First Watercooling Loop Feedback

isaacwinkler · Mar 31, 2018

Hi, so I just successfully completed my first custom water loop and just want to show a picture and ask some questions. (I expect there is a few amateur mistakes heh.)

The loop:

So a few points:
- loop is in parallel since I could only get 50cm lengths of PETG ekwb tubing and trying to figure out a way from the bottom right to the top left of the Thermaltake Core p5 was very difficult. I watched a video on youtube from singularity computers doing the parallel loop and their temps were good

- initially i ran the loop on my old PSU filled with distilled water to ensure a thoroughly clean loop (and because I didn't want to leak coolant if I could help it!). Did that for a few hours then emptied and continued with the coolant for further leak testing another 8 hours or so.

- the fans are oriented to suck air from the front through the back into the case and out the back. Not sure how well this works compared to the other way around and not sure if the ML120 are too great for pulling or pushing air through a rad but they look great!

- the drain is problematic, its so close to the bottom its almost impossible to get anything under it except a short tray. It also doesn't empty the pump to gpu or gpu to rad tubes properly either (took a bit of doing and tilting) is something I will consider changing in 6 months during the liquid change

- the monoblock does have LEDs but the cable cannot reach any of the RGB LED ports on the board, a bit funny considering the block was designed for the particular board!

Questions:
- The loop works well for the gpu, under load it only went up to 47 Celsius at the highest but the CPU runs at 35-40 idle and 60-65 under load (very occasional spike to 70ish). I do expect slightly higher temps living in Australia, it does hit 30+ degrees C somewhat regularly here, but CPU temp still gets a little high for my taste (and expectations).
I have checked all the contact between the monoblock and the board and they seem to be good, I am thinking it may be the parallel setup that is preventing the cooler liquid from hitting the cpu.

- does anyone know where to get an RGB LED extension cable? (its like a 4 pin connector, would need male end to plug into the monoblock and the female into the motherboard)

- what do you think about the fans? should they pull air through the case or push air into and out the back?

Sorry for the wall of text :/

If you want to know any of the specs or components let me know!

thanks for any tips
isaacwinkler

ps. I am considering attempting a serial loop in 6 months time when I replace the liquid. I would just need to pull out one of the tubes from the gpu to the cpu and the one from the gpu to the rad and connect the rad to the cpu

1LiquidPC · Mar 31, 2018

Specs of course

Looks great especially for first attempt.

Any extension cables for RGB come with your motherboard? I believe mine came with them. For purchasing, I'd check Performance-PCs or ModMyMods. Have to check for international shipping. These are my usual suppliers. Draining can always be troublesome. I have to use an extra length of tubing and "lung power" to force most of remaining water out after draining using valve. I think fan arrangement is fine. I have mine is push configuration as well. I've always used serial connections as well for loop.

Regarding temps, are settings at stock?

isaacwinkler · Mar 31, 2018

1LiquidPC :

I had one extension cable that came with the mobo but I had to use it in order to plug in the lighting for the reservoir, wish it came with two considering it has two headers on the board :/. I will check those sites out see what I can find.

Hmm, would it be possible to attach a soft tube with fitting to the open end of the drain then for draining? I guess I could just attach it whenever I need to empty.

I think going serial next time will be worth planning ahead for, might need some sort of way to anchor the long stretches of tube to the case though and will need more fittings, probably some extenders and angled.

Everything is at stock, didn't want to overclock anything until I saw how it was running.

Thanks for the reply! Specs follow:
(again sorry for the wall of text :/)

Specs:

CPU: i7 8700k
GPU: ASUS GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ROG Strix Gaming 11GB
MOBO: ASUS Z380-E
RAM: G.Skill Ripjawws V 1x16gb (F4-3200C16S-16GVK)
PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA 850W G2 80+ Gold Modular
Storage: 1x 128gb SanDisk SSD (OS), 1x 1TB Western Digital HDD, 1x 1TB Seagate HDD

Water Cooling Components:

(All EKWB Save the fans)
CPU: EK-FB ASUS Z270/Z370 Strix RGB Monoblock - Nickel
GPU: EKWB EK-FC1080 GTX Ti Strix - Nickel + Backplate
Pump: EK-XRES 140 Revo D5 RGB PWM (incl. sl. pump)
- EK-RES X3 - TUBE 400 reservoir upgrade
Rad: EKWB EK-CoolStream XE 480 Quad Radiator
Tube: EK HD PETG Tube 12/16mm 500mm
Fans: 4 x Corsair ML120 PRO RGB LED 120mm
Coolant: EKWB EK-CryoFuel Acid Green Premix
Fittings:
- 10 x EKWB EK-HDC Fitting 16mm G1/4 (White)
- 2 x EKWB EK-HDC Fitting 16mm G1/4 (Nickel)
- 2 x EK AF Angled 2x45 G1/4 (Black)
- 1 x EK AF Extender 12mm F-F G1/4 (Black)
- 1 x EK AF Angled 90 Degree G1/4 (Black)
- 1 x EK-AF Ball Valve (10mm) G1/4 - (Black)

Also, forgot to mention, the fans are all plugged into a fan hub on the back to clean up the cables on the front:
SilverStone 1-to-8 PWM Fan Hub

1LiquidPC · Mar 31, 2018

You should be able to do that. I have Mini-Valve fittings attached to a T-Line fitting that I keep one closed except for draining. This way, I can remove stop fitting and attach a length of tubing before opening the valve for draining. Regarding serial vs. parallel, I'm doubtful there would much of a change in temps. My understanding from research and my own experience is going to be radiator capacity and fans/fanspeed are the main factors. Loop order also doesn't make much difference as long as pump immediately follows reservoir. The temps will "level out" over time for the coolant regardless of where it goes first or last.

Those are some awesome specs for your PC. One thing I find a bit odd though is the single stick of RAM. Cutting down your memory bandwidth to single-channel for a high end build seems out of place if I'm seeing that correctly. Figure it may be from the high price of RAM at the moment. Overall though, you did an awesome job. One thing to keep an eye on though is the coolant. I still read stories of thes "premixes" breaking down, changing colors, ect. over time and start clogging cooling fins in the blocks. Not sure how widespread this is in 2018, as it used to be relatively common. Still, worth keeping watch over.

Regarding temps, GPU looks great. CPU however does seem high for stock. Is MCE enabled on your build in the UEFI? This could explain the temps being at this level for "stock" as with MCE, stock isn't really stock as far as Intel is concerned.

isaacwinkler · Mar 31, 2018

1LiquidPC :

Yeah, I intend on replacing the RAM at a later point, given the increased price for GPUs recently (and the expense of the rest of the build + water cooling) I made a little sacrifice to scrape under my budget. I want to do 2x16 sticks when i can.

Yeah, I heard the horror stories about coolant premixes but originally I couldn't find any distilled water in Australia, it was only after i bought the premix that I did heh.

I will check MCE see if it is enabled and reply after.

thanks for the help and glad you like it!

EDIT: I cannot seem to find MCE in the UEFI, hmm any idea which heading or menu it should be under? (bit of a scrub)

1LiquidPC · Mar 31, 2018

Sorry for delay, played Farcry 5 for a few hours. MCE is Multicore Enhancement. It will be on Extreme Tweaker section in UEFI. If enabled or auto, it typically will try boosting all cores to 4.7ghz at an excessive voltage setting, likely based on averages regarding voltage. This will lead to higher temps and power consumption. Normally, the 8700k has a max single core turbo of 4.7Ggz. It's known the 8700k can get toasty at higher voltages. For now, if enabled, I would disable.

The premixes are popular for both the colors available for unique looks in custom builds, as well as the needed anti-algae and corrosion inhibitors in cased of dissimilar metals. They just need replaced periodically and blocks may need cleaned.

isaacwinkler · Apr 1, 2018

1LiquidPC :

No problem, I completely understand! Will dive into Far Cry 5 once I get the new monitor in, if I can afford it this week heh.

Found Multicore Enhancement and tried switching it from Auto to disabled but i can't be sure if it is helping. The CPU is currently running really hot even just running windows normally and browsing the web its now on 45-55 (spikes to 60). This is both with and without MCE. Have been playing games for a few hours and it is about 33-35 celcius today so not really helping I suppose, will have to monitor and see how it goes.

EDIT:

As I observed changing MCE to disabled didn't make much if any of a difference to the temperatures.

That said I tried flipping my fans around to pull air out of the case rather than push through (as they build it) and it has had a noticeable difference. My CPU is only 5 - 10 degrees cooler (reaching 60-61 under load) but my hard drives and SSD are all a good 10-15 degrees cooler! I'm thinking that it may be beneficial to have a push/pull on the rad given the thickness, I could mount 4 120mm fans on the interior of the case behind the rad to pull air in from the outside and straight through the rad. Might help a little more.

isaacwinkler · Apr 7, 2018

Alright, been monitoring for about a week and things have gotten worse! for the past few days I have been running with the ram clocked up to its advertised speeds and the CPU running with MCE disabled. It was running fine (36-40 idle, 65-70 under load playing games) but today it is just unusable for gaming.

My idle temp is now about 43-45 and 70 - 90 under load (it starts off in the 70-77 range and after a little while it goes up past 80 to 90 and stays around the 88-92 range). It's odd, it is no hotter today then the rest of the week and the only thing I have changed today was overclocking my GPU. I tried out the OC profile I was using throughout the week instead of my own overclock profile from today but it makes no difference so I figure that is not the problem. The contact with the CPU is fine and the screws are tightened and I have tried setting my pump and rad fans to max without any effect so I am unsure what else I can check.

If anyone has any other ideas what might be the case let me know.

thanks
isaacwinkler

(temps in celcius)

1LiquidPC · Apr 7, 2018

Possible there is an air pocket somewhere? Does coolant flow seem normal, should be clearly moving at a good pace.
I believe 1 GPM is what to shoot for. What are temps with GPU at stock again? Pump itself sound normal?

isaacwinkler · Apr 7, 2018

Air pockets wise I don't think so. Initially there was a small one but they have all worked their way out of the loop (thus leaving a small gap at the top of the reservoir).

As far as I can tell flow seems normal, not entirely sure if there is a way to be certain since I don't have a flow meter (something ekwb doesn't do unfortunately) but the pump is vibrating.

At stock my GPU was 30-31 ish idle and like 47 underload max. Even with the overclock I did to it those temperatures are still consistent.
Overclock:
Core Voltage : +85%
Power Limit : 120%
Temp. limit : 90C
Core Clock : + 100
Memory Clock : +400 MHz (=11.8 GHz effective data-rate)

Its like the CPU just isn't being cooled properly since the GPU seems to be getting the proper treatment :/.

Thanks for the help!
isaacwinkler

1LiquidPC · Apr 7, 2018

OK. If GPU is set to stock, do CPU temps return to lower temps? When you removed CPU cooler, there was good contact and amount of thermal compound? Just narrowing things down. With both at stock speeds, your 480 radiator capacity should be fine. Since your case is open design, can you feel any "hot spots" on CPU monoblock or waterlines in/out of it? Radiator? If you run a CPU only stresstest, what are temps?

isaacwinkler · Apr 7, 2018

1LiquidPC :

Nah the temperatures don't change. Same at stock and overclock of GPU. Contact is good and compound is good (I did the method of putting a thin layer on before attaching the waterblock to ensure it was properly covered, others prefer the rice grain method + pressure, idk the method i followed was by the guy who did a similar build to mine and got lower cpu temps than mine so should be ok).

During the CPU stress test in that 3dmark time spy bench, the cpu hit 96 - 100 but mostly stayed around the 93 mark after it got to the most stressing part. Other than that I haven't done any particular CPU stress test mostly since it is running too hot already!

The monoblock gets a little warm as do the tubes in and out but nothing extreme or too noticeable. The rad gets pretty warm after a while.

I have done a small workaround for now, I set the cpu clock to 4.3 rather than leaving that on auto and changed the voltage to 1.2 instead of 1.1 something and that seems to have cooled it down to what it used to be but not getting the most out of the cpu probs.

1LiquidPC · Apr 7, 2018

Very odd situation you have there. I apply a thin layer myself of thermal compound for CPU and GPU. You should be nowhere near 96-100 with your setup or staying around 93. I typically run RealBench for CPU testing, among others. Folks on here use AIDA64, Prime95,ect. for CPU stress testing. Is there anyway to provide more pics of your build or a short video clip of running loop to see if there is flow issues somewhere, or a restriction of some sort. Given that GPU temps are always fine, yet CPU is always high even when GPU is practically idle is odd. Not sure if the parallel setup would have an affect or not. If it does, I'm doubtful it would be that much. I have my CPU block outlet going directly to GPU block inlet, and my GPU temps are still fine when gaming on CPU intensive games. You shouldn't have to lower your CPU to 4.3Ghz to get good temps with custom cooling, even with VRM cooling with monoblock. My previous X99 setup with VRM cooling integrated as well didn't have the issue that you are experiencing. When you mention 1.2v, is this a manual vcore, adaptive, or offset?

EDIT
After a bit more reading, it possibly could be the parallel setup. It can cut down flow by a large margin in some instances when used with different blocks, CPU and GPU in your case. I ran parallel before, but this was with an SLI bridge adapter with identical GPU blocks. You can end up in a situation where the majority of coolant flow goes to one block and not the other when in parallel configuration. This all said, there is much debate on real-world results. Some say big difference, some say almost none with regards to temps.

isaacwinkler · Apr 7, 2018

1LiquidPC :

manual for the 1.2 i believe.

i will try get some pictures once my phone is charged see if it can help.

The main thing is looking at the tubes all you see is solid colour, you dont see any movement or anything but i doubt you would since its completely filled loop. i see bubbles in the reservoir too, maybe from air escaping or something.

1LiquidPC · Apr 7, 2018

You should still be able to see flow in the tubes if look close enough, also, you can feel the coolant flow so to speak. I'm curious if the flow going to the inlet of the GPU is about the same as coolant flow to the tube going to inlet of CPU block. If there is a very noticeable drop, it could be a flow issue. There are only a few things that could be causing this issue I would think. Regarding pics, it's likely tomorrow until I'll be replying again on here. Going to get into some gaming for a bit yet this evening. We'll figure this out one way or another.

isaacwinkler · Apr 8, 2018

1LiquidPC :

All good, I will post the links here for whenever you are free.

pics album: https://imgur.com/a/H2PXc

I noticed there is a clear spot right under where the tube goes in, I am wondering if this is supposed to be there or not. It seems different pictures have somewhat similar results or are completely coloured.

Sorry for the poor quality, not a filming expert heh.
video: https://youtu.be/aGKY02UH14I

1LiquidPC · Apr 8, 2018

Thanks for the update and detailed pics and video. I'm no filming expert either, lol.

I found other folks with same trouble getting air pockets cleared in monoblock. Some said they disappear after awhile, while some said higher stock voltage applied by motherboard caused temp issues. Oddly, found several with similar situation with monoblock. GPU temps are great, but CPU is in the 80Cs with no OC or mild. I'm wondering if just being shared with VRMs for cooling in general causes the issue, requiring more radiator capacity to compensate. When I could VRMs previously, I had separate block.

isaacwinkler · Apr 8, 2018

Yeah it may be, doesn't seem like there is much I can do about it at the moment then. Monoblocks are the only thing available for z370 boards. You would think, though, that the monoblock would work just as well, especially given the radiator I have.

I guess I will just have to wait until I can reconfigure the loop and maybe I can make some improvements to get the cpu temps down. Try out serial (though as you said it probably shouldn't be much a difference), maybe add a second pump (seen some suggestions this can give a better flow rate depending on the set up) or set up a push/pull config on the rad.

1LiquidPC · Apr 8, 2018

Sorry I can't really be more helpful on this. We're you looking at VRM cooling originally, or just a general CPU block. It's my understanding that current high-end boards have no real issues with VRM temps, providing they have some airflow. In your case though, you wouldn't have this airflow. Push/pull fan configuration for radiator is at best a few degree difference from articles I've read. With regards to pump, I had a single D5 for routing through a top-mounted 480mm radiator, CPU, and GPU block years back and had plenty of flow. Plus, I think you mentioned running pump and fans at max made no real temp change. Flow issue would have brought temps down to some extent I would think.

isaacwinkler · Apr 8, 2018

1LiquidPC :

Its all good, you have been very helpful! Thank you for taking you time to try and troubleshoot.

You are correct in that it would not provide much benefit but maybe lots of little benefit will equal one big benefit heh.

If I could find an appropriate bracket I could mount the radiator sideways onto the case and have air flow through the radiator and across the board. Alternatively, it maybe be possible to mount fans on a 90 degree bracket down the radiator next to the res. Both these are solutions I have seen for getting air flow across the board but would require finding a bracket or making your own :/ but it might help and look good in the process.

Oh yeah, the motherboard also comes with heatsinks pre installed on the mosfets, I would assume this would be adequate for cooling them seperately since there is no water cooling solution.

Update: I also just found out that the mobo comes with a 40mm/50mm fan mount for the VRM area. I can't be certain on the actual performance of such a fan for that purpose but it boasts a 25 degree reduction.

This might just be a plan!

I could:
- replace the monoblock with a cpu only waterblock
- reinstall the standard heatsinks onto the VRM
- install a 40/50mm fan over the heatsinks

I suppose it is no guarantee but it may just work out the better.

1LiquidPC · Apr 9, 2018

Have to look into this after work. Might be onto something to solving this

1LiquidPC · Apr 9, 2018

Any luck with finding 40 or 50mm fans? I would agree they can't provide much airflow, but it could help. I'd look for low noise models, as the small diameter fans can get loud fast. If you were to look into a separate CPU only block, are you looking strictly at EK? I still can't say for sure if it's causing the problem, just seems that quite a few folks with EK's monoblocks are in a similar situation with great GPU temps and high CPU temps.

isaacwinkler · Apr 9, 2018

1LiquidPC :

Yeah, there are a bunch of different 40mm fans, there is a noctua one which might look odd but it is PWM so if it gets crazy noisy I can turn the speed up or down.

- Noctua NF-A4x20 40mm PWM 5000RPM Fan

I think the idea isn't so much airflow as it is direct onto the VRM area. So it pushes a load of air directly onto that point to cool it down.

As for CPU waterblock, yes I would go EKWB because I don't want to risk incompatibility with mixed blocks and different materials!

- EK Supremacy EVO

It is no guarantee but idk what else I can try at this point heh.

1LiquidPC · Apr 10, 2018

Noctua makes premium products, but I agree on the color scheme isn't the best. I have some of their products. You are correct about just needing a bit of direct cooling for VRMs. Just need a bit of airflow over them to dissipate heat.

Sounds like a solid plan. I try to keep brand specific CPU/GPU blocks as well. Generally though, it's just aluminum that you never want in a custom loop.

isaacwinkler · Apr 10, 2018

1LiquidPC :

Yeah. Well, I will let you know how it goes.

First Watercooling Loop Feedback

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Splendid

Reputable

Splendid

Reputable

Share this page