ultimate GPU for Asus P5K premium black pearl edition XP SP3 E8500

kutneuker · Jul 21, 2016

Hi,
to all the specialists I'd like to know which Nvidia (not interested in ATI cards) GPU will still be compatible (preferably out of the box compatibility, not hacks) with my setup knowing it's still running XP SP3 32bit with intel core2duo E8500 cpu and 4GB ram.

I'm particularly looking for low power consumption (and low heat without needing extra cooling, I already have some quality zalman stuff). When doing comparisons on gpuboss I found that for same performance, the higher number series (like compare gtx 950 to 560ti) perform similarly but very more energy efficient. Not sure if they are as durable?

In my current setup I have a 8800GTS 512 GPU which still handles 1080p (full HD) quite well, but sometimes pixelates on YT when going from low res to 1080p (though that might be a software problem). On this old rig I also have MS flightsimX (FSX) installed, which I'd like to handle over to my dad or keep as a FSX rig with the best GPU working on it.
Also not interested in SLI setups (too much energy, heat, loss of breathing room for components).

If anybody has an opinion about a stable OS to replace that XP (sorry but 7 looks like sh.t to me and I don't understand why people accept that going through your files involves waiting /loading bar on a recent pc, while in all the other windows I have known since 3.1 it was instantaneous). Looking for a decent alternative that works reliably without need to fix it every 2 weeks as my pc is typically on for 2 months (yes usually it's about that time that xp or something else crashes/freezes, never any updates exept Anti Virus and never any problems). I refer to mozilla compared to my now unuseable internet explorer (9?) which never crashed, while moz needs updates like every week...:-(
Thx a lot!

hang-the-9 · Jul 21, 2016

For your CPU, and going from an old card like an 8800, a cheaper video card like a GT 730 GDDR5 is fine. If you will be moving the card to a faster system, you can get a GTX 950 which is at a good price now, or wait till the newer lower end 1000 series models come out.

For an OS, if you don't like 7, you have 10 as the other option but it's not a free upgrade from XP.

kutneuker · Jul 21, 2016

hi mod,
thx for the answer. I'm not completely convinced since when I compare those 2 on gpuboss, thet GT 730 you're proposing me doesn't come out as better (it's about fifty-fifty, both have the edge on some specs but the gt 730 doesn't appear superior at all globally).
Here is the link: http://gpuboss.com/gpus/GeForce-GT-730-vs-GeForce-8800S-512
Ok, it's a comparison with a 8800S as they don't seem to have the 8800GTS in their database and I threw the box away a while ago.
It's not like there is anything faulty with my GPU (just mentioning in case you misunderstood that).
I'm looking for more (see orig post), not similar. Cost isn't that much of an issue as it will be limited by what my MB can exploit anyway.
So is that the best realistic replacement?
Regarding OS, I didn't like 8 or 10 on my mom's pc (same remarks as for 7, loading bar for browsing through your files). More looking like alternative outside of windows (less obvious, that's why I'm asking it here amongst people who know).
best regards, seb.

hang-the-9 · Jul 21, 2016

kutneuker :

If you want to run Linux, that is not as good for games, especially Microsoft games like flight simulator, but will be fine for any other use.

Your CPU will hold back any card much faster than the 730, depending on the game that is, but a 750 Ti or a 950 will run on the same power supply than a 8800 can run. Issue may be the motherboard, make sure you do a BIOS update before swapping cards.

If you are having issues with file browsing, get a faster hard drive and more RAM.

kutneuker · Jul 21, 2016

Yeah, indeed I have some questions about real life compatibility/performance concerning FSX with more recent linux (it supports linux from the box, but the markings on the box are 7-8 year old), not sure about the situation in 2016.
Regarding gpu: so you're telling me that a gt 730 is a real upgrade? As gpuboss doesn't really suggests so, but of course it's just numbers without taking into account the pc generation/era (although standard benchmark tests are good predictors for me).
My power supply has sufficient reserve for more, although I'm sure at what the MB can perform without bottlenecking too much it won't be necessary.

Sum up: when going by the comparison on specs and benchmark performance (on gpubssss), I'm not convinced the gt 730 will be a real performance upgrade. Please comment on that.

PS: haven't tried 7, 8, 10 on my pc, it was on my mother's laptop which came from new with 7 4years ago and from the start pissed me off by loading times. It was a quality machine (about 1500€, about 3 times as the minimum price they call decent enough). Without sh.t running in the background. I've seen it on other pc's too, loading time just to open folder/access file, I had to see it to believe people wouldn't be enraged by this.
I use mine a lot (hence it's always on), placing ads, several files/programs open at a time (not so much lately) and on average 20 internet tabs open without any problem. I know my fixed rig was build with quality components, but outperforming more expensive portables/laptop (and other fixed/desktop on 7) that are way younger doesn't look like my old system is superb, it looks more like there is something seriously wrong with the younger ones running 7,8,10. I think they were all on 32bits, not even 64. Is that normal in this pc generation??
thx for your time, I appreciate ;-)

kutneuker · Jul 21, 2016

probably silly question but:
is it possible to run totally different gpu's on the same MB simultaneously (in symbiotic relation, so they enhance the graphic output as otherways there is no point to it)?
Just asking as there are several spare slots and I guess it might not only be designed for people wanting 2 or 3 identical gpu's in sli (that's what I call a heater). Of course I could only connect my hdmi cable to one of the different gpu's, but asking can't harm ;-)

kutneuker · Jul 21, 2016

Also, when comparing (correct version of gpu this time) the 8800GTS 512 vs GT 730 on gamedebate, the gt 730 almost comes out as a big downgrade (I'm not especially a gamer except FSX, but check out the gaming scores: the 8800gts is actually 2 times better on those!).
Here is the link: http://www.game-debate.com/gpu/index.php?gid=886&gid2=148&compare=geforce-gt-730-vs-geforce-8800-gts-512mb
Also as it's very recent and cheap (gt730), I fear compatibility issues (I DONT need compat with all the new stuff at which this card is probably directed at on a cheap system) with my older rig as surely they can't be bothered that much for the price they sell?

Again, I'm no expert on gpu evolution, but downgrading was never the question. It almost looks as if you're telling me my 8800gts is already bottlenecked by my setup. (doesn't look the case to me as in task manager cpu usage reaches average 60percent, with fullscreen video in full hd 1920x1080 stats for nerds say 'video fps average 25', with about 12 tabs open, others not especially video, not that it changes much; ram usage not more than 1,8G of the 4GB and all that in mozilla which when first installed was a real ram guzzler, probably because I used it simultaneously with internet explorer).

I mentioned low power requirement to avoid the overenthousiastic 'solutions' involving OCing everything (with all the issues AND costs) and SLI setups; reliability is high on my priority list.
Also not looking at changing chipset core2duo for a quad, as the quad was not faster on everything (and still ridiculously expensive for what is old material, even if it was the highest spec available for a certain generation).

hang-the-9 · Jul 22, 2016

You are talking about usage in a video, I am talking about game speeds. The 730 GDDR5 is about the same as an 8800 GTX, but it's faster than the GT or the other model. Depends on the game though. If you are not using the system for games, does not matter what you get. If you want a faster video card than the 8800GTS, a 740 should be just over it, and a 750 or 750 Ti is even better.

kutneuker · Aug 16, 2016

hi,
I'm gonna go for a 750ti.
According to 'thebottlenecker' site, it is matched to my pc if I change the processor to a quad q9550 (or 9650 which he doesn't list).
So I guess you know where I'm going from here. I'm always tempted by the new performance stuff, but I don't need a new pc right now as my screen wouldn't take it anyway (full hd not 4k).
But I'm going to try to max out my current pc with whatever upgrade I can without starting OCing things (well, the mobo seems to be able to do that automatically when needed).
So first the cpu:
I see lots of ebaylistings proposing to change it with a Xeon. Is that reliable and worthwhile on my p5k mobo?
SSD:
I have sata II (3gb) or pcie (only 1 slot is 16x if I'm correct and I'm gonna keep it for the gpu; maybe there is a second one as the manual states I can put 2 gpu's in sli that need 16x).
There seems to be a lot of development (or is that just sales pitch?) in ssd technology, one being putting it on a pcie port instead of sata for better data transfer rate?
RAM:
at the moment I have 4GB (4x1) Nvidia SLI DDR2
Does it make sense to swap for 8GB (4x2 is the max this mobo accepts) meaning will it get recognized by a 32bit OS? Win or linux, doesn't matter.
The ram seems very specific PC2 6400 1GB dual channel SLI ready EPP 4-4-4. I'm not fully confident on which ram to install to get 8GB as last year I read a lot about problems related to this mobo ('OS installer guy' fraud opened pc and located cpu wrongly so pc didn't work anymore) as the threads (ok, most of them being 2008-2009) mentioning this mobo is very picky about which ram to use. Also from what I've read, the ram I have now seems to be very good one and I don't want to diminish performance. The mobo is ddr2 800MHz (this is what chipset supports officially) but manual says with asus super memspeed technology the mobo supports 1066MHz natively.
PSU:
no need to change that as the newer gpu will consume less (60W vs 135W) even though a Q9550 or 9650 will consume 30W more than my current E8500.
Thx for all the info and feel free to just respond with links.
I'm not gaming, but lots of tabs open, viewing high speed videos in hd pushes it (see previous posts), as does rapidly scrolling in ebay watchlist (which is always full-1, max 200 items, so 199) or anything else. When crossreading multiple pages/tabs with lots of quick scrolling the cpu gets its workout. Absolutely can't do the same on newer highend laptops (4 years old), the only reason I can see is that their integrated graphics are crap.

hang-the-9 · Aug 16, 2016

kutneuker :

You are a bit all over the place for your computer, quite a bit with wrong or over-thought info.

For an SSD, just use the normal SATA connections, same as your current hard-drive. There is no need to look into higher end PCIe drives. There is no such thing as nVidia SLI DDR2 RAM, you just have DDR2 RAM. There is dual channel RAM support on the motherboard, you are probably confusing that for SLI, which is for linking multiple video cards together. You can't use more than that in a 32 bit system. OS does matter since Linux will not run Windows program natively, you need to run a utility like WINE, and that does not work with all programs or work well at times.

If you want to run more RAM, you can find compatible RAM on any site that allows you to plug in your system model as a search, www.crucial.com is good for that. Find the RAM, it would be guaranteed compatible.

kutneuker · Aug 16, 2016

hi, thx for the info.
Of course I know what sli is as I mentioned in my first post. I fully read my asus mobo manual several times. Not sure what you mean by 'all over the place and wrong or over-thought info' without any explanation, I looked up lots of stuff but to have the opinion of a community with loads more experience in building pc's than I have I asked some specific questions here.

I've read on the speed limit in sata2 vs sata3 vs pcie and hope for a precise or experience based answer, not an answer like 'there is no need' as that is not quantifiable and looks like somebody's opinion.
I just mentioned the full name that is written on my ram sticks (since the part number starts with OCZ they may of course be the manufacturer rather than nvidia but if you know them you know what I meant). With all the different manufacturers and the nvidia promises I am certain this must perform better than first price ram of the same era. So doubling my ram is useless unless changing OS to 64bit, which I think will only slow down my typical use.
Thx for pointing me to WINE, will look that up as I do use a few typical microsoft office products (word, excel and calculator, no other programs that I'm aware of; no, no media play, no outlook, no messenger etc).
I was thinking of dual OS, one fast (xp, linux, other?) and one like win7 or so to be able to log in into sites that demand any windows more recent than xp (bank etc). So I'd only switch to that os when I need it and cut it the rest of the time.

Regarding ssd my question is legit as big things can happen in short time. Example: For long term (family videos requiring archive grade dvd-r/+r) media storage for instance, they are still selling 'gold' dvd (still good for cd-r) while M-disc is much cheaper and has as much longer life expectancy and M-disc is not exactly new. Redundant products don't disappear overnight, I'm at home in many businesses and things sell just because people know the name and want what they know, not because the product is good.
Lots of people are giving a second life to their pc with ssd and deserve the best suited solution as anybody else, marketing is only directed at newish pc's and that's where I call for the expertise/knowledge of the forum.

Any info regarding Xeon install in 775 socket and effect of that mod on reliability of p5k premium mobo?
thx for the info, seb

hang-the-9 · Aug 17, 2016

You must have this RAM: OCZ OCZ2N800SR4GK SLI-Ready Edition DDR2, it has an nVidia SLI sticker on it. It's not really SLI anything, it's just a marketing sticker on the RAM. The brand is OCZ. There is no such thing as SLI RAM, SLI depends on the motherboard and video card, type of RAM used does not matter.

If you want to spend more on a PCIe SSD, up to you, you won't see any difference in speed outside of a benchmark. For an older system like yours, spending money on a higher end storage is the wrong place to spend money on. Use it on a new motherboard, CPU and RAM instead.

The cheapest PCIe slot SSD I see is an OCZ 128GB one for $140. A SATA 150GB SSD from OCZ is about $50. Which one do you want if you need a stopwatch to tell any difference? It's like spending $150,000 on a car that can get to 60 in 3.5 seconds vs $80,000 on a car that can do that in 4 seconds. Sure there is a .5 second difference, how often will you actually use that driving around to work or the store? Is it worth double the money? Not likely.

kutneuker · Aug 19, 2016

hi mod, you got me a bit laughing (sorry) carrying on about the 'sli' marking on the ram, yes of course I know ram is not sli/crossfire etc ;-)
Cars are my specialty. Of course you don't take your sportscar daily to work or the shops, it's for a blast on great roads. 4s or 3.5s matters ;o It's like having a woman/man 12,5% more pretty, it makes a massive difference lol x-p
Bought a q9550. GPU and thus ram and thus 64bit OS will need to follow. As gpu ram gets system ram allocated leaving less for the system (at first I thought it was the opposite) and 8GB ram is recommended for a 750ti or above. I can't believe how expensive the pc2 8500 1066 ram actually is!
I might take your advice (you'll have seen this 1000x before) and upgrade MB cpu ram. Is DDR3 MB the sweet spot now? As DDR3 ram looks way cheaper. Looks like I'll have to spend 2-300€ in total (I allocated 30€ for 64bit OS).

Of course I looked at new MB etc but new CPU etc made the bill quickly explode (800€ with second hand parts) for what I don't need at the moment (will buy newish system later on). After reading loads about my asus p5k MB last year I was reluctant on buying more recent MB as apparently build quality suffered later on. My mobo and complete setup has been trouble free working continuously 24/7 for 7-8 years (on average I got a bug every 2 months and need to restart; win XP pro needs reinstall every 2 years although it's been longer now). It was 2-3 times the price of previous pc's but it also lasted that much longer. Reliability is high on my list.

Feel free to recommend me a good used MB cpu option (or which generation to choose 2nd hand), most important being a good MB as the rest can be upgraded later. Thx for all the info, thread to be closed soon unless people want to know the effect of each change, I could report on that.

kutneuker · Aug 20, 2016

any opinion on which generation is the best bargain at the moment and is reliable (see previous post) ? thx.

In the meanwhile, I used a Q9550 and 9650, I resold the 9650 as the minor difference in performance didn't justify the doubled price. Cpu use lower now and looks like previous cpu E8500 was the bottleneck. The Q9550 typically reaches 40% on 1080p and average 85% on 1440p (never thought that 8800GTS would cope with it). Not running out of ram (4 installed -> 3,2 useable). Not sure how far the cpu would still follow with a gtx 750 ti (about the limit according to bottlenecker), but indeed, I'm no real gamer except FSX.

I've been starting 2 new platforms (mini ITX covers my needs, the only question is if 2 ram slots are sufficient to do justice to capabilities of i5 i7 22nm), but the main headache is not hardware, but OS (I'm not gonna throw away perfect printer scanner etc because microsoft didn't feel like supporting the drivers anymore or hp updating them). Even on ldlc (a french pc selling site) users who bought a new windows (7 8 10 all versions still available, they all cost about the same too) are having problems with it on a clean install. But that's another debate, so thx for all the help and directions.

hang-the-9 · Aug 22, 2016

kutneuker :

There are several Best Picks links right off the Tom's homepage http://www.tomshardware.com/ The lower end parts from there are good for a fast non-gaming system.

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ultimate GPU for Asus P5K premium black pearl edition XP SP3 E8500

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