What would it take to upgrade Kaby Lake to Coffee Lake?

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Astralv

Astralv

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Hey there

I built Kaby Lake this January, but it is limited to how many lanes? If Coffee Lake supports more lanes, what would it take to upgrade? I know that I would need new motherboard and processor, but will I have to reinstall everything- can I just take out M.2 drive and put in in to the upgraded system and expect it to work? I can install drivers and chipset on top of what already installed, or will it cause the issues? I spent 5 months installing audio libraries and programs- I cant start over. Thank you.
 
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USAFRet

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Time for a new motherboard, not just a BIOS flash:
Intel's Coffee Lake CPUs not compatible with current motherboards
http://www.pcgamer.com/intels-coffee-lake-processors-may-require-a-motherboard-upgrade/

Asrock Confirms Intel’s Coffee Lake CPUs Will Require New Motherboard
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/253580-asrock-confirms-intels-coffee-lake-cpus-will-require-new-motherboard-socket

Intel’s next-gen Coffee Lake processors won’t work with existing motherboards
http://www.techradar.com/news/intels-next-gen-coffee-lake-processors-wont-work-with-existing-motherboards
 
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jimmyEatWord

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ok, thanks for the information , useful

cause some one here told me their chipset is going to be z370 i assumed a bios upgrade would do the trick

do you also know what the number of the socket would be ? 115x what ?
 
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Astralv

Astralv

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I probably should just stay with Kaby. It works great. It just that they released too many systems after January, all with more lanes and this is what I need- the lanes for SSD storage. This is what I do every night- come home and install libraries. I have 7 drives, I think... I got 4TB SSD, so it should hold me for up to 2 years- the problem is that in 2 years it would be MUCH more stuff to reinstall. This system should be built for minimum of 5 years and by 3rd year, I know I will be struggling, unless they start making larger SSDs and I would clone my 1TB drives to something larger. I already use all lanes (may be have one extra PCIX16). So I should either keep it and struggle in 2 years and clone, or rebuild now before it all settled. Actually- it is almost in working condition now- took me 6 months to install everything. This would delay the time when I get back to music production. My Ivy Bridge was 3 years old- rebuilt it because I ran out of storage options, but Kaby did not give me that much more- I made mistake with it. Don't know what to do. Thank you.
 
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jimmyEatWord

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is it also sata 4 , pci e 4 ?
 
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Astralv

Astralv

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If you looking at the pictures in this article, looks like it is SATA 3, PCIE 3. https://www.techpowerup.com/235883/intel-coffee-lake-platform-detailed-24-pcie-lanes-from-the-chipset

I totally need more USB ports, more Thunderbolt ports. I have Thunderbolt add on card and it takes PCIEx4 slot, so I can not use it for anything else. I have like 6 USB ports and I need 12... I can use 2nd Thunderbolt for another device... I have 2 M.2 Slots on my Z270, BUT- if I use 2nd M.2 Slot, it will take out 2 SATA ports, and I have drives already in each SATA. I installed DVD drive but can not use it because I don't have any more SATA to connect it. So frustrating.
 
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Astralv

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I did, and surprisingly, it works, but not recommended. I was wondering how it would know which device is which when all 6 (I have 6) connected to one port. I don't do the audio through these ports, so it is ok, but if I was using it for audio, not sure it would work well. It says in every manual not to use hubs with audio gear- it supposed to be connected directly.

I did install SATA PCIEx4 card that gave me 4 extra SATA ports but I did not like it because it added extra screen on boot- when computer boots, it would have this black screen with numbers, saying Marvel SATA controller- it just felt weird, like it would delay the system. I actually took it out to free space for Thunderbolt. I may try to put it in PCIE X16 instead and hope it would work there...
 
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USAFRet

USAFRet

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Exactly. That is precisely what a NAS box is made for.
4 or 8 bay, a bunch of 4/6/8TB drives....Done.

And of course a regular backup of that whole thing.
 
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Astralv

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The sample libraries do not run as smooth from HDDs. I have one 6TB HDD for less important libraries, but most of my libraries stored on SSDs. It is matter when I am looking for the right sound and go "Next, Next, Next..." and then I want to go 3 sounds back or compare 123 with 135- I have to load them quickly, otherwise I spend all night clicking on samples. Average library is 3-7 GB. So if you buy 10 libraries at 5GB, here is your... Ok- it just does not work this way. Space disappears fast. The C drive is worst.

No, no back ups yet. I had 8TB Seagate but on my old computer service needed for backup stopped working, so I could not back up. I need to buy another large drive... Would be great to have image of the drives in case one fails.

If I could afford 4 4TB SSDs, I would be ok, but it would be $6000... I have one 4TB, 2x 1TB, 1x 1TB M2, and 3 HDDs, (one for audio recordings and projects, one for just random storage. Software synths first have to be downloaded and unzipped, then installed, so it takes 2 locations.) and this takes all slots.
 
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USAFRet

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In my NAS box..
Qnap TS-453A, 4 x 4TB Seagate Ironwolf HDD's, RAID 5. Leaving ~10.6TB user space, currently ~6TB actually used...
Accessing the NAS from my PC, across the LAN, searching the entire volume for a single random filename fragment takes ~5 secs to locate and display that single particular file.


If you say that your libraries do not run as well from an HDD vs SSD...how do otherpeople do it? You are not the only one doing this particular function, nor are you the only one without a large block of SSD's.
 
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Astralv

Astralv

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There are different combination of people. many use hardware synths, other use fewer software synths. I am lucky one to be able to afford Kontakt libraries soon as they been released, and I do buy them frequently. they will work from HDD, but it is not single file that needs to be loaded. Audio files are large. lets say 5MB each file. You have 61 key, so for each key you need to load 5Mb file. Some instruments (by instrument I mean Violin Ensemble, or Brass section) are about 2-3 GB to load. The library contains let's say 30 instruments and you want to hear them all- you go next, next, and every time you load samples for each key. So every time you need to load 2-3 GB of audio.

Now there is a way to do it over network if you use AVB- it is Ethernet for Audio and Video- not usual Ethernet format. I never came across to AVD storage solution. My audio cards run in AVB format networked via AVB Box (MOTU). I also seen people using another computer for storage, I have not explored this option. There has to be a way to create server for this, right?
 
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USAFRet

USAFRet

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"Audio files are large. lets say 5MB each file. You have 61 key, so for each key you need to load 5Mb file."

And photo files are large, like 30+MB each file.

'Another computer for storage' ? This is precisely what a NAS box is. A small Linux based PC, with its own OS and a lot of drive space.


I'm not all on track with your whole audio processing realm. But there are thousands of other people on the planet doing exactly the same thing as you are.
Discover what they are doing, and do that.
 
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Astralv

Astralv

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For now I am trying to have it all in one box, was just wondering what it would take to move to new system. I know that reinstalling already takes me 7 months. Was hoping new computer would accept drives from old computer, but I guess not. Even if I reinstall OS and copy exactly all folders from C I have now to new C drive?
 
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USAFRet

USAFRet

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Nope.
Applications do not work like that.

When you install something, it makes dozens, sometimes thousands of entries in the Registry and elsewhere. The new registry in the new OS knows nothing about those.

Some things would work with a simple copy/paste. Many things will absolutely fail horribly.
 
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USAFRet

USAFRet

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Moving the OS drive to a new system is a 100% maybe.
It might work, it might fail. It might work, but with lingering issues later.

A reinstall of the OS is always recommended, often required.
 
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Astralv

Astralv

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Thank you for your replies. I will keep my Kaby.

I was under the impression that 14nm processors are the last powerful processors good for workstations and 10nm would not be that good, more for mobile devices. I guess time will show. Thank you.
 
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Karadjgne

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I'd run a NAS setup. Doesn't matter if the NAS itself is populated with SSDs or HDDs, it'll work the same. Basically as a giant external drive. You could have that contain all the libraries without issue, not having anything on the pc. It's accessible from anywhere via remote through the internet, you could even use a laptop in a wifi Cafe and still have library access. By tieing the libraries to internal ssd in the pc, you are limited by connections, pcie lanes etc. as the cpu/mobo now has to deal with each separate drive. NAS gets around all that and does it all before the cpu has any input. And being NAS, it's also expandable, you can link multiple NAS via network or hardwire and easily have over 100TB of usable storage, have all your audio files backed up permanently, so if anything ever happens to the pc, you are not stuck with redoing 6 months worth of work.
 
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