What/How Many Radiators do I need for custom loop

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I have not water-cooled since the GTX 580 so I do not know what I need.

i7-6800k 4-4.2 ghz 1.3-1.35V
2x EVGA GTX 1070's

Those are the only items that I want to water-cool.

I have room for 2X 360mm rads up to 30mm each. Or I could do 2x 280's

Not familiar with what these components need for cooling. Plan to overclock everything more then I currently am.

Please advise what LPH I would need also depending on how many Rads.
 
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n0ns3ns3
the bare minimum that you NEED is ~120x4 rad surface (slim 30mm).
Beyond that it's mainly to be able to run the fans at lower RPM to reduce noise.
2x360 is exactly what i'd do for your system to have the fans running at below 1200RPM.

The rads i'd suggest to look at are alphacool ST30 XFLow. They allow very flexible installation (because of ports on both sides), easy fill and drain (because of the XFLow), reduces tubing/clutter (again XFLow).

you are going to need a decent pump to push the liquid through that many components at good flow rate - D5 is an excellent example.

tubing size (ID) does not play a roll. so pick whatever you like. from my experience, for complex loops like yours, thinner tubing (7-9mm ID) is better. otherwise...
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Geekwad

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Running a single loop, the 2x360 will work well.

The exact parts you'll need (depending on tubing selection and configuration) will be tough to come up with, but this sticky will help:

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/277130-29-read-first-watercooling-sticky#3718878

It's a plumbing product, essentially, so just getting the right joints and fittings is a matter of mapping/drawing it out (which I recommend) based on your case. The EKWB configuration tool is also helpful:

https://www.ekwb.com/custom-loop-configurator/
 
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Deleted member 362816

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Thanks for the information. Still trying to figure out if I want to get into water-cooling again or not. It has been awhile 2010 to be exact. I had a very nice loop back then. No idea where the parts went and if they were still around I am sure they would be corroded.

I do like some of the Magicool rads 27mm but then again I might as well just go all EK since I know their products will work.
 
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Geekwad

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I think what's nicest is that you don't have to water cool anymore to get the best performance (not like running space-heater parts of 'yore). Good air coolers get you 90%+ of the way there, with none of the hassle.

Just this last weekend I did the annual on the dual loop, so dorked my whole Saturday. Sure does look nice though :)

 
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n0ns3ns3

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the bare minimum that you NEED is ~120x4 rad surface (slim 30mm).
Beyond that it's mainly to be able to run the fans at lower RPM to reduce noise.
2x360 is exactly what i'd do for your system to have the fans running at below 1200RPM.

The rads i'd suggest to look at are alphacool ST30 XFLow. They allow very flexible installation (because of ports on both sides), easy fill and drain (because of the XFLow), reduces tubing/clutter (again XFLow).

you are going to need a decent pump to push the liquid through that many components at good flow rate - D5 is an excellent example.

tubing size (ID) does not play a roll. so pick whatever you like. from my experience, for complex loops like yours, thinner tubing (7-9mm ID) is better. otherwise it is harder to get rid of air bubbles in tubes. also, i'd suggest to start with flexible tubing until you have finalized the loop layout.

Try to avoid "up and down" paths for you loop - it traps air and makes harder to drain/fill the loop. Ideally, you want your loop to be as close as possible to a circle.

Drain port at the lowest point is very convenient.

Flow meter and a couple of temperature sensors (for liquid) are welcome (you probably going to need a T splitter for that or you can connect them to unused ports on rads).

Loop order does not matter. Just make sure the res comes right before pump (not must, but good for beginners).

Connect your GPU blocks in parallel - less flow restriction for the loop and better performance.

P.S.
A bit of showoff :)
here is my system recent rework build that is almost finalized:
https://goo.gl/photos/8Z5uAZ4CjZ8cVa1s8
 
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Mikel_4

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You've owned these

  • ■ compatible GPU waterblock, https://www.ekwb.com/configurator/ if you need specific full cover water block, or you can opt for universal GPU waterblock such as EK FC Thermosphere (for reference GTX 1070 PCB or short top) or Supremacy VGA (for custom tall PCB) + passive heatsink for VRM.
    ■ matching fittings > tube size (inner diameter & outer diameter).
    ■ pump, XSPC Ion is reservoir + pump all in one and should provide sufficient flow rate and static head, some tech stuff at www.extremerigs.net about flow rate + static head + radiator + fan
Cooling two GTX 1070
Founders Edition GTX 1070 is 180 watt TDP, that watt is suppose to be dissipate by radiator, technically the wider the rad's surface and faster RPM fans will dissipate more watt, if noise won't be problem then a 360mm rad with three 3000RPM fan such as EK FF5 3000RPM should do fine, if your card draw more than 180 watt then series of 280 or 360 rad suite better.

Suggested parts
- two full cover water block + matching PCIE slot multi connect such as EK FC Terminal
- matching fittings > tube size, remember that there're two type of tube; soft and rigid, vendors offer different ID/OD size, EK use 10 ID/12 OD and 12 ID/16 OD rigid tube, alphacool use 10 ID/13 OD rigid tube and other size, you can't use EKWB 10/12mm fittings on alphacool 10/13mm tube and vice versa.
- XSPC Ion
- two 360 rad or one EK Coolstream XE 360.
- coolant, special premix contain anti corrosion and bio inhibitor, you can buy cheaper car distilled water but who knows what algae will dwell on your loop.

First time air bleeding and pump priming
Easiest way is to watch video tutorial, I suggest you start with soft tube, after you get the feel of your loop then you can consider rigid tube such as PETG, brass, borosilicate glass or carbon tube.
 
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Splas0rr

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I would also recommend 1 loop for entire system less trouble setting up better head pressure better cooling in my opinion I wouldn't go for an EK XE 360 because several factors given it is probably the best 360 rad out there .
I could pick 2 HWLabs black ice nemesis 360GTS radiators it will provide better cooling and will run sub fans sub 800rpm and fans I highly recommend the corsair ML pro 120mm fans they beat everything currently in static pressure and airflow they peak and perform better then 3000 rpm fans such as vardar noctua industrial 3000 they much more effective 3000rpm fans do you have room for a reservoir?i would most definitely pick a EK pump/reservoir combo like EK-XRES 140 Revo D5 PWM (incl. sleeved pump Probably the best D5 pump ATM thx to EKs redesign to pwn bases performance and you will get better performance with that pump sucks as head pressure = better flow and it's going to be really quiet.
I know size of tubes makes a lot of difference when it comes to cooling efficiency use to big diameter tube the cooling of ur waterblocks will suffer because of to much water flow
 
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n0ns3ns3

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@Splas0rr are you serious ?
3000 RPM ? and 6 of them ? and you suggest to seat next to it ?
and really, Corsair fans beat everything ? they are decent performing shiny toys at most.
And yet, performance crown still goes to Noctua NF-F12 which can be shared with GT.
As for Nemesis, they are cool. Have one of them (GTS240 X-Flow). Really like the finish. But ST30 from alphacool is slimmer and has more ports. it is useful when you get into "creative" territory.
 
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Splas0rr

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Geekwad

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A bit more comity is in order here; It is possible to disagree with someone without being disagreeable.
 
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Splas0rr

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Indeed I just stating facts and if you interpret this wrong I'm sorry but you really need to read up on ur facts before stating that others are wrong or is this wrong ?

 
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Mikel_4

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GTS series optimize for slow RPM fan (HWL call it stealth mode), which is good for audible sensitive users with not so " silent case " and practically reuse old case fan. the downside is price tag = EK XRES inc D5 pump + two GTS 360 already 200$ +, best of water cooling 6800K + two GTX 1070 is replacement, let say you expect fans will be dead 4 to 5 years and pump 2 to 3 years, those parts would probably easy to find even if it come from different vendor (Laing D5 had been re-branded to "MCP55-swiftech or VPP-alphacool, etc"), what about GPU cooler? any (QC troubled) ACX 3.0 seller? So while you plan water cooling your CPU+GPU, ought to consider also aesthetic flavor down to smallest detail.

Statistic numbers:
On free SPL any >1000 to 1300 RPM does have distracting noise, I've no idea where 16-37 dB were measured at and were there any blocking between sound source and sound recorder mic, but most of us put fans inside case right? would that reduce sound pressure a bit? I use Corsair ML series myself because the promising life span, occasionally change to Vardar FF5 for maximum Coolstream XE 360 TDP dissipation, I recently put Vardar and ML face to face (when I was boring and play with junior), Vardar put ML down and ML didn't.

On radiator:
GTS 360 will likely fits more on most cases than thicker XE 360 especially on front, on top, most cases have ~ 6cm clearance, so we agree that faster fan dumps more heat, OPs mentioned OC which need maximum rad where every °C drop matter, i.e water into rad is at 30°C, water out of rad is at 26°C, the rad is 30mm thick / 14 FPI, fan is at ~ 1100RPM, theoretically to drop Δ coolant temperature more we could increase RPM (run fan at 100% speed) or add more fans in push-pull, so for tight space where there's no alternative left to add more rads, setup push-pull high performing rad is cheaper than using two push only low RPM fan optimize rad.




 
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Karadjgne

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Something about testing for SP. It's not a standard. There is no universally accepted way to test for static pressure. At all. At best it's just a fan blowing some water away and the measurement of how far it moved the leading edge. Every company has a different setup, possibly different angles on the fans to 'pat' the results, different surface tension, different surfaces, even different water density. So it's entirely feasible to get a Noctua fan to push 1.8mmH²0 and that Corsair fan to push 4.2mmH²0, yet swap fan tests and the Noctua to push 3.6mm and the Corsair to push 2.4..

And all that is not taking into consideration the fpi of the rads, some of which do better with a directed airflow from the Noctua, some of which might do better with higher cfm, some of which might do better with lower cfm due to turbulence set up by broader area fans.

I like the nf-f12, but for my money, it's overshadowed by the Phanteks PH-F120MP.
 
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n0ns3ns3

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Mate, it's not a fact, it's just another review. And you are not stating fact, you are quoting some reviews.
For example, check out LTT, they still claim that noctua is the best fan ever made.
I've no idea what equipment they are using and how.
From my small experience of using couple of fans on couple of rads, my top picks are GT and NF-F12.
Corsair's SP and AF fans turned to be a complete crap as they were noisy with short life span and bad performance.
Vardar fans , well, they were noticeably underperfroming in my build so went back to noctua.
The NF-F12 has one small thing called "focused flow" and it really makes it better than most of the other fans.

Most of liquid enthusiast are using fans in 800-1200 RPM range. so really don't give a ... what happens beyond 1500RPM - it's too loud to be next to it.
The interesting thing about noise is not only DB, but the tone as well. so while may be noctua is louder, but it is by far less annoying sound.
 
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rubix_1011

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Funny thing because the EK Vardar fans I tested on the Predator are actually very quiet, even at full speed, which is around 1900RPM, I think?

Also, fan noise makes a big difference if you run in push or pull - pull should produce less noise because the fan blades are not constantly buffeting against blown back air from the radiator fins like you get in push config. Also, pull config is typically better performing or equal in most scenarios at most speeds and also partially negates for the dead zone in the middle of the fan that push encounters.
 
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n0ns3ns3

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My guess is that the fan performance/noise may vary depending on the rad/case/grill size, shape, FPI, and what not :)
They also may vary by quality. I had one noctua WPM fan with very annoying clicking noise from WPM.
But the push/pull question was answered many times. Performance wise it is push/pull > push > pull. but the difference is very small. Also depends on rad FPI and thickness. Due to my affection to compact builds push/pull is out of my list. On the rads mounted as intake, I prefer to do pull due to easy cleaning. No dust filter has so far did the job 100%. for exhaust rads, don't care. currently doing push for aesthetics and symmetry.

BTW, rubix check out how much more I managed to put into Nano :) though still not finalized. will do a bit more work (add res inside, change tubing layout, mod VRM heatsink and finally replace acrylic with galss) before making build log/adventure post. it's fun to see that small thing dealing with about 350-400watt tourture while being from barely audible to quietly humming depending on target temperature.
 
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Mikel_4

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true, hwlabs call it "opti-flow" meaning closing the gap on rad's "dead zone". If clearance won't be an issue you can try adding matching blank fan shroud which should eliminate dead zone. IDK about other rad, but my XE 360 doesn't work well on pull-pull although it does seem quieter then push-pull.
 
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Splas0rr

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Hey guys well i am kinda speaking from experience with the NF-F12 and Vardars i believe ive have had 2 models F4-120ER and Furious Vardar FF5-120 and Phanteks fans silent wing etc.
I agree about Corsair fan I have tryied a bunch of those aswell they where noisy beering noise etc but the ML pro fans are the absolute best i've tryied yet to date and rewievs can't be trusted and nothing is set as a standard for testing static pressure sure .
But Google Corsair ML120 pro rewiev and see all the rewievs and 90% agrees with my conclusion about this fan they cant all be wrong i hope.
One of my radiators is an EK XE 360 and this is the rad ive tryied most fans on and for me they perform quiter more effective than ive experienced with other fans .
And i have respect for ur thoughts about fans etc once again the fact is my only concern here basically I don't care about brand and being a fanboy of some sorts .
And push-pull with the ML120pro fans has made i big difference on the EK XE 360 and the 3 HWLabs GTX 480s all pretty dense radiators hence more performance with push-pull.
And "The NF-F12 has one small thing called "focused flow" and it really makes it better than most of the other fans"
That's something you have to elaborate never heard of this feature.


 
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Karadjgne

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MartinsLabs has done extensive testing of the push/pull theory, in concert with fan shrouds and without. From their perspective, fans less than @1300rpm are slightly more effective than push, fans over @1500rpm are slightly more effective than pull and fans spinning between @1300-1500rpm doesn't make any difference. Push/pull has the advantage over both because the pull side generally creates enough vacuum the straighten airflow, negating much of the turbulence of most fans, since most fans have such a broad area of angled flow. In the case of the Noctua nf-f12 and other focus flow fans, push/pull is almost pointless as the flow is almost perfectly perpendicular to the fins allowing for almost 0 turbulence. It's not a hard concept. When fans push IIII you can use low rpm, but when fans push \\\/// you'll either need high sp to force the air through or high cfm to smother the fins, forcing the air through, either way, high cfm/sp doesn't happen without high rpm. On the pull side, a vacuum is a vacuum, there is no turbulence, so lower rpm is more effective.
 
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n0ns3ns3

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@Splas0rr
Karadjgne kinda explained it.
NF-F fans focus airflow, so the air is going straight in front. You can feel it from large distance. it is looks like: ||||
on most other fans (including corsair and NF-P), the air is going kinda sideways and if you were to visualize it would look like a vortex \\\ ///.
I don't have enough understanding/knowledge in aerodynamics and thermodynamics to (scientifically) explain the difference in cooling applications. I can say from experience that directed flow creates less noise and pushes more air through the rad/case and Karadjgne provided basic explanation why.
 
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Splas0rr

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Well agian he dident test any of the new high density radiators website ended 5 years ago ? While I'm sure he was a great reweiver it's highly relevant in today's hardware scene.


 
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Mikel_4

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I think couple last comments may have gone off topic, the louvered /\/\/\ fin design and straight align |||| effect on focused flow fan or "old" tilted flow fan don't related to, both design will receive whatever air pressure from the fan because of their proximity.
@n0ns3ns3+karadgane, Turbulence on radiator??? try do push-push to get turbulence effect !!!
@Splas0rr, quit the joke (funny I like your spelling but made me loosing focus commenting).
 
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