc.. Single Monitor 1920x1080
Good deal or stick with the R9 290 !
Thanks :-
More about : 290 reference gtx 780
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Reply to Hussein Mahfouz
Gam3r01
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July 19, 2014 2:25:27 PM
Stick with the 290 for several reasons.
The reference cooler isnt the best on the 780Ti
There is no way to tell what condition the card is in
Most importantly No warranty, no RMA on used cards
Though the Ti might be better overall, at 1080p you will be hard pressed to use the whole power of the 290, let alone a Ti. I recommend against buying any used cards.
The reference cooler isnt the best on the 780Ti
There is no way to tell what condition the card is in
Most importantly No warranty, no RMA on used cards
Though the Ti might be better overall, at 1080p you will be hard pressed to use the whole power of the 290, let alone a Ti. I recommend against buying any used cards.
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Reply to Gam3r01
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I tend to agree with Gam3r01.
The 290 isn't that far from the 780ti, certainly not 30%. That is probably a best-case scenario in a game that heavily favors Nvidia hardware.
This is not true, however. It depends on the brand of the card. For example, IIRC, MSI covers its video cards based on the serial number alone, no invoice needed.
If you personally know the seller, if he can provide an invoice and you have confirmation from the manufacturer that the card will still be covered by the warranty even if you are not the original buyer, then, and only then would I accept the trade.
The 290 isn't that far from the 780ti, certainly not 30%. That is probably a best-case scenario in a game that heavily favors Nvidia hardware.
Gam3r01 said:
Most importantly No warranty, no RMA on used cardsThis is not true, however. It depends on the brand of the card. For example, IIRC, MSI covers its video cards based on the serial number alone, no invoice needed.
If you personally know the seller, if he can provide an invoice and you have confirmation from the manufacturer that the card will still be covered by the warranty even if you are not the original buyer, then, and only then would I accept the trade.
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Reply to dav_jw
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 19, 2014 2:34:02 PM
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July 19, 2014 2:36:13 PM
It only hits 73C at 40% fan speed under max load.
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_radeon_r9_290...
R9s can get up to ~90C before thermal throttling.
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_radeon_r9_290...
R9s can get up to ~90C before thermal throttling.
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Gam3r01 said:
It only hits 73C at 40% fan speed under max load.http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_radeon_r9_290...
R9s can get up to ~90C before thermal throttling.
Yeah, I have a reference 290, with the stock cooling it reaches 90-94 degrees in a few minutes, and then starts throttling. I highly doubt the DCUII will ever reach those temps.
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 19, 2014 2:45:47 PM
Well i trust his personal week warranty, it's not the first time i trade with him, he is a trader do this as a business. sell and buy used items.
if the card is defective he will take it again for sure! and i have a week to test the card (noise, temp using stress tests) i mean if there's something i will discover it before the week ends! or future problems may accrue !
Problem is i bought the R9 290 through ebay and it's on it's way "shipping" from US to my counter (will arrive tomorrow) :\
I think there's risk in both sides
so i was thinking go with the better card if the risk is exist! even with the new card
btw he's selling me the GTX 780 Ti without Box or anything (only the card)
if the card is defective he will take it again for sure! and i have a week to test the card (noise, temp using stress tests) i mean if there's something i will discover it before the week ends! or future problems may accrue !
Problem is i bought the R9 290 through ebay and it's on it's way "shipping" from US to my counter (will arrive tomorrow) :\
I think there's risk in both sides
so i was thinking go with the better card if the risk is exist! even with the new card
btw he's selling me the GTX 780 Ti without Box or anything (only the card)
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July 19, 2014 2:48:10 PM
Ah this makes the decision a bit easier.
I personally wouldnt do it (Im paranoid with used items), but go for the Ti. Run some stress tests and benchmarks on it for 24+ hours. If there is something wrong you will know it after that. I only say this because you trust him and you can return it.
But the card itself is still reference model, which I would avoid.
Its a risk you have to take, I personally would use the new card.
I personally wouldnt do it (Im paranoid with used items), but go for the Ti. Run some stress tests and benchmarks on it for 24+ hours. If there is something wrong you will know it after that. I only say this because you trust him and you can return it.
But the card itself is still reference model, which I would avoid.
Its a risk you have to take, I personally would use the new card.
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Reply to Gam3r01
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Brand new card everyday =w=
Reference models sucks by three reasons:
1. Reference clock speed.
2. Quality of components is not customized for extra performance, reliability and durability.
3. Reference cooler is bad and noisy.
The 290 may not perform par to the 780ti, but it's an Asus DCII what are you getting, meaning better customized components/build, better cooling solution and higher clock speed than the reference specs.
Worst case scenario the used 780ti was overvolted and you get a broken card.
Reference models sucks by three reasons:
1. Reference clock speed.
2. Quality of components is not customized for extra performance, reliability and durability.
3. Reference cooler is bad and noisy.
The 290 may not perform par to the 780ti, but it's an Asus DCII what are you getting, meaning better customized components/build, better cooling solution and higher clock speed than the reference specs.
Worst case scenario the used 780ti was overvolted and you get a broken card.
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 19, 2014 3:02:46 PM
dav_jw said:
What's the brand/manufacturer of the 780ti?this is a good question i asked him and he replied GeForce GTX 780 Ti (Product Of Nvidia Itself ) !!
My guess he don't know! because there's no box (only the card) he can't figure out the vendor
but i think because it's reference it doesn't matter or i am mistaken ? -
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 19, 2014 3:06:03 PM
6R1M01R3 said:
Brand new card everyday =w=Reference models sucks by three reasons:
1. Reference clock speed.
2. Quality of components is not customized for extra performance, reliability and durability.
3. Reference cooler is bad and noisy.
The 290 may not perform par to the 780ti, but it's an Asus DCII what are you getting, meaning better customized components/build, better cooling solution and higher clock speed than the reference specs.
Worst case scenario the used 780ti was overvolted and you get a broken card.
I saw alot of talks confirmed ASUS DCII with R9 290/290x is not okay! because they are using the same design of the GTX 780 ! and the VRM and the Ship run soo HOOOT !
i know if i decide to take the GTX i won't be able to OC it because it's a reference edition, but i think it will still be faster than 290 OC with the 780 TI Stock Speed?
if the card is overvolted and it's broken i will know for sure by testing the card all week, and like i mentioned i trust his warranty because i know they guy.
So if you in my place you still stick with the 290 ?
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Reply to Hussein Mahfouz
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Best solution
I was a bit surprised by what you said about VRM temps and the cooler design, so I looked up some reviews, as I have no experience with this particular card. 108C on the VRM. That is indeed a bit hot. A review here on Tom's confirm what you state about the cooler design.
It seems a bit suspicious that he would want to trade a 780Ti for a 290, since his card is worth much more. Even used, its value is probably greater than a new 290. But if you trust the seller, that is not really a concern.
Considering those facts and that you trust the seller, I can understand why you'd want to trade it. I personally wouldn't get a second-hand card of that value without a real warranty from the manufacturer, just in case. But in the end, if you are willing to take the risk it would probably be worth it.
The reason I asked about the vendor/manufacturer is the warranty. If my memory serves me well, MSI will cover used cards, and so will XFX (with original invoice, however). Sapphire won't; I'm not sure about the other vendors.
Since it is a reference card, the card itself should be identical from any vendor. The only way to tell which manufacturer actually made the card would be from the serial # (and you would probably need another reference to compare)
It seems a bit suspicious that he would want to trade a 780Ti for a 290, since his card is worth much more. Even used, its value is probably greater than a new 290. But if you trust the seller, that is not really a concern.
Considering those facts and that you trust the seller, I can understand why you'd want to trade it. I personally wouldn't get a second-hand card of that value without a real warranty from the manufacturer, just in case. But in the end, if you are willing to take the risk it would probably be worth it.
The reason I asked about the vendor/manufacturer is the warranty. If my memory serves me well, MSI will cover used cards, and so will XFX (with original invoice, however). Sapphire won't; I'm not sure about the other vendors.
Since it is a reference card, the card itself should be identical from any vendor. The only way to tell which manufacturer actually made the card would be from the serial # (and you would probably need another reference to compare)
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 20, 2014 7:58:23 PM
dav_jw said:
I was a bit surprised by what you said about VRM temps and the cooler design, so I looked up some reviews, as I have no experience with this particular card. 108C on the VRM. That is indeed a bit hot. A review here on Tom's confirm what you state about the cooler design.It seems a bit suspicious that he would want to trade a 780Ti for a 290, since his card is worth much more. Even used, its value is probably greater than a new 290. But if you trust the seller, that is not really a concern.
Considering those facts and that you trust the seller, I can understand why you'd want to trade it. I personally wouldn't get a second-hand card of that value without a real warranty from the manufacturer, just in case. But in the end, if you are willing to take the risk it would probably be worth it.
The reason I asked about the vendor/manufacturer is the warranty. If my memory serves me well, MSI will cover used cards, and so will XFX (with original invoice, however). Sapphire won't; I'm not sure about the other vendors.
Since it is a reference card, the card itself should be identical from any vendor. The only way to tell which manufacturer actually made the card would be from the serial # (and you would probably need another reference to compare)
I decided to stick with the R9 290
and i tested the card today with the latest firmware and in a room with AC temp 24C
IDLE
GPU Temperature 38'C
Fan Speed 20%
VRM 1 Temperature 38'C
VRM 2 Temperature 39'C
Gaming (BF4 Ultra Settings 1920x1024 MSAA at 4K, HBAO enabled)
GPU Temperature 77'C
Fan Speed 47%
VRM 1 Temperature 94'C
VRM 2 Temperature 78'C
FurMark
GPU Temperature 81'C
Fan Speed 48%
VRM 1 Temperature 111'C
VRM 2 Temperature 85'C
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Hussein Mahfouz
July 21, 2014 4:15:43 PM
dav_jw said:
Those temperatures are good. 94C on the VRM 1 is a bit high, but not dangerously so. I would not worry too much about the 111C during FurMark. FurMark gives unrealistic results, in my opinion. You probably won't ever see those numbers anywhere else.How much temp the VRM can handle? i need to know the dangerous range to avoid using the card in case of hot days or room without AC :\
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Hussein Mahfouz said:
dav_jw said:
Those temperatures are good. 94C on the VRM 1 is a bit high, but not dangerously so. I would not worry too much about the 111C during FurMark. FurMark gives unrealistic results, in my opinion. You probably won't ever see those numbers anywhere else.How much temp the VRM can handle? i need to know the dangerous range to avoid using the card in case of hot days or room without AC :\
I'm not sure what is the maximum temperature for those VRM, however VRMs are often rated well over 100C (105C or 125C is frequent). Considering that you reached 111C without issue, its probably around those temperatures. Then again, 111 C is definitely not within the range I would consider "safe".
So as long as you stay under 100, I wouldn't worry too much.
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July 21, 2014 7:30:23 PM
"We noticed a readout at 119c when running Furmark. We never include Furmark results as ‘real world’ indicators however and when gaming this temperature dropped to 110c.
We spoke to ASUS about this just before going to publication and their engineering team said that the placement of the VRM sensor is in a different location on their 290′s, but the VRM’s are being cooled well within specifications."
http://www.kitguru.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/scree...
Its a faulty readout, not overheating.
We spoke to ASUS about this just before going to publication and their engineering team said that the placement of the VRM sensor is in a different location on their 290′s, but the VRM’s are being cooled well within specifications."
http://www.kitguru.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/scree...
Its a faulty readout, not overheating.
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