Why is a minimum of 60 fps necessary nowadays?

Senseo1990 · Jul 28, 2016

Maybe it has always been like this but even though ive been a gamer for way over a decade now I only really noticed this in the past few years:

If your framerate drops below 60fps, even if its just by 3 fps it will become pretty much unplayable. I think that i was able to play within the 50-60fps range just fine years ago. But now its 60+ or nothing. The difference of smoothness between 57fps and 60fps (let alone 55fps and 60) is immense. Has this really always been like that, is this a recent development, or is it just me?

(Im not talking about vsync btw. I know about the vsync related 60fps to 30fps drops)

IDProG · Jul 28, 2016

Not really. I'm okay with 50 FPS, but not lower than that (even 1 FPS lower).

Frag Maniac · Jul 28, 2016

It depends on the person and how the game is coded as far as how noticeable it is.

Some people aren't as bothered by 30 FPS capped games, but in games where slight dips below 60 become very problematic, it's usually because of poor optimization.

What's really annoying is when devs use cheap practices like tying a type of physics or something together with another graphics feature that has no business being tied to it, and lock the physics to 30 FPS.

When it comes down to it, a lot of games are just coded for inferior consoles, and poorly ported to PC. Hopefully development will get better when PS Neo and Xbox Project Scorpio come out end of next year, which will have 4-6 TFLOPs graphics power. The Scorpio will also be KB/M compatible.

That will put consoles much more on level with PC, and hopefully push devs to make graphics more high end, with better porting to PC. In fact Scorpio will be able to run same version of Windows PC can, so some games might go back to being developed on PC.

Senseo1990 · Jul 28, 2016

IDProG :

I honestly cannot imagine that. Im not one of those super demanding gamers (at least I think im not), but <60fps is not enjoyable at all. In fact, I cant even hit enemies, drive cars or do anything properly (even in singleplayer games, im not playing in the high ranks of multiplayer titles) at 55fps. And I was fine with less than that years ago.

Im also absolutely fine with console games which are capped at 30fps too. I think a lot of Playstation 3 games were 30fps titles and I never noticed any stuttering back then.

Frag Maniac :

Yes, some games are much worse in that regard than others. GTA 5 is a prime example. Unfortunately the same applies to some PC exclusive titles as well though :/

ikaz · Jul 28, 2016

60fps is not a minimum requirement for every game some games can play great at 30fps, now a bigger issue is when a game frame jumps all around. A game that runs at a solid 30fps will play better than a game that's going from 40fps to 60fps all the time.

Mike3k24 · Jul 28, 2016

Coming from someone who had a laptop that had an Intel Celeron that could only play minecraft and left for dead, it feels amazing to have 60fps in pretty much every game I play now I have a PC.

koffeeshop77 · Jul 28, 2016

in the last years it has been more prevalent that the FPS remain "stable" and this is also partially due to the improvement of screens e.g it is better to run a stable 30,60,120. or whatever your HZ of your screen is at, and/or divisible by to keep a smooth frame rate (relative to you eyes).
In Addition to that, games have became more power hungry due to better graphics or more often than not, crappy ports from consoles.
with the combination of those two, it leads almost to a demand curve
(price/(quality/port)) + (devaluation overtime of you hardware)
inevitably , if you want a constant 60fps you have to pay for it, or lower your expectations in graphics.

on the other side regaurding your question, a few years ago, I bought the top card at the time, and I had plenty of headroom to meet the required FPS, hence my hardware did not devalue as fast as it does now, so the problem your having arouse much later.
of course there are always those games where you look back on that were your favorites back then, and now a facebook game have better quality graphics, or even your phone.

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

ikaz :

Vsync should help with jumping fps, right? Because even with vsync on the difference between 60fps and 55fps is insane. I just tried playing GTA 5 with a steady 30fps, and Im sorry to say this but: I simply dont believe that anyone actually enjoys it like that. 30fps on PS3 were fine with me back when I played it there. But on PC its something entirely different.

And I wont notice the difference between 60 and 70fps, but once it drops only a few fps below 60 i notice it right away.

Mike3k24 :

+1!

koffeeshop77 :

Oh, so you think monitors are the cause of this issue nowadays? Im playing on a 60hz TV, so that would explain why 60fps is the magic number

Frag Maniac · Jul 29, 2016

Senseo1990 :

That's likely because you have settings too high. In some games when you have Vsync on, dipping below it can cause excessive problems. The solution is to either cap frame rate just below 60 with something lie RTSS, or lower settings until you achieve a more constant 60 FPS.

koffeeshop77 · Jul 29, 2016

Frag Maniac :

Senseo1990 :

That's likely because you have settings too high. In some games when you have Vsync on, dipping below it can cause excessive problems. The solution is to either cap frame rate just below 60 with something lie RTSS, or lower settings until you achieve a more constant 60 FPS.

Was I some how too technical?

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

Frag Maniac :

I know about the potential Vsync problems. I can trie capping the framerate, but Im afraid it will simply constantly stutter then, instead of occassionally.

koffeeshop77 :

Why?

Frag Maniac · Jul 29, 2016

Senseo1990 :

Actually it sounds like you don't know if you think capping FPS slightly below 60 will make the problem worse.

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

Frag Maniac :

Thats because I dont believe that fluctuation of FPS creates problems with stuttering, but Im quite sure that everything below 60fps leads to stuttering . Vsync or not.

Frag Maniac · Jul 29, 2016

Senseo1990 :

Which shows how naive you are. Frame drops are one of the main causes of stuttering, as well as excessive up and down fluctuation. Some games can handle it better than others, but as a rule, excessive fluctuation is not good, and easy to minimize via frame rate capping. Games that have wild fluctuations generally also aren't optimized very well.

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

Frag Maniac :

And yet I notice no stuttering when GTA 5 goes from 60 to 70 and back again, but notice a change from 60 to 57 right away.

Frag Maniac · Jul 29, 2016

Senseo1990 :

Which further proves your naivety. When using Vsync, fluctuations are always more noticeable when they occur blow the refresh cutoff, than above.

I can see now WHY you're naive though. Rather than listen to those whom are in the know, you argue with them, even in a thread you made to ask such questions.

Do you want to learn, or be stubborn? Choice is yours.

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

Frag Maniac :

Thats because I dont believe that fluctuation of FPS creates problems with stuttering, but Im quite sure that everything below 60fps leads to stuttering . Vsync or not.

I only argue with those, who dont read posts.

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

I just capped my FPS to 55 by the way. As expected: No drops, yet constant stutter.

J_E_D_70 · Jul 29, 2016

Wait. Did I accidentally click on a CoD post?

Senseo1990 · Jul 29, 2016

J_E_D_70 :

?

J_E_D_70 · Jul 29, 2016

Nevermind... I will say that with gsync the frame rate moving around just doesnt matter. Witcher varies between 53-60 and smooth as glass. Highly recommend it.

giantbucket · Jul 29, 2016

i know nothing about any of this, but i'll wager a bet that it's not the frame rate that matters but the partially filled / half updated frames that bug you. can you try to play the same game on the same resolution on an LCD and then on a CRT monitor? i wonder if the way a CRT handles signals would matter for you. or if you lower the resolution to crank up the refresh rate if that would help or highlight other things.

Frag Maniac · Jul 29, 2016

Senseo1990 :

LOL, I should be saying that to you, because clearly you assume a lot and don't know what you're talking about. Also, I said cap at slightly below 60, like 58 or 59, not 55.

Either way though, if stuttering increases when capping just below 60, it's not the capping that's doing it. Something is wrong with your rig or your other settings.

koffeeshop77 · Jul 30, 2016

I think you need more ram.

Senseo1990 · Jul 30, 2016

Thanks for the replies

J_E_D_70 :

Oh thanks for the advice, that does indeed sound interesting. While im currently not looking to buy a new monitor+gpu, I will keep that in mind.

giantbucket :

Ive got an old (very old!) crt sitting around here somewhere, if it still works I will test some games with it.
What I did now is set GTA 5 to 1280x720 with a refresh rate of 75. Oddly enough, the game seems less smooth even at a constant 60-65fps now. Maybe I get irritated when the fps are lower than the hz? Does that make any sense?

Frag Maniac :

I only assumed one thing: That flunctuations dont matter as much as dropping below 60fps does. The rest of my posts were no assumptions, but reports on what im experiencing.

Frag Maniac :

Did that, same result.

Frag Maniac :

And what might that be?

koffeeshop77 :

I monitored my ram usage: Its 4 out of 8gb and I dont have anything else running in the background. I thought that 16gb werent absolutely necessary, if youre not planning to do lots of things simultaneously, or am I wrong?

Why is a minimum of 60 fps necessary nowadays?

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