MSI Claiming liquid damage

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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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Hiya, its my first time on here looking for a bit of advice.

We bought a Geforce GTX 1070 TI 8gb from CCL online back in December last year. All working fine up until about 3 weeks again I just couldn't get the picture to display, so I sent it in for RMA back to CCL.

CCL came back a few days later to confirm yes there was a fault so would send back to manufacturer. A few days later I get a very blunt email from CCL to say MSI have found liquid damage and will not offer repair or replacement, sending the card back, nothing we can do get lost basically.

I've naturally argued this as I do not have a water cooled system, nor has any liquid been present near my case, I have checked with a fine tooth comb the contents of my PC and there is no evidence of any liquid an anything nor the case.

I am getting nowhere with them they just always reply with its liquid damaged nothing they will do, I asked them to send me a picture of the liquid damage which I have attached. To me this looks like it could be the heat pipes that have leaked onto the unit, I have said this but they are not ever reading my thoughts, I'm just getting a generic nothing we can do, go away type email.

I paid good money for this and I am not prepared to back down if I am in the right and its a fault with the card.

Does anyone have any advice that could help my case?

Any responses would be much appreciated

https://ibb.co/fZFbO9

Hopefully the above picture link works


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Solution
androbourne
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ElectrO_90

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Apr 17, 2007
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First of, which country are you in? All countries have different laws, and to me it looks like something got very hot and died a death. Obviously, something has gone wrong, and you need to fight it. I would.

So what country are you in and then look at consumer protection laws.
Also how old it is etc
 
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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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Hi, thanks for your reply. I am in the UK. When purchased it stated a 1yr warranty and its only 8 months old.

The response I get is that MSI have found liquid damage and that it is void of warranty so no replacement or refund, they wont even entertain that its is a fault with the card. I have stated over and over this is not liquid damage from anything I have done but they are basically saying computer says no and wanting me to just go away.

I have made a complaint and waiting for a manager to contact me but I have a feeling I will get the same robotic response.

Thanks
 
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ElectrO_90

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Apr 17, 2007
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Explain, there is zero liquid in your computer, your computer is not anywhere near liquid, you treat your computer like a princess and have no food/drinks being eaten at your computer because its extremely expensive and valuable to you.

Being in the UK you do have quite good consumer protection. Also if they keep insisting about the liquid ask them what the liquid is? If they are sure it is liquid then they need to show you a data analaysis of what the liquid consists of (this is where you can become anal to them but try to always be polite and courteous) Ask for the inspection report.

If you still have the GPU you can take it to someone who knows about Electronics (such as TV Engineer who knows what water damage looks like) and if he concurs that it is liquid damage, then you really can't do much about it. EVen if you are sure you didn't do it.

Also is the liquid damage on the bottom of the card or the top? If liqiud is at the top of the card then yes something could fall on to it, if it is under the card, then how does liquid fall up against gravity?

I hope some of this helps and good luck getting it all back
 
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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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They say that the card is on the way back from MSI and that I will have it returned to me as a resolution to the ticket, but im just concerned that if I get the faulty card back and they close the ticket that's all my chances of a refund scuppered because I have taken the card back, but yes I do want to see for myself this "liquid" to see what it could be as all I have to rely on is that picture which in fairness shows no identification of being mine, there are no serial numbers etc visible. Thanks for your advice, when or should I say if the manager comes back to me I will ask for the data analysis of the said liquid then I know what we are dealing with. Makes me wonder if they have actually analysed it though and not just see the liquid and thought, nope, its liquid send it back, without thinking it could possible be an element that's failed within the card to have caused it?

Thanks for all the responses.
 
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ElectrO_90

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Apr 17, 2007
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well of course, they have not analised it, so are guessing it to be a liquid.
As i said, if the liquid is on the underside, how can liquid drip UP onto it? You will have to wait and see, even if it is returned, the ticket being closed doesn't mean anything, as you can open a new one and the gpu is only 8 months old.
 
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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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UPDATE- The saga continues, I have been backwards and forwards with CCL who claim MSI say void warranty, user damaged. I requested a full report from MSI detailing where on the card the liquid is located, what they claim the liquid to be etc. The report I got back was worded "card flooded, user damaged, picture provided" and that was it, the picture being the one above which could be anyone's card, no identification numbers, no detail of location! Its laughable. Im just getting nowhere, neither CCL or MSI are admitting this card is faulty, yet they cant come back to me with any evidence in my opinion to suggest its user damage despite me giving them many an opportunity to do so. Where do I stand, I'm not prepared to walk away when I feel I am in the right, all I can think is the small claims court, do you think I have a chance, what argument could they have because they haven't provided any back up evidence to support that my card is flooded, all I've seen is the picture they sent and their claim that its flooded, but because of how my case is it simply couldn't be caused by me, but its just little old me against a big company. The customer service at CCL has been shocking for one, ive been left over a week without a reply, when I ring I'm avoided and kept on hold for ages, then the person claims who I need is off ill, but then miraculously I get an email from her that afternoon, I'm being utterly fobbed off!

Any thoughts would be much appreciated, thanks
 
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drivinfast247

drivinfast247

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May 29, 2018
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Small claims court for a $400 video card?!?! I guess if you have the spare time you could. It would cost me more money by missing a day or more of work than the card itself. It sucks to say it but looks like you need to accept the loss and move on. Leave a review of product and seller. Never buy that brand again.
 
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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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I've never used the court before, but a quick look at its £35 online, unsure if there are any other costs without investigating further. Id rather not just suck it up to be honest, its a lot of money that I saved hard for, thanks for your reply though
 
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Phazoner

Phazoner

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Jul 2, 2014
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I guess in the UK there are consumer organizations which can advise you. As the others said, demonstrating your innocence about the failure of the graphics card should lead to MSi paying for your card, time and costs, and as soon as they receive the court, they will very probably prefer to just give you the reason and stop the process.

In spanish forums MSi is highly unrecommended because spanish MSi's SAT uses to put excuses to not process the warranty (like blaming the user for the hardware issues). Seems like they're starting to be this way in other countries :/
 
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androbourne

androbourne

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Jul 18, 2017
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Not sure I agree with the bad MSI claims here. I have only used MSI for years and had to return a few things which never was questioned. At least here in the US. MSI is a great manufacture.

As for the "water damage". The problem with bringing it to small clams court is they would need to prove this is a defect in majority of their cards. Not just yours. A one off, does not account for world wide usage of this card. I don't think you have a chance in court. Sorry.

What you could try to do is send in take a screenshot of your full system and show them there was zero water damage anywhere in the case. Try to provide to them there was no water damage anywhere.

You may need to make another claim for it to work. But it's worth a try.
 
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Phazoner

Phazoner

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He is not demanding the entire line of graphics card so there's no need to prove that it is a generalized problem. In Spain and I bet anywhere in the world a third proficient will check the damage to detail the damage. If it just isn't poured water damage as MSi says the case is done.
 
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androbourne

androbourne

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I get that, but cards dont just blow up on their own or get said "water damage" from simple use. He is talking about a defect. He would need to prove it wasn't water damage and rather a defect, and if it was a defect, there should be more cases of such.

In doing so he could prove it wasn't just some one off thing. That is really the only way I see it even standing a chance in court.

Or if you believe MSI is wrong in saying it's water damage. Then I'd say bring it to a hardware repair expert and have them validate that claim for you. Of course, you'd be spending money having a 3rd party validate or invalidate MSI claims for you.

Just remember. A lot of manufactures have way of checking for water damage. They don't just make those claims based on what they see with their eyes. They often have tools for finding such issues.

Good example of this is with cell phones. Most cell phone battery packs have a strip on them that is solid white and will turn white/red if it has been in contact with water. I'm sure large companies like MSI would have methods as such, to find different damage types as well.
 
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lju

Aug 13, 2018
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This is the reason why I asked for such test results so I could be told its "water" but after several requests they have failed to come back to me with what the liquid is, if they had test result why would they withhold them from me if it shows that I am the one that damaged it, and because they haven't been able to give me detail as to the location of the liquid, the picture shows its grouped in one area which in the picture looks like grease, again they haven't come back to me with the anything after numerous requests. I haven't been given my card back either so I cant see for myself where the said liquid is, and because of the case I have which is solid top and sides, there isn't a chance of water ingress from spilt water etc which I think they are trying to claim this is as I haven't got a water cooled system which is why I am arguing the fact that there must be a defect with that particular card. With anything, some things are unfortunate to get issues like with cars, some models are renowned for problems but you might have a car of that model and never have a problem yet someone with the same car has no end of issue, sometimes you are just unlucky, and in this case I feel I have a defective card that has failed and I'm being fobbed off and as I bought the card off CCL I feel they should honour it.

I have raised a dispute through the ombudsman against CCL as they are the ones who have provided the shocking customer service and have provided all the emails backwards and forwards from July when this started to back up my case and having read them all back, it really is ridiculous that after so many attempts for them to provide me with evidence they have either ignored me or just come back with "computer says no".

I will update more when I get any further on with this palaver!

Thanks for all the reply's, much appreciated.
 
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Phazoner

Phazoner

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ElectrO_90

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I think you have it backwards.
MSI has to prove it was damaged by water, not this guy.
You are correct in showing his setup in a photo showing how the card is mounted and how water got "up" in the card since when installed it faces downwards.
Nothing to do with defect of all cards, but a problem with this specific one.
 
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androbourne

androbourne

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I dont have it backwards. I meant exactly what I said.

I know MSI stated it was water damage. I said he should get a 3rd party hardware repair shop to verify MSI claims of water damage...

And what Im saying about it holding up in court. A defect in ONE card is not enough to provide that MSI needs to take responsibility for it. As I stated earlier, water doesn't just magically appear on the card, if it did would be a greater defect then in just one card which could be proven in court.

A defect in one card that has been used for months will not hold up in court. There is no facts here to prove the issue is with the series of card rather then just a one off, which MSI isn't responsible for because it can't be proven to not be water damage.

Long story short, dont waste your time in court. You'll get nothing from it expect a bill at the end.
 
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ElectrO_90

Splendid
Apr 17, 2007
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If you do some research there are generally a 3 outcomes if you take someone to small claims court
Taken from someone with experience.....

In reality, someone in MSI will either contact you to settle, or they'll not turn up, and you'll win by default.

I'd be tempted to try a recorded delivery letter addressed to their chief exec (of MSI) as a final step before court though.

In small claims, you generally represent yourself (in fact you are expected to) so no lawyer costs, and the other side can (if they win) only claim basic costs for witness expenses and a couple of other things, not legal fees.
 
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