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Various HP printer ink expiration dates analyzed

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Anonymous
a b α HP
September 17, 2004 5:26:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Q: What is the significance of the date printed on the HP ink PACKAGE?
SINGAPORE MAY 2003

> Relevant Hewlett Packard ink cartridge dates are:
> - The date HP manufactured the ink cartridge
> - The date HP prints on the ink cartridge
> - The date HP prints on the ink cartridge package consumer cardboard box
> - The date HP printer cartridges are installed in the printer
> - The date HP first stops printing (due to false "low ink" messages)
> - The date HP usually stops printing (due to false "expiration" messages)
> - The date HP actually stops printing (due to true expiration messages)

Since we now know full well HP inserts up to three false expiration
dates before the final (true) expiration date, I ask this question:

Q: What is the MEANING of this date printed on the HP package box?
SINGAPORE MAY 2003

Note 1: Box-print-date is NOT the date the cardboard box was
actually printed (as a quick look at packages on the
store shelves shows most, if not all, to be in the future).

Note 2: Box-print-date also can not be the Cartridge_print_date as
the date printed on the HP ink cartridge is easily proven
to be different simply by opening a box.

Given that actual re-fill tests proved (in ascending order):
a) derived_true_manufacture_date
= 2001/12/10 (cartridge printed date - 2.5 years)
b) date_cartridge_was_purchased
=== 2002/01/12 (date cartridge was purchased)
c) date_cartridge_was_installed
=== 2002/01/14 (date cartridge was placed in service)
d) date_hp_prints_on_the_ink_box
= MAY 2003 (What is the significance of this date?)
e) 1st_false_hp_empty_date
~= 2004/05/14 (approx. 800 pages of ink printing)
f) 2nd_false_hp_expiration_date
= 2004/06/10 (date actually printed on ink tank)
g) 3rd_false_hp_expiration_date
= 2004/07/14 (2.5 years of contiguous printer service)
h) true_hp_ink_expiration_date
= 2006/06/10 (cartridge printed date + 2 years)

Q: What is the significance of the date HP prints on the
outside PACKAGE of the cardboard box containing ink tanks?
MAY 2003 (What is the significance of this date?)
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 18, 2004 2:35:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

"Agent Orange" <agentorange@arboral-systems.com> wrote in message
news:ieplk053v0lv0qlm08j97eqatblq2hef2t@4ax.com...
> Q: What is the significance of the date printed on the HP ink PACKAGE?
> SINGAPORE MAY 2003

As the box says, this is the "install by" date. Exactly what this means
depends on whether it is an integrated printhead vs. a separate ink supply, but
in general if the box says "install by May 2003" it is not likely to be very
good today sixteen months later. If it is an integrated ink and printhead
design (such as the #78 or #45) there is no "lockout" for old cartridges and
you can try them, with possibly poor printing results. The products that have
separate ink and printheads do enforce an expiration date to avoid clogging a
printhead with old ink. See:
http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/Docume...

Regards,
Bob Headrick, not speaking for my employer HP
MS MVP Printing/Imaging
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:15:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
> I sincerely doubt that the [consumer] printers have ... clocks, temp
> sensors, or registers capable of counting ink drops at the rate they
> are printed.

If the HP consumer printers really do count ink drips, can anyone tell
us where the sensor which does so is located?

Anyone have a photo of this sensor? For *any* HP consumer printer?
Or a diagram? Or a datasheet?
Or an HP web page which says so?

Orak Listalavostok
Related resources
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:45:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
> > HP printers that calculate ink usage typically count drops
> > and may also apply correction factors based on storage time & temperature.

> Besides, who cares about warning levels ...

The only problem I have is that my HP ink tanks expire before I'm done
with them. I refill them using professional grade inks from the local
printing ship (at about 5 US dollars for 250 ml of high-quality ink).

My only problem is the final hp ink tank expiration date.

I have to start all over with new HP ink cartridges (which have that
lousy HP ink in them). Which means I have to again suffer through
about 500 pages of spotty HP printing before I can go professional
again with the better refill ink.

So, the most important question I'd like answered by printing experts
is:

HOW (the heck) DOES HP STORE & COMPARE THE TWO DATES?

Does HP store & compare the ink tank expire & current dates:
a) in the pc?
b) in the printer?
c) in the ink cartridge?

Where is the current date & expiry date actually stored?

------------- Bob Bonda --------------
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 2:22:11 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Could it be a binary value coded into some of the contacts on the cartridge.
For example all cartridges made in a months production have a number and the
next month the number increments by 1. 8 bits would give a range of 256
months or over 20 years.

"Robert A. Bonda" <bob_bonda@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8e505c87.0409190345.1c7f5f74@posting.google.com...
> Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message
news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
> > > HP printers that calculate ink usage typically count drops
> > > and may also apply correction factors based on storage time &
temperature.
>
> > Besides, who cares about warning levels ...
>
> The only problem I have is that my HP ink tanks expire before I'm done
> with them. I refill them using professional grade inks from the local
> printing ship (at about 5 US dollars for 250 ml of high-quality ink).
>
> My only problem is the final hp ink tank expiration date.
>
> I have to start all over with new HP ink cartridges (which have that
> lousy HP ink in them). Which means I have to again suffer through
> about 500 pages of spotty HP printing before I can go professional
> again with the better refill ink.
>
> So, the most important question I'd like answered by printing experts
> is:
>
> HOW (the heck) DOES HP STORE & COMPARE THE TWO DATES?
>
> Does HP store & compare the ink tank expire & current dates:
> a) in the pc?
> b) in the printer?
> c) in the ink cartridge?
>
> Where is the current date & expiry date actually stored?
>
> ------------- Bob Bonda --------------
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 5:06:06 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

It doesn't need a sensor. Each time a jet is fired, some logic level must be
going from 0 to 1 to do it, so you just use this same signal to advance a
counter. That's the way I would do it, anyway.


"Orak Listalavostok" <oraklistal@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:44d113e9.0409190315.71177817@posting.google.com...
> Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message
> news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
>> I sincerely doubt that the [consumer] printers have ... clocks, temp
>> sensors, or registers capable of counting ink drops at the rate they
>> are printed.
>
> If the HP consumer printers really do count ink drips, can anyone tell
> us where the sensor which does so is located?
>
> Anyone have a photo of this sensor? For *any* HP consumer printer?
> Or a diagram? Or a datasheet?
> Or an HP web page which says so?
>
> Orak Listalavostok
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 5:27:22 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In message <44d113e9.0409190315.71177817@posting.google.com>, Orak
Listalavostok <oraklistal@yahoo.com> writes
>Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message
>news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
>> I sincerely doubt that the [consumer] printers have ... clocks, temp
>> sensors, or registers capable of counting ink drops at the rate they
>> are printed.
>
>If the HP consumer printers really do count ink drips, can anyone tell
>us where the sensor which does so is located?
>
>Anyone have a photo of this sensor? For *any* HP consumer printer?
>Or a diagram? Or a datasheet?
>Or an HP web page which says so?

Break open a cartridge and you'll see a resistive strip down the inside.
When the cartridge is full there's low electrical resistance, when it's
empty there's high resistance.

Anyone who gives this ink-drop counting urban myth should as themselves
why, when you refill a cartridge, the ink indicator goes to max.

Or you can believe that there's a little man inside counting the ink
drops and that the earth is flat :-)

--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 6:58:30 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout of how
many times each colour has fired in total for a particular serial number
cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired 459,877,084 times, Cyan
250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a lot of use but it's there.


"Tony Morgan" <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote in message
news:KZH9iNCqsXTBFwWr@zen54488.dircon.co.uk...
> In message <44d113e9.0409190315.71177817@posting.google.com>, Orak
> Listalavostok <oraklistal@yahoo.com> writes
>>Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote in message
>>news:<2j8qk0toltc5kdd5m1qctlgqq6s9d5c5f4@4ax.com>...
>>> I sincerely doubt that the [consumer] printers have ... clocks, temp
>>> sensors, or registers capable of counting ink drops at the rate they
>>> are printed.
>>
>>If the HP consumer printers really do count ink drips, can anyone tell
>>us where the sensor which does so is located?
>>
>>Anyone have a photo of this sensor? For *any* HP consumer printer?
>>Or a diagram? Or a datasheet?
>>Or an HP web page which says so?
>
> Break open a cartridge and you'll see a resistive strip down the inside. When
> the cartridge is full there's low electrical resistance, when it's empty
> there's high resistance.
>
> Anyone who gives this ink-drop counting urban myth should as themselves why,
> when you refill a cartridge, the ink indicator goes to max.
>
> Or you can believe that there's a little man inside counting the ink drops and
> that the earth is flat :-)
>
> --
> Tony Morgan
> http://www.camcord.info
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:25:46 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In message <414d9087$0$50931$65c69314@mercury.nildram.net>, Steve B
<sbrads@nildramDOTcoDOTuk.?.invalid> writes
Snipped....

>You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout
>of how many times each colour has fired in total for a particular
>serial number cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired
>459,877,084 times, Cyan 250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a
>lot of use but it's there.

What happens to the count when you refill?

Though not relevant to HP printers, most current Epson cartridges have a
chip in them that "counts", and to get a refilled cartridge to be
usable, you have to reset the chip count with a 3rd-party unit.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:41:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 14:58:30 +0100, "Steve B"
<sbrads@nildramDOTcoDOTuk> wrote:
> Each time a jet is fired, some logic level must be going from 0 to 1 to do it,
> so you just use this same signal to advance a counter.
> That's the way I would do it, anyway.
>
> You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout of how
> many times each colour has fired in total for a particular serial number
> cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired 459,877,084 times, Cyan
> 250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a lot of use but it's there.

SUMMARY:
Can someone post an Internet web page which shows me the procedure for
reviewing the ink dot count in the ubiquitous HP OJ d145?

Hi Steve,

Wow. That makes sense. Good points Steve!

I had very seriously doubted HP would put expensive sensors into
every consumer HP ink cartridge anyway - so this logic-count
hypothesis seems most worth of testing out.

How could we easily test SteveB's logic-count hypothesis?

One way, I propose, is we can create a text file with a hundred black
dots (i.e., periods). Then, each time that test file is printed, the
HP printer should advance the HP black ink count by something like 100
dots. Or, if it takes ten ink bubbles to generate 1 printed period,
then following SteveB's logc, we should see the ink dot count go up by
something like 1000 dots per page (10 for each period).

To count color dots seems a bit more complicated.
Does the HP printer count the dots separately for each color?
Or does the HP printer count any color bubble as one dot?

I'm guessing one way to tell could be to create 100 red periods ( RGB
255/0/0 red) in Microsoft Word and then set 100 more blue periods (
RGB 0/0/255 blue) and see if the color dot count changes by 100 or by
200 per printed page.

I could test this hypothesis out if I knew how to see the total number
of dots printed in a Hewlett Packard Office Jet d145 all-in-one
printer.

Can someone post an Internet web page which shows me the procedure for
reviewing the ink dot count in the ubiquitous HP OJ d145?
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:41:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Agent Orange wrote:

> Hi Steve,
>
> Wow. That makes sense. Good points Steve!
>
> I had very seriously doubted HP would put expensive sensors into
> every consumer HP ink cartridge anyway - so this logic-count
> hypothesis seems most worth of testing out.
>
> How could we easily test SteveB's logic-count hypothesis?
>

Why test anything? Steve has reported what his printer is reporting
on ink usage and how it is done. Bob H has responded to your post
telling you they count drops. Have printed similar reports on several
of my HP printers as well. Just need the secret code to reveal a lot
of info about your printer. This method of calc ink usage has been
around for yrs.

When it come to HP printers, pay attention to what Bob H says. He
works at Corvallis div, the heart of HP inkjet cart. world.

Don't need no stinkn' test.

Mickey
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 8:54:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On 19 Sep 2004 04:45:02 -0700, bob_bonda@yahoo.com (Robert A. Bonda)
wrote:
>Does HP store & compare the ink tank expire & current dates:
> a) in the pc?
> b) in the printer?
> c) in the ink cartridge?
>
>Where is the current date & expiry date actually stored?

I do not know, but, here is a quote from INSIDE HP
http://www.interex.org/insidehp/articles/insidehp02.04....

End Around: Chicago Tribune reporter Jim Coates wrote that his HP
printer quit on him one day, telling him that the black ink cartridge
had expired. A spare ink cartridge yielded the same results. HP
support told Coates that the printer software reads a date code on
cartridges and blocks their use after a set length of time. He was
told the block could not be bypassed. But it can: "The best way to
defeat such a software scheme that uses a computer's internal clock to
enforce software copy protection or check expiration dates is to set
the computer to a past year when the days of the week for every month
fall on the same dates as this year," Coates wrote. "Do this and your
calendar continues to be accurate, and you fool the enforcers. The
pattern of dates associated with specific days usually rotates every
six or 11 years and always every 28 years. So, the 1997 calendar is
exactly like the 2003 calendar, and so is the 1975 one. Set your
clock/calendar to either year to fool the printer cartridge
expiration-date check."
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 9:10:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 16:25:46 +0100, Tony Morgan
<tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote:
>What happens to the [HP ink drop] count when you refill?

If someone would show me how to review the ink drop count for a
Hewlett Packard Office Jet d145, I would tell you that answer.

Without having run a test, I seriously doubt the HP ink drop count
changes when we refill an existing cartridge; but, it *might* change
when we replace the HP 14 cartridge with a new HP14 cartridge.

Bob Headrick, can you show us how to check the number of ink drops
printed in an hp oj d145? Or at least point us to the web page which
shows this (I've long lost my original manual in my housing moves).
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 9:42:29 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 22:35:50 -0700, "Bob Headrick" <bobh@proaxis.com>
wrote:
> The products that have separate ink and printheads enforce an
> expiration date to avoid clogging a printhead with old ink.

The HPOJD145 does have separate HP 14 ink & printheads.
This HP 14 ink in the Office Jet D145 does enforce an expiry date.
But, can the HP real expiry date be overcome?

Note: We're talking about the real, final, expiry date; not the two
false-expiration date which gets most users to replace the HP ink
cartridge sooner than it needs to be (as discussed previously).

For some ink cartridges, apparently the final expiry date *can* be
modified at the time of ink installation into the printer, e.g.:
http://makeashorterlink.com/?E3C0114E8 (the short url for):
http://www.interex.org/insidehp/articles/insidehp02.04....
which contains (much abbreviated for this post) instructions:
- Do not install the cartridge until you do the following.
- There is an *.ini file (hpSomethingOrOther.ini) stored in the
system directory (WINNT in NT and 2000) ... In it there is a
parameter something like pencheck. It is set to 0100.
Set it to 0000 in the file and save the file and REBOOT...
- ... once you have replaced all your cartridges that have expiration
dates burned into them (as they expire and they will) with ones
that now read UNKNOWN ... you should not have any cartridge expire,
ever again ...
- if you load a new driver, make sure to reset the value in the INI
file before you print anything or you will burn expiration dates
into the chips and you will have to buy new factory virgin
cartridges all over again...

Yet, for other inks, apparently, the HP expiry date can't be overcome:
http://www.alotofthings.com/inkjetinformation/TheNewInk...
containing the (again, much abbreviated for this post) quote below"
"the HP #10 ink cartridges ... contain an internal chip that fails 16
months after the manufacture date. This is regardless of whether or
not you have used the cartridge up or used it at all."

QUESTION:
For those who refill their HP 14 ink tanks with better ink,
we need to determine if this HP14 / HPOJD145 expiry date *can* be
overcome. Do you know how HP stores & compares this expiry date?

We have to know first how it works before we can defeat it.
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 10:38:25 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Steve B wrote:
> You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout of how
> many times each colour has fired in total for a particular serial number
> cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired 459,877,084 times, Cyan
> 250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a lot of use but it's there.
>

What combo? I have same machine, and while the above would be
interesting, what I really'd like to know is: Can I override the 14"
paper length restriction?

What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....

--
John McWilliams
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 19, 2004 11:53:29 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 18:38:25 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

>Steve B wrote:
>> You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout of how
>> many times each colour has fired in total for a particular serial number
>> cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired 459,877,084 times, Cyan
>> 250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a lot of use but it's there.
>>
>
>What combo? I have same machine, and while the above would be
>interesting, what I really'd like to know is: Can I override the 14"
>paper length restriction?
>
>What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
>paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....

IIRC it also accepts banner paper, so 14" is just the biggest common
format accepted.

--
Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian[dot]Inglis{at}SystematicSW[dot]ab[dot]ca)
fake address use address above to reply
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 20, 2004 7:00:06 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In message <414E27F3.4D7E8BCA@REMOVE-TO-REPLYoptusnet.com.au>, quietguy
<david1133@REMOVE-TO-REPLYoptusnet.com.au> writes
>Without contesting what you say, there are people like myself who only
>print ocassionally - for instance the cartridge in my HP930c was bought
>and installed in 2000 - it is still going strong, never gums up, and
>prints beautifully in B&W or colour. Love my HPs

Interesting indeed. When my 990cxi locked me out and the ink levels not
even being shown, I had a long dialogue both by e-mail and by phone with
HP support.

After advising me to replace the ink cartridges (which I had already
done) and directions to re-install the drivers (I was passed from one to
another at HP as the support call was escalated) I was finally told that
the only possible cause could be either dirty contacts on the cartridge
receptacles, or a dislodged or loose ribbon cable connecting the print
head to the PCB. No mention of an ink droplet counter, in fact the
resistive strip that I've previously mentioned was described to me. In
the event though I did clean the connecting pins in the cartridge
receptacles, since I had to get some printing done with (by that time)
some urgency, I went out and bought a Lexmark.

I do know that Epson printer cartridges do have a chip of the sort
attributed to HP printers, and this is acknowledged by Epson and special
chip resetting units are sold by a number of Ink Refill companies. But
there's none of this for HP printers.

And the very fact that many thousands of HP printer owners refill
without problems - with the ink status indication going up to maximum
without any sort of resetting - indicates to me, at least, that this
"ink-drop counting" on the HP is an urban myth. Perhaps caused by
confusion with Epsons who do have a similar system to that described
here - and who admit it.

Of course the 990cxi could be different :-)
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 20, 2004 9:51:14 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Orak Listalavostok <oraklistal@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:44d113e9.0409190315.71177817@posting.google.com...
> Brian Inglis <Brian.Inglis@SystematicSW.Invalid> wrote

>> I sincerely doubt that the [consumer] printers have ...
>> clocks, temp sensors, or registers capable of
>> counting ink drops at the rate they are printed.

> If the HP consumer printers really do count ink drips, can
> anyone tell us where the sensor which does so is located?

Doesnt need a sensor when the printer commands the ink drops.
It can just keep track of what ink drop commands have been issued.

> Anyone have a photo of this sensor? For *any* HP consumer printer?
> Or a diagram? Or a datasheet?
> Or an HP web page which says so?
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 20, 2004 12:49:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Printer on
Hold Power button down while also, in this order...
Press Cancel 4 times
Press Page Feed once
Release Power button.

You get a printout with '41-Tap (Dot Counts)' printed at the top. It's
coded......
Pen IDs:-
K=Black text #56
C=Colour #57
P=Photo #58

Counts:-
K=as above, #56
C=cyan in #57
M=magenta in #57
Y=yellow in #57
c=cyan in #58
m=magenta in #58
k=black in #58

I haven't worked out what Life/256, SS/256 or the Trigger data is yet.

PS
Another very handy test print is a 43-Tap, it tests every jet without using
hardly any ink.





"John McWilliams" <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Bmk3d.218772$Fg5.5033@attbi_s53...
> Steve B wrote:
>> You can press a combination of buttons on my HP 5550 and get a printout of
>> how many times each colour has fired in total for a particular serial number
>> cartridge. My current #57 cartridge's yellow has fired 459,877,084 times,
>> Cyan 250,571,822, and Magenta 248,605,823. Not a lot of use but it's there.
>>
>
> What combo? I have same machine, and while the above would be interesting,
> what I really'd like to know is: Can I override the 14" paper length
> restriction?
>
> What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of paper
> anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....
>
> --
> John McWilliams
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 20, 2004 2:44:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Without contesting what you say, there are people like myself who only
print ocassionally - for instance the cartridge in my HP930c was bought
and installed in 2000 - it is still going strong, never gums up, and
prints beautifully in B&W or colour. Love my HPs

David - who remembers the Epson printer (600) he stupidly bought that
had to have the heads cleaned EVERY time he wanted to print - I kept it
for 3 weeks then gave it away (wouldn't sell the bloody thing)

Bob Headrick wrote:
>
> "Agent Orange" <agentorange@arboral-systems.com> wrote in message
> news:ieplk053v0lv0qlm08j97eqatblq2hef2t@4ax.com...
> > Q: What is the significance of the date printed on the HP ink PACKAGE?
> > SINGAPORE MAY 2003
>
> As the box says, this is the "install by" date. Exactly what this means
> depends on whether it is an integrated printhead vs. a separate ink supply, but
> in general if the box says "install by May 2003" it is not likely to be very
> good today sixteen months later. If it is an integrated ink and printhead
> design (such as the #78 or #45) there is no "lockout" for old cartridges and
> you can try them, with possibly poor printing results. The products that have
> separate ink and printheads do enforce an expiration date to avoid clogging a
> printhead with old ink. See:
> http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/Docume...
>
> Regards,
> Bob Headrick, not speaking for my employer HP
> MS MVP Printing/Imaging

--
If we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made out of meat?
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 20, 2004 10:02:39 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Brian Inglis wrote:

> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 18:38:25 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
>>paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....
>
>
> IIRC it also accepts banner paper, so 14" is just the biggest common
> format accepted.
>
I'm not sure how to proceed, and maybe the drivers for the Mac are way
different than for Windows, but I can set up custom paper size in PS
(CS) and start printing on paper 4" x 23". It gets kicked out at 11 or
so inches. There are no apparent choices in the HP print dialogue for
that sized paper, nor can I see how to set up custom paper in the HP
dialogues.

What I don't know about printing could fill several books! (And does.)

--
John McWilliams
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 22, 2004 9:01:10 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 18:02:39 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

>Brian Inglis wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 18:38:25 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
>> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
>>>paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....
>>
>>
>> IIRC it also accepts banner paper, so 14" is just the biggest common
>> format accepted.
>>
>I'm not sure how to proceed, and maybe the drivers for the Mac are way
>different than for Windows, but I can set up custom paper size in PS
>(CS) and start printing on paper 4" x 23". It gets kicked out at 11 or
>so inches. There are no apparent choices in the HP print dialogue for
>that sized paper, nor can I see how to set up custom paper in the HP
>dialogues.
>
>What I don't know about printing could fill several books! (And does.)

On Windows, if I select Paper Type 'Special Papers'/'hp banner paper',
setup autoselects Paper Size 'Banner [Letter (8.5 x 11 in.)]' and
shows a picture of numbered pages printed continuously over the folds.
This probably just suppresses feeding after registration of the first
page, printing a bunch of contiguous bands 203 x 265 mm @ 300 dpi.

--
Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian[dot]Inglis{at}SystematicSW[dot]ab[dot]ca)
fake address use address above to reply
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 22, 2004 9:26:13 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

Brian Inglis wrote:

> On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 18:02:39 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>>Brian Inglis wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 18:38:25 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
>>><jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
>>>>paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....
>>>
>>>
>>>IIRC it also accepts banner paper, so 14" is just the biggest common
>>>format accepted.
>>>
>>
>>I'm not sure how to proceed, and maybe the drivers for the Mac are way
>>different than for Windows, but I can set up custom paper size in PS
>>(CS) and start printing on paper 4" x 23". It gets kicked out at 11 or
>>so inches. There are no apparent choices in the HP print dialogue for
>>that sized paper, nor can I see how to set up custom paper in the HP
>>dialogues.
>>
>>What I don't know about printing could fill several books! (And does.)
>
>
> On Windows, if I select Paper Type 'Special Papers'/'hp banner paper',
> setup autoselects Paper Size 'Banner [Letter (8.5 x 11 in.)]' and
> shows a picture of numbered pages printed continuously over the folds.
> This probably just suppresses feeding after registration of the first
> page, printing a bunch of contiguous bands 203 x 265 mm @ 300 dpi.
>

The only banner paper on my Printer Driver dialogue is under "US
Letter", and choosing that doesn't print past 11" on my tests. It looks
like it wants to print to the bottom of the paper and start in the top
of (the next) 8.5 x 11 page, but since I have an 8.5 x 30" strip in, it
just stops.

--
John McWilliams
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 22, 2004 9:56:26 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 10:48:51 -0700, Mickey <mickey@webster.com> wrote:
>Why test anything? Steve has reported what his printer is reporting
>on ink usage and how it is done. Bob H has responded to your post
>telling you they count drops. Have printed similar reports on several
>of my HP printers as well. Just need the secret code to reveal a lot
>of info about your printer. This method of calc ink usage has been
>around for yrs.
>When it come to HP printers, pay attention to what Bob H says. He
>works at Corvallis div, the heart of HP inkjet cart. world.

OK. Assuming all is correct as posted, that *still* leaves one
critical question.

How does HP actually store the final 4.5 year (from date of
manufacture) expiry date for an HP 14 ink cartridge?

(If someone has reliably answered that one, I missed it.)
Anonymous
a b α HP
September 23, 2004 6:45:33 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 05:26:13 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

>Brian Inglis wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 18:02:39 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
>> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Brian Inglis wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 18:38:25 GMT in comp.periphs, John McWilliams
>>>><jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>What is the reason this type of printer has a restriction on length of
>>>>>paper anyhow? Er, width I do kinda see why it might have a limitation....
>>>>
>>>>IIRC it also accepts banner paper, so 14" is just the biggest common
>>>>format accepted.
>>>
>>>I'm not sure how to proceed, and maybe the drivers for the Mac are way
>>>different than for Windows, but I can set up custom paper size in PS
>>>(CS) and start printing on paper 4" x 23". It gets kicked out at 11 or
>>>so inches. There are no apparent choices in the HP print dialogue for
>>>that sized paper, nor can I see how to set up custom paper in the HP
>>>dialogues.
>>
>> On Windows, if I select Paper Type 'Special Papers'/'hp banner paper',
>> setup autoselects Paper Size 'Banner [Letter (8.5 x 11 in.)]' and
>> shows a picture of numbered pages printed continuously over the folds.
>> This probably just suppresses feeding after registration of the first
>> page, printing a bunch of contiguous bands 203 x 265 mm @ 300 dpi.
>
>The only banner paper on my Printer Driver dialogue is under "US
>Letter", and choosing that doesn't print past 11" on my tests. It looks
>like it wants to print to the bottom of the paper and start in the top
>of (the next) 8.5 x 11 page, but since I have an 8.5 x 30" strip in, it
>just stops.

Some googling indicates that US Letter Banner seems to be the correct
setting. Your problems may be that the application is generating page
breaks in the middle of the document. You have to ensure that the
document is created in the application with a paper size of 8.5 x 30+
in. Not sure how you do this in your app on MacOS.

--
Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian[dot]Inglis{at}SystematicSW[dot]ab[dot]ca)
fake address use address above to reply
Anonymous
a b α HP
October 2, 2004 4:50:39 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

I am curious about how well the ink carts for Thinkjets and Quietjets will
fare after 12 years in deep storage. I think the cart model number is
92261. I still have about 40 carts left. I do plan on using the Thinkjets
soon.

Being naturally miserly I do not want to toss them, even though I did not
get to use them up as planned so long ago.


=-=
Anonymous
a b α HP
October 2, 2004 12:21:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

"jdj" <jdj@now.here> wrote in message
news:p an.2004.10.02.07.50.32.324032@now.here...
>I am curious about how well the ink carts for Thinkjets and Quietjets will
> fare after 12 years in deep storage. I think the cart model number is
> 92261. I still have about 40 carts left. I do plan on using the Thinkjets
> soon.

You have nothing to lose by trying them. Depending on the storage conditions
you may have more or less problems. Possible issues include the ink becoming
thicker (and more prone to clogging) due to vapor loss, and possible leaking
due to delaminating of the printhead. The first issue would be more prone in a
hot dry environment, the second in a hot environment. In either case, twelve
years is a long time :-).

Regards,
Bob Headrick, not speaking for my employer HP
December 26, 2004 7:38:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

My guess is that the CMOS battery has to be out for some time for a
capacitor to discharge enough for the CMOS to clear properly.


"Orak Listalavostok" <oraklistal@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104048705.151458.249330@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Bob Headrick wrote:
> http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=e...
>
> http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=e...
> http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=e...
>
> Orak Listalavostok wrote:
>> The unexplained HP engineering is why did three HP14 c5010a ink
>> tanks (all of which were placed in service on the same date with
>> all but one of which were immediately removed from service) report
>> "COLOR INK OUT" (even when 2 of the 3 were full of HP OEM ink!)?
>
> ... twas the night before Christmas ... my HP ink level sank ...
> ... not a printer was printing ... nary one of 3 tanks ...
>
> The good news:
> - We're back printing beautifully (better than before) scores of prints
> - Using (strangely) the original HP14 c5010a tri-color cartridge
> - Which previously exhibited the correct "COLOR INK OUT" message!
>
> The bad news:
> - I have no idea what particular event "cleared" the HP "memory"
>
> The lessons learned:
> - Switching the three cartridges Dec 24 had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> - Filling the one empty cartridge also had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> - Removing the CR2032 3V CMOS battery had no immediate efect ...
>
> The day after:
> - Yet, about 12 hours later (on Christmas day)
> - The completely full cartridge was removed ...
> - And then replaced with the original empty cartridge ...
>
> And it printed without error!
> After subsequent refilling ... the original PRINTER INK OUT HP14
> tri-color ink cartridge is printing beautifully vibrant photos even
> after scores of sheets of paper (and multiple refills).
>
> I guess it's the first Christmas present from HP to all of us.
> I can't explain it; if you can - please do!
>
> Orak Listalavostok
>
Anonymous
a b α HP
December 27, 2004 10:04:24 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In article <19-dnTxRrI1TdVPcRVn-vg@nildram.net>, SteveB wrote:
>My guess is that the CMOS battery has to be out for some time for a
>capacitor to discharge enough for the CMOS to clear properly.

Try this (with power off): Short together the connections to the CMOS
battery. Computer motherboards often have a place to put on a jumper
for doing this in case you added a password into your CMOS settings and
forgot the password.

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
Anonymous
a b α HP
December 27, 2004 12:16:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In message <slrncsvcvo.bu1.don@manx.misty.com>, Don Klipstein
<don@manx.misty.com> writes
>In article <19-dnTxRrI1TdVPcRVn-vg@nildram.net>, SteveB wrote:
>>My guess is that the CMOS battery has to be out for some time for a
>>capacitor to discharge enough for the CMOS to clear properly.
>
> Try this (with power off): Short together the connections to the CMOS
>battery.

Is this really a good idea ??


> Computer motherboards often have a place to put on a jumper
>for doing this in case you added a password into your CMOS settings and
>forgot the password.

I thought they shorted the power pins of the CMOS chip which was
supplied from the battery via a resistor ?


J/.
--
John Beardmore
Anonymous
a b α HP
December 27, 2004 7:09:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

In article <slrncsvcvo.bu1.don@manx.misty.com>,
Don Klipstein <don@manx.misty.com> wrote:
>In article <19-dnTxRrI1TdVPcRVn-vg@nildram.net>, SteveB wrote:
>>My guess is that the CMOS battery has to be out for some time for a
>>capacitor to discharge enough for the CMOS to clear properly.

> Try this (with power off):

Unplug power cable
Remove CMOS battery

> Short together the connections to the CMOS
>battery. Computer motherboards often have a place to put on a jumper
>for doing this in case you added a password into your CMOS settings and
>forgot the password.

I think you left out a couple of steps there, Don.


Gary

--
Gary Heston gheston@hiwaay.net

"Sept. 11, 2001, already a day of immeasurable tragedy, cannot be
the day liberty perished in this country." Judge Gerald Tjoflat
Anonymous
a b α HP
December 28, 2004 4:50:52 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers,comp.sys.hp.hardware,misc.consumers.frugal-living,comp.periphs (More info?)

The idea of shorting the battery also put me on guard. I believe your
explanation is correct.

Art

John Beardmore wrote:

> In message <slrncsvcvo.bu1.don@manx.misty.com>, Don Klipstein
> <don@manx.misty.com> writes
>
>> In article <19-dnTxRrI1TdVPcRVn-vg@nildram.net>, SteveB wrote:
>>
>>> My guess is that the CMOS battery has to be out for some time for a
>>> capacitor to discharge enough for the CMOS to clear properly.
>>
>>
>> Try this (with power off): Short together the connections to the CMOS
>> battery.
>
>
> Is this really a good idea ??
>
>
>> Computer motherboards often have a place to put on a jumper
>> for doing this in case you added a password into your CMOS settings and
>> forgot the password.
>
>
> I thought they shorted the power pins of the CMOS chip which was
> supplied from the battery via a resistor ?
>
>
> J/.
!