Do I need a gigabit ethernet connection?

danageis

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Apr 23, 2014
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So my current network setup is as follows:

50 mbps cable isp from wall coax to docsis 3 modem > N router with 100mbps ethernet ports > 500mbps rated powerline adapters

From the powerline adapters, I have straight ethernet connections (powerline socket > machine) connections to my PC and gaming consoles.

So far, I am relatively happy with my setup. My main question is, would it be worth my while to upgrade to a router/switch to run 1000mbps ethernet across my powerline connection?

I thought that it might be for 2 main reasons, and was wondering if someone more knowledgeable than me could help me out:

1. Right now I am getting pretty consistent ~30-35mbps down on my PC. As I'm paying for 50 I'd like to raise that. I have read that depending on the wiring and other factors powerline can limit bandwidth. If I upgrade from a 100mbps line to a 1000mbps one, could that increase the bandwidth I am getting out of the adapters? (Rated at 500mbps)

2. I dont do much on lan except stream media via dlna to my TV via wired connection. I haven't noticed any problems, but would it be worth it to upgrade to 1000mbps for hd content lan streams?

I hope all of this makes sense and I appreciate any input you all have for me. Thank you very much
 
Solution
You powerline devices are likely your bottleneck at the moment. You could try plugging directly into the router to see if you can get the 50mbs. The ISP always says 50m is the maximum since it is shared between you and many neighbors. Not sure which 500m powerline you have but you will find many sold only have 100m ports. That is almost a outright admission by the vendor that you can't really ever get 500m. These top out about 80m or so but it is very dependent on the house wiring

Until you get a ISP connection above 100m a gig connection will not buy you much. The slowest thing in the path dictates the overall speed. Mostly you would use gig ports on the router if you were say copying files to a NAS. Streaming multiple...
You powerline devices are likely your bottleneck at the moment. You could try plugging directly into the router to see if you can get the 50mbs. The ISP always says 50m is the maximum since it is shared between you and many neighbors. Not sure which 500m powerline you have but you will find many sold only have 100m ports. That is almost a outright admission by the vendor that you can't really ever get 500m. These top out about 80m or so but it is very dependent on the house wiring

Until you get a ISP connection above 100m a gig connection will not buy you much. The slowest thing in the path dictates the overall speed. Mostly you would use gig ports on the router if you were say copying files to a NAS. Streaming multiple uncompressed video you could exceed 100m if you worked at it but in general 100m is enough for streaming data inside your house too.
 
Solution

danageis

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Apr 23, 2014
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Oh wow, yup just looked it up and I've got one with a 100mbps port anyway. I hadn't even thought of that, that seems like some sleezy marketing... Thanks for the quick response! I will have to investigate other problems with my network
 

It's not really sleazy marketing; it's taking advantage of customers' ignorance about the tehcnology.

The 500 mbps rating for the powerline adapter is its link speed, not its data transmission speed. That is, the powerline adapters talk with each other at up to 500 mbps. Due to interference and signal loss from path length, its actual data transmission speed is a lot lower. Exactly like how 802.11n has a link speed of 300-600 mbps, but its actual data transmission speed is closer to 100-150 mbps.

Wireless typically transmits data at 1/3rd to 1/5th its link speed because it has a ton of error correction to guard against RF interference. Powerline is even worse because your house's electrical lines are unshielded. They're basically gigantic antennas picking up every tiny stray bit of RF out there. Your appliances don't care about 100 MHz FM noise in their 60 Hz electricity. But it wreaks havoc with powerline ethernet. That's why they put 100 mbps ethernet ports on it - they knew its real data transmission speed would never be faster than 1/5th its link speed.
 

danageis

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Apr 23, 2014
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Well, I understand your argument but it still seems underhanded to me. Yes, the limitations of the technology should be known by the consumer. But there is a difference from listing a theoretical maximum as a speed, and listing one that is literally unobtainable under any conditions. I do understand that the technology backing the product is cable of 500mbps transmission between powerline adapters, but the company shouldn't be marketing it as 500 if it is only capable of receiving a 100mbps connection in the first place. It is a product specifically for bridging connections in your network, in my opinion to play dumb and listing a speed that is literally unobtainable for your network connection is sleazy. To me, this type of marketing would be akin to a company selling a switch/router with one 1000mbps capable eth port and 4 10mbps ports, and calling it a gigabit ethernet switch. Just my two cents.

Edit: looking back you really summed it up in the first sentence of your post, in general I feel that taking advantage of your customers ignorance is sleazy marketing.
 
Go to www.smallnetbuilder.com and look though the router charts and the powerline charts.

Look how much a "lie" they have on wireless speed compared to tested rates.

They DO market switches like that. PoE is very common to not be able to run full power on all ports. When you look at switch speeds you actually do need to be careful of the rates. Say you have a 48 port gig switch. To really use this the switch needs to be able to pass 48g up and 48g down for a total of 96g of speed. If the back plane can not do this then the switch is not considered non-blocking or wire speed. You must really read the fine print. This used to be a huge issue in cheap consumer switches but now that the parts are so cheap you seldom see a 4 or 8 port switch that is not wire speed. Larger commercial switches though you still have to watch for this....especially on the ones that have 10g ports.
 

The reason I wouldn't go so far as to call it sleazy marketing is because the link speed info is actually useful for us techies. The link speed is an absolute max speed limit imposed by the technology being used. So I know that 500 MHz powerline adapters are using better (newer) tech than 200 MHz powerline adapters. This cannot be fudged by marketing.

The real-life data transfer speed is subject to a ton of variables - distance, background noise, device intercompatibility, wire composition and quality, error correction algorithm used, etc. As there's no standard way to test such speeds, each manufacturer would be free to come up with their own test. One manufacturer might use a really easy test (connect the powerline adapters with 6 inches of high-quality wiring!), while another comes up with a more realistic test (50 ft of 12 gauge wiring). You then you end up in a position where you have to carry this mental mapping - 10 MB/s in brand A is equivalent to 25 MB/s in brand B is equivalent to 3 MB/s in brand C - in order to compare the products.

So really, labeling these things with actual data transfer speed would be more confusing than not labeling them at all. I'd much rather the manufacturer just label the link speed, while I rely on third party reviewers (like smallnetbuilder.com) which test and compare all these products under identical, reproducible conditions. That way I know the MB/s data speeds are comparable between brands.

But I completely agree with you - there should be a huge disclaimer on these things that (for devices operating in noisy environments like powerline or wireless) actual data speeds will be nowhere near the link speed.


As I already mentioned, wireless has a ton of error correction applied to it to make it function in a noisy real-world environment. That's why you typically only get about 1/3 to 1/4 the link speed.

Hard drives actually function the same way. When you save a MB of data, you aren't writing one MB of data to the disk. That single MB becomes probably 1.5-2 MB of data actually written to the platter as magnetic data once all the error correction is applied. The difference is that HDDs operate in a constant environment where the signal's journey - from magnetic fields on the platter to bits sent to your computer - is consistent and constant for the life of the product. That's why you can label HDDs in terms of MB/s data transfer speed.

OTOH, wireless and powerline have to deal with completely inconsistent and always changing environments. So the MB/s data transfer speed is highly unpredictable, while the link speed is still constant.
 


I did not doubt you understood this I put this in for danageis.

Many people have not seen these charts that show real world test numbers....I really wish more people do.

It was only a week ago someone wanted to know if he need 10g ports on his router because the 802.11ac said it could do 3200meg. It is so sad the amount of education it takes to understand what that number really means.