Upgrading GPU, i5-3570k, 8GB RAM, SSD, 650W psu

zdeno84

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Hi Everyone,

upgrading my GPU this or next month. I built the pc 2 years ago to play Witcher 2 at ultra settings (have HD7870 now). I know there will be announcements soon, I am more looking at which of the existing cards to go for as I am a bit unsure (GTX 970, 980 or 980ti). I sit around a meter and half from 55' 1080p TV when I play games, so I appreciate the quality of detail I get. I don't want to do compromises on anything, but at the same time don't feel like spending money on something I don't actually need.

The new GPU should be:
- able to play Witcher 3 with hairworks ON and everything maxed. At steady 60 fps, I'm fine with occasional drop to ~50. Same for Shadows of Mordor and Dragon Age Inquisition (I'm an RPG guy). Seems AMD is not capable to run the Witcher 3 with hairworks atm.
- play games in 3D, especially the Witcher 2. I heard Nvidia has some 3D you can turn on for most games, which AMD doesn't have. Trine 1,2 in 3D are awesome.
- have enough VRAM to last for the next 2 years. I know this is a difficult call.
- no SLI
- as quiet as possible

As it stands, I don't want another AMD because of the Witcher 3 and 3D points from above. Have read many benchmarks and it seems 970 is not sufficient either (which I thought it will be originally).

So, the questions are - is 980 the right card to get to meet above requirements? Or is 970 actually good enough? Or the 980ti 6GB VRAM being safer bet for next 2-3 years.

Thx
 

zdeno84

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well, I have Sony KDL-55W815. It seems to support several 3D modes and recognized Trine 2 running in 3D automatically. How do I check if it supports NVidia 3D Vision without actually running a Nvidia GPU?

I also think 980 is reasonable. I don't want to wait further for price drops (not more than month-two the max) on 980ti. The only benchmark for 980ti didn't even consider 1080p, it seems to be an overkill for this resolution. But will definitely wait to see what AMD announces and first benchmarks to follow.
 
Witcher 3, 1080p, everything on including Hairworks, 50-60fps, no SLI? Not going to happen. Doubly so with Hairworks on.

You say you've read through the benchmarks, but I've not a single benchmark where even a GTX980 can hit 60 fps average at ultra without Hairworks, and Hairworks delivers a heavy performance hit (~20%) on nVidia (that becomes massive on AMD).

One set of benchmarks - 1080p/ultra/no Hairworks, GTX980 gives 28 fps min, 56 fps average.
Another set - same settings, GTX980 gives 46 fps min, 49 fps average.
Another set - same settings, GTX980 gives 60 fps average but with drops into the teens that they describe as "jarring".
Some 980Ti benchmarks] - 56 fps average @1080p/ultra, 46 fps minimum.

The best you can do right now for Witcher 3 1080p/ultra is a GTX980Ti and living with ~40-60 fps and no Hairworks. In short, for what you want you'll have to wait a year or two. Or wait to see if they optimise the game much.
 
AMD doesn't need Hairworks. AMD has a great implementation of tessellation, which works just fine in Witcher 3.

http://wccftech.com/witcher-3-run-hairworks-amd-gpus-crippling-performance/
http://wccftech.com/amd-announces-witcher-3-hairworks-performance-fix-catalyst-control-center-driver-coming-boost-tessellation-performance/

Now, I say these things not because I am an AMD fanboy. I have a Nvidia GTX 770 in my system, which I built 13 months ago.

No, the reason I say these things is that first off, AMD video cards can and do run Hairworks well. You just have to change the setting. Second, AMD created TressHair. Years ago. And when they created it, they optimized it so that TressHair worked equally well on both AMD and Nvidia cards. And then, to top things off, they posted the source code for TressHair online, for anyone to see and use. Somewhere about the same timeframe, Nvidia started working on Hairworks. In the version of Hairworks in Witcher 3, not only does Hairworks not run well on most video cards by default, but Nvidia makes the developers of anyone that uses their Hairworks sign an agreement forbidding them from optimising the code for any competitors hardware, and here is the hilarious part Hairworks only runs well on Nvidia Maxwell GPU's. Even Nvidia Titan fails to run Hairworks well, as does last generation GTX 700 series cards, and all older ones. So it appears that Hairworks ONLY optimised for Nvidia Maxwell GPU's. Everyone else is screwed over.

Now, back to TressHair for a second. TressHair, which runs equally well on both AMD and Nvidia hardware, runs faster on Nvidia hardware than Hairworks does. So why is Nvidia insisting on running inferior code that screws over so many customers of both their own cards and all AMD cards. Or at least it tries to.

The difference here between how AMD played the game, and how Nvidia plays it is disturbing. It is playing dirty. This is an industry where we need our graphic cards to be able to run everything well. If we cannot get that, then we are going to have to buy two video cards, and start swapping out the video card to match who the game is optimized for, which would be insanity.

So somehow, we have to get the message to Nvidia that they need to play the game fairly.
 

zdeno84

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Yes, I have seen the techspot and eurogamer ones. But still, the Hairworks looks too good to be OFF I think.

I remember playing DarkSouls at 30fps first on PC and then I modded it to run at 60fps. It was a massive difference. But that was solid 30fps vs solid 60fps experience.
How is it if you have jumps from 60 to 30 fps and back, is it too noticeable?

[EDIT] also the techspot says you gain like 5fps on 980 with game patch 1.03. That will bring it with hairworks on to 60avg / 30min fps. Might be if some other setting are toned down from ultra to high (e.g. draw distance), it could get to 40min fps with hairworks on.

 

zdeno84

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thanks for the link. only lists mitsubishi tvs though.
I think Eurogamer checked the amd 15.5 driver and it wasn't much of an improvement (like couple of %). But you can use tesselation option in AMD Catalyst center to ofset the Hairworks impact a bit.

 

zdeno84

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OK, I am somehow set on getting 980 and OC it or 980ti, might be a last min decision. Have seen a video comparing it with ultra/Hairworks and it seems 980 gets ~50fps, 980ti ~60fps.

What I am unsure now is how do the reference vs custom coolers perform? I like my pc quiet first and foremost.

The reference seems 20-30e cheaper than cheapest custom coolers, but I heard they are much better than AMD reference cards.
Am I fine buying reference design?
Thanks
 

zdeno84

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I don't have a GTX970 and my mobo doesn't support SLI as I prefer one card over multi-setup.

Anyway - no thought on reference vs custom coolers for Nvidia 980s?