Confused regarding adding a second router, please help :)

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marios50

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Hello,

I have a ISP provided router/modem combo thing which my ISP has locked all settings from user customisation. This means i cannot even change its IP on my network, add any DNS or anything like that.Not even configure or disable DHCP. Furthermore, i cannot remove it and put one of my choice because then i will have problems with my cable tv. I don't know if its of relevance but it is a ADSL connection.

So i decided to add a second router. Now i am confused as to what i will need, i purely need the second router to add better customisation to my network, not to extend anything. Do i need to bridge(?) or add it as an access point?

I'd be grateful if anyone can help my situation,

Thanks :)
 
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The 68U is a great router, even better if you flash it to merlin (customized firmware with additional features).
This is actually going to be the router I upgrade my WDR3600 to.
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firo40

firo40

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In this situation buying another router wouldnt give you those features. In order for the secound router to have any routing capabilities you would have to disable the dhcp on the first router otherwise the two will conflict. If you disable dhcp on the secound router while its connected which is the only way to prevent conflict you prevent your ability to have the function you want. Your best bet is to get a new cable provider and buy a stand alone adsl modem and router. Or get a better isp
 
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boosted1g

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firo is correct.

A second router does nothing to help your situation.

Any settings for dns, ddns, port forwarding, or anything like that is completely useless because your ISP router will have to be configured to allow those settings through.
The ONLY thing the second router would allow you do is setup a different DHCP addresses.

I would look into getting your own modem and router.

Why do you think your cable TV would be effected by your phone line modem?
 
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marios50

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Thanks for your answer :)

Oh i see... :/

So i know the range of ip addresses that my isp router is giving, it is 192.168.1.1 - 192.168.1.1.200, if i enter a different range in my second router, will it still conflict since it has two DHCP servers? :/

If i manage to get my isp to disable my DHCP server, will it then work?

 
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marios50

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Because the set-top box is connected with the modem/router and it uses it to "synchronise and authenticate" according to my isp. I don't know if they are trying to make me avoid what i want to do or something. They are definitely against me changing their provided thing and said that i will still have internet connection but chances are that my tv won't work..
 
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boosted1g

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You would need to make it something else then 192.168.1.x. So 192.168.0.x, or 192.168.2.x, etc, etc.

Its not just a matter of disabling DHCP. DHCP is just the addressing that the router provides to give each device its own IP address.

The other big factor is called NAT. NAT is what separates your PCs from the internet and provides the very first level of security. This is what hides your PC ip address from the internet. NAT makes it so that the router ignores all unsolicited requests from the internet (the reason why you need port forwarding). Without NAT, all of your antivirus and security would be the equivalent of the most expensive impenetrable gate, with no fence/wall so you can just walk around it.
With NAT disabled then the ISP modem/router will allow all traffic through and thus any inbound/outbound settings you make in the router (like DNS, DDNS, Port Forwarding) will then work. Without it disabled you have 2 NATs and thus it would only work if they were both configured to let the traffic through.
 
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boosted1g

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Sounds like your ISP is trying to keep you in a very tight vice.

Who is your ISP, and who is your cable company? Also how do you get your cable service?
 
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marios50

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Im from Cyprus actually, their called CYTA. They use ADSL+.

So i should opt for removing their router and adding my own?

Also even if i add the second router as an access point, will i still not be able to customise my network?
 
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boosted1g

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An access point is just an extension of the primary router. The primary router does all the logic and has all the settings. An access point is just giving the router a "third hand or foot" that it can control. So in this case it is completely pointless.

Who is your TV provider? Is it a Cable TV service from Coax cable, is it satellite, or is over a different antenna then a parabolic satellite antenna?
 
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marios50

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My TV provider and my ISP provider are the same :p
They provide you with this top box which connects through ethernet to their router/modem.
 
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boosted1g

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Ohh, if the box connects through Ethernet then it should be just fine.

They just really want to get that modem lease charge from you every month. Most ISP leases like that, they got the equipment super cheap years ago and milk the lease profits for as long as they can.

If you have adsl or adsl v2.0 then getting your own modem will be easy enough. You will need to know your user name/password for PPPoE and the IP address settings if they are not using dynamic IPs (this is setup in router and you get this info from ISP).

If they try to give you grief ask them to show them in your contract where it states that you must lease equipment form them in order to have service.
 
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marios50

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Yep, they ultimately told me on the phone, that adding my own router will work (I found all the PPPoE details) but they won't be able to provide me support.
I really am thinking of heading this way and removing that useless junk from my network.
At the end of the day, if for some weird reason my cable tv won't work, IPTV is always an option :p
 
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marios50

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Well, they just got back to me and told me that they can disable DHCP from their modem if i asked them to.
If they disable it, will i be able to proceed with the second router and have my functions?
 
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marios50

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Yup, they said they can put it into bridge mode, should that work?
 
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marios50

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Well i guess thats the best option, now im waiting for them to tell me whether their IPTV service will work with their router in bridge mode.
If not then i might be forced into getting a 2nd internet line from the with a low monthly payment dedicated to just the iptv and completely replace their router with mine in my current line.
 
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marios50

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Thats what i told them but they told me that the IPTV box "authenticates" with their router/modem with some DHCP settings. This makes zero sense to me, plus an employee there told me that he personally knows some cases where clients managed to get their iptv on their own routers but he cannot go into more details.

I call bullshit too xd
 
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marios50

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Unfortunately, there is nothing on the box besides the ISP logo.

After an extensive argument with them, they told me that the whole thing lies within DHCP. Their modem/router always gives the correct address to the set top box for it work.

He told me that my new router may work with it but its DHCP server might give the STB an ip address which won't work.

Now, when i go to the DHCP section of their router, i get this:

lfBkjCW.png



You think that if i enter those settings in the new router, i should be able to get functionality? I mean i don't think they could have any other hidden stuff.
 
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boosted1g

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I see.

Yeah if you use those same settings on your router, then it should work ok.

I would try using a different DNS server then your ISP, I use google dns servers with address 8.8.8.8 and b/u of 8.8.4.4.
If you don't like google then there is a ton of other ones like free dns or open dns, etc. Might be a better option for your area if not in USA.
 
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boosted1g

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FYI, things will still work with your ISPs DNS server, I just find the alternative ones both faster and more reliable.

If you do not know what DNS server is:
A DNS server is what tells your computer who www.google.com is (what its IP addresss is), and also acts as the "gps navigation" for what it believes is the best route to that address. Now your router can then either use that route or if it knows a certain route is faster/better it will chose that (kind of like you knowing a shortcut or faster route over what your GPS is telling you).
 
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marios50

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They won't even let me change that. That is one of the main reasons why i wanted to swap my router's since im interested in entering a DNS for a anti-geoblocking service.


 
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