i7 4771 (3.50GHz - 3.90GHz boost) + DDR3 1600MHz Bottlenecking GTX 1070 8GB?

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lowc

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Hello there.
I have a question considering "rather poor performance" in gaming on my system and my newly bought Gigabyte GTX 1070 G1 Gaming 8GB edition.

On certain games like Battlefield1, Battlefield 4, GTA V I see poor GPU utilization (usage) if I uncap my FPS (with Vsync OFF).
Im gaming on LG 25 UltraWide 2560x1080 display (60Hz).
In Battlefield 4 and Battlefield 1 for example on certain Multiplayer maps (in single player is less noticable but there are drops too) and also at certain view on maps I see significant drop of GPU usage/utilization (from 99% to 60-70% etc) and also framerates drops for example from 140-200 to 80-105 which is very noticable (feels laggy and choppy).

I have very very if not almost exact system build as this http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/1796007 and his scores are as it seems really good and satisfying.

Is there a chance that some other part of my hardware is bottlenecking my GTX 1070 (specs below) like CPU or RAM?

My 3DMARK Time Spy 1.0 score:
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/18984377

Much better 3DMARK score - http://www.3dmark.com/spy/22518 with better CPU and RAM.

Is his graphic score so much better just because he manually overclocked GPU higher?

But to be honest I don't think 3DMark is best way to be testing cpu or ram bottlenecks It's more for system stability testing and if everything is working ok together.

For example Battlefield 4 on certain map (Hainan resort) Multiplayer I set view towards the sea or somewhere where there isnt so much chaos and I get 99% GPU utilization and 180-200FPS, but when I view center of the map (building in the middle) GPU util. drops to 60 or 70% nad framerates also to 80-105.
Everything smells fishy like CPU and RAM can't keep up with the rendered frames GPU could be providing. I reviewed and watched many videos on youtube regarding this problem but I really didn't suspect that i7 4771 processor could be bottlenecking this GPU.
I've seen CPU utilization (a core or two) to go up to 80& or 85% but I didnt saw 100% CPU utilization never - perhaps MSI Afterburner doesn't show info 100% right?

According to this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nW3dNjGaaBg&t=87s he says that RAM speed is the problem :\. Any thoughts or opinions or experiences?
I dont think that my motherboard can benefit from faster memory then 1600MHz so I can't test or change that :\.

I got very good air-flow and temperatures so thats not an issue (GPU doesnt go over 62°C and CPU doenst go over 65°C) when using Vsync ON in Battlefield 1 everything on Ultra I got solid 60FPS with CPU and GPU temperatures max 52°C.

My rig:
Asus B85 Plus MB
Corsair CX600 PSU
Cooler Master CM690 III Case
i7 4771 3.50Ghz (3.90GHz turbo) CPU (with HyperEvo 212 cooler)
Gigabyte Gaming G1 GTX 1070 8GB
4 x 4 DDR3 1600MHz Corsair Ram
500GB SSD Crucial SATA3

Thanks for any thoughts and help.




This
 
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lowc

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Ok understood tnx. What about bottlenecking, are you experiencing any on your system considering you got only a little faster RAM frequency, but you got much faster CPU? I want to know whats the reason for my low GPU utilization (specially in MP games) :/
I formatted my PC fresh install on Win 10 x64 again and installed all the latest drivers, but same score and same scenarios :/
The MB drivers are pretty old though (most from May 2016 or older) :/
It can't be any other thing I think of rather then RAM speed or CPU :/
I would like to find someone with very similar system (cpu, ram and GPU) and hear their experience :/

 
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SinxarKnights

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The high CPU use in some multiplayer games isn't because of your rig. It is because it is multiplayer.

I don't know the specifics of why it happens, I didn't write the games. My best guess is there is a lot of waiting around for incoming data using threads that loop as fast as possible to minimize lag. All the while competing with processing time for the graphics. In a situation with vsync there is no need to render as quickly as possible, freeing up some CPU time that allows the game to run freely. That is just a guess though. Based on my own experience writing programs and how time-slicing in the CPU works is how I came to that hypothesis of the cause.

I am almost 100% sure game at fault here. That bit of uncertainty comes from not knowing what your CPU temps are while playing these games. It could be overheating and throttling. Have you monitored your temps while playing?

Just look at google: https://www.google.com/search?q=bf1+high+cpu+usage It is such a common search I just typed "bf" and the rest filled in. Lots of threads pop up here asing the same thing but most are not as knowledgeable as you appear to be so they just leave in a huff when we cannot do anything about it.

There are a lot of things to try though if you look through some of the results.
 
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lowc

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By the way If I'm seeing correctly there is some serious CPU/RAM bottlenecking happening on video below (same GPU and very similar CPU):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOY-yVYNKsU

Also some people from comments (from different videos) said like:
"Jirka Bounty Stiegler
lol bro i have i7 4790k and GTX 1070 8GB and my gpu usage in games like BF1,GTAV is goin rapidly down sometimes to 75 even 65% GPU usage, and i think its because of my 1886mhz 16GB ram, i need to upgrade to 2400mhz but i can use only DDR3 :) should i feel the difference in gpu usage ??? when i upgrade from 1886 to 2400 mhz ???"

"MindBlank Tech"
+Jirka Bounty Stiegler What clock are you running that 4790k? OC to 4.5GHz and see. Although, as an owner of the exact same CPU I can say that I saw GPU utilization dips even when OC'd. After I switched to fast RAM I got rid of most of these dips.

"El Greeko
He was doing tests that actually matter. He was showing us what happens when you hit 100% CPU usage with different RAM speeds. This is the video I needed to watch. I have an i7 4770k and it is ALWAYS bottlenecking my CPU (Strix GTX 1080 A8G) in games like The Division and Watch_Dogs 2 (highly intensive games on the CPU part). I have pretty shitty RAM modules (2x4GB of Corsair Vengeance CL9 @ 1333MHz + 2x2GB of some stock RAM that came with a pre-built I bought like 5 years ago, running at like 1170MHz), and this is what finally pushed me over into buying 2x8GB of Corsair Dominator Platinum CL11 @ 2400MHz that I was always telling myself I would buy someday."

So as far I can tell there is CPU and RAM bottleneck going on :( :|
 
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SinxarKnights

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Open CPUz and look at the memory tab. Are you running dual channel mode? Do you have shadowplay running?

UxXmbZC.png
 
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lowc

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Yes I'm running Dual-channel mode (got all my MB RAM slots filled (4) with 4 x 4GB sticks (same ones) Crucial 1600MHz DDR3 - also checked that with CPUz.
How you mean if I'm running Shadowplay? I know that this is some sort od Nvidia gameplay record featurw and I get notification when I enter the game that I can record with it but I never used or tried it.. must I additionally disable anything (regarding shadowplay) in nvidia settings, despite the fact that I don't do any recording?
Tnx
 
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lowc

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Ok ... HOLY f* crap (sorry for the *word) what is this? Check screens below:
My RAM memory frequency fluctuates just a little bit only around 799 MHz and thats it even in-game (tested with Battlefiled 1 Windowed mode) with capped 59 FPS and uncapped FPS. GPU utilization is in this certain Single player scenario 99% though. Didn't tested MP but can someone tell me why RAM frequency isn't 1600MHz as it should be??? Holy cow?! How to fix this?
As it seems I'm running 1600MHz memory at 800MHz only - that would explain a lot my problems? I've manual set long time ago from auto to 1600MHz for all my RAM's in BIOS but that doesn't change this apparently...

CPU-Z : Memory (in Windows only - not in game):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/QoiHZ.png

CPU-Z: SPD (in Windows only - not in game):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/LifT5.png

In-game capped FPS @ 59:
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/afrCO.jpg

In-game uncapped FPS:
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/Xecb.jpg

----------------------------------------------------------------------

In all four scenarios RAM frequency is the same... Please advise! Thanks

 
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SinxarKnights

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Not sure. I never install GeForce Experience so i cannot say if it must be manually disabled or not. That recording bar can be turned off by opening the Xbox app (press Start and type Xbox). Hit the settings button (gear icon) then click "Game DVR" and turn off the recording feature. I've never had issues with that one but it is a minor annoyance.

That is normal, 800 Mhz in that window means it is running at 1600. DDR = Double Data Rate. In my pic above it shows 1400 but it is running at 2800.
 
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DSzymborski

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This actually means precisely nothing. The DDR you see with RAM stands for double data rate. All DDR3 1600 RAM is going to show up at around 800 MHz in this type of software.

(Coke for SinxarKnights, who beat me to the answer before I hit refresh!)
 
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lowc

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Oh ok that I didn't know... but as it seems also 1600MHz isn't enough for GTX 1070 :( I can't think of anything else then RAM speed bottleneck or CPU bottleneck or both together.. any similar experiences from you guys perhaps?
 
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DSzymborski

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I remain completely unconvinced that you actually have a problem. And I say that as an owner of 4x4 16 GB 1600 RAM and a GTX 1070 running on a 3770k. Multiplayer FPS dips on newish AAA games are completely normal as are smaller singleplayer FPS. Even higher-end GPUs are not magic and without any evidence of particular framerate inconsistency, I'm leaning towards you having simply talked yourself into thinking there's a problem (and I put as much stock into random Youtube comments as I would emails from Nigerian princes desperately in need of assistance).

 
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lowc

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Hmmm.. I'm talking about low GPU usage on some of CPU/RAM demanding games (Like BF1 and BF4 multiplayer, also GTA V).
If you're unconvinced then explain this videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AOndRffRLY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nW3dNjGaaBg&t=305s

and my screenshots below (PLEASE SEE GPU UTILIZATION/USAGE) and significant FPS drop (which makes BF1 or BF4 with uncapped FPS on 60Hz monitor at least for me unplayable - it feels like laggy and choppy gameplay with quite noticable tearing when they drop significantly).
I would like to use Nvidia feature called Fast-sync which is much better alternative then Vsync (because there is no input lag) but the trick is you must mentain at least 120FPS (double the refresh monitor) which I can NOT even with lowering every setting from Ultra to Low there are dips below 120FPS but they shouldn't be on such powerful GPU. I think that should indicate the problem.

Screenshot BF4 (Ultra, without MSAA):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/8Kx95.jpg

Screenshot BF4 (Ultra, without MSAA):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/UwN35.jpg

*GPU usage drop and fps drop to 98

Screenshot BF4 (Everything LOW and OFF):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/04VBY.jpg

*on Low settings I should get 200fps minumum at all times and therefore higher GPU utilization, but this isnt happening.
** Notice CPU2 usage 80%? Some people saying that only 1 core or thread could me maxed out to cause bottleneck and that MSI Afterburner isn't always showing correct values (even on 80% thread usage - it could mean 100% bottleneck on 1 core)

Screenshot BF4 (Everything LOW and OFF):
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/04/bG7yv.jpg

*Same case here .. why do you think GPU usage is only at 40% and I'm getting only 150 FPS?
I should be getting solid 200 FPS or more with everything on LOW with GTX 1070!

What you think now? I can't think of nothing else then CPU/RAM problem here which is limiting frames per second...

Thanks


 
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DSzymborski

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You seem obsessed with benchmark FPS numbers in a mode that isn't traditionally benchmarked. And of *course* the GPU isn't going to be taxed when you turn it to low.

Nothing to see here as far as I'm concerned. I wish you luck chasing your magic dragon.
 
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lowc

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Ok guys understood.. :)

So bottoms up your opinion is that processor i7 4771(or/and DDR3 1600MHz Ram) isn't bottlenecking GTX 1070 at higher frame rates and at games which are also much more CPU demanding?
I'll also test (for myself) in future The Witcher 3, latest Assasins Creed, Hitman etc. besides BF1, BF4 and GTA V but I suspect according to online forums same/similar results.

@DSzymorski:
Perhaps I seem obsessed with everything I mentioned but I really want to know for a fact what is going on, so I apologize if that troubles you.
And btw I know that GPU isn't to be taxed when you turn video quality to Low, but there should be significant FPS increase from Ultra to Low but there is barely noticable difference in frame-rates increase. Perhaps is the game itself, perhaps its something else but the word "perhaps" troubles me, because I want to get to bottom of things which concerns me.

@SinxarKnights:
Buying GTX 1070 is currently my limit I've spent on PC for quite a while, so I don't and won't buy/replace anything more (MB, CPU or RAM) anytime soon.

I'll just play all games with vsync ON + cap 1 frame less (59) in-game or with Riva Statistics to minimize the input-lag and I'll survive :)
 
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DSzymborski

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Again, your "bottleneck" there is the limitations of both modern GPU with older AAA titles (there's a point of marginal return in the programming) and limitations caused by the very nature of multiplayer. As I said, I don't see any problem at this time.
 
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lowc

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Ok DSzymborski, now I got some pictures and video (sry poorer quality cuz I've taken it with phone in dark room) and If you're not convinced now that I have a problem then I really don't know how else to show you.

I'm on the other hand now 100% sure that i7 4771 or/and DDR3 1600MHz is bottlenecking GTX 1070 at least in Battlefield 1 Multiplayer (and this is not some old AAA title).

http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/05/axbfJ.jpg
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/05/iDGTt.jpg
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/05/oFqX.jpg
http://saveotic.com/images/2017/04/05/FHjxt.jpg

I got also video of this gameplay and poor performance if you want to see it... https://we.tl/E1nSVmGmhj

As you can see on pictures and video above the GPU usage is even below 50% and CPU is very very occupied all the time (for info: its enough that only 1 thread is at 100% use - which can also be shown as 80 or 90% in OSD to cause bottleneck).

What are your thoughts?
Tnx

 
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lowc

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And not to mention that I'm getting also FPS between 50-55 (check screens and video), which is for GTX 1070 or for Multiplayer game very poor, unusual and strange.. That just doesn't make any other sense then bottleneck, how come you don't agree?
 
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