How do i know what bottlenecks my pc or how to fix? gpu or cpu?

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

I have a problem with my system:
I play some heavy cpu intensive games like GTA5 and BeamNG.Drive, and what i noticed was that my graphics card was not at full load at all (like around 50%) and my cpu wasn't either (like 60/70%). When i play these 2 games my framerates are around 40-50 and sometimes 60. But the thing i don't get is why my gpu is not using full power it can preform.

My PC specs:
CPU: FX-8350 @4,5 ghz
Mobo: MSI-970 Gaming AM3+
GPU: ASUS ROG STRIX RX480 8GB (oc: 1380mhz;8200mhz)
Ram: 8GB DDR3 1866 Kingston Hyper X (1 dimm)
Case: Corsair Carbide Spec 03
PSU: BeQuiet! Pure Power 9 700CM
SSD: Sandisk 128GB
HDD: Seagate Barracuda 1TB

Temps:
CPU: 50-55 in games and 60 under load
GPU: 72 in games and 79 under load
VRM: 70 in games and under load

I personally think it's because of my ram because it's a 1 dimm and my motherboard is made for dual-channel memory.

I hope someone can help me with this problem.

Thanks!

Dunlop0078 · May 20, 2017

The 8350 will bottlneck a 480 in cpu heavy titles so i am not surprised. Getting higher cpu usage than gpu usage is a clear sign of a cpu bottlneck. Many tests have been done on the affects of single channel memory in gaming, almost all games show only a minor difference between dual and single channel.

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

Dunlop0078 :

So is there a thing i can do? I still don't know if i should upgrade my memory or just go wait for 1 year saving money for a ryzen system (like the ryzen 7 1700).

Dunlop0078 · May 20, 2017

bjorn_cpu_overclocker :

I can almost guarantee its not the memory. And I would not recommend you not spend more money on DDR3 if you are just going to upgrade to ryzen soon. You could OC the cpu but it looks like you are using the stock cooler if you are hitting 50-55c in games so you dont have much room for an overclock. If you want buy a cooler now and overclock it, try to make sure it supports ryzen so you can reuse it when you upgrade. Besides that I would not spend anymore money on that build honestly, saving for ryzen is the best option in my opinion.

For gaming I would say the ryzen 1600 is more than enough.

geofelt · May 20, 2017

Be careful how you interpret task manager cpu utilizations.
Windows will spread the activity of a single thread over all available threads.
So, if you had a game that was single threaded and cpu bound, it would show up on a quad core processor as 25%
utilization across all 4 threads.
leading you to think your bottleneck was elsewhere.
It turns our that few games can usefully use more than 2-3 threads.
How can you tell how well threaded your games or apps are?
One way is to disable one thread and see how you do.

You can do this in the windows msconfig boot advanced options option.
You will need to reboot for the change to take effect. Set the number of processors to less than you have.
This will tell you how sensitive your games are to the benefits of many threads.
If you see little difference, it tells you that you will not benefit from more cores.
Likely, a better clock rate will be more important.

o help clarify your CPU/GPU options, run these two tests:

a) Run YOUR games, but lower your resolution and eye candy.
If your FPS increases, it indicates that your cpu is strong enough to drive a better graphics configuration.
If your FPS stays the same, you are likely more cpu limited.

b) Limit your cpu, either by reducing the OC, or, in windows power management, limit the maximum cpu% to something like 70%.
Go to control panel/power options/change plan settings/change advanced power settings/processor power management/maximum processor state/
This will simulate what a lack of cpu power will do.
Conversely what a 30% improvement in core speed might do.

I would not spend more on old tech.

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

Dunlop0078 :

bjorn_cpu_overclocker :

Dunlop0078 :

First thing: It's water cooled (need some cleaning i think) and it is already overclocked to 4,5GHZ. The problem for higher overclocking for me is the VRM temp's are in the 70+ under load and my pc freezes when it gets to 85 degrees, and i do want it to be quiet so that's why i dont overclock it more then 4,5 ghz.

I wanted 1700 so i don't have to upgrade for 4 years or something.

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

geofelt :

Thank you for your big reply

I have tried it with gta5 changing the affinity with gta 5 from 8 to 6 cores, the framerate did not increase or decrease. (i cut off the first 2 cores (0&1). And the cpu usage is around 80%(on the 6 cores) instead of 60-70% on all cores.

a) i will try decreasing the quality of gta 5 and increasing it to see difference in cpu usage and gpu usage.
b) I will try it out right now.

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

So first test done: set the quality to double (2/1) and the framerate was the same when it is in 1080p (1/1)! What i noticed was the cpu was using per core:
core1:80%
core2:23%
core3:73%
core4:48%
core6:33%
core7:70%
core8:47%

And the cpu usage is exactly the same as when in 1080p (1/1)

But how could this be a cpu bottleneck? it's not using full100% of the cpu?

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

geofelt :

Be careful how you interpret task manager cpu utilizations.
Windows will spread the activity of a single thread over all available threads.
So, if you had a game that was single threaded and cpu bound, it would show up on a quad core processor as 25%
utilization across all 4 threads.
leading you to think your bottleneck was elsewhere.
It turns our that few games can usefully use more than 2-3 threads.
How can you tell how well threaded your games or apps are?
One way is to disable one thread and see how you do.

You can do this in the windows msconfig boot advanced options option.
You will need to reboot for the change to take effect. Set the number of processors to less than you have.
This will tell you how sensitive your games are to the benefits of many threads.
If you see little difference, it tells you that you will not benefit from more cores.
Likely, a better clock rate will be more important.

o help clarify your CPU/GPU options, run these two tests:

a) Run YOUR games, but lower your resolution and eye candy.
If your FPS increases, it indicates that your cpu is strong enough to drive a better graphics configuration.
If your FPS stays the same, you are likely more cpu limited.

b) Limit your cpu, either by reducing the OC, or, in windows power management, limit the maximum cpu% to something like 70%.
Go to control panel/power options/change plan settings/change advanced power settings/processor power management/maximum processor state/
This will simulate what a lack of cpu power will do.
Conversely what a 30% improvement in core speed might do.

I would not spend more on old tech.

i tried changing the maximum usage like you said to 80% but then my cpu goes to 1400mhz on all cores and when i benchmark cpu i doesnt go over 1400mhz

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 20, 2017

here a picture of my pc when i am in scaling mode 2/1
http://prntscr.com/fa4w8e
and one in 1080p (1/1)
http://prntscr.com/fa4zxv

What i noticed was the extreme difference between power usage (90 watts and 165 watts). so it is a cpu bottleneck then? altough it does not use 100%?

geofelt · May 20, 2017

Your tests indicate to me that your FX does not have sufficient single thread capability to drive your graphics card to it's full potential for the games you tested.
This is not surprising, FX cores do not have the power per clock that intel does(perhaps 35% slower) and also that your games are not using many of the 8 threads you have.
I would be curious as to how few cores you can run at before there is a significant drop in fps for your games. My guess is 2-3.

You have a fine graphics card.
You might improve your cpu performance with dual channel ram, but I would not dump more money into a FX build.

bjorn_cpu_overclocker · May 21, 2017

geofelt :

Thanks for the help, i think i will wait and save money towards the end of this year so i can buy the new ryzen 7 1700 and sell my 8350 system (and keep my rx480-case-psu-etc).

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How do i know what bottlenecks my pc or how to fix? gpu or cpu?

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