i7-7700K @4.9GHz w/ NH-D15S (Delid + Liquid Metal)

volkgren · Nov 4, 2017

I figured the NH-D15S (w/ second fan) would be enough to keep it cool at 4.9GHz and 1.35V. The voltage is enough to run 4.9GHz, but temps go up to 87C within a few minutes of Prime95 Small FFTs.

Would an AiO do any better? It seems at this/that point, ~$450 would have been better spent on a better CPU and a budget cooler. I have not seen any significant advantage of 4.9GHz over 4.5GHz other than the personal satisfaction of doing it.

I just upgraded from my Cryorig H7. The NH-D15S gives the same temps at 4.7GHz as the H7 gives at 4.5GHz. All of this is seeming like a huge waste of money. Intel is taking away the overclocking experience by pushing their K series processors to their economical limit with their junk TIM.

**UPDATE**

Successful delid and Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut reduced temps by ~20C.

Achieved 5.0GHz 1.400V w/ max of 73C Prime95 (20 mins).

Screenshot: https://imgur.com/TUGAQ2Q

envy14tpe · Nov 4, 2017

Yeah the 7700k runs hot as hell. I had to delid it to get more reasonable temps. If you want improvements in temps, with what you got, you got to delid and reapply thermal paste. I can get 4.7/4.8GHz on my Cryorig H5. But I know, if any chance, I want 5.0GHz then I must have a 280mm loop or greater.

Do I need 5.0GHz? No. But I too want to push what I got to its peak. Consider a custom loop or at least a 280mm AIO.

biglizard · Nov 4, 2017

This is my 7700k after delid,
Lightly modified Define S w/three Noctua 140's intake - one Noctua 140 exhaust (I put this here specifically to point out that I have great case airflow)
NH-D15s,

Temps before delid where about 10-12 C higher. And while the delid got me a more comfortable 5ghz, I really did it for the fun of it(satisfaction)

Note this Prime95 ver 29.3.

Version 26.6 is in the low 60's

P400(I think this is the case you have) is known for terrible airflow. D15 needs lots of air flow.

Room temp is important, in my example above room was about 72f.

I am curious if you have attempted to dial in all of your voltages? And what is vcore?

While Intel's TIM may be junk, many are overclocking these chips to 4.9 just fine on air.

What are real world temps like? Are you hitting 90's in games? Throttling in games?

If you have tried every trick in the book then, breakout your razor blade and get to work( its free and will be far more effective that any AIO). Hugely satisfying to successfully delid CPU.

You could also demand a replacement from Intel, might get a "golden sample". Of course if it's not throttling (hitting 100c) then they will just say that the chip is running within design limits.

I have 8600k and 8700k on the way and I fully expect to have to go the extra mile to hit high overclocks with these chips also. This is Intel, this is what they give. We have to do the rest. Up to and including high vcore, fiddling with bios settings, buying stupidly expensive ram, big air, AIO or custom water cooling.

I don't know about anyone else but I don't overclock for the few fps that I won't notice anyway, I do it for the fun of it. Infact I spend just as much time tweaking my machine as I do actually gaming.

volkgren · Nov 4, 2017

I didn't think about the P400 (yes I have that case) restricting airflow. I remember thinking that when I got it how small the front intake holes were, but never thought about it since.

I took the front panel off and ran P95 (26.6) @4.9GHz 1.350V 4.5GHz Ring/LLC (those are the only settings I've changed, haven't really 'dialed-in' voltages). My results were much better this time.

After 10 minutes it reached a max of 87C. I put the front panel back on for the last 2 minutes and it seemed to run 1-2C hotter. Maybe the thermal paste settled some more. I had just applied it last night after trying a couple different methods (placing a dot/rice grain, no spreading is what I found works best with this cooler.)

Ambient is 69-70F.

I'm somewhat satisfied now (though it's still running warm, but seems to be near normal.) I ran CoD WWII and temps averaged 65-75C with peaks at 81C. AC Origins runs hotter at avg 71-81C max 86C, but that's why I got the NH-D15S because AC Origins was doing that w/ my Cryorig H7 at 4.5GHz.

SumTingW0ng · Nov 5, 2017

No air cooler on the market right now can handle 1.35V temperature. 1.28V is when you see air cooler start to struggle. Your bet is go with 280mm AIO or a custom water cooling. Also, temperature over 85C is not good as well. I would advice turn it down to 4.8Ghz for safe voltage and temperature. In term of performance between 4.8Ghz and 4.9Ghz is literary not noticeable at all.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

I plan on going lower on voltage, which I haven't tried yet. If I can't get temps lower I will lower clocked speed. I agree over 85C is too warm.

envy14tpe · Nov 5, 2017

The P400 can accommodate fans: 3 front, 2 top, 1 rear. I'd have at least 3 front, 1 top, and 1 rear. The case only comes with a single front and rear fan. More intake is needed. If that doesn't help then you gotta delid it to get more comfortable temps. I got 10-15C drop after delidding.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

SumTingW0ng :

Negative.

Even when I was not delidded and running 4.9@1.39 temps were well below 80c on air.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

volkgren :

As envy14tpe mentioned, need all fans populated, are they? Strong airflow really is important! Take a look at this, http://www.overclock.net/t/1476618/water-to-big-air-question#post_22020875

I also would say that stock fans are not going to give the best results. You are going to have to accept a little noise.

I have always just put a tiny dab of TIM on center of IHS and let mounting pressure do its thing.

You only have one core averaging 85, I bet there is room for improvement. If adding fans/better fans doesn't get you there then some minipulation of the rest of voltages may.

It's been my experience that auto voltage is often a problem.

What is LLC set at?

XMP enabled?

SA and Io?

Long shot and there is some debate about actual effectiveness, but what is CPU PLL OC?

Could you throw up a complete HW64info screeny.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

envy14tpe :

I have enough 120mm fans to max out all fan slots on the case plus the 2x140mm Noctua fans. But the 140mm woudn't fit on the front of the cooler, so I put it on as a front intake on the case and a 120mm as the front fan on the CPU cooler.

How should I setup my fans in the case and on the cooler? I have a Phanteks PWM fan hub. I'm doubting the effectiveness of the 2x top case fans. They are not PWM and they spin slow, plus there is almost no room in between them and the CPU cooler. I'm afraid they are hindering air flow across the cooler.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

biglizard :

I don't know what to set any of those things you mentioned, so I left them on auto. Please advise.
XMP is not enabled because I am running my 2400 CL14 1.2V @ 3200 CL16 1.35V
*All case fans are connected to PWM fan hub connected to CPU fan header.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

volkgren :

Okay, cracks knuckles.

Ya gotta get that fan on the cooler, I have mine in between the towers. And that is where it's supposed to be mounted.

Take a look here, the image gallery is just below the first paragraph http://noctua.at/en/nh-d15s

I see you have a 1070, is this an open air cooler card?
Top mounting of case fans in my opinion is a waste, pulls GPU heated air straight through CPU cooler.

I'll be back after I look at your Voltages.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

I do have the 140mm fan in between the towers, but I bought a second one to go on the front but it won't fit. I removed the 2 top case fans, the stock Phanteks that came with the case.

I have:

3x Cryorig QF120 Balance fans (PWM)
2x Noctua 140mm PWM fans, except only 1 fits the cooler.

I put the one 140mm that didnt fit on the front intake of the case. And since I can only fit 2x fans on the front IF there is a 140mm, I put 1x 120mm rear exhaust, 1x 120mm intake (along w/ 140mm) and 1x 120mm on front of CPU cooler (along with 140mm in middle).

I'll take the 120mm off the cooler and see if it helps.

*Yes the 1070 is open air, it never goes above 70C.
**I can put the 2nd 140mm on the rear of the cooler and have 3x120mm intake. But do I leave a 120mm exhaust? It will be very very close the the 2nd 140mm. The RAM won't allow the 140mm on front of cooler.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

volkgren :

Your SA and VCCIO(CPU IO VOLTAGE in your bios) are pretty high.

Just some quick info for ya. the below info is from this guide. http://www.overclock.net/t/1621347/kaby-lake-overclocking-guide-with-statistics

"Safe Voltages (Always TENTATIVE):
Vcore: 1.45v/1.37v
VCCIO: 1.25v/1.2v
System Agent (SA): 1.3v/1.25v
Vdimm: 1.4v/1.35v"

Before you begin making adjustments to SA and VCCIO you need to understand what they do.

I think you should spend sometime reading that guide and this one also, http://edgeup.asus.com/2017/kaby-lake-overclocking-guide/

A Lot of the asus guide is obviously going to geared toward asus board but there is a lot of good info in there.

These two guides are what I used to oc my system.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

volkgren :

Sorry, I misunderstood about cooler fan. I only use the 140 in the center.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

Okay thank you. I will spend some time reading those.

SumTingW0ng · Nov 5, 2017

biglizard :

SumTingW0ng :

Negative.

Even when I was not delidded and running 4.9@1.39 temps were well below 80c on air.

That have to be a lie, and please provide evidence.

biglizard · Nov 5, 2017

SumTingW0ng :

biglizard :

That have to be a lie, and please provide evidence.

Here you go, Don't appreciate being called a liar.

SumTingW0ng · Nov 5, 2017

biglizard :

SumTingW0ng :

Here you go, Don't appreciate being called a liar.

Small FFT tortue test?

How da fook

I have an i7 4790k with Noctua NH D15S, and I already get 80C at 4.5Ghz @ 1.25v during stress test. I'm so jealous.

volkgren · Nov 5, 2017

Why delid with those temps?

envy14tpe · Nov 6, 2017

You can't compare different CPUs...temps and voltages are irrelevant. The 4790k we know usually hit around 4.5GHz whereas the 7700k is known to reach 5.0GHz regularly, with proper cooling.

OP should put the second fan on the cpu cooler. Even if it is in back. It doesn't matter. What matters is how many fans you use. Put two on the cpu cooler. And yes add the 120mm rear exhaust to help get that hot air out of the case. I'd still keep a top rear fan if it fits comfortably.

biglizard · Nov 6, 2017

volkgren :

For the fun of it, I really like tweaking my machine.

The delid also allowed for 5ghz.

With my new 8600k and 8700k arriving this week I may just see if I can get this 7700k up to 5.1-5.2 on air.

The new chips will be delidded as soon as I have them out of the box.

biglizard · Nov 6, 2017

I think that the problem with these chips is not the chips themselves, but that people see a few with golden chips hit 5ghz and think well that's what I am going to get.

More often these guys with large OC's have put a lot of work into it, I know I did.

I see all the time my cpu wont hit 5ghz, it's hot and some well meaning parrot will come along with the AIO advice. Midrange and higher motherboards come with bios that can be tweaked endlessly. This is where one should start when trying to manage high temps, I see quite often cooling problems solved by getting voltages off auto. This and starting with a decent cooler and air flow are paramount to OC success.

The other problem I see is cost cutting, low end components are likely to get you low end results.

I know this isn't going to be popular, but I think water cooling whether AIO OR CUSTOM should be moved behind deliding as a last resort. Its stupidly inexpensive, a razor blade and some liquid metal TIM $20.00. Even if you buy a delidding tool you're out way less than the cost of a decent AIO. If you don't have the skills or will for either then you could send cpu to Silicon Lottery and they will do it for $50.00, once again still cheaper than a AIO, In Fact less than the delid tool and liquid metal TIM.

I also don't think high OC is needed at all as far as gaming goes, benching sure, satisfaction you bet. But for 2 FPS nah.

I used to game a lot, I miss my games. But I am always one more tweak from perfection, I'm like a junkie I can't get enough.

volkgren · Nov 6, 2017

I have been on both sides, upgrading and overclocking to game and upgrading and overclocking just for self satisfaction (can't get enough.)

Right now I upgraded my cooler because AC Origins put my CPU over 80C everytime I played it. I've spent more money on games the past 2 years than I've spent time playing them, so I'm just trying to spend some time enjoying the new games without worrying about my hardware.

I'm now satisfied with stock clocks and near silent operation of [all] fans and staying at or below 70C in every game (below 60C in some games).

Maybe down the road, if there is gaming performance to be gained from 5.0GHz I might delid.

SumTingW0ng · Nov 6, 2017

envy14tpe :

i7 7700k does run hot like i7 4790k, and the i7 4790k is the cheaper version of i7 7700k.

i7-7700K @4.9GHz w/ NH-D15S (Delid + Liquid Metal)

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