Am I using too many PCIe lanes?

b3dlam20

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I've started building a computer after about 10 years and have become unfamiliar with some of the new technology. I was really wanting to max this computer out but looks like I may be running into a problem with running out of pcie lanes? Here is my computer specs:
Intel Boxed Core I7-6700K
MSI Computer ATX DDR4 Motherboard Z170A XPOWER GAMING TITANIUM
Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (4x8gb)
Samsung 950 PRO -Series 512GB PCIe NVMe - M.2 Internal SSD

I'd like to add another M.2 to get Raid 0 and 2 Geforce 980 ti in SLI.

My question is will i run out of "lanes"? And would it be worth my while to just go with 3x SSD's instead of the M.2s to save lanes or for speed?

Thank you all.
 
Your GPUs would be running at x8/x8 as mentioned, which is fine for 2-way SLI. No need to worry about 950 PRO m.2, which are PCI-E based. They use x4 lanes of PCI-E 3.0. Skylake Z170 is setup different that previous generation chipsets. It has 16 lanes of Gen3 for GPUs, but there are an additional 20 lanes of PCI-E 3.0 in the chipset for storage and other reasons. May need to check your board specifics, but I don't think you should have a problem running 980 Ti SLI and M.2 RAID 0(if board supports) simultaneously.
 
NO, there are not an additional 20 lanes AFTER subtracting the 16 lanes for CF or SLI.

26 I/O ports TOTAL, 6 are dedicated to USB 3.0 (max 10), leaving 20 ports which can be USB 3.0, SATA Revision 3, or PCI-E 3.0. After subtracting 16 lanes for x8/x8 PCIe 3.0 CF or SLI configurations, there are 4 lanes remaining.



There is also a maximum of 6x SATA6Gb/s ports that can be used out of the 20 I/O ports left after subtracting the 6x USB 3.0. Many people don't know that every PCH has PCI-E lanes, and they are used for connections to other devices such as NICs and extra USB or SATA controllers, and so people assumed that because they saw 20x PCI-E 3.0 it must be referring to the CPU's PCI-E controller, but actually it's referring to the PCH's PCI-E controller.
 
I wish this type of info would have been more clear on the chipset diagram, ect. Having a hard time finding what would seem like a simple question. I've read it as being 20 lanes PCH + 16 as the diagram shows http://www.intel.in/content/www/in/en/chipsets/performance-chipsets/z170-chipset-diagram.html, not 26 total split up in different ways depending on board vendor's design layout.
 

Jeffnmandy

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If the processor is unopened you may be able to exchange it.

I researched like crazy about pcie lanes and processors. I found a local guy with a unused 5930k i7. That one has 40 full pcie lanes.

It runs about $150 more than the 6700k, but you get six cores, 12 threads, overclockable 3.5ghz, and 40 lanes.

I lucked up and talked him down to $ 400 on mine.
 
Well, you're right, and wrong. As am I, both right and wrong. There ARE 16 dedicated CPU PCI lanes, which are a part of the overall HSIO lane count. It works as follows, but the bottom line is that after the 16 GPU lanes and the rest of the lanes necessary for the essentials like NIC and USB, and without any SATA headers being in use, there are 9 PCI lanes leftover for use with your M.2 devices, so if they are x4 M.2 drives, then you would be ok with 2 of them. If they are are PCI card drives, x8, you could only use one, and no SATA drives.


To more precisely answer your question, Z170 has 20 PCI-E lanes at max independent of the ones hosted by the CPU. The CPU and PCH connect via a DMI 3.0 interface on all of the boards with the exception of the H110 board, that uses the older DMI 2.0 interface. This is equevilant to roughly a PCI-E 3.0 x4 connection, but it does not consume any PCI-E lanes from the CPU or motherboard.

The chipset uses what are known as HSIO lanes, which are essentially the same as PCI-E 3.0 lanes to connect to virtually everything else. A good example of what is going on here is to compare it to graphics cards. In the past, like the Voodoo 2, there were a ton of different components and fixed function units used to handle the various tasks. Eventually, most of these pieces were replaced when graphics cards moved away from fixed function units to general use shaders (I.E. CUDA/Stream Processors/Pixel Shaders). Chipsets are experiencing much the same thing, as Intel moves away from creating a chipset that contains controllers for SATA-III, SATA-II, USB 3.0, USB 2.0, PCI-E etc. to a multi-purpose controller unit capable of running all of these.

Z170 chipset has 26 of these, six of which are hard coded to be USB 3.0, with an additional 4 that can be configured as USB 3.0. The USB 2.0 slots do not consume any HSIO lanes. Of the 26, if all potential USB 3.0 lanes are used that leaves us with 16 HSIO lanes remaining (or 20 at most).

Z170 also supports up to 6 SATA-III connections that also consume one HSIO lane each. If all of these are configured and in use, then the motherboard now only has 10 HSIO lanes remaining (or 20 at most assuming no SATA points and no additional USB 3.0 above the initial six.)

You drop an additional HSIO lane for a single LAN NIC, leaving 9 HSIO lanes.

Of these remaining 9 lanes, all of them are essentially PCI-E 3.0 lanes, and can be configured into x1, x2 or x4 configurations. Any additional on-board features such as extra USB 3.0 or 3.1 slots, additional SATA ports, or secondary networking devices further reduce this number by at least one.

So, long story short, Z170 has at most 20 PCI-E 3.0 lanes available, if the motherboard OEM decides to not configure any HSIO lanes for anything and sells you a motherboard without any SATA ports, additional USB 3.0 ports, networking capabilities, or any other additional similar features.

As no motherboard OEM is going to do that, however, you likely have 9 PCI-E 3.0 lanes or less on a Z170 board. Often, you will see motherboards that have far too much connectivity like this one from ASRock:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/asrock-fatal1tyz170-pr...

In which case, the motherboard has several of the connectivity interfaces shared with other devices, and just about anything you connect to the motherboard disables something else.As for the 16 lanes coming from the CPU, those are still reserved for GPUs typically.
 
And this might clarify things even more.


Z170 Platform including CPU = Max 42 PCI-E 3.0 lanes (typically 17 shared with other devices like USB, SATA, NIC, 16 reserved for GPU)

Z170 chipset = 26 PCI-E 3.0 lanes, can be segmented in groups of x1/x2/x4 (17 typically shared with other devices like USB, SATA, NIC)

Intel CPU = 16 PCI-E 3.0 lanes, can be segmented in groups of x4/x8/x16 (almost exclusively used for GPU)

The thing with Skylake chipsets is that explaining all of this is a mouthful and hard to get across. In the article I linked there is an image of the chipsets HSIO lanes that diagrams how they can be segmented, what lanes are shared with what, etc. Study that, it should help to clarify what I am attempting to say.

The reason we cannot have x16/x16 multi-GPU configurations, is because the chipset is incapable of supporting more than an x4 connection to any device that connects directly to it. Only the CPU is capable of that, which bypasses the chipset entirely. This is mostly because the connection between the CPU and chipset is essentially limited to a PCI-E 3.0 x4 connection, and so anything greater than an x4 connection would be bottlenecked by the DMI 3.0 interconnect between the CPU and chipset.

This is not to say that if you have an M.2 SSD with a PCI-E 3.0 x4 connection and a GPU connected to the chipset via a PCI-E 3.0 x4 connection that you will necessarily have a bottleneck, as it will alternate between the two devices when transferring data, but it may have some negative side effects (increased latency).

If you are wanting to have a dual-GPU and dual-M.2 setup, you should be fine with most Z170 motherboards (you need to check them carefully), but if you were planning to add six SATA drives to that, you would probably end up disabling one of the M.2 ports.

-Michael Justin Allen Sexton
 
Great info! I'm wondering if this information could be written into an article or sticky thread of some sort. Like we both discovered initially, the majority of the info available is conflicting and confusing based on some typical Google searches and reviews. I knew that some lanes would be consumed for USB 3.0, SATA, NIC, ect. as you pointed out. I didn't have in the "in depth" functionality of Skylake until now. I wonder if the OP has been reading over this thread. I also can relate w/ this on my X99 setup. There are tons of connectivity options on my X99 Deluxe, but in the "fine print" using one often will either disable or slow down something else. One I find a bit odd, though it may be helpful to someone else considering SLI + M.2 x4 NVMe drive w/ a 5820K setup. Before I had my 950 Pro, my GPUs were connected at 16x/8x. I figured being I have 28 Lanes to the CPU, I'd keep the GPUs the same and use the 4 remaining lanes for the SSD for a 16x/8x/4x configuration. What actually happened is now I'm connected at x8/x8/x4. Not entirely sure why this works this way. I figured USB, NIC, SATA, ect. were going through the Gen 2 lanes in the X99 PCH.
 
Michael is working on a new article that incorporates all the new data that has been learned/gathered since his original article on the platform, and making it into something a little more geared language wise for the average member, rather than for Intel engineers, to help clear up some of the confusion.
 
I restored your post, as I felt it was relevant and wanted to respond to it. So, I agree, the additional information makes much more sense, and even for me, somebody quite familiar with most of the prior platforms and architectures, it was somewhat confusing and misleading, so hopefully we are all more informed now and can move forward with at least a somewhat better understanding of how this platform should be expected to behave depending on what is intended.
 
That's true, but relevant answers don't always come up in Google or in-site searches, so unless you provide the optimum search terms the answer might not get found which is why many of these questions get posed despite there already being relevant answers. And in other cases, people are just lazy and want personalized help, which is ok too I guess.
 

aerossi

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Feb 9, 2010
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Dont comment if you don't know what you're talking about. The M.2 Samsung 950 pro nvme drive that the user says he is going to use is over 5x faster than the maximum bandwidth of SATA III. SATA III theoretical max is about 770MB/s The drive he wants to use on the PCI-E NVME interface is about caps out at about 3500MB/s read

The solution is simply. Purchase a single high end GPU, it will run all games at max settings. in 2 generations of video cards use the $$$ from the second GPU on a new GPU. (basically replace the GPU every 2.5yr, twice as often as I normally would)
Personally I just build a "great machine", I put in an i7-6700k skylake, 32GB DDR4 2400, Samsung 950 pro NVME M.2 500GB, MSI nVidia GTX 1080 seahawk