Motherboard, Processor, RAM for Mini-ITX gaming pc

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faelan

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Hello!

I'm planning to build a Mini-ITX system for gaming in the BitFenix Prodigy (I like the blue one) and I have a rough idea of what I want, but have some decisions to make on the motherboard, processor, and ram. I am fairly certain I want to invest in the GTX 970 because it is such great value despite it's price. I also do not plan to overclock, but might consider it.

I have narrowed down what I like some, I like the Asus motherboards. My primary decision point is is whether I should save money and upgrade later or invest now. This comes up most obviously when comparing i5 to i7: I won't need an i7 now, but eventually it will be the norm right?

Motherboard

  • Asus H97I-Plus
    Asus Z97I-Plus
Processor

  • i5 4690
    i5 4690k
    i7 4790
    i7 4790k
Memory (I think the highest speed I can have on an Asus ITX mobo is 1600 MHz, but I can get CAS latency to 7)

  • 2x4 gb
    2x8 gb

I don't mind building conservatively now and upgrading later, this is my first time building a computer and I'm excited for the challenge of an ITX machine. However, with the difference in price being only a few hundred dollars, it's hard to tell if I shouldn't just get the best parts now, especially with the major decisions coming on the mobo and the processor (I imagine those are harder to replace than most other components).

Feel free to suggest alternatives to the components above, I'm open to a general discussion.
 
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There will never be a processor released for the 1150 socket platform that is better than a current i5 haswell by a margin large enough to bother upgrading to. Yes, Intel will make new CPUs for the 1150 platform, broadwell, but that's just a die shrink of the existing architecture, like going from Sandy to Ivy bridge. If you bought a Sandy Bridge i5-2400 back when 1155 was the mainstream intel platform, there was never a CPU released thereafter for that platform that represented a significant enough upgrade to bother with on that platform. The same will apply now for this platform.

The Xeon E3-1231V3 is architecturally equal to an i7-4770. It's a hyperthreaded quad core haswell CPU running 3.4/3.8ghz. It offers the same performance...
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Rapajez

Rapajez

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I should start by asking, what are your goals, what is the resolution of the display you're using, and what's your budget?

Well, make sure the 970 you pick, will fit in a Mini-ITX case.

The i7 won't get you much right now, unless you're streaming games or doing a lot of heavily-threaded tasks. It possible that games will use more cores in the future, but Hyper-threading on an i7 isn't EXACTLY the same thing as more cores.

As far as the (k) or (non-k), only get the K if you're going to overclock it, which means pairing it with a Z97 board and an aftermarket cooler. The cooler would have to fit inside the ITX build as well.

I'd normally say games won't use more than 8GB, so only buy 8, but since you only have 2 slots, and can't just add another 8GB later, you may want to drop the money on 16.
 
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Rapajez

Rapajez

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You may want to check out the Corsair 250D as well, as it will fit a CLC (Closed Loop Water cooler for overclocking), and a pretty big video card. You can also toss the DVD bay if you're not using one, for a little more space in there.
 
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faelan

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Right now I have a ps3 and a macbook pro with boot camp. I plan to play mostly world of warcraft, but I'm sure I will get into other pc games if I have a real pc. The biggest issue I have is framerate, my macbook has 8 gb ram and an i7 processor, but an integrated intel hd 3000 graphics card.

For the i7 vs i5 discussion, is the money I spend moving up to an i7 worth the longevity I get out of it? It sounds like no since in the near future games will still not take full advantage.

So you're saying if I overclock go with the Z97 and put a (k) on the processor and if I don't then go with the H97 and leave the (k) off? The i5 4690k is only $15 more than the i5 4690 right now, if I don't overclock is it still not worth it?
 
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faelan

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Oh, my budget - I am willing to spend money for longevity, but I don't want to shy away from maintenance to upgrade if that is the smarter move. For example, it is probably best to get an i5 right now because the next logical improvement over the i5 is not an i7, but is instead whatever Intel releases to replace the i5.

If I later decide to overclock, does that entail replacing the mobo, the processor, or both? Like, if I switch to an after market cooler for overclocking is it feasible to pull off the thermal compound and put new stuff on?
 
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Rapajez

Rapajez

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Yes, if you overclock, you need a Z97 and K-Edition processor, AND you really need an aftermarket cooler, and some good airflow in that smaller case to take advantage of it. Yes, you can use the stock cooler now, and add an aftermarket cooler later, but it's kind of a pain, especially in a small mini-ITX case. If you're not OC'ing, get the H97 mobo and the non-K edition CPU. I think in your case, you probably should just do that and save a little more money.

For WoW, you're going to get a huge boost from a modern Intel CPU, and a top-of-the-line GPU. I think the i5 would meet and exceed your needs, and keep things flying along for a long time.

Take the money saved and invest in at least a 120GB Solid State Drive (SSD) for Windows, WoW, and a few other apps and games. If you can, get 250GB to hold your whole gaming collection. The SSD will eliminate loading times in WoW, stop the slow down when you hit big cities, and make the PC feel much snappier in general. You can then pair it with a large HDD to store "My Documents", with video, pictures, music, etc on it. Crucial MX100 has one of the best value SSDs, and Samsung 840 EVO is one of the fastest, most reliable, and easiest to use models.

 
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faelan

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Thanks so much for the suggestions! Can I get a smaller PSU than the one I have listed?
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/pLBrwP

[PCPartPicker part list](http://pcpartpicker.com/p/pLBrwP) / [Price breakdown by merchant](http://pcpartpicker.com/p/pLBrwP/by_merchant/)

Type|Item|Price
:----|:----|:----
**CPU** | [Intel Core i5-4690 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646i54690) | $219.99 @ NCIX US
**Motherboard** | [Asus H97I-PLUS Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-motherboard-h97iplus) | $107.24 @ Amazon
**Memory** | [G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskill-memory-f312800cl7d8gbxm) | $82.99 @ Newegg
**Storage** | [Samsung 840 EVO 250GB 2.5" Solid State Drive](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/samsung-internal-hard-drive-mz7te250bw) | $128.99 @ Amazon
**Video Card** | [Asus GeForce GTX 970 4GB STRIX Video Card](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-video-card-strixgtx970dc2oc4gd5) | $349.99 @ Amazon
**Case** | [BitFenix Prodigy (Blue) Mini ITX Tower Case](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/bitfenix-case-bfcpro300bbwkbrp) | $91.55 @ NCIX US
**Power Supply** | [XFX XTR 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/xfx-power-supply-p1650bbefx) | $89.99 @ Newegg
**Operating System** | [Microsoft Windows 8.1 - 64-bit (OEM) (64-bit)](http://pcpartpicker.com/part/microsoft-os-885370635690) | $90.26 @ OutletPC
| | **Total**
| Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available | $1161.00
| Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-10-10 16:58 EDT-0400 |
 
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faelan

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For anyone else considering putting the Asus GTX 970 into a Prodigy, it should fit with 3 cm to spare if I remove the extra drive bays. I don't know if this includes the fans. The Prodigy claims to hold GPUs as long as 317 mm and the Asus GTX 970 is 280 mm.
 
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mdocod

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If you're not overclocking, and not using the iGPU, and debating between that list of CPUs, then the E3-1231V3 should be at the TOP of your list as it offers the performance advantages of the i7 in parallel workloads without the i7 price tag, and equal performance to the i5/i7 option in less threaded workloads.


FYI: Once you buy into a ~$200 or better CPU on the 1150 platform, there will never be a CPU on this platform that can "make it" where your current CPU "breaks it." So just remove from your head any ideas about upgrade potential. The only upgrade path worth taking on an 1150 build will be an upgrade path artificially created by purchasing a low end CPU like an i3/Pentium/Celeron.
 
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faelan

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I hadn't looked at the Xeon processors, is the advantage over the i5 processors the multitasking ability?

Why is there no room to upgrade on the 1150 platform? I'm assuming Intel will eventually create a better processor right?
 
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mdocod

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There will never be a processor released for the 1150 socket platform that is better than a current i5 haswell by a margin large enough to bother upgrading to. Yes, Intel will make new CPUs for the 1150 platform, broadwell, but that's just a die shrink of the existing architecture, like going from Sandy to Ivy bridge. If you bought a Sandy Bridge i5-2400 back when 1155 was the mainstream intel platform, there was never a CPU released thereafter for that platform that represented a significant enough upgrade to bother with on that platform. The same will apply now for this platform.

The Xeon E3-1231V3 is architecturally equal to an i7-4770. It's a hyperthreaded quad core haswell CPU running 3.4/3.8ghz. It offers the same performance advantage over the i5 that the i7 does, derived from hyperthreading. Simply put, Hyperthreading is a feature (no difference in silicon or architecture) that when enabled, allows the scheduler to assign work from 2 different threads on execution ports simultaneously. It is very rare for a single thread to be able to saturate all 8 execution ports in a haswell core, hyperthreading attempts to "fill in" the unused cycles with work from 2 threads simultaneously within the same core, which can have the effect of improving execution throughput per core by up to 25-30% or so, at the cost of requiring 2 threads per core generated by the software to leverage.

This can manifest as better performance in any workloads that generate more than 4 active threads, which could be multi-tasking, or any software which scales well to many-threads.

IMO the E3-1231V3 is the best value high end CPU from Intel at this time for users who will not be using the iGPU anyway.
 
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