New workstation build for cgi and rendering

Karribu

Distinguished
Jun 24, 2006
111
0
18,680
Hi guys,

Looking to replace my old computer with a more workstation orientated build, can you help?

Approximate Purchase Date: Next few weeks.

Budget Range: Around £2000 - £2500 after tax/shipping (possibly could go to 3k)

System Usage from Most to Least Important: CGI modeling, texturing. Video editing, surfing, little bit of gaming.

Are you buying a monitor: No. Have a HP w2207h – Any opinions?

Do you need to buy OS: No, will be using a Linux OS.

Preferred Website(s) for Parts: Ebuyer (www.ebuyer.com) & Amazon (www.amazon.co.uk)

Location: UK

Parts Preferences: Definitely an Nvidia card. To be honest I'm not sure if some sort of Quadro or Titan perhaps. As I understand Quadro is for professional studios and wasted on Indie film makers like myself, that true? Besides I can see in a lot of benchmarks that gaming GPU's seem to beat Quadro's on rendering time and still giving decent view-port speed.

I would like as much memory as possible. I've had good luck with Corsair and Kingston in the past but I'm open to other brands.

Overclocking: Nope.

SLI or Crossfire: No.

Your Monitor Resolution: 1680 x 1050 – Might add another monitor if budget allows it.

Additional Comments: Software – Blender, Mari, Krita, phtoshop, Lightworks, Natron/Nuke

And Most Importantly, Why Are You Upgrading: Can't carry on with my projects due to my computer being about 6 years old and powered by mice which must have passed away judging by current system problems. Need a better computer If I'm going to get anywhere.

Include a list of any parts you have already selected with descriptively labeled links for parts.

I'm not 100% about workstation builds, I could just get by with gaming rigs but here is what I'm thinking so far...

Case: Corsair Special Edition White 600T Graphite Series Case (£117.48)
http://www.ebuyer.com/259401-corsair-special-edition-white-600t-graphite-series-case-cc600twm-wht

Motherboard: Asus X99-DELUXE Socket 2011-v3 8 Channel Audio ATX Motherboard (£319.64)
http://www.ebuyer.com/662001-asus-x99-deluxe-socket-2011-v3-8-channel-audio-atx-motherboard-x99-deluxe

CPU: Intel Xeon E5-2640 Socket 2011 2.50GHz 15MB L3 Cache (£738.70)
http://www.ebuyer.com/350031-intel-xeon-e5-2640-socket-2011-2-50ghz-15mb-l3-cache-retail-boxed-processor-bx80621e52640

Memory: Hyperx Fury Black 32GB (4x8GB Kit) 2666MHz DDR4 Non-ECC CL15 DIMM (£181.29)
http://www.ebuyer.com/702791-hyperx-fury-black-32gb-4x8gb-kit-2666mhz-ddr4-non-ecc-cl15-dimm-hx426c15fbk4-32

GPU: PNY NVIDIA Quadro K4200 4GB GDDR5 Dual DVI DisplayPort PCI-E Graphics card (£847.00)
http://www.ebuyer.com/660346-pny-nvidia-quadro-k4200-4gb-gddr5-dual-dvi-displayport-pci-e-graphics-card-vcqk4200-pb

or

GPU: EVGA GTX Titan X 12GB GDDR5 DVI HDMI 3 DisplayPort PCI-E Graphics Card (£819.99)
http://www.ebuyer.com/706073-evga-gtx-titan-x-12gb-gddr5-dvi-hdmi-3-displayport-pci-e-graphics-12g-p4-2990-kr

SSD: Do I need one on a workstation?

HDD: WD RE 2TB 3.5 SAS Internal hard drive (£128.80)
http://www.ebuyer.com/414269-wd-re-2tb-3-5-sas-internal-hard-drive-wd2001fyyg

PSU: Corsair RM 650W Fully Modular 80+ Gold Power Supply (£95.88)
http://www.ebuyer.com/545317-corsair-rm-650w-fully-modular-80-gold-power-supply-cp-9020054-uk

DVD Drive: Samsung SH-224DB 24X Internal DVD Writer with SATA - Retail Boxed (£11.99)
http://www.ebuyer.com/516900-samsung-sh-224db-24x-internal-dvd-writer-with-sata-retail-boxed-sh-224fb-rsms

Total with Quadro = £2440.78
Total with Titan = £2413.77

What do you guys feel about this?

Kind regards
Andrew
 
Solution


Andrew,

It's difficult to make a choice without knowing quite a lot about all the software used, the priorities, size of projects, and etc. You might first do a bit of research into the particulars of the software you're using, checking the makers' GPU recommendations or specialised forums. There are more applications that are beginning to use OpenCL / DirectX, but if you have Autodesk or Adobe programs, especially 3ds and Maya. So...

kanewolf

Titan
Moderator
If you are going to start with that motherboard, you need to pick from these CPUs -- https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/X99DELUXE/HelpDesk_CPU/
I believe the CPU you picked is NOT a V3 version and is not on the supported list.

I would get a 250GB SSD. It will improve everything.

You picked a SAS drive, I don't think that motherboard supports SAS disks.
 

Karribu

Distinguished
Jun 24, 2006
111
0
18,680
How about this for the motherboard

Asus X99-E WS Workstation Motherboard (Intel X99, DDR4, S-ATA 600, CEB, 1 x M.2, Quad Strength Graphic Power, 12K Hours Capacitors, Socket 2011-v3)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/X99-E-WS-Workstation-Motherboard-Capacitors/dp/B00NJGJJE0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1439065546&sr=8-1&keywords=x99-e+ws

There was a version with usb 3.0 too but it's like a hundred quid more o.0

And this for the HD

WD RE 2TB 3.5" 7200rpm 64MB SATA 6Gb/s Enterprise hard Drive
http://www.ebuyer.com/407048-wd-re-2tb-3-5-7200rpm-64mb-sata-6gb-s-enterprise-hard-drive-wd2000fyyz
 

Karribu

Distinguished
Jun 24, 2006
111
0
18,680
Yeah I'm comfortable with it. To be honest It will probably be duel booted with windows 7 and Arch.

Linux is the most popular choice of professional artists in the vfx industry with Redhat Linux being the most popular choice.

I just don't have much experience with workstations
 

kanewolf

Titan
Moderator
The CPU you are choosing is capable of running in a dual socket motherboard. You are paying extra for that but are using a single socket motherboard. You could potentially save cash by using an E5-1xxx V3 CPU. They are not dual socket compatible. Study the supported CPU list like I linked to on the one motherboard and if you want detailed specs for a specific CPU go to http://ark.intel.com/ and put in the model info.
 


Andrew,

For your uses, in my view, the current best cost / performance platform is a workstation is a Xeon E5-1600- series v3 on an X99 motherboard, with a Quadro GPU in the case of Autodesk, Adobe, and Dessualt (Solidworks , Catia) visualization applications or a Firepro if it's scientific/ calculation-based. the performance pririity should be for the workstation use, but this means that the game experience also should be reasonably good as well. When the use is mostly 3D modeling, CPU speed becomes a priority over number of cores. If rendering is the priority the balance may be better with slightly reduced clock speed but more cores/ threads. In any event, using an E5-2600 -series is not cost efficient as there is cost in having the dual CPU version. If you're using GPU-based rendering, fewer and faster cores are better, but rendering is one of the limited applications that can use every core.

With this is mind, here is a idea for a system that should have good performance for the cost for your uses;

BambiBoom PixelCannon Cadamodarendergrapharific iWork TurboBlast ExtremeSignature SuperModel 8000 ®©$$™®£™©™_ 8.9.15

1. CPU: Intel Xeon E5-1650 v3 Six-Core Processor 3.5 / 3.8GHz 0GT/s 15MB LGA 2011-v3 CPU > £614 (Amazon.uk)

http://ark.intel.com/products/82765/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1650-v3-15M-Cache-3_50-GHz

http://www.amazon.com/XEON-E5-1650V3-6C-3-5G-15MB/dp/B00MU045JU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1411580728&sr=8-1&keywords=E5-1650+v3

2. Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO CPU cooler > £26.05 Scan.UK

3. Motherboard: Asus X99-E WS, Intel X99, S 2011-3, DDR4, SATA III 6Gb/s, SATA RAID, PCIe 3.0 (x16), CEB> (£391. Scan.UK)

____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/asus-x99-e-ws-intel-x99-s-2011-3-ddr4-sata-iii-6gb-s-sata-raid-pcie-30-%28x16%29-ceb

4. Crucial 32GB (4 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM ECC DDR4 2133 (PC4-17000) Server Memory Model CT2K8G4RFS4213 > £276 Scan.UK)(£69 ea)

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/8gb-crucial-ddr4-server-memory-pc4-17000-%282133%29-288-pins-ecc-unbuffered-cas-15-12v

5. GPU: PNY Quadro K4200 VCQK4200-PB 4GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 Workstation Video Card > > £792 ( Scan.UK)

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/pny-nvidia-quadro-k4200-4gb-workstation-pcie-graphics-card-with-2xdp-dvi-plus-2-years-extended-warra

6. Samsung M.2 (2280) 850 EVO 500GB SATA SSD Solid State Drive> $113 (OS, applications, working files) > $186 > £150 (Scan.UK)

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/500gb-samsung-850-evo-m2-%282280%29-ssd-sata3-6gb-s-samsung-mgx-3d-v-nand-read-540mb-s-write-500mb-s-97k

7. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $75 (£57.18 Scan UK) (Files, Backup, System Image)

8. CORSAIR HX Series HX750 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI CrossFire 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply New 4th Gen CPU Certified Haswell Ready £119.70 (Scan.UK)

9. Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE 24X SATA DVD±RW Internal Drive w/o Software (Black) SH-224DB $17.99

10. Corsair Obsidian 750D Large Tower Case Black with Side Window No PSU > £124.50 Scan UK)

____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/corsair-obsidian-750d-black-full-tower-case-aluminium-steel-with-side-window-3x140mm-fans-usb-30-e-a

11. Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit w/ SP1 (1-Pack, DVD), OEM MSFQC04649 > $138.99 (£119.70 Scan U.K)

________________________________________________________

TOTAL = £2690

Cheers,

BambiBoom

1. HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 / 4.0GHz > 32GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K4200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB (9SSDSC2BP480G4R5) > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > 600W PSU> Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 5064 > CPU= 13989 / 2D= 819 / 3D= 4596 / Mem= 2772 / Disk= 4555] [Cinebench R15 > CPU = 1014 OpenGL= 126.59 FPS] 7.8.15

2. Dell Precision T5500 (2011) > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro K2200 (4GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB / WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > 875W PSU > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1080)
[ Passmark system rating = 3490 / CPU = 9178 / 2D= 685 / 3D= 3566 / Mem= 1865 / Disk= 2122] [Cinebench 15 > CPU = 772 OpenGL= 99.72 FPS] 7.8.15
 



Karribu,

There is a lot of good logic in using the E5-1650 as in all the series has been consistently probably the best bargain in Xeons from a cost /benefit standpoint. The E5-2600 series are essential for very high performance / high capacity multiithreaded applications, but there are complication in their design and configuration to allow them to be used in pairs so they are necessarily more expensive for the same core count / clock speed.

Your list is very good, and I like your choice for the case- I trend to like very stodgy industrial-looking cases. You might look into the noise-producing aspects of this kind of case as the fan arrangement may put fans on the front panel. That's one advantage of proprietary systems in that they use somewhat interior, remote-mounted, shrouded fans to control noise. The HP z420 I use is almost undetectable running and even the 2011 Dell Pecision T5500 is reasonably quiet.

GPU selection: the most difficult choice of all:

The choice of GPU at this level is always difficult, becaase the software is all over the map in terms of optimization. Some programmes like Solidworks will hardly run on a GTX. This is an older review - 2013, but very telling as regards GTX vs. Quadro / Firepro:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-workstation-graphics-card,3493-8.html

> and in this chart of Maya perofrmance, a $175 Firepro V3900 works far better than a $1,000 Titan. This is due to the OpenGL perormance of workstation cards- as compared to OpenCL and Direct X whihc emphasize in effect image quantity - FPS in games- to the image quality which has to do with finishing rendering every frame. When effects processing in video, a GTX will take a "good enough" approach to the rendering to try and blast it through faster. There is also the important question of viewport support in programs like 3ds and Maya and GTX are terrible trying to do it. in it. I tried a GTX 285 which had the same 512-bit GPU as a Quadro FX5800 (4GB) and I never had a useable rendering from it, -it would crash 90% into the work, or it had a rain of tiny black lines, bizarre shadows and so on. I bought a Quadro FX4800 (1.5GB) and all was solved. In Solidworks not only did the viewports almost not work- took forever to regen, I needed to snap a tangent to a torus, and at x8 anti-aliasing, it could not display the proper points. I ran a Solidworks driver with x128 anti-aliasing and besides the viewports becoming synchronized, I could do any object snap accurately and of course renderings at higher resolutions level are fantastic as the textures look integrated into smooth, curved forms rather than sort of ragged mats sitting on top on polygons.

Quadros are expensive, but for professional visualization work, especially using Autodesk, Adobe, Dessault (Solidworks /Catia) I think a Xeon > ECC RAM > Quadro is essential. If you're doing more calculation orietned work, then Firepro. I found with the recent purchase of a Quadro K4200(4GB) that at that level, they can do any visualisations at suitable speed.

HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 / 4.0GHz > 32GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K4200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB (9SSDSC2BP480G4R5) > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > 600W PSU> Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 5064 > CPU= 13989 / 2D= 819 / 3D= 4596 / Mem= 2772 / Disk= 4555] [Cinebench R15 > CPU = 1014 OpenGL= 126.59 FPS] 7.8.15

With Quadro K2200:
[ Passmark Rating = 4918 > CPU= 13941 / 2D= 823 / 3D= 3463 / Mem= 2668 / Disk= 4764]

> and the results on Passmark, which I believe is somewhat weighted to gaming grpahicsand comparing the 3D results, the Quadro K4200 is comparable to a GTX 760- not a screamer in comparison to a GTX 980, but reasonable. The Cinebench results which include OpenGL at 126 FPS is very encouraging.

In the end, my idea is to choose the GPU for the largest possible project in the most demanding programme and if there will ever be an OpenGL and/ or viewport programme on he system, it needs a Quadro or Firepro.

Sorry to ramble on so, but there are quite a number of PCr users that, having not used prefessional visualisation prgrammes, seem to consider workstation GPU's a kind of marketing trick to steal from unsuspecting consumers, when in reality, content creation hardware is quite different from that for content consumption.
_____________________________

And, sorry to bring this up so late in a long post, but I might mention one other option to have a very high cost /performance level of system:

DELL PRECISION T7610 Barebone Workstation ! Build your own System !! > £226.23

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DELL-PRECISION-T7610-Barebone-Workstation-Build-your-own-System-/321567999837?hash=item4adef2475d

This system will support dual Xeon E5-2600 v2series. Besides being a extremely low cost for a case, motherboard, CPU cooler, and 1300W PSU- costing less than the motherboard alone- you only need to plug in the CPU, RAM, GPU, and drives.

Start with one, used E5-2600 v2, for example, an E5-2667 v2 ( 8-core @ 3.3 /4.0GHz) :

http://ark.intel.com/products/75273

Intel Xeon E5-2667 v2 (#2011-96) 3.3GHz 25MB 8GT/s SR19W LGA2011 CPU Processor > £969.52
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Intel-Xeon-E5-2667-v2-2011-96-3-3GHz-25MB-8GT-s-SR19W-LGA2011-CPU-Processor-/291484021229?hash=item43ddcd31ed

> Yes, very expensive, but notice the clock speed, the number of cores, and the ability to add second one in future. After this £1300 expenditure, you need only add the RAM, GPU, and drives .

(4X ) 8GB SK Hynix 2Rx8 PC3-14900E DDR3 1866 ECC Server Memory RAM HMT41GU7AFR8C-RD > £129 (£32.29 each)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8GB-SK-Hynix-2Rx8-PC3-14900E-DDR3-1866-ECC-Server-Memory-RAM-HMT41GU7AFR8C-RD-/231625596849?hash=item35edf61fb1

> and :

1X Nvidia Quadro K5200 8GB GPU Monitor Graphics Card > £826.71
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1X-Nvidia-Quadro-K5200-8GB-GPU-Monitor-Graphics-Card-/181818608931?hash=item2a553bcd23

> and

Samsung 850 EVO 500GB 2.5 Inch SATA3 SSD/Solid State Drive > £145.02 (Scan UK)
Western Digital WD3003FZEX 3TB Black SATA 3 Performance Hard Drive - HDD > £126.36 (scan UK)


£226.23
£120 (guessing shipping of T7610 US to UK)
£969.52
£826.71
£145.02
£126.36
______________________
£2415

And you thereby have an 8-core /16 thread @ 3.3 /4.0GHZ / 32GB, Quadro K5200 (8GB)(The T7610 can use 3! of these / 500GB SSD, 3TB HD / 1300W system, and within the budget. This should be a quiet and ultra-reliable system with a surprising amount of support user manual, driver, etc. from one site- Dell.com. I've upraded three used Dell Precisions (390, T5400, and T5500) over the past five years and not one failure of any parts. Later you can add a second CPU (16-cores / 32 threads) or two more GPU's and up to 512GB of RAM. This method also saves some time as you're only plugging a few components into slots rather than ordering and assembling every part. Best of all, you can use this system for three years and it should be worth probably 80% or more of your investment becuawe the components have all been already subsantially depreciated.

Well, just a thought,...

Cheers,

BambiBoom


 

Karribu

Distinguished
Jun 24, 2006
111
0
18,680
Thanks for the reply!

Unfortunately I didn't see this in time and have already ordered the parts with a TitanX.

I might send it back and change for a Quadro.

Am I right in thinking in the future I could always have a Quadro running the view-port and a Titan X just doing rendering?

Karri
 


Andrew,

It's difficult to make a choice without knowing quite a lot about all the software used, the priorities, size of projects, and etc. You might first do a bit of research into the particulars of the software you're using, checking the makers' GPU recommendations or specialised forums. There are more applications that are beginning to use OpenCL / DirectX, but if you have Autodesk or Adobe programs, especially 3ds and Maya. So much in CAD is solidly OpenGL, the Quadro may well be worth having. As mentioned, in Maya, a cheap Firepro is faster than a Titan and if you're using textures and/or viewport software, I'd say the Quadro is going to be nearly essential, . That's the key in the discussion, the drivers simply provide more of the necessary capabilities so that a Quadro can do everything, but at a pace that focuses on image quality and a GTX is made for "good enough" images that run faster- image quantity.

I'd often thought to have a system with both a Quadro and GTX in it and so have many others. However, it seems that it can't be done because of drivers conflicts. As a work-around to that problem, perhaps having a dual boot or VMs- with different configurations might be possible, but it may also be necessary to reset the primary GPU in BIOS each time the card is switched as the system needs to know the address of the slot in which the active GPU is set. I've proposed this idea two or three times in forums and no one has ever answered one way or the other nor said they'd tried it. The driver conlfict was always mentioned. You can run a GTX driver on a Quadro but not conversely. There is one YouTube video from someone that had a GTX 680 and Quadro 600- with their separate drivers, but amazingly doesn't seem to know exactly how it was set up:

Silent Quadro CAD Workstation and GTX 680 Gaming System
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk08DHhhxc4

Taking the cost of £830 for a new TitanX, you might consider changing it for a used Quadro K5200 (8GB):

1X Nvidia Quadro K5200 8GB GPU Monitor Graphics Card > Buy It Now > £826 (in US)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1X-Nvidia-Quadro-K5200-8GB-GPU-Monitor-Graphics-Card-/181818608931?hash=item2a553bcd23

> And with a K5200, there would be no question of being able to do anything- model a new Boeing or play Crysis at full settings.

There are no guarantees with used gear, but I'd mention that I've had ten used Quadros in the last ten years- including the K4200 and K2200 I use now, and never had a single failure. I have a backup system with a 2004 FX580 that I bought in 2008 and it still works perfectly- and that model is still on the Autodesk list as certified for AutoCad 2015 as it can run the current Quadro driver.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

Quadros: FX550 (2), FX580 (2), FX1700, FX4800, 4000, K600, K2200, K4200

Firepro: V4900
 
Solution