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5ghz router running on U-NII-1 and U-NII-2/2e bands, not only on U-NII-1. Need more than 4 non-overlapping bands :)

I live in Europe and I need a solid 5ghz router for home use. My laptop has a 2.4+5ghz wi-fi card. I want to be on 5ghz cos all neighbours are using 2.4ghz and the interference is immense. So I bought the ASUS RT-N53 2.4+5ghz router but on the 5ghz band it has only 4 channels to choose between, which means the router only uses the U-NII-1 band allowing channels - 36, 40, 44, and 48 (if there's a way to allow the router to use U-NII-2 and 2e, pls share it with me). Well, that's 4 channels, as compared to the 3 non-overlapping channels in 2.4ghz. 4 is more than 3, but still I was quite disappointed when I found out that my newly-bought 5ghz router allows me to pick between only 4 non-overlapping channels. Still, I shouldn't get too worries cos ppl around haven't even found out about 5ghz, but I am writing all this for the sake of knowledge. Mine and perhaps ... somebody else's. If I can't make my Asus RT-N53 to use the U-NII-2/2e, then I want to buy another 5ghz router that runs both on the U-NII-1 & U-NII-2/2e. So far I have not been able to see that info clearly displayed in the specs of 5ghz routers. Perhaps I am missing something, but if you guys know something ... pls share it with me :)

So, as any proper nerd would do, I started digging and found the following bits of info:

http://www.connectblue.com/press/articles/what-is-the-difference-between-24ghz-and-5ghz-wireless-lan-in-industrial-applications/ ; found also here http://www.connectblue.com/fileadmin/Connectblue/Web2006/Images/Press_Image_downloads/Articles/2.4_and_5GHz_Wireless_LAN_in_Industrial_Applications.pdf

The 5GHz ISM band is divided up into sub-bands called U-NII bands (Unlicensed National Information Infrastructure) and are usually named U-NII-1, U-NII-2, U-NII-2e, and U-NII-3 where U-NII-3 is not freely available worldwide. In total, this gives 23 non-overlapping channels... Today, most available Wireless LAN solutions in the 5GHz band use the U-NII-1 band (5.18-5.24 GHz) with frequency channels 36-48. However, there are also some suppliers that have extended the range to include the U-NII-2/2e band (5.26-5.70 GHz) with frequency channels 52-140. ... The use of Wireless LAN in the U-NII-2/2e bands (channel 52 -140, frequency range 5.260––5.725GHz) requires radar detection. Within the operation context of the Dynamic Frequency Selection (DFS) function ...

This source also sheds some light onto the topic
http://superuser.com/questions/692835/which-5ghz-channel-to-use

Pls add some comments and suggestions as to 5ghz routers running not only on the U-NII-1 band, but also on U-NII-2/2e. 10x in advance :)
13 answers Last reply Best Answer
More about 5ghz router running nii nii bands nii overlapping bands
  1. anyone???
  2. HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO ???????????????????????
  3. Best answer
    Not sure how much of what you posted you actually understand. All this is related to the DFS problem and stuff like weather radar.

    You can only set channels manually that are allowed in your country and are not subject to DFS regulations. The ones allowed but subject to DFS the router itself must see if they are allowed and constantly monitor for interference. So if you run it on auto the router might use some of the other channels.

    Third party software like dd-wrt lets you change some of this stuff.... like setting the country code to something like russia that has few restrictions.

    The FCC and EU have been discussing for a while forcing the wireless chip manufactures to prevent you from being able to do this. The fear is that the chipset manufactures will solve this by no longer providing drivers instead of manufacturing different chips.

    Going to 5g may help for a bit but there still is not enough radio bandwidth even if you can use all the channels possible. 802.11ac will use all 4 of the radio channels just for 1 person. The newer tri band routers that have 2 5g radios use 2 blocks of 4 channels. If they ever figure it out the newest version of 802.11ac will use 8 channels for 1 user.
  4. Thank you for the reply! I think I have a somewhat good understanding of the subject matter. All I am asking for is a list of 5ghz routers or at least a few, or even just 1 (give me the brand, make, model, whatever) that runs on the UNII 2 and 2e bands also, not only on UNII1. So far all the 5ghz routers I've found were hardware limited to UNII 1 band only, which means they only have 4 non-overlapping channels. It is clear that in Europe the UNII 1, 2, and 2e are allowed. And as far as I know, in Europe, the 2 and 2e bands are subject to DFS. OK, so be it. What I am clearly asking for is a router allowing me to use the 2 and 2e bands whenever possible. And should there be the need to switch me to UNII 1, then I am fine with DFS doing that. So I need a router that is hardware capable of using the UNII2 and 2e bands. I don't care that due to military, weather, etc reasons DFS will automatically switch my channels to the UNII1 band.

    bill001g said:
    Not sure how much of what you posted you actually understand. All this is related to the DFS problem and stuff like weather radar.

    You can only set channels manually that are allowed in your country and are not subject to DFS regulations. The ones allowed but subject to DFS the router itself must see if they are allowed and constantly monitor for interference. So if you run it on auto the router might use some of the other channels.

    Third party software like dd-wrt lets you change some of this stuff.... like setting the country code to something like russia that has few restrictions.

    The FCC and EU have been discussing for a while forcing the wireless chip manufactures to prevent you from being able to do this. The fear is that the chipset manufactures will solve this by no longer providing drivers instead of manufacturing different chips.

    Going to 5g may help for a bit but there still is not enough radio bandwidth even if you can use all the channels possible. 802.11ac will use all 4 of the radio channels just for 1 person. The newer tri band routers that have 2 5g radios use 2 blocks of 4 channels. If they ever figure it out the newest version of 802.11ac will use 8 channels for 1 user.
  5. Many of the asus routers do have this feature, I am not sure if the one you have does. I would load the latest firmware since asus now uses a common code base. You might also load the merlin asus firmware since that is their dd-wrt versioin.

    The problem is you will never be able to tell from the configuration screens. You will be allowed to set the non DFS channels or AUTO. The problem with AUTO is it will always prefer the non DFS channels before it even attempts to use the other ones. You can not with configuration option force the device to use DFS channels...that is part of the DFS rules.

    You would have to somehow make the router think that all the non DFS channels were not the best choice by doing something like putting strong signals on all the non DFS channels.
  6. Thanks! That's a good reply on your part. About ASUS - I know for certain that their 'RT-N53 Dual-band Wireless-N600 Router' and the 'ASUS RT-AC52U' and 'ASUS RT-AC51U' are 100% hardware limited to UNII1 ONLY! I have talked to ASUS about all 3 routers and they confirmed to me that the routers cannot use UNII2 or 2e. So I am not sure which ASUS routers you were referring to then ... it seems to be a trend with their routers, so ...

    Dont know what 'asus now uses a common code base' means. How can that help me use UNII 2 and 2e?

    Any links to 'merlin asus firmware' and is it certain that with dd-wrt I can switch to UNII2 or 2e?

    Do you mean that I'll never be able to tell what band I use from the config screens when I'm using the merlin asus or dd-wrt or in general or what? Or was that only for ASUS routers or for all 5ghz routers. If so then what's the point with 5ghz ... when on 2.4ghz we have 3 non-overlapping channels and now on 5ghz it seems we only have 4 ... not that much after all. Well, in US its nice cos they have the UNII3 also but not in Europe.

    bill001g said:
    Many of the asus routers do have this feature, I am not sure if the one you have does. I would load the latest firmware since asus now uses a common code base. You might also load the merlin asus firmware since that is their dd-wrt versioin.

    The problem is you will never be able to tell from the configuration screens. You will be allowed to set the non DFS channels or AUTO. The problem with AUTO is it will always prefer the non DFS channels before it even attempts to use the other ones. You can not with configuration option force the device to use DFS channels...that is part of the DFS rules.

    You would have to somehow make the router think that all the non DFS channels were not the best choice by doing something like putting strong signals on all the non DFS channels.
  7. It generally is not a hardware limitation it is software. The radio chips themselves support multiple regions. You will see the same router sold in russia many times with the same exact part number.

    Since it appears you are willing to dig though technical documentation. Start with this site.
    https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Main_Page

    It will give you lots of information about the chipsets. It also provides links to the fcc licensing documents filed for these devices.

    The router firmware sends messages to the radio chipset drivers telling it what region to run in.

    If the chipset actually has the DFS support or not takes a lot of digging but it has become a much more common feature.

    The problem with DFS is you can not configure it. The only way I can think they can meet the rules is a configuration screen that says run "auto" and then another screen that says do not use channels 36,40,44,48. This would mean the router would only search DFS channels.

    The only way I have seen it when you happen to see a router sending ssid beacons on one of the restricted channels. It appears almost to be pure luck if the routers decide to use these.

    .....the common solution to this is to set the region to russia and then the configuration menus allow you to set any of the channels directly.
  8. I can only find where to set the time zone, not the region in my settings for my asus router ... will dig deeper, but so far anothing.
  9. Nothing ... cannot find where to change the region to Russia on my ASUS RT-N53. I don't know where you have this information from but from ASUS they told me that it is a hardware limitation for the ASUS RT-N53 router to only use UNII-1. So ... I guess that is why I cannot find where to change the region to Russia.

    Ok, and even if I have a router on which I can change the region to Russia will the router then allow me to use the UNII2 and 2e bands despite weather and military interferences?
  10. You likely will have to load a different firmware image. The image you have loaded is likely does not support what you want. DD-WRT, tomato,open-wrt all have options to set the region.
  11. OK. If I load any of those then I'll be able to choose Russia and then will see more channels than the current UNII-1 ones. So far so good. Once I'm there, will the router actually use the UNII-2 and 2e channels or will it still prefer the UNII-1 ones?
  12. If it runs in auto mode it seem to always prefer the non dfs channels not sure this is done by the chipset itself not the router firmware. The router firmware just set a variable in the radio chipset.
  13. I just spoke to ASUS and they told me that only some of their routers run also on the unii2 and 2e bands. They even gave me a list ... so yes. it turns out it is a hardware limitation. Why otherwise would they give me a list of devices capable of running on the unii2 and 2e?

    Still ... i'll try other firmware such as tomato or asus merlin or whatever and will see if this way i can somehow change channels to anything other than the unii1 band. will also try your tip about selecting Russia as region ...
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