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Windows 8.....Pros and Cons?

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a b * Windows 8
September 30, 2011 11:45:51 AM

Who has tried the recent developers release of Windows 8?What do you feel are the pros and cons?

More about : windows pros cons

September 30, 2011 11:50:38 AM

Is the beta already out, where can I dl it? I tried google but none of the place look legit.

Edit: nevermind, found the source from msdn.
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a b * Windows 8
September 30, 2011 11:52:15 AM

It's a developers release!
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Related resources
September 30, 2011 11:56:16 AM

I will try it on my old test rig. Since you are the first post of the window 8 forum, I congradulate you for making the 1st post. Are you going to be the moderator of this section?
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a b * Windows 8
September 30, 2011 12:07:20 PM

No, i moderate in all sections of the forum , but i enjoy the windows and apps sections.
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September 30, 2011 5:17:30 PM

Pyree said:
I will try it on my old test rig. Since you are the first post of the window 8 forum, I congradulate you for making the 1st post. Are you going to be the moderator of this section?



Can you paste that link here I am too curios to experiment on that beta. thanks. :sol:  :sol:  :sol: 
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September 30, 2011 7:02:33 PM



Well I won't be troubling Windows 8 unless they drop the bootloader scheme they're trying to impose on us, which will preclude Linux users from dual-booting.

I own my computer - Microsoft does not and I insist on control over it.


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a b * Windows 8
September 30, 2011 10:14:23 PM

Let us know what you think pyree!
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October 1, 2011 1:22:08 AM

I am testing it on virtual machine instead. Can't bothered to burn it and move out of my room to insert it to the test rig.
Installing...

Apart from comments on the OS itself, I will test some common program and report wether they work and how well they work. The VM I set up is on VirtualBox 4.1.2 with window 7 (64bit) host and guest with 2GB ram, 1 core, 32MB graphics memory and 20GB HDD for the host machine, really low spec.
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October 1, 2011 1:33:03 AM

So now the installation is complete and restart, updating registry. Only took 10 minutes to install. Very impressive.

The OS took up 10GB of HDD space. Only about 30 process and use 650MB for memory.

On the otherhand, what the hell is that interface?! Metro makes the OS like a web flash program. It will take me some serious behavioural adjustment to get used to it.

There is so much crap I don't need on Metro. Hopefully they give us a tick box selection on the first run of window 8 so we can select to have only the things we want fast, instead of removing them individually (may be because I am using mouse).

Hell no! I tried to ctrl+click and it wouldn't select multiple icon for me to delete. I am really stuck to removing them individually.

Got a suggestion from window asking wether I want optimisation and I went ok. Didn't give me options after that. Window took over without explaination on what it is about to do. But by the flashing HDD light, I think it is doing a defrag. I am not sure how much it helps on a VM. So this is one of those black box OS where automation require no input or explaination to the users, which I don't like. At least tell me what you are going to do. If I know it is a defrag, I won't press the OK button blindly and slows my system to a halt.

Everytime I click on the "start" icon, it brings me back to that awful Metro interface. I still haven't figure out how to change to classic view after 20 minute.

Found a solution with google. You can do it by a software which changes the registry for you or you can change teh registry yourself. Of course I am going to change the registry myself.

For anyone searching for it, it is:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer

Chnage RPEnabled string to 0 to get rid of Metro.

But then, all of a sudden, there is this giant grey box pop-up showing my time and my network icon. I did not request for that. Must have pressed something. How do I get rid of it? It won't go away by pressing the desktop or the blank on the taskbar.

Try restart to see if grey box goes away and it does. I waited for it to restart and it is taking a long time to go to the logon page. But it appears to be my problem. I am just being stupid, the logon page was there for a long time. It was covered by a wallpaper which you have to drag over to uncover the logon screen. I feel like an idiot or should I say the GUI developer makes people feel like they are idiots or the developer themselves are idiots.

I timed it and turns out it reach the logon screen from the time I turn on the VM in 28 seconds on a 1TB 5400rpm WD Green HDD.
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a b * Windows 8
October 1, 2011 2:16:04 AM

Keep us posted on further observations of windows 8!
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October 1, 2011 3:33:24 AM

The software I tested are:

FF 7.0.1
CCCP MPC 2011.07.30
OpenOffice 3.3.0

They all install and work normally. Apart from when I try to play HD .264 content. I am going to give the VM more power to run it. Give it all 4 cores and 256 VRAM with hardware acceleration but still couldn't get it to work. I assume that is because of the VM. Window 8 should have no problem handling 1080p with gpu or igp acceleration.

An interesting test I ran was the number of cores to boot up time test. I though window 8 allow you too boot up with more than 1 core, I used 1 core and 4 cores for boot up time but I see no difference. Maybe it just wasn't implemented or implemented correctly yet or maybe because it is HDD limited.

IMO, window 8 is going to be a performance oriented OS concentrating on sliming down on the hardware requirement. The slim window 8 would be good running on tablet device because they are low on hardware, also window 8 accomodates the newer trand of touch device by putting in the Metro interface.

However, if you use a recent or older desktop or laptop, the Metro interface is difficult to get use to with the mouse and keyboard. Window 7 for now is just as efficient on desktop and laptop machine.

Even with the registry change, there are still some adjustment you have to get used to. So if you are still on old hardware using xp, get ready for a big change because it will be like learning on how to use window vista/7 and the Metro interface in 1 go. For window vista/7 users, it will still take time to get used to it.

From my experience, the preview release does not provide advantage over window 7 to persuade me to migrate to window 8. The Metro interface need to be invisible to users without touch input. I know technology changes, but we had so many years of xp, we just get used to vista and window 7; we are lazy and just don't want to change the way we nevigate through the OS for no advantage on speed or user friendliness.
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October 1, 2011 5:42:57 AM

I do not have at this time, after release i will buy.
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October 1, 2011 8:13:52 AM

^so true. Cannot turn off Metro with a button and must go through regedit is nasty. Metro is not good for device without touch at all. Since the majority of computer still use mouse and keyboard, Metro should be invisible and you turn it on with a button, as oppose to Metro is the default and you have to turn it off going through regedit (many people don't or don't like touching the registry). MS got the GUI priority totally wrong.
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October 1, 2011 8:45:08 AM

I haven't managed to get GPU acceleration working inside the VM yet, so it still feels a bit choppy. First impressions are generally positive, but the interface is tricky to navigate with mouse and keyboard if you're not used to it.
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October 1, 2011 9:22:17 AM



I must try harder to be positive about W8 and appreciate that I'm coming across as a bit anti but I really don't see the need for yet another OS at this time. XP has been with us for ten years and by the look of the this Forum's XP board, is still used by a huge number of people.

W8 will be the fourth new release in under five years and that alone is an indicator to M$ that something has been wrong with the NT 6.* project from the word go? A new OS is also the trigger for the hardware upgrade requirements to be rachetted up and many people find the costs of that hard to bear - particularly at the moment.

All that said, I will try harder to learn to love it. :D 

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October 1, 2011 9:35:20 AM

No, I don't think there is a need for hardware upgrade. I ran the VM with 1 core, 2GB RAM, 20GB in a 5400rpm Green drive and 32MB of graphics and it still gives me 2.0 for the wei and Window 8 decides that I can have all of the visual effects on. Althought I have to say can get a bit choppy, but no long lag. Turn the effect off gives me no problem.
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October 1, 2011 10:28:58 AM

Looks interesting..!
Downloading...
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October 1, 2011 3:37:22 PM

mmm... I think I am going to make it to go to BSOD. Interesting to see it in person. I am going to set the pagefile to 0 and set the VM to like 128MB RAM. Hopefully that will do it.

Fail! Window 8 just load really slow.

Googled method to trigged bsod, I am going to try them. But the crash on ctrl scroll doesn't work. How can I BSOD my window 8?

end process csrss.exe and received a critical object termination. My first BSOD on window 8. It does look a lot more friendlier. There is no mention of the word error and doesn't have a bunch of numbers which you cannot understand. The problem is toned down to something less serious with word description which you can understand. It does not have the shocking effect of the old BSOD maybe because instead of looking at a high contrast blue screen with white text which will catch your attention, you now stare at a soothing sky blue screen, sad face emoticon with smoothed edge text.
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a b * Windows 8
October 1, 2011 6:14:33 PM

Thanks for the updates pyree!
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October 2, 2011 5:01:24 AM

I am going to see if old software can run on window 8. I think I am going to try run AOE I and II on it, but I can't find them...

Update: found them, and installing.

Works flawlessly with both game, no need for compatible mode.
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October 2, 2011 5:45:34 AM

yasir siddiqui said:
I do not have at this time, after release i will buy.


Try it before you buy. There is a big chance you won't buy it if you already have window 7 and not using touch interface.
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a b * Windows 8
October 2, 2011 6:13:54 AM

If you need a new OS, then simply buy the latest version of Windows.

All Windows releases have bugs. Vista had way too many, but Windows 7 was based mostly on Vista so it was sorted out.

Windows 8 is based mostly on Windows 7 so it will probably be the most stable Windows OS at time of release.

The METRO desktop interface is unlikely to be used much by a normal desktop user. I wouldn't even want it with a laptop with touchscreen because of the fingerprints.

As for TABLETS, the issue isn't really the fact that Windows 8 will be running underneath, but the fact that the programs it uses need to be optimized for tablets. That's what Apple did with the iPad.

Unless every tablet program you can access is optimized for using with our fingers it's going to be a big problem.

Basically for desktops the changes will be like going from a MATURE version of Vista to Windows 7. A few extras here and there, definitely an improvement but not a requirement to upgrade.

However, I say again, simply always buy the latest Windows OS available.
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October 3, 2011 6:18:43 AM

Well, that link I posted is 64 bit without developer tool. saga lout provided the 32 bit version and area51reopened provide the link to the page with everything, that page was where I download it from. If you need 32 bit or need developer tool, go to that link and thank saga lout and area51reopened.

I am going to google for program with compatibility problem with window 7 even in compatibility mode and see if window 8 can do better.

Did a brief search, too lazy to go deeper to find a software that won't work on window 7 compatibility mode, or are there any? Suggestion?
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October 6, 2011 1:50:00 AM

I know this is a “developers” release but I already know that I don’t like metro, it gets in the way of doing work.
The way I see it we now have three platform environments Tablets, or Pads, Desk tops and laptops. The deference could be compared to Air, Land and Water. While Air and Water share some similarities they are never the less different but at the same time requiring many of the same parameters to operate efficiently; laptops can be touch screens or mouse, tablets are usually touch screens but can also use a mouse. Then there’s Land where real heavy duty work is done and requires heavy duty machines, usually using a mouse and keyboard as the pointing device, while desktops can also use touch screens they normally do not come with such devices mainly because the arm will tire quickly after reaching fro the monitor to move things around or point to the umpteenth icon, application, etc. Metro works fine in the tablet and laptop environments but on a desk top it simply gets in the way.
Suggestions:
MS should consider making the OS smart enough to know what environment it is being installed in and setup the GUI accordingly, this would be an auto detection algorithm or give the users a choice; choices are always better than no choice at all.
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a b * Windows 8
October 6, 2011 10:20:48 AM

NelsonVe said:
The way I see it we now have three platform environments Tablets, or Pads, Desk tops and laptops.
You left out Phones.

"I don’t like metro, it gets in the way of doing work."
I don't find this to be true in my case. Within just a week's worth of experience and experimenting I didn't find any limitations to getting my work done. I'm not using any touch screens at the moment.

"Metro works fine in the tablet and laptop environments but on a desk top it simply gets in the way"
My laptop and desktop environments are virtually identical and perform the same tasks and workloads.



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October 6, 2011 11:22:47 AM

in my rig i got a problem with sound drivers, I tried to fix with MS visual studio but i cant done it well. Any suggestion, its a test rig for win 8 64 bit.audio codec is ALC662 from Realtek (Intel board dg41rq).

thanks
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October 7, 2011 2:07:06 AM

Saga Lout said:


Well I won't be troubling Windows 8 unless they drop the bootloader scheme they're trying to impose on us, which will preclude Linux users from dual-booting.

I own my computer - Microsoft does not and I insist on control over it.



Secure Boot has been supported by quite a few computer since 2008. Microsoft only requires it enabled by default, they specifically said they have no problem allowing it to be disabled.

Also, it's only a requirement if you want the Windows8 Logo on your computer. You can still sell computers with Windows8 an no secure boot, you just can't use the logo.
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October 7, 2011 11:54:58 PM

For you guys using VirtualBox, does Windows 8 lag for you? It lags for me.
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October 8, 2011 3:10:17 AM

SR-71 Blackbird said:
Who has tried the recent developers release of Windows 8?What do you feel are the pros and cons?


So far I've notice tremendously fast start up and log-in times, but I suspect that is due to the Operating System having no drivers or processes to load of any sort. As the release stages progress into Beta, then Release Candidate and then more updates, it should climb up. However as of now, on my laptop with an Intel X25-V SSD, the OS boots in 3-4seconds Flat and login is 1 second. Very Impressive.

Internet Explorer 10 is pretty buggy, but I installed chrome and seems to work excellent.

I cannot place my laptop into Standby mode at all....not sure why. It is quite annoying, but I can tolerate it a bit due to the intensly fast boot times.

I absolutely hate the fact that you can't create desktop shortcuts unless you search for the apps into the program files folder, but I fixed that by downloading the Metro UI tweaker and taking away the entire fancy start menu interface and replacing it with a regular windows 7 style start menu.

Resource usage is similar to window 7 if not lighter and the OS is flying so far, very stable, no crashes and excellent performance. I like it.!
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October 8, 2011 3:50:14 AM

@pckitty4427

Deja vu? Try turn off visual transition effect.
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a b * Windows 8
October 8, 2011 6:15:34 AM

Saga Lout said:
Well I won't be troubling Windows 8 unless they drop the bootloader scheme they're trying to impose on us, which will preclude Linux users from dual-booting.

I own my computer - Microsoft does not and I insist on control over it.
Here is my bootloader menu. Win8 and Linux can play nicely together.
I understand the default bootloader scheme is not ideal for you but there isn't an actual limitation to what you can choose to run.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

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October 8, 2011 6:34:19 AM

WR2 said:
Here is my bootloader menu. Win8 and Linux can play nicely together.
I understand the default bootloader scheme is not ideal for you but there isn't an actual limitation to what you can choose to run.




Thatnks for that WR2, it's very useful and much like my Win 7 bootloader but my understanding is it's harder to organise in W8. I'lll start playing with it properly this weekend - haven't had time before now - and if as it obviously can be done, I'll do it. Did you use BCDEDIT or edit an existing menulst in Grub or Lilo?



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a b * Windows 8
October 8, 2011 6:49:15 AM

I'm using EasyBCD. I've grown to like it a lot.
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a b * Windows 8
October 8, 2011 6:57:44 AM

The Win8 Logo requirement / UEFI boot environment is certainly something to keep an eye on.
As Kewlx25 mentions if the Secure Boot option can be configured or set off you can probably end up keeping large enterprises, goverfments and enthusiast users satisfied.
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October 8, 2011 8:43:31 AM


Another item on the con side of this balance sheet is the increasing need for touch-screen technology W8 encourages. Microsoft has always been known top rachet up the hardware requirements but this one is going to prove quite expensive, especially for parents.

Add to that the fact that the incidence of RSI - Repetitive Strain Injury - to young wrists is increasing because of the constant use of mobile touch screens and text messaging on small buttons or screen keys. Some articles predict some of today's teenagers having claw-like hands by their thirties I suspect Windows 8 will add to that problem.

I promise I'll stop posting the negative side of W8 now and concentrate on its good points when I find some. :D 

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October 9, 2011 11:45:08 AM



A couple of points - one is I turned off the Metro using the RPEnabled tweak from above and I still get a blank screen on clicking the Start button. Will spend some more time in the Registry if no-one else has any ideas.

The second is that MSE doesn't want to work in W8 and I feel distinctly naked online with no AV. Anyone found one that works or is this just a Developer Edition problem??


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October 9, 2011 12:16:47 PM

The registry change works perfectly on my VM. I don't why it didn't work for you. Try the other method using 3rd party software.

I am going to dl MSE to test it.

I cannot update definition. My internet is working and firewall is set to off but still cannot update definition. Maybe MS server block it.

Although I can run scan alright.
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October 9, 2011 3:21:37 PM




Hmm - wouldn't even install here. How odd.


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October 9, 2011 3:44:00 PM

It does seem odd. Do you think there is a chance something went wrong on your installation of W8 since the registry change doesn't make Metro go away but makes it unusable and also cannot install MSE.
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October 9, 2011 5:34:01 PM



It all seemed to run quite smoothly and everything else works. I'll press on without an AV for the time being - I just assumed MS were developing another version of MSE for Windows 8.


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a b * Windows 8
October 9, 2011 6:43:04 PM

Not to worry - you've been protected all along with built-in AV and malware protection. You've been getting AV definition updates and probably not even realized it.

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October 9, 2011 6:45:50 PM



I noticed Defender's in there and working but wanted to add in MSE to the mix. Will persevere when work quietens down a bit. :D 

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a b * Windows 8
October 9, 2011 6:49:02 PM

OK,
I thought "press on without an AV for the time being" meant you didn't realize you had an element of protection already working for you.
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October 9, 2011 7:06:51 PM

Pros
The interface is nifty
It comes with Developer tools
It's a heads up on what the final product will look like
You can influence the final product with your feedback

Cons
It's a build. It's not even a beta at this point
It's different from what we're use to with windows.
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