4gb HBM vs 8gb vram for future proof Gaming (2x390 vs 2xfuryx(Gemini))

parani

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Hi guys im ready to buy graphics card..but before the release of dx12 i have decided to buy 980ti..After dx12 i decided to get couple of r9 390 for CF..Now i have to make a good decision to get a 2x390 or 2xfury(Gemini)..r9 390 have 8bg vram..but furyx has 4gb HBM..i dont have any knowledge about High Bandwith Memory.so for 1440p/4k and atleast for 5year usable gaming rig 8gb r9 390 or 4bg HBM furyx(i mean gemini)..Help me guys
 
Solution
0) Wait?
There will always be something newer coming. We don't have exact dates and pricing, plus it may take months to get a good non-reference card that's not sold out. Who knows, it could take six months from now. I say buy a card and be happy. I'm still rocking a GTX680 and not in a huge rush, though I do carefully tweak my games and that makes a HUGE difference (especially using Adaptive VSYNC... i think alternative is Dynamic VSYNC with RadeonPro for AMD users.)

1) 4GB of HBM is not enough IMO to future proof->
The memory sits next to the GPU and being faster (to the GPU) this does help a bit at higher resolutions due to minimal latency getting code in efficiently.

*However, if a game wanted to use 6GB of video memory that means...

RobCrezz

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You would be crazy to judge DX 12 performance by some synthetic benchmarks and a couple of game demos. Ask your self this, do all DX 11 games perform the same? no they dont.

From things like the Fable DX12 benchmarks, the 980 ti is still top.
4Ki7.png


http://www.anandtech.com/show/9659/fable-legends-directx-12-benchmark-analysis/2
 

Andres de Groot

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In my opinion it is best to wait another year.
Next year is THE year that the real 4K gpu`s are coming to the market (HBM 2).
They say that they come in June - Juli.
Next year is ALSO the year Amd comes with a new line of high-end cpu`s (end of the year).

The performence boost wil be so great......We haven`t seen that in many years.
But the fact is that they had no choice since 4K hit the market so quickly :p

So very difficult time to upgrade now in my opinion. If you have a pc that is just quick enough......I should hold on and upgrade next year :)
 
0) Wait?
There will always be something newer coming. We don't have exact dates and pricing, plus it may take months to get a good non-reference card that's not sold out. Who knows, it could take six months from now. I say buy a card and be happy. I'm still rocking a GTX680 and not in a huge rush, though I do carefully tweak my games and that makes a HUGE difference (especially using Adaptive VSYNC... i think alternative is Dynamic VSYNC with RadeonPro for AMD users.)

1) 4GB of HBM is not enough IMO to future proof->
The memory sits next to the GPU and being faster (to the GPU) this does help a bit at higher resolutions due to minimal latency getting code in efficiently.

*However, if a game wanted to use 6GB of video memory that means there is 2GB that could be in the video memory but is currently NOT there. Fast video memory doesn't help if the data isn't even in it in the first place (already proven by PCPER in GTA5... the frame rate plummeted relative to the GTX980Ti at same settings chosen to give almost 6GB vs those chosen to stay just under 4GB).

(DX12 allows us in theory to add VRAM if we have more than one card, but that must be supported by the developer not to mention it's going to be quite a while until most games are DX12)

2) AMD vs NVIDIA:
Ignoring PhysX and a few other things, while I normally prefer NVidia I'm very impressed with AMD's focus on driver support for some things though it's not clear if they're going to improve DX11... though assuming a good Intel CPU the poor efficiency shouldn't make a huge deal AFAIK.

So... I prefer NVidia, but feel okay recommending AMD if the price is there.

3) FREESYNC vs GSYNC:
FREESYNC is finally usable with the new Crimson drivers. Good job, and the monitors are cheaper. I think it's close enough there for now to not go further. A few weeks ago I'd be saying go NVidia just for that reason (i.e. future GSYNC monitor).

4) Crossfire or FREESYNC monitor?
Right now it's roughly $600 for a 1440p FREESYNC, 4ms g-g IPS monitor that's 144Hz (the best combination of specs IMO).

I would strongly recommend if going AMD to invest in a SINGLE R9-390/390X then put money aside for a good FREESYNC monitor.

(maybe a $500 model in first half of 2016... the ONLY monitors I currently like are closer to $800. I'm confident we'll see a quality $500USD model with the specs above in under six months.)

Crossfire can give you higher frame rates, but you still have to deal with the VSYNC On/Off issues, not to mention FREESYNC can look smoother at lower frame rates which can negate most of the dual-GPU advantage.

*And FREESYNC works for ALL games, whereas Crossfire does not, and even with improvements is going to be a constant hassle (is it smoother with or without...) and of course noise and power.

5) Relative performance of GPU's (use 1440p):
https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/R9_390X_Gaming/30.html

*GTX980Ti is averaging almost 30% higher here (varies by game).

**Price however is very roughly $650 vs $400 for comparable cards (USD) which is 62% difference, plus that's $250 you can put towards a FREESYNC monitor (which is also cheaper than GSYNC monitors right now).

Summary:
My advice without knowing your current monitor is this:

1) Buy a single R9-390X, and
2) Save up for a quality FREESYNC monitor with similar specs to what I mention (2560x1440, 144Hz, IPS 4ms)

I hope this helps.

Update:
*Get the latest Crimson beta driver if going AMD. Latest is I believe Nov 30th, and I think that's the one with the fix for the potential fan issue causing overheating in some cards.
 
Solution

atrix396

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I completely agree with all of this, though despite the fact that FutureProofing is like impossible to predict and how well it will do, I am an, AMD fan boy. Bam shocker! Anyways I would say go with the two furyx's, because I own a 390x which gets up to 60 degrees idling on MSI afterburner, then it will go up to 95 degrees on furmark with full fans which sounds like a jet engine. Thus I recommend the fury x due to the liquid cooling, if you have two 390x in the same systems you will have heat problems unless you want your whole computer to sound like a F-18 and still reaching high high temperatures, unless your fine with that and plan to game on 4k then go with the 390x just because more vram is helpful in higher temps, but the 8gb of HBM is alot better if your doing less then 4K. :) Goodluck!
 

snazzyconnor

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With current cards if you want a gpu that can play 4k for 5 years you wont find any atm, I have a 980ti and I'd say its a card made for 1440p, not 4k.
From benchmarks I've seen on the internet, out of your choice the 980ti is probably the better option in terms of performance (alot of the results are so close there's not anything noticeable between them) and the 980ti plays at roughly 40fps on average with current games at 4k.

If I were you, I'd get a 980ti, sell it in 2017 and put that money towards the then best card. I got a 780ti a year ago and upgraded because the games I play had a large jump in gpu demand, unfortunately with pc gaming the closest you'll get to proper future proofing in the high end is like 1-2 years now
 

parani

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furyx x2 crossfire only gives 4gb they dont stack right now..how could it be 8gb of HBM
 

atrix396

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If I were you, I wouldnt expect any cards to run 4k for anymore than 3 years at best. I mean the GTX 580 was 5 years ago so, dont expect too long life expectancy.
 

parani

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so can i get a 1080p freesync with a single r9 390..?

 

atrix396

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Sorry my mistake I misread some info, It stated that it could stack its siblings with 4gb of HBM each, so I had understood that as the vram stacking.
 

atrix396

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Definitely!
 
atrix396,
1) liquid cooling can be problematic too

2) The Fury X only has 4GB which I've said is going to be an issue in the future which has been proven by testing GTA V.

3) The Fury X also costs about the same as the GTX980Ti, which is a better card in every way IMO.

There's not one advantage to the Fury X I can think of other than enabling a slightly cheaper FREESYNC vs GSYNC monitor. The GTX980Ti is incredibly quiet with the right model (perhaps more so if there are pump issues). The Gigabyte G1 is I believe the one Jayz2cent reviewed on Youtube and it was very quiet.

There's also things like PhysX etc that AMD doesn't have so for me the AMD card needs a price advantage but 6GB is my minimum for VRAM on expensive cards.

3) I'm checking the NOISE of the R9-390X cards and will post back, but the cards are excellent value otherwise.
 

parani

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ok thanks im waiting

 
Example FREESYNC monitor that's inexpensive:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00VBNQJKU/?tag=pcpapi-20

First off, that's ultra-wide (pros and cons) so let's look at the specs:
- 21x9
- 2560x1080
- 29"
- $335
- FREESYNC
- IPS 5ms
- 60Hz

If on a budget, this is a really interesting monitor though my main beef is that you are capped at 60Hz (60FPS).

The new CRIMSON drivers solved the low-end for asynchronous support, and I think (but can't confirm) that there's a way to GLOBALLY CAP and stay in asynchronous mode?

*I saw a video at PCPER where they pointed to the global cap, however from past comments I don't know if capping to say "60FPS" means you can stay in freesync mode or whether it's got to be somewhere slightly lower (I mean 55FPS would still be a great experience with asynchronous enabled).

I'd still strongly recommend waiting a bit and get a monitor with specs that I recommend (especially the 144Hz or at least a minimum 90Hz).

THIS represents my current IDEAL specs, however the quality is a deal breaker and I didn't see a similarly priced monitor with similar specs and same quality:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ZOO348C/?tag=pcpapi-20

(very, very important to investigate quality such as average customer review score, and 1/5, 2/5 score comments as light bleed or other issues may be common)
 

parani

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how about these monitors..
1 http://mdcomputers.in/3dgaming/benq-3d-gaming-monitor-27-xl2720z-with-144hz-1ms-responce-vga-dvi-hdmi-dp-full-hd.html

2 http://mdcomputers.in/products/monitor/3dgaming/asus-monitor-27-vg278he.html

 

snazzyconnor

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I have the gigabyte g1 980ti, had it since it came out and runs like a dream, so far never heard the fans from it while gaming or stress testing/benchmarking, rund everything at 1440p highest graphics at least 60fps, apart from assassins creed syndicate which is 30 :p

only issue I have with it is if you want the led's on the card to be a particular colour apart from the default teal it can be confusing to get it set up, you have to use the gigabyte program and nvidia experience led settings, then everytime you turn the computer on you have to open gigabyte again. Only a small thing though and has no impact at all on performance or noise, just aesthetics :D
 

parani

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hey have you tried shadow of mordor,witcher 3 ,gta 5,grid autosport..?any diff b/w dx 11 and dx 12..?
 

RobCrezz

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The games you list are DX 11 games?
 

snazzyconnor

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Yeah all of them except grid, they all run at 60+fps at 1440p highest graphics, only exception is gta, I turn the anti aliasing down to 2x msaa and get about 70 fps usually. Seem to remember shadow of mordor was in the 90's havent played for a while and witcher runs between 60 and 80 fps
 

parani

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But in fallout 4 gtx 970 wins over r9 390 buy 10-15 fps https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15wOp7_dD8E

 
If using FPS as a metric, then it should be based on the AVERAGE of many games such as what is offered by TECHPOWERUP.

That eliminates cherry-picking bias.

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/R9_390X_Gaming/30.html

If you know certain cards overclock better, or have other beneficial features then that should be added into the mix as well. In fact, it might be good to make a list of the pros and cons if stuck.

*FALLOUT 4 results:
While the video may be indicative of current F4 performance that may change as there may be some issues for that specific game that get sorted out. Plus, that video doesn't even agree with THESE RESULTS so what's the deal? (UPDATE: seems to be explained in the video)
http://www.techspot.com/review/1089-fallout-4-benchmarks/page3.html

Anyway, as I said that's one game which may get better optimized (Bethesda's already stated LOTS of fixes are coming over the next year) so while it's worth mentioning don't buy a card based solely on that.

(I know AMD's DX11 drivers can cause a bottleneck, but saying that's what's causing big dips on Fallout 4 when using a high-end Intel CPU seems very unlikely. Unless they downclock the CPU and compare results they haven't proved that it's not just some GPU optimizations that NVidia did, or work that AMD needs to do in a driver update)

And as a GREEN TEAM member, I feel it worth pointing out that I do think Asynchronous Compute in hardware is going to make some noticeable benefits for AMD in some DX12 games though I'm not comfortable quoting numbers.
 

atrix396

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I was only responding to what he said, the 390 or fury X no 970 or 980ti or such. Just flat out red team.