Help on deciding between which parts to use - 4670k vs 6500

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heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
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First off, thank all of you for your expertise. I have gotten into computer building and what not the past 6 months and this forum has been crazy helpful. I have learned a lot so far, but still have much to learn.

So my situation. I have two computers now (one because it was such a good deal I couldn't pass it up) and I need to decide the optimal part configuration. Whatever I don't choose, I am just going to sell it just for the cost I grabbed this other PC at. As for context, I plan to eventually sli gtx 970s because the girlfriend got me a 4k monitor a few days ago for my birthday. That being said, I don't plan too right this second, but the ability to is important. As well, I'm planing on messing around with OCing soon. The Z170 mobo does have the BIOS update to be able to overclock the base clock of the CPU.

Here is my current PC specs(all parts about 4-6 months old):
i5 6500
ASROCK Z170M Pro4S (I just found out today they may only be compatible with Xfire and not sli?)
8G DDR4 3200 mhz
Cryorig M9i CPU Cooler
PNY GTX 970
PNY 240g SSD
Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm 1TB
Win 10
Corsair cx500m 80+ Bronze
VIVO V02 case

The computer I can part in and out off(all parts are about 1.5 years old, except GPU it's about 4 months):
GPU-ASUS GTX 970
CPU-Intel i5 4670K (Haswell)
CPU Cooler-Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO
MoBo-MSI Z87-G45
Power Supply-Rosewill Hive-750W (Modular)
RAM-G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 16GB (4 x 4GB)
SSD-PNY 120GB
Hard Drive 1-WD Black 1TB
Hard Drive 2-WD Green 1TB
DVD/CD Drive-2X ASUS DVD Writers
Case-Corsair 450D
OS-Windows 10 (64BIT)

I already plan on switching the case and GPU for sure. I assumed based on reading on this website, I should grab the Hive PSU over the Corsair as well. My decision I really am stuck with is whether to take the unlocked CPU, and mobo. From what I am aware, the z87 would be able to support SLI, while my current one would not. But would that be worth it, to get rid of the newest processor and DDR4 usability?

Thanks in advance for the help! I really just am not sure which direction to take.
 
Solution
Barty1884
As you mentioned, gaming can be GPU intensive - so what you're aiming for is a CPU that is not likely to be a bottleneck for any GPU in the forseeable future. Having an unlocked multiplier helps even more.

Neither the 4670K, nor the 6500 would present any noticeable bottleneck to even the best GPUs of today (likely not even SLI'ing 980 TI's). The simple fact is the 6500 is a mid-range i5 of the latest generation. Performance-wise, it's not really a "step up" from the 4670K, infact it's likely a slight step back. Going forward, with Polaris & Pascal coming, those cards may start to see the CPU as a bottleneck (probably not from the first release - that would be ridiculous), but as newer versions of cards come out.

The...
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H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
9
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1,510


Yeah, I guess I have seen that around. That makes plenty of sense. Thank you. One last thing while I have you around. I looked at the benchmarks of the 6500 vs 4670k in terms of performance. Could you explain why the 6500 is better? I believe you, just a little confused about the comparison.

http://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-6500-vs-Intel-Core-i5-4690K/3513vs2432
 
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Barty1884

Barty1884

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Apr 16, 2015
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The MSI Z87-G45 is SLI compatible whereas the ASRock Z170M Pro4s is not.
(if you want to keep that option open, but logain makes a great argument for the benefits of a single card).

Unless I've missed an update somewhere along the way (which is possible), the BIOS OCing of locked Skylake is no longer available after the last round of updates.
If that's still the case, as much as the mobo has the 'perfect' BIOS at the moment, if you even want/need to update the BIOS, you lose your OCing ability.

As logain pointed out, neither have a quality PSU, so I'd invest in one for whichever rig you decide to run with.


My recommendation out of those builds would be to take the SSD from the Skylake build and put it in the Haswell built & keep that.


As an sidenote, if you really did pick the second rig up real cheap - why not take the 970 from it & SLI on the Haswell setup? (with a new PSU, of course)

The 6500 has an iGPU, so still a viable option for someone to use and, it's still a "gaming" rig somebody could buy and drop a GPU in....
 
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H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
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1,510


Don't you need the exact same model GPU? One is a reference PNY and the other is a custom ASUS Strix model. I was under the impression that I would need for instance, two strixs to sli not using one of both.
 
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Barty1884

Barty1884

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The only real requirement(s) for SLI are model (ie 970) and memory (2GB / 4GB). Differing clocks will default to the lowest common denominator. Different manufacturers/versions/cooling methods don't really come into play.

The GTX 970 is an odd card though, as manufacturer's were given much more freedom with the design that with other models (for example, some EVGA 970s won't SLI with other EVGA 970s), so for this particular card it may well be mixed result.

Consider you have both on hand, it won't hurt to try.
 
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logainofhades

logainofhades

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I was not aware of that board being SLI capable. That does change things. The 4670k has the potential to be quite a bit faster, through overclocking. My main reasoning, as I was not aware of the SLI capability of that Z87 board, was the fact that the 4670k has very limited upgrade options, compared to the i5 6500, which is current gen tech. Agree with Barty that the 4670k system, and SLI the two GTX 970's, that you already have, makes good sense.
 
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H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
9
0
1,510
I wish I could check both of your answers as the selected answers. You guys are helping me so much.

As far as, upgrade potential. Will the socket change again whenever the next Intel processor goes live? or is that just an occasional thing. It seems like there are almost as many sockets as processor generations. I'm assuming the lack of upgrade path is talking about the socket, correct?
 
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Barty1884

Barty1884

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I guess the best way to describe it would be "worthwhile" upgrade path in this sense.

The 4670K can only really "upgrade" to a 4690K on the same, LGA1150 'socket'. There will be no more releases on that socket. Minor, minor improvement going to the 4690K though (0.1GHz speed).

The 6500 is socket 1151. 1151 supports Skylake CPUs and will also support

Lacking an upgrade path can mean one of two things:
1. You have the best chip available for the socket
2. There's still a "better" chip available, but it will provide minimal improvements (if any)

Intel have a "tick tock" phased released, meaning there is always two generations for ever socket, but it's highly unlikely the mainstream user will upgrade within that generation. Like a 4670K to a 4690K, it's not worth it pricewise. The only time this differs, generally, is if somebody buys an entry level Pentium, or even an i3. In the same generation it's reasonable to assume some will upgrade to an i5 or even an i7 of the same generation.

Socket LGA1155 supported Sandy & Ivy Bridge CPUs (2nd and 3rd gen):
iX-2XXX and iX-3XXX

LGA1150 supported Haswell & Haswell Refresh (4th gen + revision)
iX-46XX and iX-47XX

LGA1155 supports Skylake, an upcoming refresh and Kaby Lake (6th & 7th gen).

There's other chipsets and sockets too (the X-series, the LGA2011-v3, but that isn't relevant for this discussion).
 
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H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
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1,510


Okay, I'm following you. Being that in most cases in gaming the hardware is GPU bound, do you think that most likely I would not need to upgrade either of these processors until 8th gen? If so, is that why you both suggested the unlocked 4th gen?
 
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Barty1884

Barty1884

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Apr 16, 2015
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As you mentioned, gaming can be GPU intensive - so what you're aiming for is a CPU that is not likely to be a bottleneck for any GPU in the forseeable future. Having an unlocked multiplier helps even more.

Neither the 4670K, nor the 6500 would present any noticeable bottleneck to even the best GPUs of today (likely not even SLI'ing 980 TI's). The simple fact is the 6500 is a mid-range i5 of the latest generation. Performance-wise, it's not really a "step up" from the 4670K, infact it's likely a slight step back. Going forward, with Polaris & Pascal coming, those cards may start to see the CPU as a bottleneck (probably not from the first release - that would be ridiculous), but as newer versions of cards come out.

The advantage the 4670K has, is the unlocked multiplier. Even at stock, the 4670K is faster than the 6500....with the unlocked multiplier, it's reasonable to expect the 4670K to be OC'd stable at least 4.2, likely more like 4.3GHz, with some even being stable around 4.6GHz. With appropriate cooling of course (as an FYI, the 212 EVO isn't going to cut it for that)
 
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Solution
H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
9
0
1,510


I would like to once again thank both of y'all for the help! I am going to mark that as the answer. But I do have two more questions if you don't mind me asking related to that response. What cpu cooler would cut it? and I was thinking the EVGA GQ 750 watt for the PSU I would get. What do you think about that?
 
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Barty1884

Barty1884

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Apr 16, 2015
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A really good air cooler, like the Noctua NH-D15 (or NH-D14 or 14s) would be good options for a solid OC. Liquid cooled, something like the Corsair H110i GTX if your case supports the size.

For your PSU, you want quality. The GQ 750 is a quality unit - slightly overkill in terms of wattage, but that's not a bad thing!

Anything Tier 1 or 2
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2547993/psu-tier-list.html

750W is probably a good buy - if you're going SLI. Realistically, 600W would do it, but there's no harm in getting a 750W, especially if the price is right.

Don't worry too too much about the bronze/silver/gold etc ratings. There are good quality bronze units too.
For example, if you're in the US, the EVGA SuperNOVA B2 750W (a Tier 2, bronze PSU) is $49 after rebate!
https://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-power-supply-110b20750vr

The SuperNOVA GQ is a quality PSU though (as is the G2 & GS, T2, P2 etc, just avoid the "NEX" supernovas).
 
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H

heyitschas

Commendable
Apr 20, 2016
9
0
1,510


$50 sounds much better to me! Is the corsair H60 any good for cooling? I looked at that awhile back.
 
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