Can a battery lose abiity to supply sufficient current to a laptop even when it has a good percentage charge?

diapolical · Apr 28, 2016

My laptop is a bit sluggish on battery at times but returns to normal when I plug the A/C in. Does tht mean the battery is no longer supplying enough current?

What's more, even when both battery and A/C supplies are connected, the laptop has problems if I am playing a video from the local hard drive while something is downloading from the internet, in fact even rendering (downloading) web pages can cause the problem. The sound on the video is interrupted, or breaks up. I notice this problem is more severe when the laptop is on battery so I am thinking that even with the A/C adapter connected there is still a current shortfall. Could a failing battery even interfere with the current coming from an A/C supply?

I have reinstalled ALL the latest drivers for my laptop and still the sound problem in video recurs. I have followed every piece of advice the internet has to offer and there is still no solution. So now I am looking at the power sources. I really don't want to discuss anything else here, I am not looking for advice on how to solve the video problem.

In summary
1. Can a battery lose abiity to supply sufficient current to a laptop even when it has a good percentage charge?
2. Could such a battery even reduce the current coming from an A/C supply?

I have a Lenovo Y580 laptop, 8gb ram, 2gb Nvidia graphics and Intel graphics, 1TB hdd, 16gb ssd, Windows 8.1 - used for video editing

Thank you in advance.

Ironsounds · Apr 29, 2016

Hello... 1) Yes... Oxides/? can build up on the internals connections... restricting output.
2) Yes... Oxides/? can build up on the internals connections... restricting input.

Batteries of all types...need to be replaced, maintenanced and have a life cycle to them... Monitoring charging - discharging levels/Time periods, and SMART charger use, can PRO-LONG a battery life.

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

Do I understand you right Ironsounds - that even if the PSU is working properly, a faulty battery can stop the PSU from providing sufficient current?
I do need some confirmation since you gave me the same answer for question 2, "oxides", even though the question was about the interaction between battery and PSU.
Can a battery interfere with the current being supplied directly by a PSU?

Dugimodo · Apr 29, 2016

A faulty battery goes flat fast, it does not affect the performance of your PC especially when connected to A/C. The Laptop however has power management settings that reduce it's power usage and performance when on battery to prolong battery life, you can alter these settings in control panel for more performance if battery life is not important to you.

As to your other issues, sounds like either the Laptop is not using hardware acceleration or simply isn't very powerful, or the media player is hogging resources. Try a different media player, some are better than others as far as resource use goes. VLC is a popular one or media player classic with the appropriate codecs (VLC has it's own).

another thought, how full is your hard drive? if it's low on space it can cause these sorts of issues.

Ironsounds · Apr 29, 2016

Hello... *2) Depends on how the PS, Battery, laptop are in circuit together... batteries Can FAIL in the "Open" and "Shorted" modes. "Shorted mode" is the cause of a many laptop fires... or Car/Truck batteries exploding, when people try to Jump them.

3) AS a 'simple test" can you remove the battery and power up the laptop without it?

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

Thanks Ironsounds - I'll try that and get back to you

Dugimodo · Apr 29, 2016

The problems described are not battery related, it's a red herring.
As I said laptops perform lower on battery because of their power management settings.

Yes a battery can stop the PSU supplying enough current, no that will not cause the problems described. If the PC is not getting enough power it will perform erratically or shut down/crash. Maybe if the laptop think's it's still on battery power it might go into a power saving mode when current is low, but I don't really think that's happening here.

However Ironsounds test is simple and easy so you should do it to confirm for yourself, take the battery out and run without it and see what happens.

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

Yes the laptop will run without the battery in.
So that suggests that the battery can not interfere with the current supplied by the PSU doesn't it?
It occurs to me there is one other possibility, that the battery is drawing so much current from the PSU that the PSU's abilty to provide sufficient current to the laptop is compromised - could that also be true?
What do you think?

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

This is not a red herring, I am asking for information specifically about batteries. I do not accept your solutions Dugimodo, what you say is not pertinent, I tried everything you have suggested long ago. Please read my posts more carefully, I am exploring battery problems in this thread. Ironsounds recommendations are instructive however.

Ironsounds · Apr 29, 2016

Hello... Yes... if the battery is starting to fail toward "shorted mode" then it could be "Loading down" the PS Voltage and current to the laptop hardware...
4) How old is the battery?
5) I suggest doing further laptop testing at this time... too ALSO determine if your PS is still good too B )

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

Battery is 3 years old, it still charges fully (at least the battery meter in the tray says so) and seems to last about 80% as long as when new-
I can get a multi-meter and test the battery and PSU
That would be a good idea?
There's no need for you to go into it here, I will research how to test a PSU and a battery and do it properly.
Is that a good next step?

nukemaster · Apr 29, 2016

Just the act of charging a battery and running a laptop puts more load on the power supply(charger + computer). It should be rated for this.

Normally when a notebook battery fails it just has a VERY short life(even with it showing a full charge).

Some notebooks may be setup to limit the cpus and even video cards max clock speed or power consumption on battery power to prolong the runtime. My old Compaq would NEVER clock to full speed no matter the power setting on batteries(but it ran cooler and longer so I was happy.).

Video editing is very processor intensive and may be hard drive intensive as well. Do these issues happen when not editing or compressing video?

Short answer if it works with the battery out and the battery life is still good, maybe the charger is on the weak side. Some companies have done this. I remember reading some companies used lower wattage AC adapters to make them lighter, but they lacked power to run the system and charger together. This was years ago.

Dugimodo · Apr 29, 2016

One more time...
The first sentence you posted descibes normal laptop characteristics. The CPU is clocked slower and for some laptops the graphics performance reduced when running on batteries. The battery does not cause this it's normal laptop power management.

OK you don't want help with your Video problems, fine let's talk about batteries and power suppkies. If the battery is a bit worn it'll simply go flat faster. If it's going faulty and drawing way too much charge current it might damage the power supply, might get hot, might even explode, but unless it draws so much current that the laptop can't even power on it will not affect the performance of your laptop. Nothing you describe indicates a problem with your battery other than it's not giving the full performance it did when new which is perfectly normal.

Go Ahead, get a multimeter, buy a new battery, it's your money to throw away fixing nothing while you ignore people trying to help. I will butt out.

Solandri · Apr 29, 2016

diapolical :

A lot of gaming laptops are designed to reduce performance on battery because at full power the CPU + GPU can draw so much current they will damage the battery.

There is nothing you can do about this because it's baked into the laptop's firmware. (You might be able to modify it if you're skilled enough to hack the laptop's firmware, but you'd probably end up destroying your battery, or even causing it to catch on fire).

What's more, even when both battery and A/C supplies are connected, the laptop has problems if I am playing a video from the local hard drive while something is downloading from the internet, in fact even rendering (downloading) web pages can cause the problem. The sound on the video is interrupted, or breaks up. I notice this problem is more severe when the laptop is on battery so I am thinking that even with the A/C adapter connected there is still a current shortfall.

The fact that this happens even when on AC power tells you that the battery has nothing to do with it. The usual culprit is accidentally switching to a power-saving power profile, but you say you've already checked for that. I'd try:

- Defragmenting the hard drive.
- Checking to make sure the Windows disk read cache is enabled.
- Try disabling your SSD cache - maybe the SSD is malfunctioning and slowing down disk accesses instead of speeding them up.
- If there is an option for it, make sure write-caching on the SSD is *disabled*.
- In task manager, see if your HDD usage is 100% or close to it.
- If so, open resource monitor and check which process is excessively hitting your hard drive. Windows Update was once doing that on my dad's laptop, slowing everything else down.
- Also try blasting your laptop's vents and fan with compressed air (while the laptop is off) to blow off any dust which may have built up. The laptop may be thermal throttling, causing the CPU to run at its slowest speed, the slowest speed being slower when on battery than on AC because of the firmware restriction I mentioned above.

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

This is a recent problem to a laptop that is 3 years old so something has clearly degenerated.
Everything worked fine until about a month ago so any consistent automatic reduction in clock speed or graphics performance doesn't seem relevant, unless those automatic settings have somehow been set even lower perhaps due to some BIOS corruption?
To be honest I never edit video when I am on the internet, I'll have to look at any connection there nukemaster
As I say there is clearly a power component involved because the problem is worse on battery and it never used to be there at all, not even on battery.
I see now that it is easy enough to test a PSU and a battery with a multi-meter and an inline amp meter.
Thanks Solandri, will also check out the SSD too (was using that for swap file) so seems like a good call!

Ironsounds · Apr 29, 2016

Hello... 6) is it a NiCad battery?
7) what is written on it amp/hrs volts etc?

*** Too TEST batteries or Power Supplies you need what is called a 'Load Center" this is not possible in Typical Voltage only multimeter... But I could show you how to do it with two multi-meters and a high watt resistor... you basically determine the Volt/AMP/hour of the battery, by Charging and the "Control and Measurement" of the Discharging... And then compare it to the Spec that is written on the label of the battery B )

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

thanks for advice so far --- willl post how tests turned out

Ironsounds · Apr 29, 2016

Hello... The material used in the "Battery" have a Voltage "Potential" and determine the "nominal" readings to be read/expected... Your laptop Battery have multi-cells of these wired in 'series" and "parallel" and you custom design your portable "power supply" for voltage and current needs.
So there is a potential of having a defective "open-short" circuit between them... splitting the 'housing" of these cells, it IS possible to repair the bad cells or connections.

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

Thanks ironsounds, I am aware now about even replacing defective cells inside a battery
My battery is Li-ion 20
Nom 10.8v, 6700mAh, 72Wh
Model Lenovo - L11P6R01

The PSU is giving out correct voltage and current.
Software on the laptop reports that the battery has lost about 13% of it's capacity (as if it were only a 58000 mAh battery now) which seems to square with the fact that it runs the laptop for less time than it used to?
I don't want to test the capacity of the battery now - could the battery not be giving out the same amps as it did when it was new (I know that mAh is about how long it can release current and is a different thing)?
I suppose testing the current output of the battery is very difficult since you need it to be powering the laptop when it it tested?

diapolical · Apr 29, 2016

I just moved the virtual memory paging file off the SSD and rebooted - video plays smoothly now when downloading something.
I was resistant to suspecting the SSD because of the aura they have!
Laptop is snappier even on battery it seems. Time will tell.

So thanks for that Solandri - it seems it was a hardware problem but not a power problem.
I must also acknowledge that Dugimodo said it wasn't a power problem.

I appreciate your offer to help me test the battery Ironsounds and while it has certainly lost some performance, I will hold onto it for now.
I will probably test the cells inside at a later date and replace any defective ones. I know how to do that now.

Dugimodo · Apr 29, 2016

SSD's need some space for housekeeping, you should keep them under 80% full Ideally. Also if the BIOS somehow got set for IDE or SATA mode instead of AHCI then TRIM support would not be working and you'd need to run an SSD utility from time to time to do it manually. Personally I never leave the Swap file on the SSD unless it's the only drive, with 8GB or more RAM you rarely will notice any performance issues from the swap file if indeed you ever do.

It was very clear from your description it was not a battery issue. It soon became even clearer you had to discover that for yourself.

Can a battery lose abiity to supply sufficient current to a laptop even when it has a good percentage charge?

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