Overclocking i5 4690K High Heat Temps

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510
Im having an issue with high heat temps when overclocking an i5 4690K.
I'm running an ASUS Z97-A motherboard with an i5 4690K CPU. I've installed an enermax Liqtech 240 liquid cooling system on the CPU.
I overclocked the i5 4690K CPU from 3.5GHz stock to 4.0GHz at about 1.15v. The system ran very stable at with my overclocking. Next, I ran prime95 version 24 along with realtemp software and doing small FFTs in my torture test I got core temps of about 60-65C. after reading the posts from here http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-2387010/intel-4690k-temps-voltage.html#xtor=EPR-8809 i took the advice from CompuTronix(i also read through his link to Intel temperature guide) and ran Prime95 version 26.6 and my core temps shot up to 95-100C within 1 minute of torture testing. I was shocked especially since im running the enermax liquid cooling system. I also tried prime95 version 28.5 and my temps were still too high. after those results i lowered my overclock to 3.7GHz and my realtemp software shows the core temps still at 85 - 90C. It seems i possibly have something wrong. Does anyone in the forums here have a suggestion?
I'm considering pulling apart the liquid cooling system and checking the thermal paste but i'm pretty sure i did it correctly.
I've also ordered a corsair h100i cpu liquid cooler to see if that resolves my issue.
Could my CPU be the problem?

Thank you in advanced for your suggestions
 
Solution
I would definitely change out the cooling system.

As far as overclocking and BIOS settings are concerned, unfortunately the terminologies used by different motherboard manufacturers are not standardized, which makes it confusing. You need to read your motherboard manual and perhaps search ASUS's website for details, explanations and definitions specific to your motherboard's BIOS settings.

Please give this a read: 3 Step Guide to Overclock Your i7 / i5 Haswell Platform - http://www.overclockers.com/3step-guide-to-overclock-intel-haswell/

Let me know what happens with your H100i.

Keep in mind that when mounting the water block, there is a known problem with the screws being slightly too long to allow for adequate contact...

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator


Zorac12,

I was watching for you to PM me regarding this thread.

Which of Prime95 version 24?

There are several versions of 24.X.

24.6
24.9
24.10
24.11
24.12
24.13
24.14
24.15

Prime95 Release History - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime95

I need to know so I can test it for you.

Also, what is your ambient temperature?

Thanks,

CT :sol:
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator


MisterSprinkles,

Prime95 version 26.6 is pre-AVX and works fine across all platforms.

Also, AIDA64 is not a blanket solution. In addition to not being freeware, it has issues of it's own.

The CPU test when run individually is well below TDP, and the FPU test when run individually will cause your core temperatures to skyrocket like P95 v28.5. While good for stability testing, it's poorly suited to thermal testing.

Prime95 Small FFT's is a steady-state 100% workload, which makes it ideal for thermal testing.

Prime95's default test, Blend, is a cyclic workload for testing memory stability, and Large FFT's combines CPU and memory tests. As such, Blend and Large FFT's both have cyclic workloads which are unsuitable for CPU thermal testing.

Other stability tests such as Linpack and Intel Burn Test have cycles that peak at 110% workload, and are also unsuitable for CPU thermal testing. The software utility OCCT runs elements of Linpack and Prime95.

Shown above from left to right: Small FFT's, Blend, Linpack and Intel Burn Test.

Note the steady-state thermal signatures of Small FFT's, which allows accurate measurements of Core temperatures.

Shown above from left to right: Small FFT's, Intel Extreme Tuning Utility CPU Test, and AIDA64 CPU Test.

The "Charts" in SpeedFan span 13 minutes, and show how each test creates different thermal signatures. Intel Extreme Tuning Utility is also a cyclic workload. Although AIDA64's CPU test is steady-state, the workload is below Thermal Design Power (TDP), which is insufficient.

Please read this Tom’s Sticky: Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html

Thanks,

CT :sol:
 

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510




CT
Thanks for responding. I apologize for not messaging you and appreciate that you found my new post.
I took a look at prime95 version and it is version 24.13
I dont currently have a measure device for the ambient temp inside the case but i have the covers open and the room temp is 72 degrees F
I can acquire a device and measure the ambient temp soon if it will help

Thank you again for your assistance!
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator
Zorac12,

Room temperature is close enough. Thank you for that information.

P95 v24.13 was a "Test Release" from July, 2005.
P95 v24.14 was a "Release" from August, 2005.

After spending some time searching, I could not find either available to download. However, the oldest available P95 version is 25.11 which was a "Release" from July, 2009 that I downloaded and tested against v26.6.

The results with Small FFT's were identical.

Sorry I wasn't able to download and compare v24.13.

Nevertheless, I think the reason you're reaching 100C "Throttle" temperature with v26.6 as well as 28.5 is due to a problem with your Enermax Liqtech 240 liquid cooling system.

Please check and confirm that the pump and fans are indeed running, and that your water block is properly and securely attached. It's possible that you have a faulty power connection, defective pump or kinked tube. You should also remove your water block to inspect the thermal compound dispersal pattern.

Since you're using Real Temp, please also run Core Temp to confirm "Power" (watts) at idle and during P95 v26.6 Small FFT's. Also use CPU-Z to confirm Core Voltage and Core Speed during Small FFT's.

At idle, if your C-States and power saving features are enabled in BIOS, you should see less 25 to 30C and less than 2 watts in Core Temp. If your idle temperature is elevated to near 40C, this indicates a problem with your cooling system.

With a short 1 minute burst of Small FFT's, you should see your Core Speed begin to "Throttle" in CPU-Z as your Core temperatures approach 100C, and the power approaches TDP (Thermal Design Power), which is 88 watts for you i5 4690K.

If this is your result, it would indicate that there is definitely a problem with your cooling system. If you get a significantly different result, then we'll take a different approach to troubleshooting this problem.

Keep in mind that when this problem is solved, you can expect that P95 v28.5 will still overheat your processor, while v26.6 will not.

Let me know what happens.

Thanks,

CT :sol:
 

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510


thank you for all the information. I appreciate your time on this.
I've loaded the other utilities you advised me to run; however, i am confused when you say "at idle, if your C -States and power saving features are enabled in the BIOS you should see 25-30C and less than 2 Watts" I am uncertain what you mean by C-States and power saving. Please forgive my overclocking ignorance. I can only tell you that i set my Vcore to 1.15 volts and i changed from auto to manual so i could sync all cores and change them to a multiplier of 40. with my base clock at 100 i should get 4.0G. Are you referring to offset or adaptive. I'm am not quite sure how to set these do to my inexperience. If you're referring to those settings for when idle, then i'll need help with that.
I notice with CPUz that in the multiplier box it shows x40 when running prime95 v26.6 and drops to x8 when at idle.
here is what i got with core temp and real temp:
1. (At Idle)with my bios OC CPU Core at x40 and VCore at 1.15volts I got 11 Watts for power and 33-39 degrees between the 4 core temps(33,39,37,34)
2. (Prime95 v26.6 small FFTs)with my bios OC CPU Core at x40 and VCore at 1.15volts I got 80 watts for power and 90-98 degrees between the 4 core temps.

I also used a listening device that amplifies sound to a headset from a metal clamp. I was able to hear the pump but it was difficult to hear any fluid running through the thick rubber tubing on my enermax CPU liquid cooler. I am uncertain if this device is working properly.
I also received a different cooler today that i purchased in an attempt to fix this problem. Its a Corsair H100i. I'm just waiting to see what you say before i proceed with anything else.
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator
I would definitely change out the cooling system.

As far as overclocking and BIOS settings are concerned, unfortunately the terminologies used by different motherboard manufacturers are not standardized, which makes it confusing. You need to read your motherboard manual and perhaps search ASUS's website for details, explanations and definitions specific to your motherboard's BIOS settings.

Please give this a read: 3 Step Guide to Overclock Your i7 / i5 Haswell Platform - http://www.overclockers.com/3step-guide-to-overclock-intel-haswell/

Let me know what happens with your H100i.

Keep in mind that when mounting the water block, there is a known problem with the screws being slightly too long to allow for adequate contact pressure against the CPU. If the water block doesn't feel securely attached or can be wiggled, the fix is to use small "O" rings between the back plate and the screws to correct the problem.

CT :sol:
 
Solution

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510


I am going to move forward with replacing the cooler device with the Corsair then. I'll let you know how it goes. I may also post a snapshot of the paste from the Enermax cooler.
I was looking around the internet and found this information about the intel processors intentional defects creating higher CPU temps. here is the link http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/two-ways-to-cool-down-your-defective-overheating-intel-cpu/
how relevant is this article?

I've removed my enermax cooler and i'll bet ya $100 bucks you're going to tell me my heat paste is completely messed up. I'm attaching some pictures.

IMG_1257_zps0a3kmmu9.jpg


IMG_1256_zpsy17iyaar.jpg


I assume you'll tell me i have too much paste and its not covering enough of the heat die of the CPU. That being said, CT do you have a guide for thermal pasting an intel CPU? I read through your posted link on how to properly thermal paste and it only showed an AMD CPU. Do you have one for an Intel CPU? Will it cover thermal past for a liquid cooler like i have?
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator
Zorac12,

Thank you for that information. I am well aware of Intel's use of TIM in their 3rd and 4th Generation processors.

My Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html - covers the same topic in Section 9 - The 22 Nanometer Problem

Please give it another read, as it covers a great deal of information, and will help you to reach a higher level of understand about your processor temperatures.

CT :sol:
 

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510


CT,
I updated my previous response where i added pictures of my thermal pasting job after pulling apart the liquid cooler and asked for help. I think you missed it. Can you please refresh the thread and take a look at it. I may have found the problem and could really use your input. Thanks again! :D
Thanks
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator
Zorac12,

Also present in my Temp Guide in Section 14 - Improving Temperatures is the following:

Concerning Thermal Interface Material (TIM), here's some helpful links:

Thermal Paste Comparison, Part One: Applying Grease And More - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/thermal-paste-heat-sink-heat-spreader,3600.html

Thermal Paste Comparison, Part Two: 39 Products Get Tested - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/thermal-paste-performance-benchmark,3616.html

Personally, I use the short edge of a business card to very carefully apply a thin, even coat by troweling out the thermal compound in four directions until there are no bubbles, lines or imperfections.

Although most people don't have the patience required for this method, I've never had a problem with temperatures, and the contact dispersal pattern has always been perfect with 100% coverage.

CT :sol:
 

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510



Im just posting an update to where i am with this entire problem since it's been awhile. I've been delayed in installing my new CPU cooler (Corsair H100i). I will have it done in a few days. I'll be posting my results soon after that. thanks for your patience. I wanted you to know i haven't abandoned my postings in this thread. I just had a delay.
 

Zorac12

Reputable
Jan 28, 2015
11
0
4,510


CT I've picked your suggestion of changing out the water cooler as the solution. you were correct. That Enermax Liqtech 240 was not cooling the CPU. The H100i works great. Here are my new OC results
1. (Prime95 v26.6 small FFTs)with my bios OC CPU Core at x45 and VCore at 1.2 volts I got core temps of (58, 64, 58, 58). Core2 seems to run a bit hotter than the rest but i am assuming that is an acceptable temp according to your temperature guide yes?

Thank you for all your help, links, advice. It has been my pleasure to have worked with you. It's been a difficult problem for me and you made my life easier. I have much appreciation toward you. Thanks

one more question please. Can i OC a little bit higher or should i remain satisfied due to the bit higher temps of core2? is it not recommended to go higher?
 

CompuTronix

Intel Master
Moderator
Zorac12,

If your ambient temperature was still 72F (22C) when you ran P95 v26.6 Small FFT's, then you definitely have headroom to run a higher Vcore and overclock. Crank it up another 100Mhz, which will require a corresponding increase of approximately 40 to 50 millivolts (0.040 to 0.050) to maintain stability, then repeat the Small FFT's test.

Depending on ambient temperature and stability, this would suggest that your present O/C of 4.5 @ 1.2 @ high 50's could be increased to:

4.6 @ 1.24 @ high 60's
or possibly;
4.7 @ 1.28 @ high 70's

Also, it's typical for the 2nd Core to run higher than it's neighbors. The physical layout explains it:

IGPU - Inactive (Cool)
Core 0 - Active (Warm; cool neighbor on one side)
Core 1 - Active (Warmest; sandwiched between warm neighbors)
Core 2 - Active (Warmer)
Core 3 - Active (Warm; end of Die, no neighbor on one side)

Let's revisit some basic information from the Intel Temperature Guide:

" ... Core temperature is 5C higher than CPU temperature due to sensor location. Intel's Thermal Specification is "Tcase", which is CPU temperature, not Core Temperature. Tcase for the popular i5 4690K is 72C.

Tcase + 5 makes the corresponding Core temperature 77C..." <-- This is your spec.

The rule is; don't exceed 1.300 Vcore, keep your P95 v26.6 Small FFT's average Core temperature under 80C at 22C ambient and you'll be fine.

CT :sol: