i3-6100 + 1050 Ti; Good processor or needs more beef?

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Hello PCP! I'm looking to make a super tiny M-ITX build, and I want to cram everything onto a single board. With that said, I want to use this part list:
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/kWVjqk
And this PicoPSU kit:
http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-160-XT-192W-Adapter-Power-Kit
I saw this recommended on Not From Concentrate's channel and I wanted to try building something super tiny. Any thoughts?

Petrossa · Jan 17, 2017

Well, it does depend on your usage scenario, but as a general purpose and media system, it will do just fine.
For gaming purposes it will be able to keep up with the 1050Ti.

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

I probably wouldn't consider the 6100 anymore. The Pentium G4560 is basically the same CPU only with AVX instructions disabled - it's a 3.5ghz 2c/4t Skylake CPU, and it's about $40-50 cheaper. Or, you might consider the i3 7100 which is the same price but 200mhz faster with slightly lower power draw.

EDIT: You don't need the aftermarket cooler. The C7 is actually only marginally better than Intel's stock cooler, as they're about the same size. Save yourself the $40, or maybe get something like an i5 7400T with the money saved?

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Good point Ecky! I chose the Cryorig C7 because I really like the color scheme on a previous black ITX build, it's more for cosmetic style.
Is the Pentium G4560 new? Haven't heard of it. I'll poke around processors some more.

SgtScream · Jan 17, 2017

What are you going to use this computer for?

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

It is new. You'd need to make sure you get a board with an updated BIOS, old stock may not be updated to support it yet, or go with a B250/H270 board which would be guaranteed to support it. These new chipsets will also support Intel's "Optane" technology, which should be orders of magnitude faster than any existing solid state drives when it hits the market.

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Gaming, but mainly to make the smallest, leanest and fastest computer on a power budget of 160W. I know the small PSU is capable of 200W, but I want to lean safe here.

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Should I wait for these Optane drives? I'd want them to be M.2 also. Any idea for release?

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

Here's a good article on it written about 3 weeks ago:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10932/kaby-lake-systems-with-intel-optane-ssds-coming-soon

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Unless Optane drives get bigger, I'll have to pass. Aside from the M.2 SSD, I plan to have NO internal 2.5 or 3.5 devices to cache from. I think I'll leave it alone. On a different note, you think the Pentium can keep up with the 1050 Ti, or should I try a low power i5?

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

GPU and CPU load are largely independent of one another. Either a CPU can deliver the frames you want in the games you play, or it can't.

I'll make up a scenario: Let's say in Battlefield One the Pentium will average 55fps and dip down to 40 in intensive areas, whereas an i5 will average 65fps and dip down to 55. It doesn't matter whether you pair a GTX 1050 or 1080 with either CPU, it's not going to change how many frames the CPU can deliver and you'll never get above 55fps averages with the Pentium. With a GPU you can always lower graphical settings to increase framerate, but with a CPU, you get what you get.

EDIT: My opinion, CPUs are lasting longer and longer, because the rate of improvement has slowed. My 4 year old i5 is still plenty for my needs, and any CPU you buy today may last even longer. GPUs on the other hand are replaced far more quickly, so it makes more sense to me to spend more on the component that's not going to be outdated as soon.

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

Well, now that you mention it, I do have an i5-2400. I salvaged it from a Point Of Sale system a company was throwing out. I was expecting to find a Pentium or something, but there it was. Problem is, I can't find any M-ITX mobos for it. Any ideas?

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

I scored an 1155 ITX board on eBay a while ago by buying an ITX barebones and selling the parts I didn't want. You're not going to find any new 1155 boards.

Be aware that the i5 2400 is a 95w TDP CPU. I doubt it actually draws 95w (TDP is mostly cooler related, but it's definitely going to be more power hungry than a newer 22nm or 14nm chip.

Some interesting bits:
i5 2400 - quad core, 3.4ghz turbo, 95w TDP
i5 7600T - quad core, 3.7ghz turbo, 35w TDP
Pentium G4640 - 3.5ghz 2c/4t, 54w
i3 6100 - 2c/4t 3.7ghz, 51w TDP
i3 6300 - 2c/4t 3.9ghz, 65w TDP
i3 7120 - 2c/4t 4.1ghz, 51w TDP

TDP does not equal power consumption exactly. Often a whole series of CPUs will have the same TDP rating, which just means they can be used with the same cooler, but some will draw less power than others. However, Intel definitely does some binning to get higher quality chips into lower power configurations.

Newer CPUs will also perform better at the same clockspeed. When comparing a 2xxx vs 6xxx or 7xxx CPU, the difference is roughly 30%, so a 3.7ghz i5 7600T (just as an example) would perform somewhere around a 4.8ghz i5 2xxx.

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

Dunno if it's of any interest to you, but power consumption is something I have great interest in. Here's a frequency vs wattage chart for the i5 in my signature (just CPU power):

My CPU has a 77w TDP, however at 2ghz it's a 15w chip, at 3ghz it's a 27w chip, at the stock 3.6ghz with an undervolt it's a 45w chip, at 4ghz it's a 60w chip and at 4.5ghz it's a 120w chip. Power consumption is exponential as clockspeed increases.

SgtScream · Jan 17, 2017

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft :

For gaming i'd make sure you get at least an intel core i5, if you expect to run triple A titles for a few years at a respectable frame rate. Even if it means spending most of your budget on it.

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

For what it's worth, a modern i3 has just as much multithreaded performance as an older i5 due to improvements in performance with successive generations. Single-threaded performance is much higher and power consumption is down.

SpeedEnforcedByAircraft · Jan 17, 2017

My biggest deal is with power consumption. I want this PicoPSU to be running well within a safe limit, so as long as an i3 can keep up, I'll take it. In other news, know where I could sell an i5-2400?

Ecky · Jan 17, 2017

Craigslist, eBay, the classifieds on here perhaps.

i3-6100 + 1050 Ti; Good processor or needs more beef?

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