Help with choosing CPU and GPU for CAD build

Pooslipper

Honorable
Jul 5, 2013
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10,640
Hi, as the title says, I am looking for some input into my PC build. I am designing a PC for probably 60% CAD work and 40% gaming.

The CAD software I will mainly be using is Autodesk Inventor 2015/16, but a bit of Autocad and playing around with other stuff.
My understanding is that Inventor doesn't scale well with multiple cores when modelling, but does when rendering, which I do a fair bit of.
It also uses DirectX, so gaming cards are the best option (I think).

My budget will allow for either an i7 6700k + z170 Deluxe or an i7 5820k + x99 Pro, and I'm having a hard time deciding between higher IPC and clock speed or more cores.

On the GPU side of things, I was thinking about a GTX 980, but am leaning more toward the R9 Fury, due to (as far as I can tell) better compute ability, and the emerging rumours about Nvidia's lack of asynchronous shaders and poor DX12 performance.

The build is all over the place due to a whole load of problems/unforeseen circumstances, so I have had a few parts for a couple of months already.

-what I have-
Phanteks enthoo luxe
H110i GT
500gb 850 EVO
HDDs from my old PC
Peripherals

-what I need-
CPU (6700k or 5820k)
Mobo (z170 Deluxe or x99 Pro)
GPU (GTX 980 or r9 Fury)

32gb DDR4 (possibly Kingston hyperx fury 2666?)
PSU (possibly Corsair HX850i? - room for crossfire in a couple of years)

Any help would be much appreciated!

 
Solution
You're on the right track.

It's a tough choice depending on your needs. If you do a fair bit of rendering, maybe multi-core performance and high bandwidth RAM capability is your better choice. Skylake can have a slight advantage for single core performance.

As far as GPU, the R9 Fury may be better for your purpose.

Here are some nice 32GB kits for that build:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=gskill+32gb+ddr4&N=100007611%20600521523%20600564657%20600531811&isNodeId=1
You're on the right track.

It's a tough choice depending on your needs. If you do a fair bit of rendering, maybe multi-core performance and high bandwidth RAM capability is your better choice. Skylake can have a slight advantage for single core performance.

As far as GPU, the R9 Fury may be better for your purpose.

Here are some nice 32GB kits for that build:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=gskill+32gb+ddr4&N=100007611%20600521523%20600564657%20600531811&isNodeId=1
 
Solution

Pooslipper

Honorable
Jul 5, 2013
61
0
10,640
Hi, thanks for your reply.
I should have mentioned, I am in the UK so Newegg isn't much good, but I'll look into Gskill RAM.
I have been told that the frequency of the RAM has little bearing on performance, is this the case with CAD, or would I see a big difference between, say, 2133mhz and 2666?
And between the dual-channel of z170 and quad-channel x99?

And other than processing power, which is reasonably easy to compare between CPUs, are there any platform benefits or features between z170 and x99?
Thanks
 
With CAD, memory frequency won't have much improvement as there is no real need for high bandwidth. Also X99 platform is quad channel, so DDR4-2133/2400 RAM it is about the same memory bandwidth as Z170 with DDR4-2666/2800. On the other hand with rendering and more continuous processing, bandwidth can have a greater improvement. ie. reducing overall processing time
But frankly whether you notice or care that the system took a minute longer you won't really know unless you put the two systems side by side to compare, which is why most people can simply say there's 'no' difference.

X99 has more PCIe lanes 30 vs. 16, other than that additional features are dependent on the motherboard you purchase.




 
Pooslipper,

Autodesk publishes recommended / certified hardware / system lists for their software. Inventor actually has three or four levels depending on whether it's free standing or part of a suite and the orientation of the suite. In general, my inclination is to follow the GPU's that are certified because using others may lessen Autodesk's support if there are problems. If you have instability in rendering or simulations, the non-certified card gets blamed. In the certified list for Inventor 2016, the GPU's are all workstation cards- Quadros and Firepros:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=12&release=2016&os=8192&manuf=all&opt=2

"Recommended":

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=12&release=2016&os=8192&manuf=all&opt=1

"All" cards that will work:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=graphic&product_group=12&release=2016&os=8192&manuf=all&opt=0

And in those three lists, the only mentions that are not Quadros or Firepros is the Intel P-series (Pro) Integrated graphics.

The systems listed are similarly workstationcentric:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/syscert?siteID=123112&id=18844534&results=1&stype=system&product_group=12&release=2016&os=8192&manuf=all&opt=1

> all Dell Precisions, Lenovo Thinkstations, and HP z-series.

A pattern seems to developing.

If you're using an Inventor version with simulation, I'd recommend an LGA2011-3 (Xeon E5) > ECC > Quadro system. the recent- (1 year) Kepler series GPU's are very good, and in only a week or so (8 September.15) , there will be two new Maxwell GPU's, the M4000 and M5000, both GM204GL 256-bit and 8 GB and with 1664 and 2048 CUDA cores. the specifications that are know suggest that the M4000- which will be the same price as the K4200 - about $800 in the US- may well perform at a similar level to the K5200 which is to say it can do anything and that would include games. I use a K4200 (4GB) and the 3D results in Passmark are very good- similar to GTX 960.

As for the CPU, one of the best values in workstation CPU's has been the various versions of the Xeon E5-1650- these are 6-core and the current v3 is 3.5 /3.8GHz:

http://ark.intel.com/products/82765/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1650-v3-15M-Cache-3_50-GHz

For stability, precision, multi-core rendering, to support multi-lighting sources, high anti-aliasing, and viewports, I'd suggest a Xeon E5-1650 v3 > X99 (possibly ASUS X99 WS > DDR4-2133> Quadro M4000 > M.2 SSD OS /Applications /mech'l storage.

To demonstrate the idea, here's a system concept from a few weeks ago, with prices from US sources and then in Scan and Amazon UK:

BambiBoom PixelCannon Cadamodarendergrapharific iWork TurboBlast ExtremeSignature SuperModel 8000 ®©$$™®£™©™_ 8.6.15

1. CPU: Intel Xeon E5-1650 v3 Six-Core Processor 3.5 / 3.8GHz 0GT/s 15MB LGA 2011-v3 CPU> $575 > £614 (Amazon.uk)

http://ark.intel.com/products/82765/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1650-v3-15M-Cache-3_50-GHz

____ http://ark.intel.com/products/82765/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E5-1650-v3-15M-Cache-3_50-GHz

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=E51650V3BX
____ http://www.amazon.com/XEON-E5-1650V3-6C-3-5G-15MB/dp/B00MU045JU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1411580728&sr=8-1&keywords=E5-1650+v3

2. Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO CPU cooler > $31. (£26.05 Scan.UK)

3. Motherboard: Asus X99-E WS, Intel X99, S 2011-3, DDR4, SATA III 6Gb/s, SATA RAID, PCIe 3.0 (x16), CEB> $499 (£391. Scan.UK))

____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=Asus+X99-E+WS&N=-1&isNodeId=1

4. Crucial 32GB (4 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM ECC DDR4 2133 (PC4-17000) Server Memory Model CT2K8G4RFS4213 > $316 ($79 each) > £276 Scan.UK)(£69 ea)
____ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148854&cm_re=Crucial_8GB_288-Pin_DDR4_SDRAM_ECC_DDR4_2133-_-20-148-854-_-Product

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/8gb-crucial-ddr4-server-memory-pc4-17000-%282133%29-288-pins-ecc-unbuffered-cas-15-12v

5. GPU: PNY Quadro K4200 VCQK4200-PB 4GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 Workstation Video Card > $789459 > £792 378.26 Scan.UK) ( But I would wait for the M4000 (8GB) which should have a similar cost)

____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/pny-nvidia-quadro-k4200-4gb-workstation-pcie-graphics-card-with-2xdp-dvi-plus-2-years-extended-warra

6. Samsung M.2 (2280) 850 EVO 500GB SATA SSD Solid State Drive> $113 (OS, applications, working files) > $186 > £145 (Scan.UK)

____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/500gb-samsung-850-evo-m2-%282280%29-ssd-sata3-6gb-s-samsung-mgx-3d-v-nand-read-540mb-s-write-500mb-s-97k

7. WD BLACK SERIES WD1003FZEX 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive> $75 (£57.18 Scan UK) (Files, Backup, System Image)

8. CORSAIR HX Series HX750 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI CrossFire 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply New 4th Gen CPU Certified Haswell Ready> $130 £119.70 (Scan.UK)

9. Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE 24X SATA DVD±RW Internal Drive w/o Software (Black) SH-224DB $17.99

10 . Corsair Obsidian 750D Large Tower Case Black with Side Window No PSU > £124.50 Scan UK)

____ http://www.scan.co.uk/products/corsair-obsidian-750d-black-full-tower-case-aluminium-steel-with-side-window-3x140mm-fans-usb-30-e-a

11. Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit w/ SP1 (1-Pack, DVD), OEM MSFQC04649 > $138.99 (£119.70 Scan U.K)
________________________________________________________

TOTAL = £2685

To some extent with this kind of system, it's necessary to choose the more demanding use as priority. Above a certain level, content creation systems are quite different from content consumption systems. If your business is with Inventor it needs to be able to do that work well and if it runs that demanding application well enough, it will also play games reasonably well, only it will try and finish every frame completely and perfectly.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

1. HP z420 (2015) > Xeon E5-1660 v2 six-core @ 3.7 / 4.0GHz > 32GB DDR3 ECC 1866 RAM > Quadro K4200 (4GB) > Intel 730 480GB (9SSDSC2BP480G4R5) > Western Digital Black WD1003FZEX 1TB> M-Audio 192 sound card > 600W PSU> Logitech z2300 > Linksys AE3000 USB WiFi > 2X Dell Ultrasharp U2715H (2560 X 1440) > Windows 7 Professional 64 >
[ Passmark Rating = 5064 > CPU= 13989 / 2D= 819 / 3D= 4596 / Mem= 2772 / Disk= 4555] [Cinebench R15 > CPU = 1014 OpenGL= 126.59 FPS] 7.8.15

2. Dell Precision T5500 (2011) > Xeon X5680 six -core @ 3.33 / 3.6GHz, 24GB DDR3 ECC 1333 > Quadro K2200 (4GB ) > Samsung 840 250GB / WD RE4 Enterprise 1TB > M-Audio 192 sound card > Linksys WMP600N PCI WiFi > 875W PSU > Windows 7 Professional 64> HP 2711x (1920 X 1080)
[ Passmark system rating = 3490 / CPU = 9178 / 2D= 685 / 3D= 3566 / Mem= 1865 / Disk= 2122] [Cinebench 15 > CPU = 772 OpenGL= 99.72 FPS] 7.8.15