Does CPU Usage Scale with ever new generation on intel cpu's?

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

What I want to know is if an intel cpu such as i7's scale cpu core usage for each generation. So for example an i7 3770k uses 70% while playing a game but a i7 7700K uses only 40% while playing the same game using the same hardware. If anyone has done a test with similar i7 systems let me know as I am concerned that a quad core cpu just wont cut it in the newer games being developed as they are becoming more and more cpu hungry. Which is good for the games, it means we have access to more things in game development at the cost of more expensive hardware.

My current pc is running a i7 3770K with a GTX 980 no overclocks,16gbs 1600hz ram an 275 crucial mx300 ssd for the OS and 1TB 7200rpm hdd for games another 2tb HDD for everything else. When playing Tom Clancys Ghost Recon Wildlands On High (as I cant get 60fps when playing on anything higher) it uses 70% of my cpu on average and if I run google chrome and it maxes out my cpu decreasing my FPS. My friend runs a i7 5820K with a SC GTX 980 and gets 60 FPS on Very High while streaming and watching his stream on google chrome but only uses 40% of all of his 6 cores. So does a game use less CPU on a quad core each generation or is it the same?

Well say any open world Ubisoft game, such as Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Wildlands. That game uses at least 70% of my i7 3770k's cpu. So I ask myself does a current generation i7 cpu have the same cpu usage or less? Does each generation have cpu usage efficiency or just improved performance in calculations? This is what I want to know.

iamacow · Mar 23, 2017

I think its completely game dependent and more game engine actually. Some games engines only use 2 cores, so newer chips like the i7 7700k which over several generations is slightly faster than the previous one. The raw calculations speeds increase. However games that use more than 2 cores, my nearly 6 year old i7 3930k still beats the 7700k because It has more cores even though its technically has less raw performance per core.

Than you have the crap games that it doesn't matter what you have, it will always run like crap, therfore it doesn't matter what you have.

So you really unless you have a certain game to benchmark across multiple systems, its impossible to say if the i7 3370k is becoming dated.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

Every game is different and not only that the progression has slowed so the spread is nowhere near what you think there. Either way if a 3 generation old CPU is only using 70% in a game thats pretty darn good. And in the end even if a game uses 100% of the CPU that doesn't mean the game is going to run like crap. Its only when the CPU at 100% can't put out what the game needs fast enough. Right now there are 5 year old + processors that can still run modern games playably. I would not be concerned buying ANY current processor.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

Well Id say playable is a matter of opinion. To me playable is at least High graphics settings with 60fps with no drops below 50fps. So Im doubting that a 5 year old+ i7 quad core could play a game like GTA 5 or Tom clancy ghost recon wildlands. But most games dont use very much cpu 40-60% at most. So I could see those games being fine but as time goes on and hardware gets better which this year it has, 4k gaming is becoming a reality and our software and game developers can finally make the games better because our hardware can handle it. My point being is that quad core cpu's will no longer be viable for people who want to enjoy games at Ultra settings at 60fps or above. Im glad that Ryzen is making intel drop prices and giving us more options for six and octa core cpu's as games will be using it very soon. Next year or so.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

iamacow :

Well say any open world Ubisoft game, such as Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Wildlands. That game uses at least 70% of my i7 3770k's cpu. So I ask myself does a current generation i7 cpu have the same cpu usage or less? Does each generation have cpu usage efficiency or just improved performance in calculations? This is what I want to know.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

We have been hearing that for years. The truth is not all games even scale well over multiple cores. Its why the Quad core i7-7700k beats Ryzen 7 1800x and i7-6900k in most all games handily despite having half the cores (and is the best gaming processor out right now).

And as I said it does depend on the game. DOOM for example ran on ultra at 100 fps on my old system which had an RX 480 and a 6 year old AMD Phenom II.

Its gonna be a long time before quad core CPUs can't keep up. Single core performance is still going to be gaming king for a while longer.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

Im not arguing single core performance over multicore. Im arguing that there wont be enough cpu usage left to have other applications open while playing ie google chrome. There are more and more games using multiple cores now a days and if we limit ourselves to weak systems then developers try and make their games for the average systems instead of making them for the best systems out there. Therefore limiting the potential of games. Many games using Unreal Engine 4 use multiple cores especially if the developers allow it. So unless each cpu has a gain in cpu usage efficiency each generation then I would keep recommending them for the next couple years. But if a quad core cpu doesnt have more cpu usage efficiency each generation then only 6 core systems and above will be a viable solution for gamers who want to play the most demanding games on high or ultra settings at 60 fps while having more than ample cpu left over for other applications.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

Ok but not everybody keeps chrome etc open while gaming, and its not ridiculous for a fullscreen game to need you to shut down other programs to get the best performance. As is today quad core CPUs take a performance hit while streaming, thats why many big streamers use CPUs like the 6900k, its worth the performance loss to have the extra cores handling this. This is nothing new.

That said until theres proof of most games using or needing multiple cores your argument that it will be required would hold water. Many game engines have the capability, but again the developers need to utilize it. Developers many time cater to the lower core setup as well as they don't want to limit their market to folks with $500 and above CPUs.

CPU usage efficiency is a metric that does not exist. CPU usage is determined by the program and the CPUs IPC. Each generation the IPC of CPUs does get better (when you look at Intel), and as IPC gets better usage needed for a game to perform goes down, but as I said those improvements have slowed and so game advancement has slowed with them. Its why 5 year old processors are still viable somewhat these days.

Crixilian · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

no, later cpu will get better IPC (Instruction Per Clock)
since later cpu will have more ipc than older one, so the later cpu can be run as fast as older cpu even on lower frequency
ex. i5 2500k stock is equivalent with i3 6100

on i7 3770k will use at least 70%, on later i7 like 6700k or 7700k may be only used 40% or so (just an approximation not exact result from benchmark)

your friend got i7 5820k has 6 cores/12 threads, later cpu better IPC, more cores/threads more multitasking power
therefore your friend can run many things smoothly

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

I completely agree with this. I just wish that there was a way to measure cpu usage while limiting the variables to do so. That being said intel cpu's are overpriced. AMD has made them lower there prices. Even ryzen 4 and 5 will be better suited than intels i3 systems. Also amd is priced well. Everyone who looks at intel looks at the single core performance and because of that, developers who use intel (most of them do) choose to better optimize intel cpu's over amd cpu's. I personally dont know anyone who plays games over the age of 16 who closes programs to get better performance. Also you shouldn't have to. People shouldn't recommend a quad core system if there is no cpu left over for other things. All of these replies, while informative are not an actual answer to my question.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Crixilian :

Thats the thing I want benchmark proof of how much cpu is being used when playing the same game on both systems. I know why his cpu is better. Im just wanting to clarify what cpu should be recommended for best use in everday gaming solutions that dont involve closing programs for better performance or more cpu. An overall great cpu to handle any game at any resolution (obviously the gpu will be dependant mostly on how many fps you get). The more a cpu can handle the better a game can be and the more AI or instructions per clock can be put into the game.

iamacow · Mar 23, 2017

Newer CPUs do equal better IPC. so a 4GHz i7 3770k is going to lose to a 4GHZ i7 7700k. But if you look at game benchmarks you'll see it's like 5 fps at most difference between a 2nd gen i7 and the 7th gen. AMD is a different beast so you cannot compare apples to oranges on that one.

Your video card is going to matter a whole lot more than the CPU when it comes to games.

Edit: here you go proof http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/amd_ryzen_7_1800x_1700x_1700/9.htm benchmarks of the same game across 15 different cpus.

Once you get to a higher resolutions like 1440P and above, its within 1-2fps.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

I still do out of forcive habit and I'm a LONG way from 16. Back in the day if you tried to run a game in Windows while something else was running you were gonna have a bad time. I also don't need some other program annoying me with an update mid game (like when I leave a tab open and some ad starts playing in chrome because I forgot what page I am on).

Intel is overpriced and now that AMD is competitive again expect to see their prices get more in line with reality. But you can't blame the game makers for building for the market, its gotta work for everyone they don't want to limit themselves.

And I did answer your question. They do not "scale cpu core usage" because thats an arbitrary number, every game and program uses cores differently. IPC scales up every generation, but again how that translates to % usage is different on a per program basis. The reason your friend's computer runs better is that he has 2 more cores to handle chrome or whatever other tasks, while some cpu cycles of your CPU are being dedicated to chrome or whatever while you are playing. Also his CPU is newer so he has higher IPC than you as well.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

I get what you mean now. CPU usage is program based not hardware. i knew that but got lost in thought I guess haha. So to answer my question a 6 core cpu is better for gaming and overall usage as they have a smaller chance of being all used up. As far as blaming developers I do, because they are more focused on money and not making the games as good as they can because they love doing it. Im just getting into game development because of this. Im so passionate about making games that money isnt about it, my games will never be over $40 and I wont have a deadline or a budget. If I cant afford something Ill make it or wait until I can afford it. Games shouldnt be a business its an art. Also I noticed your AMD build and its seems like a nice choice. I think you should have went with a 1080ti instead but overall I like seeing people give AMD a shot as I want Green and blues tyranny to end. I also need a new monitor haha, the screen tearing is getting really bad. Should I go with a Gsync or 144hz monitor?

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

iamacow :

So 10fps difference isnt bad IMO especially at 1080p 100fps. That is for a ryzen 1700 - i7 6950X. So all this tells me is that a 6 or 8 core is better for gaming as they have extra cpu leftover.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

Right exactly, there is no like gen 3 cpus have 40% usage and 5 have 60%, it is all how the program works within the IPC envelope of each core of a CPU generation.

Now that said in theory int he world we have now the best gaming CPU would be a hybrid of 8 7700K cores running at 5 ghz. That CPU would give max fps in games will still running background programs with no overhead. The problem is there are no 8 core CPUs with cores as fast as a 7700k core is. AMD Ryzen cores are not as fast, nor are Broadwell cores (ex i7-6900k) so each CPU is a compromise. 6 and 8 core AMD and Intel CPUs have slower cores but more of them. Different CPUs for different tasks. If you have a pure game machine and want max FPS you need a 7700k. If you're a streamer then you can benefit from the extra cores of a R7 1800X or a i7-6900k.

In your case not only do you have less cores than your friends computer you have lower IPC, your CPU is 2 generations behind (and clock speed is not a comparison point, clock speed is only relevant for comparison within the same generation).

I admire your optomism about your future game programming, as someone who went into college intending to do that, and came out not doing it, I can tell you theres a lot of pitfalls out there. And you can't blame developers, its the parent companies that want as much profit as possible. As a dev you don't have much of a choice, you have to develop things with a profit margin, if you want to keep your sanity and food on the table. You will see once you get there, its tougher than it looks.

Rogue Leader · Mar 23, 2017

cstiles96 :

My GPU is held over from my last computer, I am going to replace it with an AMD Vega GPU later this year when they come out. Until then its good enough. Every Gaming PC I've ever owned was AMD or Cyrix based. My wife's PC and my Server are Intel but otherwise I always liked the underdog.

You have a Nvidia GPU, G-sync is the way to go.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

cstiles96 :

Right exactly, there is no like gen 3 cpus have 40% usage and 5 have 60%, it is all how the program works within the IPC envelope of each core of a CPU generation.

Now that said in theory int he world we have now the best gaming CPU would be a hybrid of 8 7700K cores running at 5 ghz. That CPU would give max fps in games will still running background programs with no overhead. The problem is there are no 8 core CPUs with cores as fast as a 7700k core is. AMD Ryzen cores are not as fast, nor are Broadwell cores (ex i7-6900k) so each CPU is a compromise. 6 and 8 core AMD and Intel CPUs have slower cores but more of them. Different CPUs for different tasks. If you have a pure game machine and want max FPS you need a 7700k. If you're a streamer then you can benefit from the extra cores of a R7 1800X or a i7-6900k.

In your case not only do you have less cores than your friends computer you have lower IPC, your CPU is 2 generations behind (and clock speed is not a comparison point, clock speed is only relevant for comparison within the same generation).

I admire your optomism about your future game programming, as someone who went into college intending to do that, and came out not doing it, I can tell you theres a lot of pitfalls out there. And you can't blame developers, its the parent companies that want as much profit as possible. As a dev you don't have much of a choice, you have to develop things with a profit margin, if you want to keep your sanity and food on the table. You will see once you get there, its tougher than it looks.

I appreciate your advice. I cant work due to illness so putting food on the table is as complicated. Game development is a passion and my games will be made right as im my own boss haha. I will never sell out and my team is only going to be people who feel the same way and are okay with being paid after a game is sold.

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

Rogue Leader :

Haha for now its Nvidia, Ive always loved their day one drivers and performance. Im very optimistic about vega but AMD always seems to be one step behind intel and nvidia. I hope that it will give more balanced prices and better performance for everyone!

cstiles96 · Mar 23, 2017

All right thanks for all the answers and I hope you all have a nice day and recommend 6 core cpus from now on!

iamacow · Mar 23, 2017

Also remember Skylake and Kabylake have the same IPC so the only difference is some microcode update and a higher clock for i7 6700 vs i7 7700k. Since the i7 6900 is based on the Haswell, we would need to wait for the Skylake-EP for out in Q2 for a true 8 Core i7 7700k equivalent.

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