i7 7700K too high temps under load (maybe idle too), but something seems to be off

imike777

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Hi all,

I know this question has been asked several times on the forums, however my case seems to be different to all of them, so any ideas and help is appreciated.

In advance I'm only running (and only plan to run for now) the CPU on stock speed.

So I recently upgraded my build with i7 7700k (rest of the build at the bottom of my post), and there seems to be some kind of an issue with my temps. My cooler is a Coolermaster Hyper TX3 Evo, and my temps seem to be all over the place. Firstly in BIOS, it showed as 70C (lolwut), but after booting into Windows10, it seemed 'all right' as at first my idle temps were about 35C-38C, which I think is okay based on the ambient temp (28C, neighbors heat up our flat as balls). Then after a couple uses, it idled at around 42C-45Cm which is, well... meh...

Under load, (mainly Mass Effect Andromeda), it quickly goes over 80C, sometimes almost reaching 90C, which is not okay at all. I though to myself, lets run some tests. In Prime95 Core0 goes up to a 100 almost instantly, the other cores hovering about 95C-96C. During Cinebench, it's about the same as in Andromeda. Well, time to hit the forums (which I did for a solid 5 days). Here's what I tried/found (either here on Tom's Hardware or some other forums):

-Some Z270 mobos set the voltages too high when set to automatic
What I tried: Modifying fixed voltages, offset voltages (truth be told I'm a noob when it comes to either), no joy same temps. (turned out voltages were 1,20V-1,24V under load, which I presume is okay)

-RAM speeds and voltages matter when it comes to temps
What I tried: setting RAMs to default (hence 2133 Mhz with lower voltages), same temps.

-BIOS Update
What I tried: Duh. I should have started with that. Anyways I did, and what it did is that now in BIOS it says 60C-65C instead of 70C, in Windows it's still the same temps.

-Must have put on the cooler wonky
What I tried: Remove it, clean both CPU and cooler with Alcohol, reapply thermal paste, same temps. I've repeated this process 2 more times, once with a bit less, once with a bit more thermal paste, same temps in all cases.

-Turning off Turbo Boost
What I tried: turned it off, but in Windows (realtemp) it still shows it boosts to 4,5Ghz. Nevertheless, same temps.

-Improper case airflow
What I tried: My case has proper airflow as I didn't change cases, it has 2 intake fans (front-bottom and bottom) and one Exhaust fan (top-back) and a hole on top.

Now what I noticed
I noticed that on both exhaust holes the air coming out is cold. Hmm... Took off the side panel, put load on the CPU, stopped the CPU fan, and touched the heatsink, and it was 'lukewarm' at best. (this happened after all 3 heatsink reapplications). So after all these, what I can think of are 2 things:
- The cooler is a piece of crap (however I saw other people having quite nice temps with it), or just has some mounting issues (however it seems to be not moving AT ALL when mounted), but then why the consistent temps tho
- Something is wrong with the CPU, namely the thermal compound under the lid, hence it's unable to tranfer the heat properly.

Please guys help me as I'm out of ideas, and I'm thinking about taking up heroin (or crack or whichever's the stronger)

MY RIG:
Mobo: ASRock Z270 Fatal1ty Gaming K4
CPU: Intel i7 7700K (Kaby Lake)
GPU: ASUS Strix GTX 970
RAM: G.SKILL TridentZ 16Gb (2 kit) @ 3200 Mhz
Hard Drives: Samsung 500Gb and Seagate 2Tb
SSD: No SSD :(
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO
Case: Cooler Master Elite Knight 350

Thank you guys for all the help in advance,
A desperate enthusiast

P.s.: Can provide pics of course if need be
 
Solution
The first thing that strikes me as odd is a TX3 on a 7700. I would expect something more beefy like a Cryorig H7. Granted it can handle the 91W TDP of the 7700 k(it's designed for up to approximately 130W). Is the base of the heatsink perfectl flat. Sometimes they don't flatten the tubes right and one can be slightly askew resulting in some wonky temps..

Voltage is expected and okay.

As I think you have seen in other posts, the 7700K does run pretty warm but your temps are not warm. They're HOT. I recommend the Cryorig H7.
The first thing that strikes me as odd is a TX3 on a 7700. I would expect something more beefy like a Cryorig H7. Granted it can handle the 91W TDP of the 7700 k(it's designed for up to approximately 130W). Is the base of the heatsink perfectl flat. Sometimes they don't flatten the tubes right and one can be slightly askew resulting in some wonky temps..

Voltage is expected and okay.

As I think you have seen in other posts, the 7700K does run pretty warm but your temps are not warm. They're HOT. I recommend the Cryorig H7.
 
Solution

imike777

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Thanks for the quick answers guys, yeah that's what I thought as well, that the TX3 (the heritage from my old 3570k xD) won't be enough for Kaby Lake, but still it seems off with all these temp differences. About the heatsink being askew, whell yeah I looked at it thoroughly before, and I can tell that it's nothing that some good old fashioned thermal paste cannot fill in. (also there's a very small crack on one of the pipes, but again, thermal paste)

Let's say I don't pay rent this month, what beefy coolers would you guys recommend for a 'not too big case' (air/water, doesn't matter). Or I just get a bigger case as well... I can do that too... I won't pay rent...
 
H100i or H115i. H80 minimum. Your case is only 7.08" wide. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA3BG3TS3984&cm_re=Vivo_titan-_-9SIA3BG3TS3984-_-Product is about the same price as yours but it has many more fan options. You can mount any of those AIO closed loop water coolers on top. It comes with 2 fans up front and a fan in the back. At 9" wide it can handle the Cryorig or the Noctua.

Your case is only 7.08" wide which limits air-cooling options. I have 7 fans in my Titan. Two up front and one in the back(stock). I then have 2 120mm fans on my 212 evo and 2 120mm fans up top.

I can't recommend skipping rent or selling a kidney for PC hardware but it does look like a hardware change is in order.

The Titan also has a fair amount of cable management space under the motherboard. It also has a cutout under the CPU so you can install a cooler without removing the board.
 

imike777

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Oh nothing to worry about, it didn't punch through, we're talking about a 1/10 of a mm in depth, and 2 mm wide. No idea how it got there tho

Anyways, I'll get a cooler probably this week or next, and update you guys on the progress.
Thanks for the help ;)
 

Barney6262

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Sounds like that cooler has seen some action...

I've had a fairly bad experience with corsair coolers. Their software seems extremely dodgy (Had to RMA A H110i GT a few weeks ago because the software controller failed). Generally I would advise a decent air cooler or something from the kraken series.

What is your budget?
 


Nice :). I like to seen these problems turn into solutions.
 

imike777

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Well, since I'm after buying mobo, CPU and RAMs, not much :S. I'd say I'd be willing to give about 150 bucks, but my choices are quite limited, as I'm not living in the US (such is life in eastern europe...). Just checked out what budget cases I can get here, and the most 'budget case' with adequate space is this: https://www.nzxt.com/products/source-530

But then I wouldn't have that much money for a cooler. I'm really thinking about buying what has been recommended above: http://www.cryorig.com/h7.php It seems like a quite decent budget solution, and it fits into my current case (barely, but fits), and I can only hope it will be enough, as it's said it's on par with the EVO 212
 

Barney6262

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Yeh just had a look at your case and AIO watercooling probably isn't the best idea.

Judging by your ram selection the H7 is probably quite a good choice.

Coolers like the bigger Noctua NH-D15 would end up hitting your ram.
 

imike777

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Yeah did the same, checked online and whipped out the ol' reliable tape measurer, and H7 seems to be fitting, so I ordered it, and hope for the best. It will arrive next thursday (it would arrive in late May if I ordered it from amazon germany xD). I'll put it in and update you guys on the temps, give upvotes and best solutions and whatnot :).

Hopefully in Q3 Q4, I can go for a bigger case with a beefy ass cooler, and a monster GPU, but for now I'll have to settle with this solution :)

Thank you for all the help to everyone so far, greatly appreciated.
 


Thanks for the update :). As I've said before, I love to see these problems come full circle to a solution. I hope that's the case here.
 

imike777

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In the meantime, I've played some Mass Effect Andromeda praying to all the gods that maybe the temps go lower this time but no still slightly above 80, sometimes hitting 85. Then a strange thing happened, I alt+tabbed out of the game and it went to windowed mode, and the temps went down a LOT. So for shits and giggles, I set the game to borderless window mode, and the temps remained around fifty, barely scratching 55 (I visibly lost around 5-10 FPS in some scenes, but that's something I can live with until I get the new cooler).

But when I alt+tabbed from either windowed or borderless windowed mode to write this reply in Firefox, the temps jumped up again to 82-85 with MEAndromeda running in the background, but using Firefox alone provides idle temps... Seriously wtf? Am I doing something wrong? I'm absolutely confused now...
 


Nothing wrong. I don't know how the processor handles these types of scenarios. Speedshift also moves CPU throttling and turbo boosting control from the OS over to the CPU. The borderless setting obviously reduces CPU load and you saw that. You just know that alt tabbing won't be a good thing. Still you are under the thermal shutdown limit but over Intel's definition of hot. Apart from Capt. Obvious's monologue you know how to control your temps so just be satisfied with that until the cooler arrives and you can install it.
 

VIVO-US

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The i7-7700K is rated for 91W at stock speed, so the TX3 EVO shouldn't have that much of a problem cooling it even if it's not the best for the job. If you take the cooler back off, does the thermal paste show good thermal contact, or is there any pooling which would indicate poor contact? Are those push-pins holding properly?
 


I wouldn't install the radiator up front. That will exhaust hot air into the case. Install it so it exhausts and you would not be feeding your internal parts enough air. That would only leave the top fans for intake which is counter-productive because hot air rises. The Titan lacks the option for a side fan which still isn't an optimal solution. A front-to back airflow is the best option imo. Just an opinion. Of course they and other retailers have other solutions. In the end it looks like you will be going with a NZXT case or some other route.

On a side note. @ Vivo - Newegg is one of your retailers. Your specs are still missing for the Titan. I contacted you over a year ago regarding that. It helps sales for a product when it has all the specs. You did reply stating you would look into that. It's nothing big but it can help.
 

VIVO-US

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Thanks for your concern! The Newegg specs are still a work in progress. We've updated them multiple times, only to find the updates have later been deleted. We may have found a work-around though, and are testing it with a few other products right now. If it works, we'll eventually use the method for the rest of the products that need it.
 

Dragon155

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I have had the issue with extremely high temps on my 7700k as well, (likely the 5ghz overclock at 1.32v). I have a 240mm radiator with noctua nf-f12's, and can relate to the temperatures you are feeling, the air coming out of the case can hardly be considered warm. One of the biggest issues I have heard of is that the thermal paste intel uses is awful, hence why people have delidded the cpu and swapped for better thermal paste (not the best idea unless you have the right equipment). The people who have delidded their CPUs (the ones that survived anyways) experienced much better thermals than before.
 

imike777

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Thanks for the advice, I actually liked the case, so I'll definitely check it out in Q3-Q4, when I hoarded enough cash for the last steps of the upgrade, but as I stated above, I'll have to go with the budget solution for now.

2 questions about your message
1. Do you do worldwide shipping? Cause I can't find the case anywhere in my country
2. How do I know if the paste shows good or bad contact, and how does "pooling" look like? :D When I take it off, it looks quite normal, adequate paste sticks to both the CPU lid and the heatsink as well. As for the pins, when I first installed it, and after one of the reapplications, I checked them, and it seemed absolutely fine, also the cooler doesn't move at all. So I can only assume I applied everything correctly, hence the consistent temps. When the new cooler comes, it'll have a proper mounting with screws and whatnot, even if the mounting is the problem (which still is a possibility I presume) that'll have to be ruled out.

Aaaaaaaand last but not least and update to you guys all, I mentioned above the windowed/borderless windowed mode for ME Andromeda. Well if I turn Vsync OFF, the temps rise to above 80 again... Turn it ON, temps go down to 55C tops. I've tried it with Witcher 3 as well, and it has a different symptom, the cores stay on under 70C, except that 1 core always rises above 90C for a second or two, then goes down under 70C, then another core goes up above 90C, and so on and so on. So with this in mind, I've come to a conclusion, which is I've now absolutely sure for 100%, that I have no idea wtf is going on, and can't think of anything else to try except for the new cooler, but if that doesn't help, then comes the noose xD. (one last thing I haven't tried and I don't want to with warranty still on is delidding)
 

VIVO-US

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Woops, read the posts out of order and thought you already had the case, but that was just aquielisunari that had one. Gotta be careful to make sure I don't post anything that could count as advertising per forum rules! :)

Unfortunately, we only ship PC cases to North America at this time.

The thermal paste should be compressed enough that when the heatsink is removed, you can practically see through to the metal. If the paste is too thick, it can become a thermal insulator between the CPU and heatsink, but if it's too thin, it won't fill all the air gaps to assist the metal to metal heat transfer. There's a pretty fine line for the point of being "just right".

For now, I guess the best thing to do would be to not push the system past a lighter load, and then see how things work when the new cooler arrives. Hopefully, it'll make all the difference!
 


Agreed.

I applied a normal rice grain sized dab on the cooler and spread it with the clamshell case my CPU was shipped in, inside its retail box which looks like
cpu%20plastic%20box%20clamshell%20AMD%20AM2%20AM3%20d.jpg
without that particular CPU. Some use a razor blade but that can cause more issues. You are looking to fill microscopic pits in the lid and heatsink base which impede the heat transfer. Both applications were super thin to the point of translucency, suggested by the Vivo rep..
 

imike777

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Yeah I either use the 'pea' method or the 'ricegrain' method, and the results always seem all right, as in both the heatsink and the lid has an almost transparent layer of paste when I take the cooler off. So all in all, I'd rule that out ,as I menitoned earlier, I've put together quite some builds in my lifetime, with some smaller issues here and there in my earlier days, but this particular one really baffles me. :) Oh rather sad face :(

What I'm trying now, is decreasing the vCore voltage in 0.05 increments to the point it's stable in cinebench or something more 'gamelike', maybe I'll have better temps. (when I tried earlier I tested it with Prime95, and it was instant bsod every time, maybe for the better)
 


I'd tap the brakes man. The cooler is giving you grief and you don't deserve it. Chill with the troubleshooting until your new cooler arrives.
 

Barney6262

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Changing temperatures when changing settings is to be expected. Especially settings like V-sync and fullscreen/windowed. You are changing how the game is being rendered so obviously the CPU will have different loads and different temperatures.

Your cores going up to above 90 and then down again could be because they are thermally throttling so that's normal.

Just wait for the new cooler. You may have a particularly bad application of TIM between the IHS and die but deliding carries a very high chance of destroying your CPU, especially since skylake/Kabylake have much thinner bases than older generations. Only do it if you know 100% what you are doing and you have a backup plan if you do destroy it.