Watercooling with AMD Crossfire in BitFenix Prodigy M or DS Cube or analog
Tags:
- compact
- Water Cooling
- BitFenix
- Prodigy M
- Crossfire
- SLI
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Components
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Cases
Last response: in Components
bobochko
August 17, 2014 12:42:46 PM
Hello Everybody!
I want to build my first gaming rig in a compact case like BitFenix Prodigy M
I hope all of this stuff will fit this case http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/cLyyHx
But I'm highly confused because of airflow between graphics cards. I don't worry much about CPU cooling, but 290 Radeons produce a lot of heat in very limited space. So I decided to use water cooling for graphics.
I never built any water-cooled systems before.
What kit or components I should use for this build?
Where to install the radiator?
Or it's better to choose a larger case?
Thank you in advance!
I want to build my first gaming rig in a compact case like BitFenix Prodigy M
I hope all of this stuff will fit this case http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/p/cLyyHx
But I'm highly confused because of airflow between graphics cards. I don't worry much about CPU cooling, but 290 Radeons produce a lot of heat in very limited space. So I decided to use water cooling for graphics.
I never built any water-cooled systems before.
What kit or components I should use for this build?
Where to install the radiator?
Or it's better to choose a larger case?
Thank you in advance!
More about : watercooling amd crossfire bitfenix prodigy cube analog
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Reply to bobochko
albertotron
August 17, 2014 12:56:26 PM
Rammy
August 17, 2014 3:00:24 PM
You don't necessarily need a larger case, you just need one better suited to what you are trying to do.
Search for Prodigy M - I've run through some of it's foibles before so I'm really just repeating myself, but it's got quite a lot of issues for even a mid-range build. At high end it's a lot of compromises to get everything working.
If you are unsure about water cooling then I'd avoid it all together - it's very expensive and the price
erformance return is going to be very poor. If you find a mATX case with 5 expansion slots (like a 350D) and a suitable motherboard to support this (off the top of my head I think the G Sniper mATX works for this) then you can leave a slot gap between two cards with conventional air coolers and still keep the cards fairly cool as they have some room to circulate.
There's some other options too.
Alternative cases -
Fractal Design Arc Mini - Pretty small, 4 expansion slots, very conventional but space for radiators
Corsair 350D - Fairly larger for mATX (nearer to ATX) but 5 expansion slots and loads of room for radiators.
Parvum Systems S2.0 - Very suited to watercooling, self assembly, looks not for everyone.
Aerocool DS - Similar to Bifenixes cases but has the motherboard sitting horizontally (like a proper Prodigy) so it's airflow isn't rubbish.
Silverstone SG10 - Three dedicated fans for graphics card cooling (though arguably more suited to reference coolers here), small size, similar cubic form factor.
Alternative graphics cards -
If you are going to spend a load of money buying full water cooling and water blocks for graphics cards, the cost saving on getting GTX780s over R9 290s really isn't that significant. By comparison, the GTX780s have a very solid reference cooler you can stack up reasonably well in smaller spaces (especially if you have direct fan support like on the SG10).
Go single graphics card -
Dunno if you've considered this, but do you actually need dual R9 290s? If your running a single display, even if it's 1440P, there's a case for it being a waste of money. If you want a smaller, watercooling build, then there's much more flexibility if you only have the one graphics card.
ITX Bitfenix Prodigy - Much better airflow, layout and radiator support than the "M" version. Works fine on air, but has good water cooling options.
Corsair 250D - vaguely similar layout to the Prodigy but less suited to air - more of a closed loop cooler system.
EVGA Hadron Hydro - Very small, unusual looks, packs a lot of stuff in, but limited options.
Ncase M1 - Good luck getting one, very cool though.
Compact Splash - Great name kinda explains everything.
Caselabs Mercury S3 - Expensive but loads of options/configurations.
For general watercooling advice if you do go down that route, have a look at the watercooling sticky. If it seems intimidating, it's kinda because it is. What sort of radiators you will need depends on a bunch of factors, all of which are addressed - things like fan speed/noise, levels of overclocking etc.
Search for Prodigy M - I've run through some of it's foibles before so I'm really just repeating myself, but it's got quite a lot of issues for even a mid-range build. At high end it's a lot of compromises to get everything working.
If you are unsure about water cooling then I'd avoid it all together - it's very expensive and the price
erformance return is going to be very poor. If you find a mATX case with 5 expansion slots (like a 350D) and a suitable motherboard to support this (off the top of my head I think the G Sniper mATX works for this) then you can leave a slot gap between two cards with conventional air coolers and still keep the cards fairly cool as they have some room to circulate.There's some other options too.
Alternative cases -
Fractal Design Arc Mini - Pretty small, 4 expansion slots, very conventional but space for radiators
Corsair 350D - Fairly larger for mATX (nearer to ATX) but 5 expansion slots and loads of room for radiators.
Parvum Systems S2.0 - Very suited to watercooling, self assembly, looks not for everyone.
Aerocool DS - Similar to Bifenixes cases but has the motherboard sitting horizontally (like a proper Prodigy) so it's airflow isn't rubbish.
Silverstone SG10 - Three dedicated fans for graphics card cooling (though arguably more suited to reference coolers here), small size, similar cubic form factor.
Alternative graphics cards -
If you are going to spend a load of money buying full water cooling and water blocks for graphics cards, the cost saving on getting GTX780s over R9 290s really isn't that significant. By comparison, the GTX780s have a very solid reference cooler you can stack up reasonably well in smaller spaces (especially if you have direct fan support like on the SG10).
Go single graphics card -
Dunno if you've considered this, but do you actually need dual R9 290s? If your running a single display, even if it's 1440P, there's a case for it being a waste of money. If you want a smaller, watercooling build, then there's much more flexibility if you only have the one graphics card.
ITX Bitfenix Prodigy - Much better airflow, layout and radiator support than the "M" version. Works fine on air, but has good water cooling options.
Corsair 250D - vaguely similar layout to the Prodigy but less suited to air - more of a closed loop cooler system.
EVGA Hadron Hydro - Very small, unusual looks, packs a lot of stuff in, but limited options.
Ncase M1 - Good luck getting one, very cool though.
Compact Splash - Great name kinda explains everything.
Caselabs Mercury S3 - Expensive but loads of options/configurations.
For general watercooling advice if you do go down that route, have a look at the watercooling sticky. If it seems intimidating, it's kinda because it is. What sort of radiators you will need depends on a bunch of factors, all of which are addressed - things like fan speed/noise, levels of overclocking etc.
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Reply to Rammy
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Man, that would be a challenge.
TBH, I dont see any way it can be done while still keeping the case aesthetic (so externally mounting WC'ing gear) or its portability (a dock kind of setup).
Dual cards in that case is already a tight fit, at best you might get a 200m rad at the bottom and a pump (depending on the size of your PSU and no 5.25" bay). Your definitely going to need more than 200mm of rad space, so anticipate a external rad (240 or 360mm) on top and a reservoir (you could pretty that up pretty well actually).
You could limit this back to a single card, getting an R9 295X2 will give you a lot more room to work with (internal mounted 240mm rad for instance).
However.
If this is your first computer build, I recommend not even going near custom water. Its already hard enough that you picked this case, adding water to the mix just makes it so much more complicated. Whenever something goes wrong with my rig I dread having to troubleshoot it, because if its something that requires me to pull hardware out or I need to breadboard, there goes your day. Water-cooling pretty much anchors your hardware to the case, and it requires a lot of work to extract it.
My opinion, dont even consider water on your first build.
TBH, I dont see any way it can be done while still keeping the case aesthetic (so externally mounting WC'ing gear) or its portability (a dock kind of setup).
Dual cards in that case is already a tight fit, at best you might get a 200m rad at the bottom and a pump (depending on the size of your PSU and no 5.25" bay). Your definitely going to need more than 200mm of rad space, so anticipate a external rad (240 or 360mm) on top and a reservoir (you could pretty that up pretty well actually).
You could limit this back to a single card, getting an R9 295X2 will give you a lot more room to work with (internal mounted 240mm rad for instance).
However.
bobochko said:
I want to build my first gaming rig in a compact case like BitFenix Prodigy M If this is your first computer build, I recommend not even going near custom water. Its already hard enough that you picked this case, adding water to the mix just makes it so much more complicated. Whenever something goes wrong with my rig I dread having to troubleshoot it, because if its something that requires me to pull hardware out or I need to breadboard, there goes your day. Water-cooling pretty much anchors your hardware to the case, and it requires a lot of work to extract it.
My opinion, dont even consider water on your first build.
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Reply to manofchalk
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bobochko
August 18, 2014 12:47:28 PM
Thank you, guys!
I'm not yet an experienced builder, but I really want to try water cooling with all those fancy UV-glowing hoses.
I see two main difficulties here
1. Liquid cooling itself.
2. Very limited space inside Prodigy M case.
So one of the solutions is to pick a larger case.
First let's calculate TDP of water-cooled components:
Intel 4790K - 88W
AMD Radeon R9 290 - 275W x2 = 550W
Total TDP is 638W
90% is 574W (moderately overclocked will be about 700W)
I believe two 280mm radiators with 140mm fans should be enough to achieve about 10° delta T, am I right?
If I consider Corsair 350D Window MicroATX Mid Tower Case, I imagine to place one radiator on top and one on front, booth working as exhausts and reverse the rear 120mm fan for intake. Will this work?
I also would be very grateful for your help in the selection of perfect pricepoint components, including:
the pump, the reservoir, radiators, fans, CPU waterblock and full-cover GPU blocks.
I'm not yet an experienced builder, but I really want to try water cooling with all those fancy UV-glowing hoses.
I see two main difficulties here
1. Liquid cooling itself.
2. Very limited space inside Prodigy M case.
So one of the solutions is to pick a larger case.
First let's calculate TDP of water-cooled components:
Intel 4790K - 88W
AMD Radeon R9 290 - 275W x2 = 550W
Total TDP is 638W
90% is 574W (moderately overclocked will be about 700W)
I believe two 280mm radiators with 140mm fans should be enough to achieve about 10° delta T, am I right?
If I consider Corsair 350D Window MicroATX Mid Tower Case, I imagine to place one radiator on top and one on front, booth working as exhausts and reverse the rear 120mm fan for intake. Will this work?
I also would be very grateful for your help in the selection of perfect pricepoint components, including:
the pump, the reservoir, radiators, fans, CPU waterblock and full-cover GPU blocks.
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Reply to bobochko
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Rammy
August 18, 2014 2:40:13 PM
You don't explicitly need a bigger case than the Prodigy M, so much as one with a better use of space for your goals.
Both the Arc Mini and the 350D (arguably the go-to cases for mATX water cooling) are bigger than the Prodigy M in volume, but not significantly so. Some of the other options I mentioned are actually smaller.
Two 280mm radiators is a sensible number, but remember that how these perform depends on all of the other components in the loop, the thickness/fin density (and other factors) of the radiators themselves and of the quality/speed of the fans used. It's perhaps also worth considering that there is generally a better selection of 120mm fans than there is of 140mm, though I wouldn't think of this as a limiting factor.
Component selection is a bit tricky, but if you are just starting out then one of the watercooling kits might be a good place to start. A lot of these however will come with bay resorvoir/pump combos which are relatively straightforward for installation but possibly impractical in some of your case options. Still the XSPC Raystorm kits are worth looking at.
Your 350D plan doesn't really work, you are best to stick to the conventional approach whether you are air or water cooling - front/side/bottom intake, rear/top exhaust. This means one radiator would be on an exhaust section and the other would be on the intake.
Both the Arc Mini and the 350D (arguably the go-to cases for mATX water cooling) are bigger than the Prodigy M in volume, but not significantly so. Some of the other options I mentioned are actually smaller.
Two 280mm radiators is a sensible number, but remember that how these perform depends on all of the other components in the loop, the thickness/fin density (and other factors) of the radiators themselves and of the quality/speed of the fans used. It's perhaps also worth considering that there is generally a better selection of 120mm fans than there is of 140mm, though I wouldn't think of this as a limiting factor.
Component selection is a bit tricky, but if you are just starting out then one of the watercooling kits might be a good place to start. A lot of these however will come with bay resorvoir/pump combos which are relatively straightforward for installation but possibly impractical in some of your case options. Still the XSPC Raystorm kits are worth looking at.
Your 350D plan doesn't really work, you are best to stick to the conventional approach whether you are air or water cooling - front/side/bottom intake, rear/top exhaust. This means one radiator would be on an exhaust section and the other would be on the intake.
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Reply to Rammy
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bobochko
August 19, 2014 6:29:13 AM
Ok then. I decided to take one of those new Aerocool DS 200 cases. It's a bit larger but looks neat, and I can fit ATX mobo and two slim 280 rads in it.
I'm pretty sure it will be enough to dispel 700W of heat without a lot of noise, but I don't know what components to pick up. Can you help me to choose 280 radiators (not thicker than 30mm), silent 140 fans and the pump?
I'm pretty sure it will be enough to dispel 700W of heat without a lot of noise, but I don't know what components to pick up. Can you help me to choose 280 radiators (not thicker than 30mm), silent 140 fans and the pump?
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