Deterioration questions about hardware

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Operator86

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Jul 17, 2014
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I have a question. I am an amateur cpu builder and never attempted to over clock before so still have some learning.

Currently I have
Asus hero vii
I7 4790k proc
32gb corsair vengeance ram 1600mhz
1tb hd mirrior
250gb ssd sam
thermaltake 850bronze psu
asus 780ti dc2 oc
And corsair intercooler on proc

I built this comp in early 2014 and just rocked it. It was fairly quick in its day but now its time to start replacing things. I'm starting with a new vid card.
I am between a asus 1080ti fe that i would like to mod the stunts, waterblock, and oc, but I have also thought about the asus 1080 strix and water blocking it. My understanding is wattage is what stops from pushing the 1080ti fe and why modding the stunts is recommended to push it further. My question is what causes the cards to deteriorate prematurely after modding the stints if the card is water blocked keep the processor, vrm, and vram cool. Essentially why does this happen is what I'm asking I suppose.

I still have much to learn about OC as far as clock boost and how to know when and how much voltage to apply ect. I wont attempt any forum of OC until I have a firm grasp of whats happening when I do what I'm doing and how to know calculations.
 
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I can recommend the strix 1080. Mine stays cool and is OC's well. Haven't met a game it could not handle. The 1080ti's are really fast mind you, it a question of whether you want to spend 700 bucks on a card... Mine came in at 540.00 on sale on new egg a while back before the 1080ti's where out. I'll bet you can get one for even cheaper now... (well, after video cards become normal priced again).

Adam
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elbert

elbert

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With all parts its the voltage. The higher voltage the hotter the VRM's. I suggest you get a GTX1080ti and just use it stock. Save all the water cooling money for a second SLI. With video cards the company's have already pushing them hard. You are really better of just adding more cards.
 
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danielthegreate

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Even if you keep your temperature in check, the higher voltage you apply speeds up the buildup of charge traps and wear out of the insulation between gates which will result in eventual failure of the chip. Chances are that you will eventually need higher voltage for the same frequency to stay stable because of the electrons that got trapped in the insulating layer, and at some point, the charge traps reduce the voltage at which you are stable.

In oversimplified terms, the layer between gates in transistors of the processor loses its initial properties due to the electrons that got stuck in it while travelling through and the charge traps that were created due to voltage.
VRMs and other components also deteriorate causing you to lose voltage stability and such.

If you want to look at the scientific details of it all this paper would be an easier one:
J. Keane and C. H. Kim, "An odomoeter for CPUs," in IEEE Spectrum, vol. 48, no. 5, pp. 28-33, May 2011.
 
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Operator86

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I apologize Danielthegreate was scrolling over on my phone to and voted down your comment on accident. So in an easy term I it deteriorates from internal friction caused by trapped electrons due to the voltage? So aggressive cooling simply slows down the rate at which this happens?
 
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danielthegreate

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Yeah, trapped electrons (HCI) which cause a charge buildup in the dielectric, this is related to the current passing through the transistors. Charge traps, or oxide breakdown which is due to voltage and regardless of the passing current and electron migration in the contacts which wears them out eventually. The degradation is power law dependent on time, and exponentially dependent on temperature and voltage.
However, with aggressive cooling we can't "remove" the effect of increased voltage, the chip will still degrade faster (exponentially) because of the additional voltage. Aggressive cooling only reduces the effect of temperature on degradation, so voltage and current degradation still exponentially increase.
 
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Operator86

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Thanks this answers a lot. I had planned to close loop my pc, so I was leaning towards a 1080ti fe and waterblocking it and bypassing the shunts for more power to boost it. Now im thinking im may just go with a strix. Idk,..been playing with my asus 780ti oc in the mean time. Think ill pull the trigger on a new card later today or tomorrow.
 
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adamscurr

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I can recommend the strix 1080. Mine stays cool and is OC's well. Haven't met a game it could not handle. The 1080ti's are really fast mind you, it a question of whether you want to spend 700 bucks on a card... Mine came in at 540.00 on sale on new egg a while back before the 1080ti's where out. I'll bet you can get one for even cheaper now... (well, after video cards become normal priced again).

Adam
 
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Operator86

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You're dead on about the ti's being expensive. That's why I was surprised about the fe's with the modding what they can do. Then again when you add in the cost to do so. Currently im air cooled. With my 780ti oc, I idle at 30c and under load run at about 78c. However recently my gpu is starting to show its age. I attempted to do a minor clock on it last WEEK with no success. Actually got so hot it shut down and for around 15 mins my monitor was blacked out with a solid white strip through the top. This has lead me to here and youtube learning as much as I can. I get the basics of the programs, benchmarking, and what to do as adjustments. Honestly though all the numbers and stats provided minus temperature might as well be mandarin to me. I simply attempt trial and error and watch for artifact and temperature.
 
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adamscurr

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Ya... The 780ti's were great, but games are pretty demanding these days, especially if you want ultra settings. About the Strix 1080. Mine was the advanced model, not the OC. I did some research and figured paying the extra money to have Asus OC it was a waste. Ilucked out because I got a good chip. I did read that the OC models are garunteed their OC while the advanced model I got was hit or miss...

I do have to mention that I was using the Asus GPU Tweak II software, but went back to afterburner because it started giving me some problems... In case you buy one...

BTW, I heard that a lot of the crytominers are selling off their 1070's on ebay since the price of the currencies were lowering... You might be able to swing a cheap card if you headed that way...
 
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Operator86

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I went ahead and got a 1080ti oc strix, should be in tuesday. Can't wait lol

 
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