setting up multiple WAPs

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njitgrad

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I have three WAPs in my house each using different SSIDs. I find it very annoying that when I move from one part of my house to another I have to manually switch the WiFi connection on my devices to get a better signal.

I am questioning whether I should have assigned the same SSID to all of the WAPs instead of the way I did it. Would this accomplish anything to account for roaming in my house?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Here is my current configuration...

1. Modem to Router/AC1900 WAP configured as follows:
SSID1: 2.4GHz (private)
SSID2: 5.0GHz (private)
SSID3: 2.4GHz (guest)
SSID4: 5.0 GHz (guest)

2. The AC1900 Router/WAP connects to an 8 port switch which eventually feeds into a pair of AC1200 WAPs configured as follows:

AC1200 WAP1:
SSID5: 2.4GHz (private)
SSID6: 5.0GHz (private)

AC1200 WAP2:
SSID7: 2.4GHz (private)
SSID8: 5.0GHz (private)

 
Solution
Rogue Leader
YES give them all the exact same SSID and password that will allow you to seamlessly walk through the house. But to prevent interference between them you want to also go into the settings and look for the channel settings, give each one a distinct and separate channel (so if theres 11 channels set them to 2, 6, and 11).

How do I know this? I have the exact same thing in my house. In fact each of my WAPs has 2 SSIDs a home network and a guest, duplicated on each.
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Rogue Leader

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YES give them all the exact same SSID and password that will allow you to seamlessly walk through the house. But to prevent interference between them you want to also go into the settings and look for the channel settings, give each one a distinct and separate channel (so if theres 11 channels set them to 2, 6, and 11).

How do I know this? I have the exact same thing in my house. In fact each of my WAPs has 2 SSIDs a home network and a guest, duplicated on each.
 
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Solution
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bill001g

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You can not solve your problem with consumer grade equipment. You can spend huge amounts (more than most cars cost) and get a system like cisco sells and it mostly works. You can spend less on something from say ubiquiti but it still is not truly seamless at times. It is a lot better than a system that has no controller.

Your problem is actually the end devices. They only look at the signal level when you first connect. Partially this is the radio chip design, it can not actually scan other radio channels for devices and talk to end devices at the same time. What they have done is set a signal level the it scans for other equipment. In most cases this is set to a almost unusable level before it tries. The problem with setting it too high is that it runs the risk of it bouncing back and forth when signals are weak but similar. It also has the problem when you have poor signal and only have 1 option it will still go out and scan and then connect right back because there is no other option. Every time it checks for or changes ap you will get a small outage.

You have 2 choices, set the AP ssid all the same and hope the software gets lucky or set them different like you do and you the person make this determination of when to switch.

Your only real option if you want this function is to toss all your current equipment and replace it......and don't expect magic even on systems designed to allow roaming.
 
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Rogue Leader

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You can name them all the same, you will only "see" 1 SSID on your devices. The only reason you would want to give it different SSIDs is if you have devices you would prefer to run on the 5ghz network, just to make sure they always connect to it. However the device will generally pick up what is best.,
 
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njitgrad

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What about the 5 GHz channels? The choices are 36, 40, 44, 48, 149, 153, 157, 161.

BTW, why choose 2, 6, and 11....something special about them? Or is it just because they are spaced the furthest apart?

 
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Rogue Leader

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I just used those as an example, its preferable to pick channels that are far apart from eachother to make sure there is no signal interference. so for example I would use 36, 48 and 157 for 5 ghz.
 
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bill001g

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It tends to not be that simple though. Now if you were to set you AP to run 20mhz channels then you have more options but that would mean you have converted you 802.11ac devices into 802.11n devices and then you limit the top speed to about 150m.

Even though there are 11 so called channels they are only 5mhz wide on 2.4g so multiple are used for a wifi signal. There is only 60mhz total available and you can only have 1 device running 40mhz wide channel without overlap.

On 5g it is a little better because the channels are 20mhz wide but 802.11ac uses 80mhz...ie a continuous block of 4 channels. This means in most countries you can only run 2 (some only 1) devices running 802.11ac. They only fit using channels 36 and 149.

Now in most cases people are not limited by using the 20mhz channels. Real world max speed is about 40mbit per radio but because you have more radios running the total speed tends to be higher that if you used 1 large (ie 802.11ac) connection and had all your users fight over it.

Of course this assumes you have no neighbors competing and hope none of they are using the newest triband devices that has 2 5g radios and can use all the 5g channels for 1 device.
 
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Rogue Leader

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I have multiple WAPs set up the exact same way, and seamlessly move through the house without issues. I do see my neighbors wifi but unless I'm in my yard not near the house it doesn't cause me issues, and TBH I don't want the signal to reach that far anyway.
 
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bill001g

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I am so glad it works for you but that is pure anecdotal. You have not explained how you solve all the problem with the unit not switches ap even though a better signal is available.
 
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Rogue Leader

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Devices when they lose connection consistently look to reconnect, because the APs have the same SSID, the device picks up the strongest signal to it. You may get a blip in your connection (a momentary loss of service) but it picks right back up where it left off, and its better than connecting to different networks each time.

This is how its set up in my home, I have done it in other locations, and I know in both my office and my firehouse it uses WAPs set up this way as well.
 
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bill001g

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I see your definition of seamless is not what most people mean. Seamless generally means you can not detect the outage. There is always some outage but good systems can do it in less than 1sec.

You also must accept much poorer quality at times. You can connect to a AP walk over and put your PC directly on top of a second AP and it will not switch if it thinks the quality is good enough. You can get massive packet retransmission and it will not switch.

Again it does eventually switch automatically but most people want it to switch sooner which is not possible with consumer equipment. You end up dropping it manually to force it to connect where you want.

Either way with the same SSID or different you tend to have to take manual actions to get the best service.
 
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Rogue Leader

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I agree, but it works, and it works well enough. Well enough that I and others never even notice it, and well enough for someone like the poster who is just using home equipment and doesn't want to go out and spend a ton of money to fix this issue.

Like I said, it works, virtually seamlessly.
 
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njitgrad

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Not sure if this single SSID concept is working out for me. Ironically I think my WAPs are too close together. How can I tell what CHANNEL I am connected to on my device? When I walk from my garage (WAP1) through my family room (WAP2 on other side of house) and into my bedroom upstairs (WAP3) how do I know if my Galaxy S6 is still connected to WAP1? Even if I briefly turn WiFi off on my device (while in my bedroom) and then turn it back on, how do I know if it is connecting to WAP3 like it should be since it is the closest? Somehow I get the feeling that this is not happening. The connection seems weak, almost like it reconnected to WAP1 again (which is in the garage quite a distance from my bedroom). Perhaps my situation calls for unique SSIDs for each WAP like I used to have.
 
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bill001g

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That is the trade off, you either use different SSID where you can control it or you live with the issue of it not changing when you like.

Most times when you have multiple AP you want to reduce the output power of the devices. This reduces interference but it also reduces the overlap which encourages the end device to switch sooner.

You should be able to see the mac address of the AP you are connected to.
 
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Rogue Leader

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Yes you cannot see the channel, many WAP's allow you to turn down the power of the radio (I did on mine to prevent getting access all through my yard). I should have mentioned this, because based upon the distance they may well be crossing over, so turning the power down on each one should make this solution work better.
 
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njitgrad

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What setting would I be looking for and how far should I dial down the power on each WAP? I have TRENDNET devices.

 
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Rogue Leader

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You're looking for something that says Signal strength, (its measured in db), and what you want to do is lower it somewhat and test, see how long it takes to lose signal.

What model in particular, I can check the manual for you to tell you exactly if you can't find it?
 
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njitgrad

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I have a TRENDNET TEW-818DRU router as my first WAP and a pair of TRENDNET TEW-813DRU as my two other WAPs.
 
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njitgrad

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If I can't change the settings on the 818 router then I don't think this will work. Won't it just overtake the other WAPs in my house? I can see the 818 router everywhere in my house but since it's located on one side of my house the signal is rather weak on the other side of my house (especially upstairs). That's why I installed the 813s. One on the side of the house opposite the 818 and one on the 2nd floor. My only other option is to disable the WiFi on the 818 and connect another 813 to it.



 
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njitgrad

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What about setting up a WDS bridge between the three? I noticed that in the manual but know nothing about it.

Actually this only makes sense if my WAPs were not connected to my LAN via ethernet cables but they are.
 
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Rogue Leader

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Wireless bridging will work in the sense that it will provide a seamless connection, but the performance compared to how you already have it hooked up will be nowhere near as good.
 
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njitgrad

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I just ordered a basic router and a third 813. At least I have the feedome to move the new 813 WAP out of the garage (which is where my modem and 8-port switch is) and into my adjoining office.

 
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