Need A Good Budget Router for Household Network Traffic Control

Shlutka · Mar 2, 2018

Trying to play online games, video stream, etc has become a very huge problem in my household. People are starting to understand technology, and their bandwidth usage has become utterly annoying.

I'm currently using the Actiontec NVG443B, which supports bonding. It's Frontier Communication's standard router, and does not have much QoS control.

I'm on a budget here, so anywhere in the $50 range would be ideal.

I'm also willing to buy used.

P.S I have never done anything with QoS, bandwidth limiting, etc. I just want stable ping in my games.

Thanks!

terry4536 · Mar 2, 2018

The $50 range is fairly low for a router.

Here is one for $69.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA4RE4S37427

Shlutka · Mar 2, 2018

terry4536 :

What do you think about this? Is it just a better version of the one you linked but used?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00DDK1QUC/ref=dp_olp_used_mbc?ie=UTF8&condition=used

terry4536 · Mar 2, 2018

I never recommend used electronics. If you know the person selling it, then maybe it is worth the risk.

Shlutka · Mar 2, 2018

terry4536 :

Definitely considering this purchase. Just to be clear, I will be able to setup QoS on this right? I'm not familiar with brands of routers/ their firmware.

bill001g · Mar 2, 2018

QoS is not some magic solution that creates bandwidth. Someone is not going to get the bandwidth the want. You first need some form of agreement that your gaming is more important than say someone who is watching netflix. You could actually accomplish the same thing as QoS by yelling down the hall get off the internet I am trying to play my game.

Your first problem is you are going to be very limited in router selection because of the need of vdsl modem in the device. You need to check the list on your ISP site of devices they will support. I suspect you are way over your price range even for a basic router that support vdsl.

For QoS you need a device that can limit the DOWNLOAD bandwidth to a fixed value by ip address. The vast majority of routers can only limit the upload speeds. Be aware that you can't really limit the download speed it is attempting to trick the end device into requesting less. Some applications do not respond well, torrent files transfers will actually open more sessions if it thinks the ones it is using are having issues.

Still first step is to get a agreement on how much each person can use, after that you can try to find a router to implement that agreement.

Shlutka · Mar 2, 2018

bill001g :

I understand that QoS does not equal more bandwidth. To be more clear on my situation, my mom (who is old) likes to watch youtube videos on her tablet while she cleans, and watches movies on netflix sometimes. My sister is always snap chatting. My sister would have no problem with her snapchats taking 1 second to send instead of 200ms, and my Mom does not care whatsoever.

Essentially, they are okay with me having the highest priority, as lag in online games is much worse than something taking 1 second longer to send.

I talked with an IT from Frontier Communications the other day about what routers I could use; he said as long as I connect it into one of the ethernet ports of the main router (the one provided), all routers should work. I could easily be mistaken, if so, please enlighten me.

Also, how could I tell if the router posted by terry4536 limits the download speed as well?

Thanks for the reply!

bill001g · Mar 3, 2018

Running 2 routers can cause issues for game console machines, they have trouble with 2 layers of nat. It does eliminate the need to buy a router with a modem though.

You are going to have to read the manual anyway so you might as well do it now before you buy something. QoS is not a beginner network project it is actually one of the more advanced network topics. Even the routers that can do download limits the configuration is complex. It is not a simple give machine xxx priority, you must limit the other machines traffic.

Shlutka · Mar 3, 2018

bill001g :

I game on PC so that will not be an issue.

I feel as though there is a huge gap in my knowledge. To my understanding, the 1st router will supply the full 12/2 speed through ethernet to the 2nd router, which will then be divided up among the devices based on their QoS priority. What is more to it than that?

I suppose my belief that QoS would be as easy as adding a priority value to a device listed on the router was from the images I've seen. Reading this: it seems relatively easy to setup.

terry4536 · Mar 3, 2018

Here is another router for about the same cost.

https://www.amazon.com/RT-ACRH13-Dual-Band-AC1300-4-port-Gigabit/dp/B01LXL1AR8/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1520059270&sr=1-1&keywords=ASUS+RT-ACRH13+Dual-Band+2x2+AC1300+Wifi+4-port+Gigabit+Router+with+USB+3.0&dpID=41XjwZQZ6RL&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

bill001g · Mar 3, 2018

Shlutka :

It is SO much more complex that you think. If your problem is overload of you UPLOAD bandwidth then QoS can be as simple as priority.

On download the ISP is in full control. Lets say there is a large download running and it can use 15mbps of data and you have your game running that is using 1mbps. 16mbps will not fit in 12mbps so the ISP has to drop 4mbps. It will drop randomly but lets say it drops 3.75mbps of the download and .25mbps of your game. The download will just continue re transmitting the lost data but game will likely be unplayable with even a tiny loss.

What does setting the priority of the game traffic to "high" do in that case. It does not magically get you the lost data. The ISP is not affected in any way by your settings.

The only method that partially works is to some how configure your router to cause even more data to be lost and hope something like a file download detects this loss and slows down the rate it requests data from the internet. You would have to hope the application would respond the the loss and slow down its request rate. For example youtube if it detect loss will drop the resolution of the video.....unless of course you force it not to.

It takes a very complex configuration to even partially do this. Even on routers you can set bandwidth limits by ip you must set them very much lower than the limit you want to set because of what is called burst rate.

USAFRet · Mar 3, 2018

How much bandwidth, up and down, do you get from the ISP?

All the fancy routers and QoS in the world won't help if you simply don't have enough to go around.

Karadjgne · Mar 3, 2018

Apart from priorities, in most decent routers is software that'll allow you to customize limits. I had to cap my daughter's iPhone, it was a huge bandwidth hog, couldn't even watch Netflix if she was home. Capping her dl usage to 20% solved everything.

Using an Asus RT-N66U with 6 cellphones, 2 hardwired pc's, 1 Xbox, TV and a printer with no worries.

Shlutka · Mar 3, 2018

USAFRet :

12mpbs down
2mbps up

Shlutka · Mar 3, 2018

Karadjgne :

What is the software like on Asus routers?

Honestly, I'm willing to do whatever it takes. Whether that is limiting download speed by percentage, or through QoS, no one using my internet really cares. I just want stable ping.

Shlutka · Mar 3, 2018

bill001g :

Shlutka :

It is SO much more complex that you think. If your problem is overload of you UPLOAD bandwidth then QoS can be as simple as priority.

On download the ISP is in full control. Lets say there is a large download running and it can use 15mbps of data and you have your game running that is using 1mbps. 16mbps will not fit in 12mbps so the ISP has to drop 4mbps. It will drop randomly but lets say it drops 3.75mbps of the download and .25mbps of your game. The download will just continue re transmitting the lost data but game will likely be unplayable with even a tiny loss.

What does setting the priority of the game traffic to "high" do in that case. It does not magically get you the lost data. The ISP is not affected in any way by your settings.

The only method that partially works is to some how configure your router to cause even more data to be lost and hope something like a file download detects this loss and slows down the rate it requests data from the internet. You would have to hope the application would respond the the loss and slow down its request rate. For example youtube if it detect loss will drop the resolution of the video.....unless of course you force it not to.

It takes a very complex configuration to even partially do this. Even on routers you can set bandwidth limits by ip you must set them very much lower than the limit you want to set because of what is called burst rate.

But if I were to follow what Karadjgne said, wouldn't it solve that issue?

bill001g · Mar 3, 2018

Shlutka :

bill001g :

Shlutka :

It is SO much more complex that you think. If your problem is overload of you UPLOAD bandwidth then QoS can be as simple as priority.

On download the ISP is in full control. Lets say there is a large download running and it can use 15mbps of data and you have your game running that is using 1mbps. 16mbps will not fit in 12mbps so the ISP has to drop 4mbps. It will drop randomly but lets say it drops 3.75mbps of the download and .25mbps of your game. The download will just continue re transmitting the lost data but game will likely be unplayable with even a tiny loss.

What does setting the priority of the game traffic to "high" do in that case. It does not magically get you the lost data. The ISP is not affected in any way by your settings.

The only method that partially works is to some how configure your router to cause even more data to be lost and hope something like a file download detects this loss and slows down the rate it requests data from the internet. You would have to hope the application would respond the the loss and slow down its request rate. For example youtube if it detect loss will drop the resolution of the video.....unless of course you force it not to.

It takes a very complex configuration to even partially do this. Even on routers you can set bandwidth limits by ip you must set them very much lower than the limit you want to set because of what is called burst rate.

But if I were to follow what Karadjgne said, wouldn't it solve that issue?

Go ahead and try it but don't be surprised if it does not work well unless you severely limit the other machines. If you limit something to say 20% that means 2mbits on your connection which pretty much is the same as completely blocking most content.

Karadjgne · Mar 3, 2018

I've gone into my router software maybe half a dozen times over the last 4 years or so. 95% of it is still at factory defaults.

My stats are a little different for sure than yours, on 5GHz band I get 145down and 36up, on 2.4GHz I'm getting 56down and 32up, and thats with the router in a closet under the stairs 20feet away, behind 2 doors and I'm in the garage. I can afford to cap someone at 20% easily.

Much will not depend on the actual router itself, most are capable of far greater speeds and bandwidth management than what you are seeing, But! First you'll need to figure out just what is available to you. It's entirely possible your modem is a choke. I'd borrow a friend's for an hour, someone you know has very good service, and see what his modem does on your line. Then test your current router against what is coming from the modem. See if you are truly choked by the router and it needs firmware updates or replacement or if it's your modem that's hurting performance. Then you'll at least know where to spend money, or if it needs spending. It's also possible that 12/2 is all you'll get in which case time management becomes the issue.

Hate to see ppl spend money on a guess, you've only got a 33% chance of being right in this case.

Shlutka · Mar 3, 2018

Karadjgne :

I get 12 down and 2 up, but I'm also paying for 12 down and 2 up. I live in a very small town and this is one of the best options. Also my router is just plugged into the wall.

Also here's a hypothetical situation:

Let's say I give someones phone 20% of the upload.
A snapchat is sent from the phone.
Instead of trying to send the picture at 2mbps, it would just send it at 409.6kbps, right?

If so, that would completely solve my situation.

Also, I purchased the router terry provided. It should run the same software as yours, if I'm not mistaken.

Karadjgne · Mar 3, 2018

Yes, you can cap usage usually. Some software is a %, some is a physical number, so say 500k. Apple products, iPhone, iPad etc tend to be bandwidth hogs and will attempt to use as much as is available at times, so limits are really good for them, you can also cap guest usage per guest, deny usage at certain times (this was great when kids were younger, bed time = no data), but in my software I can also set limits on certain apps, so snap chat etc for any phone would be limited.

Your software should be similar, but maybe not exactly the same, mines a 4yr old unit with older capabilities, a/b/g/n vrs newer a/b/g/n/ac or the latest a/b/g/n/ac/as

terry4536 · Mar 3, 2018

I actually looked for the ASUS RT-N66U first, but it was over the budget he listed ($90). It has been around for a long time and highly rated.

When I set up my present router, I wanted a gigabit wired ethernet network. I bought a D Link DIR-655 roughly 6 -7 years ago. It has worked great ever since. Although the set up is a pain. Last I checked the download was about 113 Mbps download, 11Mbps upload, and 15 ms ping.

terry4536 · Mar 3, 2018

Also, I would recommend about 20 Mbps download. The internet will become much less of a pain at about that level (buffering pretty much goes away, but then you end up waiting on the server on the other end).

USAFRet · Mar 3, 2018

terry4536 :

You having 113down/11up and that particular router has nothing to do with the OP having 12/2 from his ISP.
No matter what SooperZoom router he gets, 12/2 is all he gets when talking to the outside world.

terry4536 · Mar 3, 2018

USAFRet :

The OP is looking for a $50 router. I don't know what a "SooperZoom router" is, but I doubt it is available for $50.

My router is even older than yours is. I posted my internet speeds to show that even an old router is capable of good internet speeds. I suspect that the internet speed that he listed is more related to his budget for internet service, than what is available. So, I don't see your point.

terry4536 · Mar 3, 2018

USAFRet :

The OP is looking for a $50 router. I don't know what a "SooperZoom router" is, but I doubt it is available for $50.

My router is even older than yours is. I posted my internet speeds to show that even an old router is capable of good internet speeds. I suspect that the internet speed that he listed is more related to his budget for internet service, than what is available. So, I don't see your point.

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