Is this monitor IPS or not?

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MrHappymoon

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Hello

Ive been looking at the BenQ BL2710PT which has got good reviews from various sites eg:

https://pcmonitors.info/reviews/benq.../#!prettyPhoto

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/benq_bl2710pt.htm

Ive discovered it is not IPS but something called 'AHVA' (Advanced Hyper-Viewing Angle).

How would this monitor compare with an IPS, would it be inferior to IPS?

I'm currently using a 21.5" HP 22xi monitor which is IPS and has superb viewing angles (by my eyes anyway). Im concerned that the BenQ be worse as it isnt IPS- is this a genuine concern?

What are your thoughts on this monitor?

thanks people


CORRECTION:

just to clarify its the BenQ B2710PT I meant, I posted that other link in error.
 
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MrHappymoon

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just to add, I've read the reviews in the links posted and cant get a clear answer to whether this AHVA is inferior to IPS or not.

There isnt a lot of info online re AHVA....

Im confused about IPS/PLS/AHVA.

Im wondering are BenQ are cutting corners by using 'AHVA' instead of IPS (?)

If anyone can advise me on this I'd be grateful.
 
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DarkSable

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BenQ's are top of the line monitors, mate.

That being said, your links are to two different monitors. The first is to the one I have, the XL2420T... it's a TN panel, but 120Hz. I have NEVER noticed any issues with viewing angles with it (unless I use it in portrait mode, which is never do), and it's my secondary monitor now, not my primary.

The second link is to a monitor that's designed specifically for working with CAD systems. It's designed to give the color accuracy of IPS with the fluidity of TN or CRT monitors. I'd say that it's a pretty good option... if you care about things like that.

Personally, as long as the viewing angles are decent, I'm happy. I don't understand why you want to be able to look at your monitor from more than 45 degrees off the vertical without having any issues. I would much, much rather have a good, high refresh rate monitor than an IPS panel; I think that IPS panels are often over-hyped by the people who bought into them and don't want their money to have been a waste. (And I have experience working on multiple flagships of both types from the best companies out there. I'll take a 120Hz, TN panel for 90% of the work I do, and use an IPS panel for the bits where absolute perfect color accuracy is necessary. Even for gaming, I don't really notice any issues with viewing angles... on high-end TN panels. I do on lower end TN panels.)
 
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VincentP

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AHVA and PLS are equivalent technologies to IPS.
PLS is from Samsung.
AHVA is from AU Optronics.

TFT Central article on AHVA:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/content/panel_technologies_content.htm#ahva

Index for articles on panel technologies:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/content/panel_technologies_content.htm

None of the three (IPS/PLS/AHVA) is inherently better or worse, but the quality of different monitor models do vary.
TFTCentral is a great source of information on monitors.

From a quick look at the review for this monitor it looks OK.
The monitor to compare it to is this:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2713hm.htm
 
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MrHappymoon

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Hi VincentP

You mention comparing it to the Dell U2713hm; you reckon its better?

There seems to be some serious issues with backlight bleed on the U2713hm from what Ive read.


you stated ''None of the three (IPS/PLS/AHVA) is inherently better or worse, but the quality of different monitor models do vary.''

So you mean that, for example, I could have 3 different IPS monitor models in front of me with varying viewing angles? (or 3 different PLS monitor models in front of me with varying viewing angles)- Is that right?
 
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VincentP

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Good IPS panels have better image quality than any TN panel. This isn't about viewing the screen from extreme angles, it is about consistency of luminance and colour across the screen and the colour spectrum. Just moving your head from side to side will show visible colour shift with a TN panel, and it is even worse if you use the screen in portrait mode.

TN panels only ever cover the sRGB colour space. This is the same colour space covered by the BenQ BL2710PT or the Dell U2713HM. These aren't really professional monitors despite what BenQ might claim. They are not a waste, they simply offer better image quality at a reasonable price. The only selling point TN panels have over this is responsiveness but it usually comes at the cost of image quality. The best TN panel on the market is the Asus ROG PG278Q, and even this doesn't have the viewing angles of IPS.

You can buy higher end IPS monitors that support the full RGB colour space, but these offer no benefit for games. An example is the Dell U2713H.
Dell U2713H - Wide Gamut 103% NTSC (CIE 1931), 99% Adobe RGB, 100% sRGB coverage
Dell U2713HM - Standard gamut >99% sRGB, 72% NTSC
BenQ PB2710PT - Standard gamut 100% sRGB, ~72% NTSC
 
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JackNaylorPE

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One technology is not inherently better than the other. Different technologies excel in different areas. And a $175 IPS monitor is word's apart from a $500 IPS monitor.

IPS panels excel in color accuracy and uniformity making them ideal for tasks such as photo editing ....

TN panels don't do well in photo editing as for the most part they are only 6 bit. The RoG Swift is 8 bit but it still suffers from color variation across the screen.

OTOH, IPS panels are very slow and they don't do 120/144 Hz .... some can be OC's that high but the manufacturers will only guarantee 96 or so. The slowness causes ghosting which is best evidenced by images

Eizo EV2436W
eizo_ev2436w.jpg


Asus VG278HE
benq_xl2720z.jpg

 
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VincentP

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This is from the TFTCentral article on the Dell U2713HM:
As usual we also tested the screen with an all black image and in a darkened room. A camera was used to capture the result. To the naked eye, there did not appear to be much in the way of backlight leakage although you could notice the characteristic IPS-glow as you looked at the black image from different angles. The camera picked out some slight unevenness and some clouding from the backlight in the four corners. This was most apparent in the bottom right hand corner but in practice overall there was nothing too severe. There was no bleeding from the edges which was good to see as that can become quite distracting during some uses, for instance when watching a movie with black borders top and bottom.

I did research on these monitors months ago and found this to be the best on offer.
The competition was the Asus ROG PG278Q, where the viewing angles were of some concern but the major sticking point for me was that it has only a single Displayport input so I have no way of connecting my laptop to the same monitor as my PC.

The article on the BenQ BL2710PT suggests it is pretty close, but just behind the Dell on gamma and colour accuracy as well as panel uniformity. Viewing angles are the same (both very good). Lag is also slightly lower on the Dell.
Compare the specific features that matter most to you in the reviews.
Also look at cost.
The Dell does not come with built-in speakers. You can buy a speaker bar that attaches to the bottom if you like, or of course you will get better sound from separate speakers.
 
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VincentP

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As I said "Good IPS panels have better image quality than any TN panel."
This is the area where IPS excels.
I wouldn't buy any IPS panel over 60 Hz, they simply don't have the response time to support higher refresh rates.

Where TN panels can excel is response time.
This doesn't apply to most TN panels though as they are only 60 Hz the same as IPS.
Good quality 120Hz and 144 Hz models offer incredible responsiveness but very few offer accurate colour and none offer good viewing angles.

Ghosting is an obvious point of contention between the panel types. Any 60 Hz panel will exhibit some ghosting. Most monitors have some sort of advanced technology to overcome this and some are better than others. Both the BenQ BL2710PT and Dell U2713HM are pretty good in this regard. I have seen no evidence that a 60 Hz panel with a 1ms response time is any better in this regard than a 60 Hz panel with an 8ms response time. Keep in mind the screen only refreshes every 16ms at 60 Hz.

8-bit colour depth should be considered standard for sRGB monitors if you want accurate colour, and you can get this in an IPS or TN panel.
Obviously 6-bit is undesirable. 6-bit + FRC is a way of approximating 8 bit colour.
10-bit or 8-bit + FRC colour depth is suitable for the RGB colour gamut. This requires support not just from the monitor but from the graphics card and from software. This is a professional monitor feature and it offers no benefit for games.

So for high quality panels used for gaming:
IPS offers superior viewing angles, colour accuracy and panel uniformity
TN offers lower lag and less image blur if it supports 120Hz or higher refresh rates and if the computer can support a frame rate well in excess of 60 FPS.
 
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MrHappymoon

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Vincent,

I did consider the Dell, and read the review which didnt seem to have any issues with backlight bleed.

However, many other people online have had serious issues with backlight bleed on the Dell u2713hm

eg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb_CXmXSQQU

a quick google search on ''dell u2713hm backlight bleed'' shows numerous forums/discussions about people experiencing backlight bleed with that monitor

 
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VincentP

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I've had the monitor for a few months and not noticed any problems. I've played a lot of Skyrim with lighting mods that make areas very dark and I think I would have noticed this if it affected my specific monitor. Perhaps it is an issue that affects only some of these monitors. The Asus PG278Q that he mentions is also another monitor I considered but the image quality on the Dell seemed better from reviews.

Edit: I've just booted up the computer with the Dell U2713HM monitor and shown a black image across the screen.
Now that I'm looking for it, I can see the light bleed this guy is complaining about.
I've had the monitor almost 7 months and have never noticed this, which I guess speaks to how much of an issue it is for me.
I don't watch movies on the monitor though if that is a factor.
What I have always noticed is the amazing colour compared to every other monitor I see, especially the Asus VS278Q that I bought before this and returned because it was terrible.

Edit 2: I've looked at the light in the corners of this monitor again. I think what I am seeing now is largely reflection of light from sunlight. As I move I can see patterns of light and dark matching the room I'm in. I'll be interested to look at it again tonight when I can actually make the room dark.

Edit 3: The corners of the monitor are lighter than the centre when showing a completely black image in a dark room, and none of it is truly black. Some monitors have dynamic contrast that makes them look better with this specific test, but it only works when the screen is completely black which never actually happens in real use. I've never noticed this in seven months, so I don't think it is a big deal.
 
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DarkSable

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Like I said, I've got experience with panels from all over the spectrum. I'm currently sitting in front of a BenQ XL2420T and an Iiyama Prolite XB2779QS-S1.

If you're talking about photo editing where the color on the screen has to match the color that comes out of the printer, then yes, IPS panels blow TN panels away. I never contested that.

However. When gaming, I know that I'm not alone in having my monitor set to a very low brightness, while still trying to maintain decent color. IPS loses some of it's advantages here, but is still slightly better off. However, color shift isn't nearly as much of an issue... especially, like I said, while gaming, when you aren't moving your head side to side anyways. Yes, portrait mode is hideous with almost any TN panel, but with a very high end gaming or professional monitor, I do not see the advantages of an IPS panel being anywhere close to overwhelming when compared to the response of the TN panel, especially when the color issue is evened out a lot by running at low brightness.

Again, I repeat... the image quality is absolutely not what a lot of IPS proponents make it out to be. When you take a very good IPS panel and a very good TN panel (Read: preferably 8-bit, user-calibrated, from a top manufacturer.), there is no difference that I can tell between image quality when gaming... and there's a huge difference in how smooth the game feels when you look at the fact that the TN panel can often run at 120Hz natively.

I'd rather have a more smooth game than a game with half the frames, but that doesn't shift imperceptibly when I slide my head right two feet.



 
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VincentP

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Virtually all monitors out of the box come with brightness set much too high.
Comparisons of colour accuracy are done after brightness is adjusted to a reasonable level.
I don't mean photo editing. I mean everyday use of a monitor. Something as simple a photo on the Windows desktop can look amazing on a monitor with a high pixel density and accurate colours. It matters just as much in games with sufficiently high graphics quality.

Perhaps it is fair to say that the benefits of an IPS panel can be overstated when some people barely notice the difference in colour accuracy and panel uniformity.
I think it would be equally fair to say the the benefits of 120 Hz TN panels can be overstated when some people barely notice the difference in image blur and responsiveness.

There are benefits of each technology. The user experience largely comes down to what they are looking for.
 
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JackNaylorPE

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I will echo the "black" issue on the IPS....we have a Dell IPS and two Asus TN panels (one 120 and one 144). On the Dell, when gaming, the fact that so much activity takes place in dark places is annoying..... the little bit of light that is available in the are of your party is washed out by the background light haze.
 
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VincentP

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It means you can view the screen within 178 degrees with a contrast ratio of 10:1.
Here is an article on it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viewing_angle

Your best bet for seeing the relative viewing angles are the detailed reviews.
Have a look at the images on TFTCentral for viewing angles for any of these IPS panels compared to any TN panels.
Different IPS panels vary in colour accuracy and many other features, but they are almost universally good for viewing angles.
As noted before, the major benefit of TN panels over these IPS panels is response time if a 120 Hz screen is desired.
 
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MrHappymoon

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It means you can view the screen within 178 degrees with a contrast ratio of 10:1.
Here is an article on it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viewing_angle

Your best bet for seeing the relative viewing angles are the detailed reviews.
Have a look at the images on TFTCentral for viewing angles for any of these IPS panels compared to any TN panels.
Different IPS panels vary in colour accuracy and many other features, but they are almost universally good for viewing angles.
As noted before, the major benefit of TN panels over these IPS panels is response time if a 120 Hz screen is desired.
Click to expand...

http://www.viewsoniceurope.com/uk/products/vp2770led.htm


This viewsonic above states in the spec:

Viewing Angles 178° / 178°


ie it doesnt state (CR>=10) like the Benq

does this mean it has better viewing angles than the Benq?

thanks
 
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VincentP

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It just means they haven't specified how they measure the viewing angles.
These are most likely the same.
 
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VincentP

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Here is the TFTCentral article on this viewsonic monitor:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/viewsonic_vp2770-led.htm
It looks pretty good really.

What I find interesting is the comments about white glow when viewed from an angle.
With this monitor again they write no noticeable backlight bleed, but the photograph shows a glow near the edges of the screen.
They write "On a black image, like many IPS panels, there is a white glow when viewed from an angle. ... Because of the size of the screen you may notice some of this glow from the corners when you are viewing it head on. This is only really noticeable in darkened room conditions and when viewing dark content and is quite similar to IPS panels."
Maybe this is what some people call backlight bleed in the Dell U2713HM.

If you are considering a TN panel, I think the Asus ROG PG278Q is the only 27" TN panel monitor that can come close to an IPS panel for image quality.
If you are looking at an IPS panel, the Viewsonic VP-2770-LED seems similar to the Dell U2713HM and BenQ BL2710PT.
 
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VincentP

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I've done some research on the "back light bleed" issue. This was mostly for my benefit, but it may be of interest to you.
The professional review sites all wrote there was no noticeable backlight bleed.
There were a number of forum posts with people asking about the issue, and that one guy who decided to make a youtube video.

This was the best post I found on the topic:
---
All IPS screens will "glow" when displaying a black screen off axis. The bigger the screen, the worse the problem is, as the viewing angles into the corners are so much more acute than centre, simply becuase it;s so big.

Is it back light bleed, or black glow? Easy to tell. Look at it from dead centre, but from a long way away... from the other side of the room. Has it gone? If so, it's IPS black glow. If not, it's back light bleed.

If it's back light bleed, sent it back if under warranty. If IPS glow... suck it up... welcome to IPS.
---

I tried viewing the screen from a distance and also looking at different areas of the screen from straight on. There is some bleed along the top and right hand side, but this is completely obscured by the "IPS glow" as I get closer to a normal sitting position.

From what I've learn't, I would put this down as another pro of TN panels over IPS. I can't see any evidence of a specific issue with the Dell U2713HM.

Comparing quality high end monitors for gaming (excluding 10 bit colour IPS monitors for professional colour work):
IPS panels have better colour when viewed from an angle
TN panels have higher refresh rate and less glow when dark images are viewed from an angle

Note that viewing from an angle is always the case at the corners of a 27 inch monitor.
If I was buying today, that would probably be enough to push me to the Asus ROG PG278Q.
 
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